President natural-born citizen clause. Repealed?

elcieloesazul

Section one, Article Two of the United States Constitution outlines: "No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States." The Twelfth Amendment goes on to say the same for Vice-Presidents, the Fourteenth, again, about senators and representatives.

My question to any U.S. citizens or any one with an opinion is: should this be repealed under the notion of equal opportunity?

In my opinion, some "non-natural" citizens uphold the ideals of America better than those who have generational roots in this territory. So, what do you think? Keep in mind this clause was added around 1787--to deter foreign aristocrats from creating a monarchy in the Americas. This is a threat we no longer face. Also note that 24 proposed amendments were sent to Congress for review regarding this topic. All were denied.

EDIT: An articulate, educated, ad hominem-free discussion is the hopes of this topic. Please remember that just because someone doesn't agree with you, doesn't mean they don't have the right to think it (First Amendment).

kapeluza

"In my opinion, some "non-natural" citizens uphold the ideals of America better than those who have generational roots in this territory. So, what do you think? Keep in mind this clause was added around 1787--to deter foreign aristocrats from creating a monarchy in the Americas. This is a threat we no longer face. Also note that 24 proposed amendments were sent to Congress for review regarding this topic. All were denied. "
No, while they may uphold the ideals of America better it's not a guarantee and we run the risk of having these people look after the better interests of their native countries rather than ours. Pretty far fetched but it could happen no?

elcieloesazul

No.

Why? Because Arnold Schwarzenegger would be eligible (:noway:)?

cramernh

I do not believe that this should be repealed.

I do feel that anyone who assumes these high-powered political positions should be a natural born citizen of US soil. What I would prefer is that said-person who is of natural-birth of the US ought to have a background in some fashion that involves the US Military. I think that background would greatly enhance the decision making necessary for when times there is a question of war with another country. Its not required but, it just seems logical to me (sorry for the Spockness)... lol

Alexandria_JB

It's an interesting idea. I am just glad your subject line was not a tongue-in-cheek statement claiming Obama was born in Kenya...

kapeluza

No.

Why? Because Arnold Schwarzenegger would be eligible (:noway:)?

Responded.

taunto

well...this thread will go places I am sure

Newhampshireboy

nope the constitution has it perfectly stated.

elcieloesazul

well...this thread will go places I am sure

Yep, all great things started in the chit-chat section.

HelloSweetie4

I do not believe that this should be repealed.

I do feel that anyone who assumes these high-powered political positions should be a natural born citizen of US soil. What I would prefer is that said-person who is of natural-birth of the US ought to have a background in some fashion that involves the US Military. I think that background would greatly enhance the decision making necessary for when times there is a question of war with another country. Its not required but, it just seems logical to me (sorry for the Spockness)... lol

I agree with you! I think we would benefit greatly if we required that to run for president you must have a significant military background. I don't believe that presidency should be considered an "equal opprotunity" job. I think it should strictly be for the best of the best. I believe, to be able to run for president, you should have to do some sort of testing to measure your intelligence and capabilities. We have not had the smartest people in office, and I think that is a big problem. And having a president that's a natural born citizen maintains more respect. (I'm sorry if I offend anyone but) I would have less respect for a president if they were not born in the U.S. It would be difficult to take them seriously and be sure they are making their decisions for the benefit of the country.

LilRedRooster

I'm a bit torn on the issue, actually.

I know many, many people who weren't born here that are amazing citizens. They are hard-working, honest, and add a lot to America through their dedication. They uphold all the ideals that people look for in their leaders. My boyfriend is one, actually. He was born in Poland, moved here when he was about 12, works for the government as a range-land specialist in the Bureau of Land Management, and is a very hard-working, honest guy. He doesn't even have an accent, so you'd never know he wasn't born here. And not that he's interested in political office, but he never could go for the presidency, even though he's a model citizen.

Of course, there is a certain awareness of a culture and a feeling that you can only get by being born and raised in a country. There are cultural things I talk about that my boyfriend doesn't catch, because he doesn't get the reference. For him, he feels completely American, but he doesn't have all the awareness that comes with being born here, which I really think a leader of a country needs. They need that awareness, and sense of belonging that goes with the country they are attempting to lead, because without it, they might feel American, but they won't ever be able to entirely identify with those that were born here. And that goes for any leader in any country, not just America.

I actually think that that clause needs to stay where it is. We might be equal-opportunity in offering the best lifestyles that people can achieve, but the Presidency is not a general, run-of-the-mill office; it's the figurehead leadership of the country. That requires a certain sense of identification, for them and for the people, and that's just not going to happen with someone born in another country.

elcieloesazul

No, while they may uphold the ideals of America better it's not a guarantee and we run the risk of having these people look after the better interests of their native countries rather than ours. Pretty far fetched but it could happen no?

There's definitely that possibility. But, as OP, here goes my role as devil's advocate: almost every president before and including Van Buren were tied to foreign countries. "American" isn't an ethnicity, it's a nationality.

sjtreely

Funny you should ask.

I was just thinking about this very topic on a road trip a few weeks ago.

I don't know what I think for sure, but if I have to get a "Aye," or "Nay." I'd go with no for now.

I can't imagine a non-native born citizen loving my country as much as a native born citizen. When I hear of world disasters, it saddens my heart. But when I hear of world disasters in the United States of America the cut is a little deeper. Wrong of me, but it's an honest truth. I think about 9-11 and Katrina years after they happened. But I don't think of disasters in other countries years later.

I think it's because it hit "home." And my president should be from my home.

And surely we have a great enough pool of applicants from which to choose. So why would we need to repeal the law?

I do agree, it would be very nice if our Commander In Chief had military experience.

nas24

Why are politics on a fitness board? Bring this crap somewhere else, please!!

elcieloesazul

I'm a bit torn on the issue, actually.

I actually think that that clause needs to stay where it is. We might be equal-opportunity in offering the best lifestyles that people can achieve, but the Presidency is not a general, run-of-the-mill office; it's the figurehead leadership of the country. That requires a certain sense of identification, for them and for the people, and that's just not going to happen with someone born in another country.

I'm a first-generation American, so I identify with the entirety of your post. I really posted this to see the response and connection people still have to the Constitution. I, like you, am torn.

elcieloesazul

Why are politics on a fitness board? Bring this crap somewhere else, please!!

Opinions aren't crap. Discussion isn't crap. This is the chit-chat section. :flowerforyou:

taunto

Why are politics on a fitness board? Bring this crap somewhere else, please!!

Opinions aren't crap. Discussion isn't crap. This is the chit-chat section. :flowerforyou:

16. No Political Topics in the Main Forums

Political content is not allowed on the Main Forums. This includes images. Please form or join a Group if you would like to engage in political debate on MyFitnessPal.
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Microfiber_wechange

should this be repealed under the notion of equal opportunity?

I think so yes. I've got huge plans for my 14 year old son. He was born in the UK but I'm hoping that one day, he may just be president of the United States :laugh:

rextcat

nope we got enough crazys that can allready run, so lets not add to the crazy pool

ALSO IN BEFORE THE LOCK!!:laugh: :laugh:

femmi1120

I am an immigrant and my family came here legally, we have been living here for over 10 years, and we are now all citizens. I do agree that many immigrants uphold American ideals better than many Americans, and I would definitely say most immigrants appreciate this country more than the majority of its natural-born citizens.

Despite this, I still say no, because of the risks that would come with it.

elcieloesazul

I think it's because it hit "home." And my president should be from my home.

I think this is what a few posters have insinuated. And, I have to agree. There is an unspoken, unbreakable connection there for most people. But, I see and interact with people born out of the US, speak English as a second, third, or even fourth language, and solely classify themselves as American.

sjtreely

Why are politics on a fitness board? Bring this crap somewhere else, please!!

Wow.

elcieloesazul

Why are politics on a fitness board? Bring this crap somewhere else, please!!

Opinions aren't crap. Discussion isn't crap. This is the chit-chat section. :flowerforyou:

16. No Political Topics in the Main Forums

Political content is not allowed on the Main Forums. This includes images. Please form or join a Group if you would like to engage in political debate on MyFitnessPal.
source: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/welcome/guidelines

Where's the rule regarding trolling?

rextcat

Why are politics on a fitness board? Bring this crap somewhere else, please!!

Opinions aren't crap. Discussion isn't crap. This is the chit-chat section. :flowerforyou:

16. No Political Topics in the Main Forums

Political content is not allowed on the Main Forums. This includes images. Please form or join a Group if you would like to engage in political debate on MyFitnessPal.
source: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/welcome/guidelines

Where's the rule regarding trolling?

97. trolling

Its fun everyone should do it, so long as its the most obnoxus crap you can think of by all means post it!

:laugh:

taunto

Why are politics on a fitness board? Bring this crap somewhere else, please!!

Opinions aren't crap. Discussion isn't crap. This is the chit-chat section. :flowerforyou:

16. No Political Topics in the Main Forums

Political content is not allowed on the Main Forums. This includes images. Please form or join a Group if you would like to engage in political debate on MyFitnessPal.
source: http://www.myfitnesspal.com/welcome/guidelines

Where's the rule regarding trolling?

Sorry I'm a foreigner. What exactly you mean by that? You trying to call me a troll or saying that you're an almighty troll that "got us"?

forum guidelines were posted in my thread to inform you WHY there might be an issue with a post like this. Political/religious topics are rarely a good idea in these public forums

TinkrBelz

I do not think it should be repealed I believe that it is good to only allow US born citizens (or children that were born in another country only because parents are in the military) to be allowed to be the President of the United States.

The President of the US is not an "Equal Opportunity" job. We have plenty of US born citizens to choose from to be our President I say, leave it alone.

I am sure that there are plenty of non US born citizens that would make a great president, just as there are probably a few 20 something people that would make a great president...but these are our guidelines and I do not think that they should be changed.

elcieloesazul

Where's the rule regarding trolling?

Sorry I'm a foreigner. What exactly you mean by that? You trying to call me a troll or saying that you're an almighty troll that "got us"?

forum guidelines were posted in my thread to inform you WHY there might be an issue with a post like this. Political/religious topics are rarely a good idea in these public forums

Sure, it is. Where else could I find such a broad, freely-opinionated array of people apart from the interwebs?

HelloSweetie4

I love a good politcal debate!

kapeluza

You should have posted this on the debate group by the way.....

I foresee this getting locked and deleted in the near future....

kapeluza

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/groups/home/116-debatable-debating

bjfmade

No.

Why? Because Arnold Schwarzenegger would be eligible (:noway:)?

This ^^^^^^^