Paleo Diet?

DaveRCF

Whatever works for you would be the way I'd look at it. If Paleo is working for you and you don't feel you are giving up too much food enjoyment go for it.

Personally, I just look at all the tremendous athletes that aren't actually that careful about the types of foods but probably are careful about the calories ingested and that gives me my answer.

Life's too short; drink wine, eat butter and be happy is my motto!

weathergirl320

Does anyone have research on matched diets keeping calories and macros identical but one diet has all paleo approved foods and one includes a mixture of both, that shows the Paleo diet leads to significantly better outcomes?

I know its not what you are asking for but I did this myself. Did everything by the book and didn't lose a pound. Switched to "paleo" weight fell off. HOWEVER I also have hormonal imbalances. That is what could have been preventing my weight loss while on a traditional calorie counting diet. So althouh its not a study and it is purely anecdotal, I have seen first hand the benefits in my life. And I also believe more people have hormonal issues like the ones I had than we think. And many are undiagnosed. So when I see someone struggling to lose weight while counting calories, I offer them info on the paleo diet because it can make a differeence depending on that persons hormones.

No doubt if you have specific intolerances to things, it's obviously a good idea to cut them out. But for people that don't, are their significant benefits to doing so?

I think for someone who is doing fine and all their bloodowork is fine by "everything in moderation" than good for them. But people either struggling to lose or have high cholesterol or other health issues I see no down side to switching up the diet to a more natural "healthier" way of eating. Someone could be thin with bad bloodowork. You know and I know dietary fat is not the enemy so I know you are aware of the benefits on cholesterol and other serum results by eating more animal fat. Just because someone is thin doesn't mean everything is ok on the inside. Or someone like my mom who has excelle t bloodwork but is overweight. (she has thyroid issues too that's why she is overweight). So for someone who has met the two conditions of no weight issues and no health issues, that's awesome and keep it up. But for people with those issues that aren't being corrected on a traditional calorie in/out moderation diet, I think we both know the paleo diet premise could be beneficial.

Acg67

Does anyone have research on matched diets keeping calories and macros identical but one diet has all paleo approved foods and one includes a mixture of both, that shows the Paleo diet leads to significantly better outcomes?

I know its not what you are asking for but I did this myself. Did everything by the book and didn't lose a pound. Switched to "paleo" weight fell off. HOWEVER I also have hormonal imbalances. That is what could have been preventing my weight loss while on a traditional calorie counting diet. So althouh its not a study and it is purely anecdotal, I have seen first hand the benefits in my life. And I also believe more people have hormonal issues like the ones I had than we think. And many are undiagnosed. So when I see someone struggling to lose weight while counting calories, I offer them info on the paleo diet because it can make a differeence depending on that persons hormones.

No doubt if you have specific intolerances to things, it's obviously a good idea to cut them out. But for people that don't, are their significant benefits to doing so?

I think for someone who is doing fine and all their bloodowork is fine by "everything in moderation" than good for them. But people either struggling to lose or have high cholesterol or other health issues I see no down side to switching up the diet to a more natural "healthier" way of eating. Someone could be thin with bad bloodowork. You know and I know dietary fat is not the enemy so I know you are aware of the benefits on cholesterol and other serum results by eating more animal fat. Just because someone is thin doesn't mean everything is ok on the inside. Or someone like my mom who has excelle t bloodwork but is overweight. (she has thyroid issues too that's why she is overweight). So for someone who has met the two conditions of no weight issues and no health issues, that's awesome and keep it up. But for people with those issues that aren't being corrected on a traditional calorie in/out moderation diet, I think we both know the paleo diet premise could be beneficial.

I agree the premise could be beneficial, what if someone just started eating more whole nutrient dense foods but still ate grains, legumes and dairy, would they not see as much as an improvement if they cut all those things out or severely limited them?

weathergirl320

Also a lot of people on the paleo diet (myself included) had issues with either health or weight loss before starting paleo and a lot have seen those problems corrected after doing the diet. Not many people who do just fine with traditional dieting go the paleo route because they don't need to. But people who have seen such changes like myself are passionate about it. I want to shout it from the rooftops that after seven years of dieting and counting and subsequently gaining in 4 months 5 years of weight has come off. I don't doubt that calorie counting can work for some people, but I do believe that anyone can have success on paleo. Even if you tried it I don't think you would have any problems. That's my opinion based on my experiences. But I think except for some people with specific allergies or digestive issues, anyone can benefit from paleo but not anyone can benefit from calorie in/ out.

mfpcopine

The paleo diet is simply a low carb diet based on the false premise that certain food groups, not excess calorie, cause obesity. If you believe you can succeed without the energy benefits of carbs, great. Otherwise its another path to failure.

I suggest reading George Bray's history of obesity before making such a drastic dietary change.

This is a misunderstanding of the Paleo diet. It isn't "oh carbs are bad," that's beyond ignorant. It is about removing processed carbs and sticking to natural carbs like fruits and the like. It also wants you to increase fat intake to provide your energy supply. Deeming a diet a path to failure when plenty of people are having long term success is very short sighted. Is it perfect for everyone? No. Everyone is effected differently by the food they eat and you should figure out what best effects your body. Anyone who defines something as an absolute, you should avoid.

Obviously you didn't read my post. It seems your haste to defend your ideology results in you rebutting imaginary claims.

Anyway, my personal beliefs are that there aren't 'good' or 'bad' foods. There are only correct or incorrect usage and dosage. The paleo designers claim certain 'bad' foods cannot be eaten without weight gain despite the calorie amount.

I read your post, and I thought your description was an oversimplification, especially for someone who has no information about the diet.. Of course, there's no one Paleo Diet. There are different approaches.

weathergirl320

Does anyone have research on matched diets keeping calories and macros identical but one diet has all paleo approved foods and one includes a mixture of both, that shows the Paleo diet leads to significantly better outcomes?

I know its not what you are asking for but I did this myself. Did everything by the book and didn't lose a pound. Switched to "paleo" weight fell off. HOWEVER I also have hormonal imbalances. That is what could have been preventing my weight loss while on a traditional calorie counting diet. So althouh its not a study and it is purely anecdotal, I have seen first hand the benefits in my life. And I also believe more people have hormonal issues like the ones I had than we think. And many are undiagnosed. So when I see someone struggling to lose weight while counting calories, I offer them info on the paleo diet because it can make a differeence depending on that persons hormones.

No doubt if you have specific intolerances to things, it's obviously a good idea to cut them out. But for people that don't, are their significant benefits to doing so?

I think for someone who is doing fine and all their bloodowork is fine by "everything in moderation" than good for them. But people either struggling to lose or have high cholesterol or other health issues I see no down side to switching up the diet to a more natural "healthier" way of eating. Someone could be thin with bad bloodowork. You know and I know dietary fat is not the enemy so I know you are aware of the benefits on cholesterol and other serum results by eating more animal fat. Just because someone is thin doesn't mean everything is ok on the inside. Or someone like my mom who has excelle t bloodwork but is overweight. (she has thyroid issues too that's why she is overweight). So for someone who has met the two conditions of no weight issues and no health issues, that's awesome and keep it up. But for people with those issues that aren't being corrected on a traditional calorie in/out moderation diet, I think we both know the paleo diet premise could be beneficial.

I agree the premise could be beneficial, what if someone just started eating more whole nutrient dense foods but still ate grains, legumes and dairy, would they not see as much as an improvement if they cut all those things out or severely limited them?

I would venture to guess it depends on the ratio of those foods to the rest of their diet. As long as they were getting enough of their macros and keeping calories in check I don't think it would be that bad. Hence the 80% 20% rule so many of us talk about. HOWEVER the only problem with that is that for some people its very hard to eat those things minimally and they get caught up in a binge situation. I mean you don't hear about people binging on broccoli so obviously there is something to those "no no" foods that cause people to over eat. Like popcorn is my vice. And the whole time I have been doing my paleo I still eat it when I want it. I don't believe in resrtiction or guilt about food. I just find a way to work it into that 20% category.

10KEyes

Also a lot of people on the paleo diet (myself included) had issues with either health or weight loss before starting paleo and a lot have seen those problems corrected after doing the diet. Not many people who do just fine with traditional dieting go the paleo route because they don't need to.

Spot on.


My diet is the primal principals for the most part and yes, I did cut grains and wow what a difference. It seems I had grain issues and I didn't know that my digestive problems were related to the grains I was eating regularly. However, I still count my calories.

gardengals

I strongly believe that the "best"diet is whatever works for you....works for your health as well as, weightloss, works in the "keep it off longterm" sense etc. I have friends who are doing the Paleo thing and I have been on an Atkins/ Low glycemic Index diet because it is working for me. I am loosing weight, feeling so much better and my blood work reflects a healthier me. The most important part of the Paleo thing, in my opinion at least, is that you cut out refined, processed, artificial foods....shouldn't we all be doing this???? The more high tech, refined and processed our diets have become of the years the worse our health has become and obesity rates keep rising. It stands to reason that getting back to natural would be better.

Acg67

Does anyone have research on matched diets keeping calories and macros identical but one diet has all paleo approved foods and one includes a mixture of both, that shows the Paleo diet leads to significantly better outcomes?

I know its not what you are asking for but I did this myself. Did everything by the book and didn't lose a pound. Switched to "paleo" weight fell off. HOWEVER I also have hormonal imbalances. That is what could have been preventing my weight loss while on a traditional calorie counting diet. So althouh its not a study and it is purely anecdotal, I have seen first hand the benefits in my life. And I also believe more people have hormonal issues like the ones I had than we think. And many are undiagnosed. So when I see someone struggling to lose weight while counting calories, I offer them info on the paleo diet because it can make a differeence depending on that persons hormones.

No doubt if you have specific intolerances to things, it's obviously a good idea to cut them out. But for people that don't, are their significant benefits to doing so?

I think for someone who is doing fine and all their bloodowork is fine by "everything in moderation" than good for them. But people either struggling to lose or have high cholesterol or other health issues I see no down side to switching up the diet to a more natural "healthier" way of eating. Someone could be thin with bad bloodowork. You know and I know dietary fat is not the enemy so I know you are aware of the benefits on cholesterol and other serum results by eating more animal fat. Just because someone is thin doesn't mean everything is ok on the inside. Or someone like my mom who has excelle t bloodwork but is overweight. (she has thyroid issues too that's why she is overweight). So for someone who has met the two conditions of no weight issues and no health issues, that's awesome and keep it up. But for people with those issues that aren't being corrected on a traditional calorie in/out moderation diet, I think we both know the paleo diet premise could be beneficial.

I agree the premise could be beneficial, what if someone just started eating more whole nutrient dense foods but still ate grains, legumes and dairy, would they not see as much as an improvement if they cut all those things out or severely limited them?

I would venture to guess it depends on the ratio of those foods to the rest of their diet. As long as they were getting enough of their macros and keeping calories in check I don't think it would be that bad. Hence the 80% 20% rule so many of us talk about. HOWEVER the only problem with that is that for some people its very hard to eat those things minimally and they get caught up in a binge situation. I mean you don't hear about people binging on broccoli so obviously there is something to those "no no" foods that cause people to over eat. Like popcorn is my vice. And the whole time I have been doing my paleo I still eat it when I want it. I don't believe in resrtiction or guilt about food. I just find a way to work it into that 20% category.

I agree 20% seems about right, but I personally wouldn't put grains/legumes/dairy in that 20%, that'd be more reserved for things like ice cream and stuff like that

weathergirl320

Does anyone have research on matched diets keeping calories and macros identical but one diet has all paleo approved foods and one includes a mixture of both, that shows the Paleo diet leads to significantly better outcomes?

I know its not what you are asking for but I did this myself. Did everything by the book and didn't lose a pound. Switched to "paleo" weight fell off. HOWEVER I also have hormonal imbalances. That is what could have been preventing my weight loss while on a traditional calorie counting diet. So althouh its not a study and it is purely anecdotal, I have seen first hand the benefits in my life. And I also believe more people have hormonal issues like the ones I had than we think. And many are undiagnosed. So when I see someone struggling to lose weight while counting calories, I offer them info on the paleo diet because it can make a differeence depending on that persons hormones.

No doubt if you have specific intolerances to things, it's obviously a good idea to cut them out. But for people that don't, are their significant benefits to doing so?

I think for someone who is doing fine and all their bloodowork is fine by "everything in moderation" than good for them. But people either struggling to lose or have high cholesterol or other health issues I see no down side to switching up the diet to a more natural "healthier" way of eating. Someone could be thin with bad bloodowork. You know and I know dietary fat is not the enemy so I know you are aware of the benefits on cholesterol and other serum results by eating more animal fat. Just because someone is thin doesn't mean everything is ok on the inside. Or someone like my mom who has excelle t bloodwork but is overweight. (she has thyroid issues too that's why she is overweight). So for someone who has met the two conditions of no weight issues and no health issues, that's awesome and keep it up. But for people with those issues that aren't being corrected on a traditional calorie in/out moderation diet, I think we both know the paleo diet premise could be beneficial.

I agree the premise could be beneficial, what if someone just started eating more whole nutrient dense foods but still ate grains, legumes and dairy, would they not see as much as an improvement if they cut all those things out or severely limited them?

I would venture to guess it depends on the ratio of those foods to the rest of their diet. As long as they were getting enough of their macros and keeping calories in check I don't think it would be that bad. Hence the 80% 20% rule so many of us talk about. HOWEVER the only problem with that is that for some people its very hard to eat those things minimally and they get caught up in a binge situation. I mean you don't hear about people binging on broccoli so obviously there is something to those "no no" foods that cause people to over eat. Like popcorn is my vice. And the whole time I have been doing my paleo I still eat it when I want it. I don't believe in resrtiction or guilt about food. I just find a way to work it into that 20% category.

I agree 20% seems about right, but I personally wouldn't put grains/legumes/dairy in that 20%, that'd be more reserved for things like ice cream and stuff like that

Right because you have no issues with those foods. But for many people they cause a different hormonal response in the body and therefore should be limited. But if you went on the paleo diet you probably wouldn't see much of a diffrence unless of course you have cholesterol issues or something like that. If someone is struggling what's the harm in limiting grains and such? If it works it works. I don't see harm in limiting them. They don't provide nutrients that can't be found elsewhere. So if one is struggling with traditional dieting why not give it a try? I mean it works for lots of people so there must be something to it. And I don't just mean weight loss either I mean health wise also.

cjstrong

Buckeye sounds like one of those people that are mad that it didnt work for him or he cant handle it lol. Jussayinnn.

marieautumn

I often feel that people hear processed foods and thing things like Pop Tarts or other severly processed foods. With paleo diet its more strict than that. Flour, whole wheats, milk, and basic things that benefit the body are also considered processed. Some people have success cutting this out, some people do not. Women really need to tread lightly as our bodies needs calcium and they are used to getting it from dairy products. Basically anything that was not readily edible by cavemen is not on this diet. NOT all fruits and veggies are allowed as some need to be cooked in ways that were not available back in this pre-historic times and thus were considered inedible. My friend lives by this diet and I do love how much bacon she can eat....she feels healthier, but she surely has not lost any weight!

you can have diary and still be paleo.

Acg67

Right because you have no issues with those foods. But for many people they cause a different hormonal response in the body and therefore should be limited. But if you went on the paleo diet you probably wouldn't see much of a diffrence unless of course you have cholesterol issues or something like that. If someone is struggling what's the harm in limiting grains and such? If it works it works. I don't see harm in limiting them. They don't provide nutrients that can't be found elsewhere. So if one is struggling with traditional dieting why not give it a try? I mean it works for lots of people so there must be something to it. And I don't just mean weight loss either I mean health wise also.

And I agree people with intolerances should limit them, it's the notion that people who don't have intolerances should limit them for better health, weight loss what have you I take issue with.

Sidesteal

If someone is struggling what's the harm in limiting grains and such?

The potential harm comes in the form of dietary adherence assuming the user enjoys the grains that he or she is eliminating. If you've got an individual intolerance to ANYTHING you should obviously limit or eliminate that item, but if you don't, then it's usually best to learn to incorporate those foods rather than avoiding them.

weathergirl320

If someone is struggling what's the harm in limiting grains and such?

The potential harm comes in the form of dietary adherence assuming the user enjoys the grains that he or she is eliminating. If you've got an individual intolerance to ANYTHING you should obviously limit or eliminate that item, but if you don't, then it's usually best to learn to incorporate those foods rather than avoiding them.

Dis you not see most people do it 20% of the time. No elimination.

weathergirl320

Right because you have no issues with those foods. But for many people they cause a different hormonal response in the body and therefore should be limited. But if you went on the paleo diet you probably wouldn't see much of a diffrence unless of course you have cholesterol issues or something like that. If someone is struggling what's the harm in limiting grains and such? If it works it works. I don't see harm in limiting them. They don't provide nutrients that can't be found elsewhere. So if one is struggling with traditional dieting why not give it a try? I mean it works for lots of people so there must be something to it. And I don't just mean weight loss either I mean health wise also.

And I agree people with intolerances should limit them, it's the notion that people who don't have intolerances should limit them for better health, weight loss what have you I take issue with.

Yes I understand but those foods cause many issues in people and they aren't necessary for overall health. Also, there is no other food groups that can be eliminated without needing supplementation in the diet. And I'm sure you know how I feel about supplements. If you eliminate meat veggies/fruits you will need to supplement your nutrition. Some people are veg for moral reasons so the issue isn't about veg or not but they still need to supplement. But eliminating grains and dairy, they don't offer anything that can't be found in meats and veggies/fruits and "natural foods".

anima_gemella

Ditto Buckeye...

Paleo isn't a weightloss diet it is a lifestyle way of eating....there are plenty of people who don't want to loose weight who eat a Paleo lifestyle - I know people who eat a Paleo way to bulk up since it is dependant on protiens and fats...within the Paleo lifestyle you can certainly restrict calories in order to loose weight.

Because you remove grains for many people it does become a lower carb way of eating...but it is not specifically "lower carb" as many veggies and fruits contain a significant amount of carbs...I could easily eat 300 grams of carbs a day and remain paleo and within my calorie goals for the day...a few pieces of higher carb fruit and some higher carb squash...

as for the idea that people who eat Paleo think food groups rather than excess calories cause obesity is laughable...in the end it is all about energy sources and how your body uses the energy sources you provide it...Some people do just fine eating all sorts of food products and focusing soley on the calories if they are attempting to loose weight - but nnot everyone is the same and for some people it REALLY DOES MATTER what you fuel your body with for long term success....if you don't belive that that then that is your perogative...
[/quote]

^^^^ this.... and since I started eating that way my asthma that I had for 7 years almost vanished, believe it or not .

rebeccap13

I often feel that people hear processed foods and thing things like Pop Tarts or other severly processed foods. With paleo diet its more strict than that. Flour, whole wheats, milk, and basic things that benefit the body are also considered processed. Some people have success cutting this out, some people do not. Women really need to tread lightly as our bodies needs calcium and they are used to getting it from dairy products. Basically anything that was not readily edible by cavemen is not on this diet. NOT all fruits and veggies are allowed as some need to be cooked in ways that were not available back in this pre-historic times and thus were considered inedible. My friend lives by this diet and I do love how much bacon she can eat....she feels healthier, but she surely has not lost any weight!

you can have diary and still be paleo.

Primal - includes occasional dairy
Paleo - excludes all dairy

There's a few other minor differences pointed out in this article... http://www.crossfitsouthbay.com/2011/08/paleo-vs-primal-repost/

Not trying to start any debate, just thought I'd mention that.

twinmom01

Does anyone have research on matched diets keeping calories and macros identical but one diet has all paleo approved foods and one includes a mixture of both, that shows the Paleo diet leads to significantly better outcomes?

I would think it would be hard to do - since there are people who do have internal issues that can stall weight loss if that is what they are looking for...

The thing about the Paleo lifestyle is that there are so many cooks in the kichen - each one with their own twist...

I have read plenty and what i have choosen to do is follow the very basic tenants of what the lifestyle is...

Remove Grains and legumes

Eat good protien sources - beef, bison, venison, chicken, turkey, fish
Eat lots of veggies - especially dark green leafy ones
Eat good fats - olive, coconut, avocado
Eat some fruits
Eat some nuts

for those that are Primal - have some dairy sources - milk, half and half, cheeses

As far as processed sources i see "processed" as having a crap-ton of things I have no idea what they are - i.e. I will buy land o Lakes regular butter (cream, salt) but won't buy Land o Lakes Light butter (13 different ingrediants - some of which I have no idea how to pronounce)

I know I ran around in circles journaling and only looking at the calories in/calories out cycle and getting frustrated when I wasn't loosing weight....that is why I started reading - i went the other way around with dropping things out of my diet slowly without even knowing about Paleo - so by the time I heard about and started reading about it I was basically eating the same as the above tenets that i listed above - because of that i choose to align myself under the Primal/Paleo lifestyle...

Now I firmly belive that for myself MACROS makes a huge difference in me being able to loose weight...and I think this would be regardless if I was eating a paleo lifestyle or not...but I didn't really reflect all that much on the Macros until really started reading about Paleo....For me I lost 10 lbs last year journling and doing the calories in/calories out approach while cleaning up my diet....so in effect yes calories in / calories out does work at the basic level....Once I embraced the paleo way and furthermore adjusted my macros to be lower carb under the Paleo lifestyle I lost 10 lbs in 3 months....exercise wasn't any different...calories in weren't different - but what I was using to fuel my body was...

I WILL SAY - I will attribute the better loss of weight to going lower carb with lower sugars - something someone can do without aligning themselves under a Paleo lifestyle - fully agree with that...

I think you will find that those of us that "defend" the Paleo lifestyle aren't into the whole "oh this the the way the caveman ate" (although there are hardcore Paleo people that will do that) - I find it a better way to eat for myself...it has given me a lot more energy by choosing to cut certain foods from my diet and forcing me to make different choices (before aligning myself with paleo I would have never touched a brussel Sprout - now roasted brussel sprouts are one of my favorite things...) By making different choices and eating a healthy clean way I find I don't want for cakes and cookies and pastas and breads....the desire is gone...I have had a number of people remark on the changes in my body over the past few months and ask me what I am doing - I simply tell them - I cut out things like pasta and breads, watch my calories and especially my carbs and sugar intake...usually the first thing out of thier mouths is "Oh I could NEVER give up pasta and bread" - to each their own...I have had 3 friends decide to give the Paleo way of eating a whirl after seeing my results and 2 are doing great and 1 ditched it after 3 weeks saying it wasn't for them...

It really isn't for everyone...and I encourage people to sort of muck through the "reasonings" to get to the basics...which most everyone can agree on - remove junk from your diet and eat healthier....some people choose to eat healthier and have oatmeal and whole grain bread and kidney beans in their diet - if it works for them great, wonderful....I choose to have other foods then those - I don't focus in on what I "can't" have (cause really I can have anything I want - I choose NOT to eat certain things) and focus in on the groups of food that i should eat from....

I have read papers on research about different people on different types of diet and what works and I think the only outcome is not every type of eating style works for every person - hence why there are so many different types out there...

mtread13

It focuses on whole foods, minimally processed. It eliminates gluten because some people are intolerant. You don't really realize you're intolerant until you get rid of it for a while (about a month) and then try to reintroduce it into your diet only to realize how bloated it makes you feel. It eliminates dairy for some of the same reasons. I am slightly gluten intolerant, a severe bread, pasta, and cheese binger so eliminating those foods has really eliminated my source of overeating. You're generally eating more nutrient dense foods as opposed to calorie dense foods so it reduces the likelihood that you will over consume calories. Most people lose weight when they switch to this style of eating because they are consuming a larger volume of food while still eating at a deficit.

I've followed the basics of it off and on for the past three years. I don't agree with the good carb/bad carb ideology that some of the main supporters of paleo/primal have, Sisson, Cordain, etc. Most people will agree with the benefits of a minimally processed, whole foods diet... they just don't like the extremism of completely eliminating foods based on sketchy scientific studies. I honestly can't blame them.

I've switched over to more of a "if it fits in my macros" approach. I've learned how crappy gluten makes me feel as well as eating highly processed foods (fast food, junk food, etc.). I went a little crazy during the first couple weeks but now I think I'm starting to learn this moderation thing pretty well. I still eat mostly a minimally processed diet, limited gluten, limited dairy, but if I want a beer, I drink one... or two, or three , if I want a slice of cheese, I eat it, if I want some ice cream, I eat it. In moderation.

Yay! I want to follow the Rebeccap13 diet. While a subsequent poster makes a good point about going stricter if one has problems that she or he can't seem to solve, for me it makes sense to move towards a moderation approach and within that, more natural.