intermittent fasting..thinking about it

13

Replies

  • monty619
    monty619 Posts: 1,308 Member
    DONT

    yeh... please dont do it. especially if you have obese body fat levels dont even consider it. just learn to eat sensibly and count calories and macros.
    Really? and why is intermittent fasting so bad if your obese, this interests me?
    Feel free to rip into me :wink:

    i was wondering the same thing....and i have been counting calories and eating right....i just want to try something different....
    you want to rely on something that you know you can stick with (ie. regular* eating patterns...) for someone who is just trying to get down to a normal bodyweight there is no reason to try different gimmicks, diets, supplements, tricks, etc. whether they work or not... if i were you i would establish that i know how to administer self control then if you can get urself down to an acceptable bodyweight then go from there if you choose to do intermittent fasting.

    people try to overcomplicate things when it comes to getting in shape, simplicity leads to success.
  • butterflymarks
    butterflymarks Posts: 97 Member
    I definatelt endorse IF. However there is a psychological aspect associated with ED. Let me give a hypothetical. This does not entail all. Most who suffer from anorexia or bulimia have a difficult time controlling triggers. If someone is anorexic and they go 24 hours without eating then their brains revert back to old tapes. Feelings of worthlessness. Or see how good your doing because you didnt eat. An alcoholic cant just go have 1 beer. It creates the phenomenon of craving. Same thing happens in ED. Its an addiction and they stay away from things that create the phenomenon of craving
    There are definitely a lot of factors to consider, and I wouldn't want to make a generalization for all ED sufferers, just pointing out that saying IF/ED recovery are incompatible is ludicrous... it is going to depend on the individual. I think the problem is most of the people here who are not familiar with ED at all think of them as food-related, which couldn't be further from the truth (Eating Disorder is really a misnomer). Anorexia and Bulimia are both profoundly different disorders, with Bulimia being more centered around a similar pattern of behaviors as OCD, and anorexia is more oriented around feelings of helplessness and a need for control. Obviously these are both very deep subjects, and no short post is going to adequately describe them, but thinking of ED as being driven by food is wrong-headed. The disordered eating is a manifestation of the disorders, not the core symptom, which is why ED are so difficult to overcome for most people. ED are not the opposite of obesity, which seems to be the prevalent view here.


    Some of that is true and some of it kind of isn't. From someone who is recovering, I would HIGHLY recommend that people with ED's do not try this. I have anorexia nervousa and OCD and this seems to just feed into it. If I were to do one day of planned fasting, I would just go a few more days because I already did one day, might as well continue it as long as I could. Especially because people with EDs will not end up eating a healthy caloric intake the rest of the week. It'd be hurtful in the long run.

    But this is just my experience, to me it would be triggering. For other anorexia sufferers or people with bulimia, I do not know.
  • wackyfunster
    wackyfunster Posts: 944 Member
    I fast a lot for religious reasons. I feel like it is excellent for that purpose, and, as a bonus I have excellent digestion ;-)

    BUT as I get older (have been doing this for 15 years) I notice that some fast days are really tough as far as dizziness and mental confusion. And when we do our annual series of multi-day fasts, I find that I actually GAIN weight, even if I eat very little during the eating part of the week. I think it messes up my metabolism. But the spiritual and self control benefits are worth it, so I do it anyway.
    Weight gain would be due to water retention, and completely normal. Should go away after your first high calorie high carb meal after you finish fasting :)
  • Megdmcda
    Megdmcda Posts: 273 Member
    DONT

    yeh... please dont do it. especially if you have obese body fat levels dont even consider it. just learn to eat sensibly and count calories and macros.
    Really? and why is intermittent fasting so bad if your obese, this interests me?
    Feel free to rip into me :wink:

    i was wondering the same thing....and i have been counting calories and eating right....i just want to try something different....
    you want to rely on something that you know you can stick with (ie. regular* eating patterns...) for someone who is just trying to get down to a normal bodyweight there is no reason to try different gimmicks, diets, supplements, tricks, etc. whether they work or not... if i were you i would establish that i know how to administer self control then if you can get urself down to an acceptable bodyweight then go from there if you choose to do intermittent fasting.

    people try to overcomplicate things when it comes to getting in shape, simplicity leads to success.

    well being as u aren't me and u don't how i administer self control or how i got this way i will just say thank u for ur advice.
  • crisanderson27
    crisanderson27 Posts: 5,343 Member
    i don't agree with the idea of fasting, and neither does my doctor. You need to eat food. Your body requires it. There is a reason why your stomach starts to hurt and grumble after mere hours of not eating. :grumble:

    That's funny...many doctors recommend it.

    Here's the thing NO ONE SEEMS TO GET. You still get your food. Your body still gets fed. I bet you most people...women included who IF eat more on average (still in a deficit) than people who do not.

    And by the way...your stomach starting to hurt and grumble is a trained response. When you eat...your body doesn't just instantly digest it within a couple hours. YOU STILL HAVE FOOD IN YOUR SYSTEM. When I used to eat 5x a day, I was hungry every two effing hours. It was insane...I couldn't go three hours without putting something in my face. Everyone thinks this is your metabolism 'speeding up' (horse crap, that). What it really is is your body anticipating the food you've been giving it regularly for long enough that it became a habit. Since IF, I'm usually hungry twice a day, tops...once around 3pm, and once around 8pm. If I ignore the 3pm, it goes away in MOMENTS, and doesn't come back until 8pm. EVERY SINGLE PERSON I know that has done IF for more than a week, says the same thing.

    The other benefit is that I can eat very large, satisfying meals...or small calorie dense meals...depending on my mood and cravings at the time. I'm not restricted to some 400cal limit 5-6x a day.
  • Crumleygirl
    Crumleygirl Posts: 86 Member
    I had to do a liquid diet for several days about a month ago. Yes I lost quite a bit of weight but then it's hard to keep it off once I could eat again so I would advise not to do it.
  • crisanderson27
    crisanderson27 Posts: 5,343 Member
    I had to do a liquid diet for several days about a month ago. Yes I lost quite a bit of weight but then it's hard to keep it off once I could eat again so I would advise not to do it.

    A liquid diet has NOTHING TO DO with intermittent fasting.

    Seriously...will you people (and this is only partially directed at the person I quoted) please educate yourselves before telling people not to do something?

    I wish to God that whoever named this method of eating had called it 'Caloric Cycling' instead of 'Intermittent Fasting'. No one *****es about zig zag diets...yet this, which is just a different expression of that method...is unhealthy?
  • crisanderson27
    crisanderson27 Posts: 5,343 Member
    I had to do a liquid diet for several days about a month ago. Yes I lost quite a bit of weight but then it's hard to keep it off once I could eat again so I would advise not to do it.

    A liquid diet has NOTHING TO DO with intermittent fasting.

    Seriously...will you people (and this is only partially directed at the person I quoted) please educate yourselves before telling people not to do something?

    I wish to God that whoever named this method of eating had called it 'Caloric Cycling' instead of 'Intermittent Fasting'. No one *****es about zig zag diets...yet this, which is just a different expression of that method...is unhealthy?

    email me when you change your picture so i can visit the forums again.

    ps the butt bible seems to be working good for you.

    Dude...quit looking at my *kitten*! You're making ME uncomfortable!!

    :laugh:
  • strawberrie_milk
    strawberrie_milk Posts: 381 Member
    below is a copy and paste of the protocols for leangains...

    I see people always talking about calorie cycling, or carb cycling... how it's part of the lean gains method. I don't see it. This looks like a pretty simple fasting method. Looks like a short fast 16hrs...

    Where is the cycling stuff listed??

    Fasted training

    Training is initiated on an empty stomach and after ingestion of 10 g BCAA or similar amino acid mixture. This "pre-workout" meal is not counted towards the feeding phase. Technically, training is not completely fasted - that would be detrimental. The pre-workout protein intake, with its stimulatory effect on protein synthesis and metabolism, is a crucial compromise to optimize results. The 8-hour feeding phase starts with the post-workout meal.

    Sample setup

    11.30-12 AM or 5-15 minutes pre-workout: 10 g BCAA
    12-1 PM: Training
    1 PM: Post-workout meal (largest meal of the day).
    4 PM: Second meal.
    9 PM: Last meal before the fast.

    Calories and carbs are tapered down throughout the day in the example above.


    Early morning fasted training

    Here's a sample setup for a client that trains early in the morning and prefers the feeding phase at noon or later. Read this for details regarding this protocol.

    6 AM: 5-15 minutes pre-workout: 10 g BCAA.
    6-7 AM: Training.
    8 AM: 10 g BCAA.
    10 AM: 10 g BCAA
    12-1 PM: The "real" post-workout meal (largest meal of the day). Start of the 8 hour feeding-window.
    8-9 PM: Last meal before the fast.

    For the sake of conveniency, I recommend getting BCAA in the form of powder and not tabs. Simply mix 30 g of BCAA powder in a shake and drink one third of it every other hour starting 5-15 minutes pre-workout. Tabs are cheaper, but much more of a hassle (you're going to have to pop a lot of tabs). Check my supplements guide for specific brand recommendations.


    One pre-workout meal

    This is the most common setup for my younger clients that are still in college or have flexible working hours.

    Sample setup

    12-1 PM or around lunch/noon: Pre-workout meal. Approximately 20-25% of daily total calorie intake.
    3-4 PM: Training should happen a few hours after the pre-workout meal.
    4-5 PM: Post-workout meal (largest meal).
    8-9 PM: Last meal before the fast.

    Two pre-workout meals

    This is the usual protocol for people with normal working hours.

    Sample setup

    12-1 PM or around lunch/noon: Meal one. Approximately 20-25% of daily total calorie intake.
    4-5 PM: Pre-workout meal. Roughly equal to the first meal.
    8-9 PM: Post-workout meal (largest meal).

    http://www.leangains.com/2010/04/leangains-guide.html

    You eat more on workout days. Typical LG recomp is -20/+20, cut is -20/0. Fat/carb distribution is typically 50/50 on rest days and 25/75 on workout days.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
    I had to do a liquid diet for several days about a month ago. Yes I lost quite a bit of weight but then it's hard to keep it off once I could eat again so I would advise not to do it.

    A liquid diet has NOTHING TO DO with intermittent fasting.

    Seriously...will you people (and this is only partially directed at the person I quoted) please educate yourselves before telling people not to do something?

    I wish to God that whoever named this method of eating had called it 'Caloric Cycling' instead of 'Intermittent Fasting'. No one *****es about zig zag diets...yet this, which is just a different expression of that method...is unhealthy?

    email me when you change your picture so i can visit the forums again.

    ps the butt bible seems to be working good for you.

    Dude...quit looking at my *kitten*! You're making ME uncomfortable!!

    :laugh:

    Awww - you changed your pic - it was fun to imagine PU checking your butt out.
  • Megdmcda
    Megdmcda Posts: 273 Member
    I had to do a liquid diet for several days about a month ago. Yes I lost quite a bit of weight but then it's hard to keep it off once I could eat again so I would advise not to do it.

    A liquid diet has NOTHING TO DO with intermittent fasting.

    Seriously...will you people (and this is only partially directed at the person I quoted) please educate yourselves before telling people not to do something?

    I wish to God that whoever named this method of eating had called it 'Caloric Cycling' instead of 'Intermittent Fasting'. No one *****es about zig zag diets...yet this, which is just a different expression of that method...is unhealthy?

    email me when you change your picture so i can visit the forums again.

    ps the butt bible seems to be working good for you.

    Dude...quit looking at my *kitten*! You're making ME uncomfortable!!

    :laugh:

    Awww - you changed your pic - it was fun to imagine PU checking your butt out.

    LMAO
  • tobnrn
    tobnrn Posts: 477 Member
    This is a lifestyle. I fast 2 days a week. I am getting more calories in a week now than I did before. I lost BF and inches along with gaining LBM.

    The noise you hear in your stomach is actually air.
  • Awkward30
    Awkward30 Posts: 1,927 Member
    I just started IF and I like it because it is more like how my body wants to eat naturally. Basically, on a training day I eat 2k calories between noon and 10 pm. On a rest or cardio day I eat 1500 calories in that window. I'm eating more than I was when I was doing a straight deficit, and the best part is 800+ calorie meals. I prefer to have 2 big meals and a smaller meal snack. When I eat, I tend to be hungry soon after... So I feel less hungry when I skip am meals.
  • crisanderson27
    crisanderson27 Posts: 5,343 Member
    This is a lifestyle. I fast 2 days a week. I am getting more calories in a week now than I did before. I lost BF and inches along with gaining LBM.

    The noise you hear in your stomach is actually air.
    I just started IF and I like it because it is more like how my body wants to eat naturally. Basically, on a training day I eat 2k calories between noon and 10 pm. On a rest or cardio day I eat 1500 calories in that window. I'm eating more than I was when I was doing a straight deficit, and the best part is 800+ calorie meals. I prefer to have 2 big meals and a smaller meal snack. When I eat, I tend to be hungry soon after... So I feel less hungry when I skip am meals.

    These two ladies get it :).
  • MoreBean13
    MoreBean13 Posts: 8,701 Member
    I want to chime in on the OCD aspect of IF...I have OCD (real, clinically diagnosed and treated OCD- not the cute OCD that people use to describe behavior quirks) and when I was younger my OCD manifested itself in disordered eating. I never had a *true* eating disorder, but I thought I did for a long time, before I was diagnosed with OCD. I later discovered that the root of the problem was control and not food at all. Anyway, I have been practicing a 16/8 IF for a couple weeks now. I hesitate to describe it as leangains, because I don't follow all the dietary recommendations (like the massive amount of protein recommended- I'm pretty maxed out at 130-140 grams as a vegetarian).

    The IF has been GREAT for alleviating the craziness associated with food for me. Trying to eat 5 or 6 meals a day caused MUCH more anxiety. How to plan each little meal to get everything I need and making time for all that eating, while not being burdensome to those around me caused me great anxiety. Now, I have a big and satisfying "brunch", a protein heavy shake after working out, and a big and satisfying dinner. I can eat socially with my family/friends, and not stress out about the composition of each meal.

    Before discovering IF, I was leaning towards this way of eating on my own, because of how it made me feel. After reading one of these threads I decided to read up on leangains and ESE, and switched immediately to a 16/8 schedule. I don't think ESE is for me- my control issues dictate that a regular daily schedule works better than dramatic daily changes. Anyway, just thought I would chime in since there has been a lot of speculation in this thread about OCD and IF, and I can tell you the two can work together nicely.
  • tobnrn
    tobnrn Posts: 477 Member
    I loooove food. And when I sit down to eat, I want to eat. I am a very happy girl with a big ol honkin piece of steak. IF allows me to do this.
  • wackyfunster
    wackyfunster Posts: 944 Member
    You eat more on workout days. Typical LG recomp is -20/+20, cut is -20/0. Fat/carb distribution is typically 50/50 on rest days and 25/75 on workout days.
    For fat/carb, if you are eating +anything on workout days, you actually want to shoot for 30-40g fat (probably safe to go down to 20 if you can). Remainder carbs.
    Rest days, 20% carbs or less. Remainder fat/more protein.

    It doesn't really matter much if you are >~12%/20% body fat (man/woman), but the lower you get, the more of a difference it makes.

    Also, make sure you still get enough fiber on rest days. Ask me how I know! :P
  • shorty35565
    shorty35565 Posts: 1,425 Member
    For those of you saying 'I don't think'...please, do...it's harmful to yourself and others when you don't.

    I didn't say no, or I don't think.... how is it harmful to them and others? if they eat or not?

    Umm...it's harmful to yourself and others when you don't think.

    lol very true, but I didn't want to say it wouldn't make a diff, cuz I didn't know. I would starve doing that I feel like. I do high intensity cardio & I an so hungry if I don't eat a certain amount cuz I burn so much.

    I'm glad you didn't take me teasing you wrong :).

    Seriously though...you can still eat the same amount. Why couldn't you?

    Cuz you don't get to eat for an amount of time right?
  • ProjFit
    ProjFit Posts: 143
    I don't judge, I'm just here to say that it wont aide in weight or water loss and can actually hinder your overall goal. If its not for spiritual reasons then i would recommend not doing it.
  • wackyfunster
    wackyfunster Posts: 944 Member
    Cuz you don't get to eat for an amount of time right?
    That is true, but your daily caloric intake is the same. E.g. on workout days, I eat 3500 calories, I just do it in an 8 hour period, after fasting for 16. My meals are EPIC!
  • crisanderson27
    crisanderson27 Posts: 5,343 Member
    I don't judge, I'm just here to say that it wont aide in weight or water loss and can actually hinder your overall goal. If its not for spiritual reasons then i would recommend not doing it.

    Ok...fair enough.

    Now please tell me why you believe this.
  • shorty35565
    shorty35565 Posts: 1,425 Member
    i don't agree with the idea of fasting, and neither does my doctor. You need to eat food. Your body requires it. There is a reason why your stomach starts to hurt and grumble after mere hours of not eating. :grumble:

    That's funny...many doctors recommend it.

    Here's the thing NO ONE SEEMS TO GET. You still get your food. Your body still gets fed. I bet you most people...women included who IF eat more on average (still in a deficit) than people who do not.

    And by the way...your stomach starting to hurt and grumble is a trained response. When you eat...your body doesn't just instantly digest it within a couple hours. YOU STILL HAVE FOOD IN YOUR SYSTEM. When I used to eat 5x a day, I was hungry every two effing hours. It was insane...I couldn't go three hours without putting something in my face. Everyone thinks this is your metabolism 'speeding up' (horse crap, that). What it really is is your body anticipating the food you've been giving it regularly for long enough that it became a habit. Since IF, I'm usually hungry twice a day, tops...once around 3pm, and once around 8pm. If I ignore the 3pm, it goes away in MOMENTS, and doesn't come back until 8pm. EVERY SINGLE PERSON I know that has done IF for more than a week, says the same thing.

    The other benefit is that I can eat very large, satisfying meals...or small calorie dense meals...depending on my mood and cravings at the time. I'm not restricted to some 400cal limit 5-6x a day.

    This is interesting. U learn something new every day. Chalene Johnson said that u should eat every 3 hrs so I have been. I eat small meals too, but that's because I can't eat a lot in one sitting. I never have been able too. I get full fast, idk why. The at the end of the day, I have all the snacks I have to cram in b4 bed to reach my cal goal. Most of the time I'm eating them when I'm not even hungry.
  • tobnrn
    tobnrn Posts: 477 Member
    Cuz you don't get to eat for an amount of time right?
    That is true, but your daily caloric intake is the same. E.g. on workout days, I eat 3500 calories, I just do it in an 8 hour period, after fasting for 16. My meals are EPIC!

    I eat 600 cal on my fast day. 1900 on the other days and 1600 on weekends.
  • tobnrn
    tobnrn Posts: 477 Member
    I was having that problem. It got to the point I was only getting about 800 cal a day in, partly because of my work schedule. I went to IF. I found that when I break my fast and eat a 600 cal dinner. The next morning I wake up and I am hungry. I have no problems getting my calories in now.
  • shorty35565
    shorty35565 Posts: 1,425 Member
    Cuz you don't get to eat for an amount of time right?
    That is true, but your daily caloric intake is the same. E.g. on workout days, I eat 3500 calories, I just do it in an 8 hour period, after fasting for 16. My meals are EPIC!

    I could NEVER eat tht amount of cals in 8 hrs. I'm trying to think, but depending on the day in 8 hrs I eat mayb 1200 cals. I'm supposed to b eating 1600. Idk if I could cram it all in in that amount of time. I wrote up there ab it. I get full fast and I try to eat as healthy as I can. Idk many high cal healthy things tht I like. I'm really picky.
  • MoreBean13
    MoreBean13 Posts: 8,701 Member
    For those of you saying 'I don't think'...please, do...it's harmful to yourself and others when you don't.

    I didn't say no, or I don't think.... how is it harmful to them and others? if they eat or not?

    Umm...it's harmful to yourself and others when you don't think.

    lol very true, but I didn't want to say it wouldn't make a diff, cuz I didn't know. I would starve doing that I feel like. I do high intensity cardio & I an so hungry if I don't eat a certain amount cuz I burn so much.

    I'm glad you didn't take me teasing you wrong :).

    Seriously though...you can still eat the same amount. Why couldn't you?

    Cuz you don't get to eat for an amount of time right?

    I do high intensity cardio on IF- you just have to schedule it differently. I do long cardio in the early evenings, so it's smack in the middle of my eating window. I personally would not try a long run while fasted. I think some people do it, but I would not feel comfortable trying at this point.

    Then, I power eat when I'm done....It goes Long run, water, protein shake, shower, POWER MEAL.
  • shorty35565
    shorty35565 Posts: 1,425 Member
    I was having that problem. It got to the point I was only getting about 800 cal a day in, partly because of my work schedule. I went to IF. I found that when I break my fast and eat a 600 cal dinner. The next morning I wake up and I am hungry. I have no problems getting my calories in now.

    I always get my cals in, but I space them out. I just ate my last snack ab 2 hrs ago.
  • shorty35565
    shorty35565 Posts: 1,425 Member
    For those of you saying 'I don't think'...please, do...it's harmful to yourself and others when you don't.

    I didn't say no, or I don't think.... how is it harmful to them and others? if they eat or not?

    Umm...it's harmful to yourself and others when you don't think.

    lol very true, but I didn't want to say it wouldn't make a diff, cuz I didn't know. I would starve doing that I feel like. I do high intensity cardio & I an so hungry if I don't eat a certain amount cuz I burn so much.

    I'm glad you didn't take me teasing you wrong :).

    Seriously though...you can still eat the same amount. Why couldn't you?

    Cuz you don't get to eat for an amount of time right?

    I do high intensity cardio on IF- you just have to schedule it differently. I do long cardio in the early evenings, so it's smack in the middle of my eating window. I personally would not try a long run while fasted. I think some people do it, but I would not feel comfortable trying at this point.

    Then, I power eat when I'm done....It goes Long run, water, protein shake, shower, POWER MEAL.

    I do Turbo Fire. This week my schedule looks like this
    Mon: HIIT & Sculpting
    Tues: 45 min intense kick boxing w/ a couple HIITs in them
    Wed: rest
    Thurs: HIIT & Toning
    Fri: 55 min intense kick boxing w/ 3 HIITs in them
    Sat: HIIT & Sculpting + abs
    Sunday: 30 min intense kick boxing w/ a couple HIITs in them. (I might add something else, haven't decided yet)
    Next week w/ look different, cuz I got Chalean Extreme & will prob add more it. But that's the general idea.
    I always work out an hr after breakfast. If it's a HIIT day, I do it after breakfast, break for an hr and then do the sculpt/tone
  • tobnrn
    tobnrn Posts: 477 Member
    I was having that problem. It got to the point I was only getting about 800 cal a day in, partly because of my work schedule. I went to IF. I found that when I break my fast and eat a 600 cal dinner. The next morning I wake up and I am hungry. I have no problems getting my calories in now.

    I always get my cals in, but I space them out. I just ate my last snack ab 2 hrs ago.

    You just said you should be getting 1600 but are only get 1200. I doubt at 1200 your even eating at BMR. I'm not telling you to do IF. It is a personal preference. But earlier you said it wouldn't work because of xyz, now your saying it wouldn't work because of abc. There are many ways to skin a cat. Not that I endorse skinning cats. If what your doing is working for you great. IF works for alot of people. My results have been amazing.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
    I was having that problem. It got to the point I was only getting about 800 cal a day in, partly because of my work schedule. I went to IF. I found that when I break my fast and eat a 600 cal dinner. The next morning I wake up and I am hungry. I have no problems getting my calories in now.

    I always get my cals in, but I space them out. I just ate my last snack ab 2 hrs ago.

    You just said you should be getting 1600 but are only get 1200. I doubt at 1200 your even eating at BMR. I'm not telling you to do IF. It is a personal preference. But earlier you said it wouldn't work because of xyz, now your saying it wouldn't work because of abc. There are many ways to skin a cat. If what your doing is working for you great. IF works for alot of people. My results have been amazing.

    I think that the thing that is being missed here is that the primary benefit for many people is the fact that the eating protocols fit into peoples natural eating habits and work and social life - if it does not, then it would not be the way to go.

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