Fasting for weight loss vs. anorexia

sabusby

Forgive my ignorance, but I fail to see the difference.

For someone with an ED (in year 9 of recovery) I'm not sure what the difference is. Aren't you both doing it to lose weight? Is anorexia just fasting taken too far?

Discuss!

ilovedeadlifts

Kind of agree.

For the most part (with the exception of IF) fasting is ridiculous.


I guess you're trying to figure out at what point it becomes an ED? I think anytime you completely obssess about it and/or it causes negative effects to your health, it becomes some type of disorder.

Just my 2 cents.

sabusby

Thanks for the reply!

I am, in a way, attempting to construct a 'definition' of sorts.

JayByrd107

I do intermittent fasting on a daily basis. I eat during an 8 hour window and when I do eat, I consume my daily calorie allowance. I am quite, quite far from being anorexic. From what I understand, when anorexics eat, it is too little, too infrequently.

sabusby

I understand. Your fasting is regular...like most people who fast overnight.

I guess I should be more specific and say that when you don't consume your caloric/micro/macro needs for extended periods of time.

TyFit08

Well fasting for weight loss can mean eliminating certain foods from your diet for a period of time. It doesn't have to mean going without food completely. Eating only fruits and vegetables for a month is technically a fast. I do get how if taken too far it can be the same as anorexia, but it doesn't have to be.

ilovedeadlifts

I understand. Your fasting is regular...like most people who fast overnight.

I guess I should be more specific and say that when you don't consume your caloric/micro/macro needs for extended periods of time.

There is definitely a fine line between anorexia and athletes who cut weight for sports and your average gym goers who want to be leaner.

I'd say it comes down to someone eating WAYYY below their needs, for an extended period of time, when they are already underweight.

sobriquet84

i'm sorry, but if you've had an ED, you should know the difference.

anorexia, bulimia, ect.. they are PROGRESSIVE psychological disorders.

a fast is wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am-i'll-try-it-and-see-how-long-i-last... a far cry from a progressive psychological disorder.

DrMAvDPhD

i'm sorry, but if you've had an ED, you should know the difference.

anorexia, bulimia, ect.. they are PROGRESSIVE psychological disorders.

a fast is wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am-i'll-try-it-and-see-how-long-i-last... a far cry from a progressive psychological disorder.

Exactly how do you think EDs start?

"I'll eat a little less today" then "I won't eat all today" then "I won't eat at all this week"

Sounds a lot like "I won't eat for as long as possible" to me.

Beastette

The "professional" definition of a disorder is when the behavior is impacting your life negatively in 2 or more areas. Work AND home. Home and friendships. School and church. Physically and socially. You get the idea.

Technically, it isn't a clinical disorder unless you're having some kind of trouble. So if you are fasting, but you aren't changing your social life, work performance, or physical health for the worse, you don't have a clinical disorder.

You're still playing with fire, imho.

ilovedeadlifts

The "professional" definition of a disorder is when the behavior is impacting your life negatively in 2 or more areas. Work AND home. Home and friendships. School and church. Physically and socially. You get the idea.

Well put. I was trying to think of a way to explain it.

mcarter99

There are a lot of kinds of fasting. The 8 hour window kind is popular now. Brad Pilon's kind (which was like fast a few 24 hours periods in a week, IIRC) was popular. Master Cleanse is always out there. Technically, going not eating from 8pm to 6am is a fast. Of course there are spiritual fasts and political fasts.

I think it's dangerous to paint anyone as potentially anorexic. Usually someone trying the MasterCleanse or other silly fasts like that will be fine on the drink for the 1-10 days (usually 1-2 is enough) and then gain back all the weight lost (or not) and realize there are easier ways. In a way it's probably a good, educational experience and reaffirms their need for a healthy relationship with food. I've seen it suggested in intuitive eating books to do a short term fast just to experience true hunger and your feelings about it.

I suspect true disordered eaters will get to where they are with or without the trendy fasts. But I'm no expert.

auroranflash

i'm sorry, but if you've had an ED, you should know the difference.

anorexia, bulimia, ect.. they are PROGRESSIVE psychological disorders.

a fast is wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am-i'll-try-it-and-see-how-long-i-last... a far cry from a progressive psychological disorder.

^

http://www.something-fishy.org/

I suggest anyone confused should read up on it, knowledge is power and all.

Great site for recovery, also.

secretlobster

Having recovered from an ED myself, I'll just give my take... It becomes "disordered" when you are doing something IN SPITE of your health, rather than FOR it, and the focus is on the action itself (whether it be binging, purging, or fasting) rather than the result.

sabusby

i'm sorry, but if you've had an ED, you should know the difference.

anorexia, bulimia, ect.. they are PROGRESSIVE psychological disorders.

a fast is wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am-i'll-try-it-and-see-how-long-i-last... a far cry from a progressive psychological disorder.

Exactly how do you think EDs start?

"I'll eat a little less today" then "I won't eat all today" then "I won't eat at all this week"

Sounds a lot like "I won't eat for as long as possible" to me.

Not only am I a recovering anorexic (I say 'recovering' because many health professionals recognize it as an addiction) but I'm an RD.

I'm not sure why people who are FASTING don't consider themselves to have ED. My perspective is not from this side.

Thank you, Beastette! Good information.

sabusby

Ah, yes. Too many times was it more of a 'competition' with myself, knowing I'm doing something unhealthy but keeping at it, much like smoking.

That was so many years ago!

auroranflash

Ah, yes. Too many times was it more of a 'competition' with myself, knowing I'm doing something unhealthy but keeping at it, much like smoking.

That was so many years ago!

Glad you are better able to cope now. :flowerforyou:

MoveTheMountain

Forgive my ignorance, but I fail to see the difference.

For someone with an ED (in year 9 of recovery) I'm not sure what the difference is. Aren't you both doing it to lose weight? Is anorexia just fasting taken too far?

Discuss!

I would say yes, effectively, if not specifically (I have no clue what the actual medical definition of anorexia). When I fast, I do it conciously for a 24 hour period of time, usually once per week. The other days I eat a very good amount of food, work out, etc. With fasting, you're definitely not starving yourself, and none of those metabolic self defense mechanisms kick in.

GnochhiGnomes

Anorexics don't always fast, its different for every person.

MoveTheMountain

Kind of agree.

For the most part (with the exception of IF) fasting is ridiculous.


I guess you're trying to figure out at what point it becomes an ED? I think anytime you completely obssess about it and/or it causes negative effects to your health, it becomes some type of disorder.

Just my 2 cents.

So, for the record, all fasting is intermittent fasting. Otherwise, it's called death.

Beastette

i'm sorry, but if you've had an ED, you should know the difference.

anorexia, bulimia, ect.. they are PROGRESSIVE psychological disorders.

a fast is wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am-i'll-try-it-and-see-how-long-i-last... a far cry from a progressive psychological disorder.

Exactly how do you think EDs start?

"I'll eat a little less today" then "I won't eat all today" then "I won't eat at all this week"

Sounds a lot like "I won't eat for as long as possible" to me.

Not only am I a recovering anorexic (I say 'recovering' because many health professionals recognize it as an addiction) but I'm an RD.

I'm not sure why people who are FASTING don't consider themselves to have ED. My perspective is not from this side.

Thank you, Beastette! Good information.

You're welcome.

sabusby

Haha! We're splitting hairs, now. :laugh:

bagge72

Then wouldn't counting calories be the samething? I think the difference is that with anorexia it is taken to far with such a little amount of food, but when most people talk about fasting on here they are talking about fasting for a short period of time, but still getting the same amount of calories in for the day. If somebody is doing a cleanse type fast then I think the difference is self control.

onikonor

Fasting alone will not make you an anorexic. But then again, it depends how people interpret fasting. If people fast based on religion beliefs or personal reasons but then resume eating normally I don't consider this anorexia.

Taken from http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/anorexia+nervosa

Diagnosis

Diagnosis of anorexia nervosa is complicated by a number of factors. One is that the disorder varies somewhat in severity from patient to patient. A second factor is that most anorectics deny that they are ill. Eventually they usually are brought to treatment by a family member. Most anorectics are diagnosed by pediatricians or family practitioners.

Anorexia nervosa is diagnosed when most of the following conditions are present:

- an overriding obsession with food and thinness that controls activities and eating patterns every hour of every day
- the individual weighs less than 85% of the average weight for his or her age and height group and willfully and intentionally refuses to maintain an appropriate body weight
- extreme fear of gaining weight or becoming fat, even when the individual is significantly underweight.
- a distorted self-image that fuels a refusal to admit to being underweight, even when this is demonstrably true
- refusal to admit that being severely underweight is dangerous to health
- for women, three missed menstrual periods in a row after menstruation has been established

MoveTheMountain

Having recovered from an ED myself, I'll just give my take... It becomes "disordered" when you are doing something IN SPITE of your health, rather than FOR it, and the focus is on the action itself (whether it be binging, purging, or fasting) rather than the result.

Not to make it fit on a bumper sticker or anything, but I would say when it's controlling you and you're not controlling it...

PANZERIA

Anorexics don't always fast, its different for every person.

Umm...where exactly do you get this idea from?

Yes, typically, anorexia goes hand in hand with bulimia, but that's a completely different disorder. Both are notorious to abuse laxatives and exercise excessively, but the definition of anorexia is someone who refuses to eat in order to get to a goal weight that is never 'thin enough.'

And to the OP, as a recovering ana/mia myself, I totally understand. When people talking about 'fasting,' I just roll my eyes. Completely ridiculous.

auroranflash

Anorexics don't always fast, its different for every person.

Umm...where exactly do you get this idea from?

Yes, typically, anorexia goes hand in hand with bulimia, but that's a completely different disorder. Both are notorious to abuse laxatives and exercise excessively, but the definition of anorexia is someone who refuses to eat in order to get to a goal weight that is never 'thin enough.'

And to the OP, as a recovering ana/mia myself, I totally understand. When people talking about 'fasting,' I just roll my eyes. Completely ridiculous.

Starving oneself can be a symptom of anorexia. Choosing not to eat for a span of time does not mean one is anorexic.

LaurasClimb

Kind of agree.

For the most part (with the exception of IF) fasting is ridiculous.


I guess you're trying to figure out at what point it becomes an ED? I think anytime you completely obssess about it and/or it causes negative effects to your health, it becomes some type of disorder.

Just my 2 cents.

So, for the record, all fasting is intermittent fasting. Otherwise, it's called death.

LOL...this really cracked me up!

I would say the difference is that when a person fasts (be it for weightloss or religious purposes or whatever), there is a starting point and a stopping point. "I'm going to fast for 24 hours then start eating again." kind of thing. I would assume (since this is not a condition I have) that an ED such as anorexia takes on a whole different life - it consumes a person. They are not going to eat until...well?? until they feel it is safe to eat and not gain weight?? IDK.

Just my two cents...

Rach_Gem_n_Disguise

Being anorexic in my teens ....I have to say for me it had nothing to do with fasting. It's different for each individual. For me back then, I only consumed 20 grams of fat per day....pretty much only ate the same thing for lunch and dinner every day. I got very ill doing so. Luckily, thank God I know longer am living that lifestyle but will always have a complex about body image. That never goes away.

I also have to agree with another person who posted if you've ever had an ED, you'd know the difference between fasting and having an eating disorder. Some people fast for religious reasons, etc....doesn't mean they have an eating disorder.

SeaChele77

Fasting is a far cry from an ED. People who fast do it to cleanse or even for religious reasons. They are doing it the healthy way and know how and when to go back to consuming the right amount of calories for their body. Someone with ED is OBSESSED - meaning they do it day in day out 24/7 365!! Its not about a 24hr or 3 day cleanse or for a religious practice - its because they have a disordered view of themselves and have an extreme need for control. Additionally, many anorexics do not "fast" they just consume very small amount of food and their caloric intake is minimal to what they "need". They consume the bare minimum just to function. Those who fast do it as a temporary means. There is a huge difference and I'm sorry but as someone in recovery to another - Im very suprsed you can't recognize the difference!!!

secretlobster

Not to make it fit on a bumper sticker or anything, but I would say when it's controlling you and you're not controlling it...

Maybe I can get it to drive my car for me, so that I can read and play on my phone during my commute!