If low carb works, why are people still fat?

LesterBlackstone

So then some of us maybe juuuust maybe are "special snowflakes" after all....maybe juuuuuust maybe some of us can't work on the energy balance equation alone, which goes against what a lot of people here tout all over the place and make people who struggle to lose feel bad and dumb and lazy. Maybe juuuuust maybe there is more to it then???

Or not.

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/you-are-not-different.html

bcattoes

What if flying monkey tears held the key to ending the obesity problem?

We would exploit them nearly to the point of extinction, then genetically modify them to produce more tears, but the GMO tears would be less potent so we'd feed them GMO foods to make them grow faster and reproduce more quickly, then there would be so many that they would take over the world. Crying all the while.

mmapags

And what if the cure for obesity (i.e. energy in greater than energy out) is a low carb diet? What if a low carb diet causes a decrease in appetite and an increase in NEAT calories spontaneously? What if eliminating carbs from your diet allows your body to regulate it's weight just like it regulates everything else like breathing, body temperature and blood pressure.

Why does it have to be a lack of will power or people being lazy and stupid? Have you ever seen kids eat right before a growth spurt? They're always hungry. Do you see post after post with women asking how to deal with being HUNGRY before menstruation? Why is it so hard to even consider that something else is driving the obesity epidemic around the world?

Diet and maintain your weight however you'd like but it really takes some hubris to believe you know everything and there's nothing to be learned about obesity.

And all the research that's been done on this type of diet wouldn't have discovered this by now? And if this were the case, how would people do so well on other diets also? I think it takes some hubris to suggest what you are suggesting in this post.

Seattlema

We really need to refine the phrase "calories in - calories out" etc.

Eating deep fried chicken (in) and walking around the block and burning calories (out) has a night and day different end result than eating grilled salmon (in) and exercise followed by cardio (out). The quality of the nutrients make a big difference. I can't support any NO carb solution. I have no problem with LOW carbs as long as they are measured low carbs.

I agree with this! I went low carb and yes lost a ton of weight and also gained a ton of weight. Low is no always the key and doesn't work for everyone. If you start to eliminate the wrong carbs then your body starts to break down the things it needs for recovery after workouts. Everything is a lifestyle change, I would not suggest a low carb diet. I've done it and once I realized I was missing key nutrients I had to stop. And of course many would say just take more vitamins but I'm not a pill popper, I rather get what I need from good foods.

bcattoes

And what if the cure for obesity (i.e. energy in greater than energy out) is a low carb diet? What if a low carb diet causes a decrease in appetite and an increase in NEAT calories spontaneously? What if eliminating carbs from your diet allows your body to regulate it's weight just like it regulates everything else like breathing, body temperature and blood pressure.

Why does it have to be a lack of will power or people being lazy and stupid? Have you ever seen kids eat right before a growth spurt? They're always hungry. Do you see post after post with women asking how to deal with being HUNGRY before menstruation? Why is it so hard to even consider that something else is driving the obesity epidemic around the world?

Diet and maintain your weight however you'd like but it really takes some hubris to believe you know everything and there's nothing to be learned about obesity.

This is a pretty ridiculous post. Why would a low carb diet take less will power than any other diet? Even IF a low carb diet were a cure for obesity, that would not remove will power from the equation. I've never been obese, but it would sure take a lot of will power for me to follow a low carb diet. I suppose I would if I had to, but luckily I don't.

Low carb diets could cure obesity if everyone followed it and created a deficit. Many diets could. But many people don't have the will power (or desire) to follow them.

AlabasterVerve

And what if the cure for obesity (i.e. energy in greater than energy out) is a low carb diet? What if a low carb diet causes a decrease in appetite and an increase in NEAT calories spontaneously? What if eliminating carbs from your diet allows your body to regulate it's weight just like it regulates everything else like breathing, body temperature and blood pressure.

Why does it have to be a lack of will power or people being lazy and stupid? Have you ever seen kids eat right before a growth spurt? They're always hungry. Do you see post after post with women asking how to deal with being HUNGRY before menstruation? Why is it so hard to even consider that something else is driving the obesity epidemic around the world?

Diet and maintain your weight however you'd like but it really takes some hubris to believe you know everything and there's nothing to be learned about obesity.

This is a pretty ridiculous post. Why would a low carb diet take less will power than any other diet? Even IF a low carb diet were a cure for obesity, that would not remove will power from the equation. I've never been obese, but it would sure take a lot of will power for me to follow a low carb diet. I suppose I would if I had to, but luckily I don't.

Low carb diets could cure obesity if everyone followed it and created a deficit. Many diets could. But many people don't have the will power (or desire) to follow them.

Well since you've never been overweight I'm going to guess you've never felt like you need to eat all of the time but how about a smoker? For me, the experience has been remarkably similar. It's hard at first but once you just suck it up and do it it gets better. And while an occasional craving pops up you feel so much better you wouldn't think about picking up a pack of cigarettes again--no will power required.

ETA:
Obviously that's just my personal experience but as has been pointed out, I'm not a special snowflake, and there are thousands of people who have shared similar experiences from what I've seen in the diet communities on line. There's something to it and I'm just thankful I finally discovered this way of eating and I'm extremely happy people are more willing to entertain the idea that there's more to weight loss than calories in vs calories out and the clinical studies are showing this and more studies are being planned as a result.

carld256

And what if the cure for obesity (i.e. energy in greater than energy out) is a low carb diet? What if a low carb diet causes a decrease in appetite and an increase in NEAT calories spontaneously? What if eliminating carbs from your diet allows your body to regulate it's weight just like it regulates everything else like breathing, body temperature and blood pressure.

Sorry, but that's just magical and wishful thinking.

Why does it have to be a lack of will power or people being lazy and stupid?

Don't put words in my moth. That's dishonest. I never said anything about will power or people being lazy or stupid. I said it comes down to eating less and exercising more. That's the answer.

Have you ever seen kids eat right before a growth spurt? They're always hungry. Do you see post after post with women asking how to deal with being HUNGRY before menstruation? Why is it so hard to even consider that something else is driving the obesity epidemic around the world?

What makes you think that this hasn't all been carefully considered. Why do you presume to know what other people are thinking and have experienced? As far as the obesity epidemic the fact is that every lean and healthy, large population in recorded history has lived on a starch (carbohydrate) based diet, every single one.

Diet and maintain your weight however you'd like but it really takes some hubris to believe you know everything and there's nothing to be learned about obesity.

Honestly, I think the hubris shoe is on the other foot. And again you're putting words in my mouth. I never said any of that.

I shouldn't need to even state the standard disclaimer, but I will anyway. Unless you've got some underlying medical condition that actually makes you a unique and special snowflake who is different from almost everyone else in to world then the answer to obesity is eating less and exercising more.

myofibril

Leaving aside the fact that protein has an insulin response as well as carbs, the "carbs spike insulin meaning instant fat gain" nonsense really needs to be shelved. Considering that the value of the global market for weight loss related goods exceeds well over $100 billion you would have thought some bright spark in the pharmaceutical industry would have capitalised on insulin blockers to guarantee fat loss by now. Maybe "they" want to keep us fat to ensure our compliance. Or maybe because it makes naff all difference:

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1463-1326.2006.00645.x/abstract

As I said before I do think "low" carb can work very well for many people but please enough with the insulin is the cause of obesity drama...

carld256

For anyone who says that low-carb diets haven't been around long enough to be sure if they work or not, they've actually been popular for almost 150 years. William Banting published his "Letter on Corpulence, Addressed to the Public," which was a low-carb diet, in 1863. It was so popular that "banting" is still a term used for dieting, and his pamphlet remains in print.

mmapags

Leaving aside the fact that protein has an insulin response as well as carbs, the "carbs spike insulin meaning instant fat gain" nonsense really needs to be shelved. Considering that the value of the global market for weight loss related goods exceeds well over $100 billion you would have thought some bright spark in the pharmaceutical industry would have capitalised on insulin blockers to guarantee fat loss by now. Maybe "they" want to keep us fat to ensure our compliance. Or maybe because it makes naff all difference:

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1463-1326.2006.00645.x/abstract

As I said before I do think "low" carb can work very well for many people but please enough with the insulin is the cause of obesity drama...

Again, awesome!!

mmapags

And what if the cure for obesity (i.e. energy in greater than energy out) is a low carb diet? What if a low carb diet causes a decrease in appetite and an increase in NEAT calories spontaneously? What if eliminating carbs from your diet allows your body to regulate it's weight just like it regulates everything else like breathing, body temperature and blood pressure.

Why does it have to be a lack of will power or people being lazy and stupid? Have you ever seen kids eat right before a growth spurt? They're always hungry. Do you see post after post with women asking how to deal with being HUNGRY before menstruation? Why is it so hard to even consider that something else is driving the obesity epidemic around the world?

Diet and maintain your weight however you'd like but it really takes some hubris to believe you know everything and there's nothing to be learned about obesity.

This is a pretty ridiculous post. Why would a low carb diet take less will power than any other diet? Even IF a low carb diet were a cure for obesity, that would not remove will power from the equation. I've never been obese, but it would sure take a lot of will power for me to follow a low carb diet. I suppose I would if I had to, but luckily I don't.

Low carb diets could cure obesity if everyone followed it and created a deficit. Many diets could. But many people don't have the will power (or desire) to follow them.

Well since you've never been overweight I'm going to guess you've never felt like you need to eat all of the time but how about a smoker? For me, the experience has been remarkably similar. It's hard at first but once you just suck it up and do it it gets better. And while an occasional craving pops up you feel so much better you wouldn't think about picking up a pack of cigarettes again--no will power required.

ETA:
Obviously that's just my personal experience but as has been pointed out, I'm not a special snowflake, and there are thousands of people who have shared similar experiences from what I've seen in the diet communities on line. There's something to it and I'm just thankful I finally discovered this way of eating and I'm extremely happy people are more willing to entertain the idea that there's more to weight loss than calories in vs calories out and the clinical studies are showing this and more studies are being planned as a result.

There are others like you that this LCD has worked for. That's great. Glad you've found what works for you. This will work for some. Won't for others. The obnoxiousness come when you proseletize this as a unviversal solution just because it worked for you and make ridiculous speculations about how awesome LCDs would be for everyone. It's the attempt to sell it as a cure all that appears so ridiculous. You, and some others, will respond to this well. Others won't.

raystark

<snip> But I'm continually surprised that anyone would care about anyone else's diet to begin with so I'm probably wrong about this too. :laugh:

Well of course you are.

Dragonwolf

Riiiiight. Those dumb slovenly lazy people who can't count calories and are too lazy to work out. Yes that's it. You solved the obesity crisis in one sentence!!! Voila!

Your pointless sarcasm aside, the solution to obesity does fit in one sentence, actually just four words. Eat less, exercise more.

...Except for those of us who've busted our a**es following the "eat less, move more" (which has its own diminishing returns, btw), doing everything "right", and still saw neither the scale, nor the tape measure move.

What most people don't seem to realize is that while "eat less, move more" does work for the general population (particularly one that's used to sitting on their butts, eating Cheetos all day), there is a fair-sized portion for which that doesn't actually work for, even though those people are considered "healthy" by medical tests (good A1C, thyroid, etc results).

I'm not sure why so many low-carbers have trouble taking responsibility for themselves? Taubes made a mint telling people what they want to hear: it wasn't their fault, they didn't eat too much food, exercise is pointless... it's all the ebil, ebil food's fault.

Perhaps because for a lot of people who have gone the low-carb route, "eat less, move more" didn't work. Carbs screw with your hormones by dumping glucose into your bloodstream, causing an insulin response (yes, even "healthy" carbs do this, not just sugar). Do that enough times, with enough insulin, over a long enough period of time, and you desensitize your muscles and burn out your pancreas (not unlike how alcoholics often burn out their livers). Even for those with adequate insulin sensitivity, other hormones can make people prone to gaining weight and not being able to lose it. This is a common symptom of PCOS, which elevates testosterone in women with it, making it nearly impossible for them to lose weight. There's also growing evidence that humans in general can't handle gluten very well (ie - that gluten intolerance isn't nearly as rare as once believed), and that a good portion of the population may actually have subclinical intolerance to it, which has often been linked to a host of non-descript problems (part of what makes it so difficult to diagnose), which can directly and indirectly lead to weight gain and/or difficulty losing weight.

So yes, for some of us, it is the "ebil, ebil food's" fault.

So it is the fault of the food? Not the fault of the people who overeat the food? Do I have that right??

When you're not overeating, and are doing what you're "supposed" to be doing (exercising 3x+ per week moderate-high intensity, eating "good" foods, such as whole grains, lean proteins, etc) and still not losing weight (or worse, still gaining), then yes, it may, in fact, be what you're eating, regardless of how much (or in this case, how little) you're eating.

Dragonwolf

There's also growing evidence that humans in general can't handle gluten very well (ie - that gluten intolerance isn't nearly as rare as once believed), and that a good portion of the population may actually have subclinical intolerance to it, which has often been linked to a host of non-descript problems (part of what makes it so difficult to diagnose), which can directly and indirectly lead to weight gain and/or difficulty losing weight.

Where is this growing evidence??

I'm not at all sure that's true, but even if it were, not all grains contain gluten so it would not be a reason to cut out grains completely.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1373929/

http://kalishresearch.com/a_gluten.html
Specifically:

Gluten intolerance has a genetic basis, meaning it passes from generation to generation. Gluten intolerance is found most frequently in those with Irish, English, Scottish, Scandinavian, and other Northern European and Eastern European heritages. The research study published in the British Medical Journal in November of 1998 found previously unheard numbers of people suffering from celiac disease, the medical condition related to gluten intolerance. They found approximately one in 150 people with this condition. It is suspected the levels of sub-clinical gluten intolerance are much higher, perhaps as high as one in three Americans.

wellbert

For anyone who says that low-carb diets haven't been around long enough to be sure if they work or not, they've actually been popular for almost 150 years. William Banting published his "Letter on Corpulence, Addressed to the Public," which was a low-carb diet, in 1863. It was so popular that "banting" is still a term used for dieting, and his pamphlet remains in print.

How many carbs do you think humans got before we started cultivating wheat?


Though, really, part of the success of LCD is that it's damn hard to eat tons of calories when you're just eating proteins and fats . Built in calorie deficit.

Dragonwolf

Leaving aside the fact that protein has an insulin response as well as carbs, the "carbs spike insulin meaning instant fat gain" nonsense really needs to be shelved. Considering that the value of the global market for weight loss related goods exceeds well over $100 billion you would have thought some bright spark in the pharmaceutical industry would have capitalised on insulin blockers to guarantee fat loss by now. Maybe "they" want to keep us fat to ensure our compliance. Or maybe because it makes naff all difference:

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1463-1326.2006.00645.x/abstract

As I said before I do think "low" carb can work very well for many people but please enough with the insulin is the cause of obesity drama...

Protein doesn't create the same level of insulin response that carbohydrates do (this is pretty well illustrated by comparing the glycemic load of a chicken breast (less than 15) to that of pretty much any high carb food (100-300)*), so the "well, protein causes an insulin response, too!" line holds about as much water as "insulin instantly makes you fat!".

Insulin is a hormone necessary for our bodies to function. It keeps us from overloading our blood with Glucose (which is deadly at too high of levels). However, that doesn't change the fact that extreme difficulty losing weight is a common symptom of insulin resistance, and insulin resistance is a giant red flag for the risk of Type 2 Diabetes. It also doesn't change the fact the chronic exposure to certain substances is linked to certain organs malfunctioning or shutting down entirely (alcoholism and the liver are a prime example of this).

* http://www.lowglycemicload.com/glycemic_table.html

Wonderob

When you're not overeating, and are doing what you're "supposed" to be doing (exercising 3x+ per week moderate-high intensity, eating "good" foods, such as whole grains, lean proteins, etc) and still not losing weight (or worse, still gaining), then yes, it may, in fact, be what you're eating, regardless of how much (or in this case, how little) you're eating.

I would love to see the stats of anyone who is exercising 3+ per week, eating healthy foods, and not overeating (i.e eating at or below their TDEE) and GAINING weight!

In fact I would say that you will not find someone like that

LorinaLynn

This article pertains to gluten rather than just carbs, but it still applies:

http://eatthis.menshealth.com/node/186827 - 6 Gluten-Free Foods That Make You Fat

If you've got a sensitivity or intolerance to carbs, or gluten, or anything else... avoiding it is the smart thing to do. If you don't have a sensitivity or intolerance, avoiding those things isn't going to matter.

FaithandFitness

I started eating low carb to hopefully loose weight. It works because I have lost 24lbs already. But I can honestly say that now, if I didn't loose a sigle ounce more, I would still stay with low carb. I just feel so much better, I am no longert hungry all the time, all my joint aches and pains have gone, funny lumps on my finger joints..gone, asthma medication no longer needed, feflux and stomach pain...gone, sleeping well, alert and focused, much more productive, and just generally happier.

I agree, I am starting to see that carbs (at least the way I was eating them before) are not my friend. I still eat carbs, but I am much more careful about the quality and quantity! It has made a huge difference!

Acg67

Leaving aside the fact that protein has an insulin response as well as carbs, the "carbs spike insulin meaning instant fat gain" nonsense really needs to be shelved. Considering that the value of the global market for weight loss related goods exceeds well over $100 billion you would have thought some bright spark in the pharmaceutical industry would have capitalised on insulin blockers to guarantee fat loss by now. Maybe "they" want to keep us fat to ensure our compliance. Or maybe because it makes naff all difference:

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1463-1326.2006.00645.x/abstract

As I said before I do think "low" carb can work very well for many people but please enough with the insulin is the cause of obesity drama...

Protein doesn't create the same level of insulin response that carbohydrates do (this is pretty well illustrated by comparing the glycemic load of a chicken breast (less than 15) to that of pretty much any high carb food (100-300)*), so the "well, protein causes an insulin response, too!" line holds about as much water as "insulin instantly makes you fat!".

Insulin is a hormone necessary for our bodies to function. It keeps us from overloading our blood with Glucose (which is deadly at too high of levels). However, that doesn't change the fact that extreme difficulty losing weight is a common symptom of insulin resistance, and insulin resistance is a giant red flag for the risk of Type 2 Diabetes. It also doesn't change the fact the chronic exposure to certain substances is linked to certain organs malfunctioning or shutting down entirely (alcoholism and the liver are a prime example of this).

* http://www.lowglycemicload.com/glycemic_table.html

Lol at using the GL to make your point

Holt et al. An insulin index of foods: the insulin demand generated by 1000-kJ portions of common foods. American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, Vol 66, 1264-1276

http://www.ajcn.org/content/66/5/1264.full.pdf+html