Confused can anyone clear this up?
A_Shannigans
Posts: 170 Member
I have of course read that you can't build muscle while burning fat. I have also read that you can no idea which is true but...
What concerns me more is I've seen it said a few times on here that you more or less to have to lift to build muscle and you can't/don't build muscle doing aerobic exercise.
Would that depend on the type?
aren't running and biking aerobic exercise? Underneath my newly found flab I have very muscular legs that I got fro running in junior high and high school.
I'm just trying to get an idea of how much I can tighten up before I have to break down and get weights.
What concerns me more is I've seen it said a few times on here that you more or less to have to lift to build muscle and you can't/don't build muscle doing aerobic exercise.
Would that depend on the type?
aren't running and biking aerobic exercise? Underneath my newly found flab I have very muscular legs that I got fro running in junior high and high school.
I'm just trying to get an idea of how much I can tighten up before I have to break down and get weights.
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Replies
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I have of course read that you can't build muscle while burning fat. I have also read that you can no idea which is true but...
What concerns me more is I've seen it said a few times on here that you more or less to have to lift to build muscle and you can't/don't build muscle doing aerobic exercise.
Would that depend on the type?
aren't running and biking aerobic exercise? Underneath my newly found flab I have very muscular legs that I got fro running in junior high and high school.
I'm just trying to get an idea of how much I can tighten up before I have to break down and get weights.
Building muscle will in turn burn fat, for your body to hold muscle it will burn calories to do so and it burns more than holding fat does, as long as diet is right then the fact you have built muscle will overall contribute to fat loss, however muscle weighs more than fat due to its density therefore weight may stay the same or even increase but body shape will change
As for anaerobic vs aerobic, any exercise builds muscle if the muscle is broken down and enough protein in diet to repair it.
Running builds muscle and burns fat, but it all rests on diet.0 -
most cardio exercises build lean muscle i think that may be where things get confusing when lifting weights the muscle you achieve doing that burns calories longer than lean muscle does. hope this helps..? haha0
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Are you saying there is more than one type of muscle?most cardio exercises build lean muscle i think that may be where things get confusing when lifting weights the muscle you achieve doing that burns calories longer than lean muscle does. hope this helps..? haha
What type of muscle is made from weight lifting?
As is this related to fast and slow twitch?
Now i'm all confussed, off to google muscle.......0 -
Are you saying there is more than one type of muscle?most cardio exercises build lean muscle i think that may be where things get confusing when lifting weights the muscle you achieve doing that burns calories longer than lean muscle does. hope this helps..? haha
What type of muscle is made from weight lifting?
As is this related to fast and slow twitch?
Now i'm all confussed, off to google muscle.......
No, there is no such thing.
Muscle is muscle, you will either hold less water and fat and look lean or you wont, the muscle remains the same.
the slow twitch/fast twitch refer to the fibers that get exercised and subdivied the musle due to red and white muscle, but none of it is lean, it is all skeletal, there is no difference in the muscle leanness in ryan reynolds or butterbean the boxer, the difference is the fat and water held, the muscle "leanness" stays the same
Holding muscle burns calories, in short build it and enjoy it.
peace0 -
Are you saying there is more than one type of muscle?most cardio exercises build lean muscle i think that may be where things get confusing when lifting weights the muscle you achieve doing that burns calories longer than lean muscle does. hope this helps..? haha
What type of muscle is made from weight lifting?
As is this related to fast and slow twitch?
Now i'm all confussed, off to google muscle.......
The biggest bit of advice I can give is dont believe anything that the armchair nutritionists and fitness experts say on an uncertified website. Whilst some of it may be correct or true the vast majority is not and so if you pick and choose what to believe you will pick and choose what you want to believe.
99.9% of the posts made on here telling people facts are either badly informed, utter nonesense or well meaning but rubbish. All you can do is what is right for you and since you are 2/3 of your way to goal it seems you know what that is
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I have of course read that you can't build muscle while burning fat. I have also read that you can no idea which is true but...
What concerns me more is I've seen it said a few times on here that you more or less to have to lift to build muscle and you can't/don't build muscle doing aerobic exercise.
Would that depend on the type?
aren't running and biking aerobic exercise? Underneath my newly found flab I have very muscular legs that I got fro running in junior high and high school.
I'm just trying to get an idea of how much I can tighten up before I have to break down and get weights.
Building muscle will in turn burn fat, for your body to hold muscle it will burn calories to do so and it burns more than holding fat does, as long as diet is right then the fact you have built muscle will overall contribute to fat loss, however muscle weighs more than fat due to its density therefore weight may stay the same or even increase but body shape will change
As for anaerobic vs aerobic, any exercise builds muscle if the muscle is broken down and enough protein in diet to repair it.
Running builds muscle and burns fat, but it all rests on diet.
I am more interested in my shape and size than my weight. The only reason I even know my weight is because I was getting bigger and err softer.
I think I have the diet pert down in so far as I know I have to watch what I eat and how much and pretty much only drink water. That part came easier than I thought it would (giving up coke was the most difficult followed by coffee but I can't do coffee with no sugar so it had to go).0 -
Are you saying there is more than one type of muscle?most cardio exercises build lean muscle i think that may be where things get confusing when lifting weights the muscle you achieve doing that burns calories longer than lean muscle does. hope this helps..? haha
What type of muscle is made from weight lifting?
As is this related to fast and slow twitch?
Now i'm all confussed, off to google muscle.......
The biggest bit of advice I can give is dont believe anything that the armchair nutritionists and fitness experts say on an uncertified website. Whilst some of it may be correct or true the vast majority is not and so if you pick and choose what to believe you will pick and choose what you want to believe.
99.9% of the posts made on here telling people facts are either badly informed, utter nonesense or well meaning but rubbish. All you can do is what is right for you and since you are 2/3 of your way to goal it seems you know what that is
That's one of the reasons I'm going to see a nutritionist. I want someone who can advise me about me.0 -
[
[/quote]
The biggest bit of advice I can give is dont believe anything that the armchair nutritionists and fitness experts say on an uncertified website. Whilst some of it may be correct or true the vast majority is not and so if you pick and choose what to believe you will pick and choose what you want to believe.
99.9% of the posts made on here telling people facts are either badly informed, utter nonesense or well meaning but rubbish. All you can do is what is right for you and since you are 2/3 of your way to goal it seems you know what that is
[/quote]
Wow.....somebody sensible!0 -
Lifting weights is awesome0
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Cardio conditions muscle but doesn't "build" it as in cause muscles to grow in size. Isn't it really academic though? Are you looking to get big? If not do a mix of cardio and strenght training and maintain your deficit. You will get leaner and your muscles will develop and condition. You'll look better and feel better.0
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^^^^^^^^^what pags just said x2
Whatever for this "debate". Just go ahead and start doing whatever cardio you prefer and at the same time begin a strength building routine. Make sure you are in a calorie deficit and you will start improving immediately. There's no debate here, just "delay". Get started. Today.0 -
^^^^^^^^^what pags just said x2
Whatever for this "debate". Just go ahead and start doing whatever cardio you prefer and at the same time begin a strength building routine. Make sure you are in a calorie deficit and you will start improving immediately. There's no debate here, just "delay". Get started. Today.
Too funny man! Everyone here always calls me mma or mmapags, you just called me pags which has been the nickname I've been called ever since grammer school and my father was called before me. First time ever on here. You must be a psychic!! lol
Totally agree on the "delay" thing!0 -
^^^^^^^^^what pags just said x2
Whatever for this "debate". Just go ahead and start doing whatever cardio you prefer and at the same time begin a strength building routine. Make sure you are in a calorie deficit and you will start improving immediately. There's no debate here, just "delay". Get started. Today.
Too funny man! Everyone here always calls me mma or mmapags, you just called me pags which has been the nickname I've been called ever since grammer school and my father was called before me. First time ever on here. You must be a psychic!! lol
Totally agree on the "delay" thing!
I always thought it was fairly obvious that Pags was the name here, but I'm a frigging genius so it was easy for me..... :happy:0 -
I always thought it was fairly obvious that Pags was the name here, but I'm a frigging genius so it was easy for me..... :happy:
You are man! That's obvious!! :laugh:0 -
MY experience is that no amount of cardio in the world is going to tighten things up without weight lifting. My current profile pic is how much ChaLEAN tightened me up in 60 days. I was always a cardio addict for over 15 yrs and always had loose skin on my legs and even though I'm 39, ChaLEAN really helped to tighten them up. I'm hoping to build on that with P90X but ChaLEAN got me addicted to weight lifting and I LOVE it!!0
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Thank you for the link it was an interesting read. It didn't really get to the heart of what I'm trying to find out though.
I'm still seeing a lot of "can't build muscle doing cardio". Running and biking are cardio...yes? You build leg muscle doing those this I know from experience. The implication from many is that muscles only develop when lifting.
It seems to me they can only develop so far without lifting but they will develop to a degree without it... Is that incorrect?0 -
Thank you for the link it was an interesting read. It didn't really get to the heart of what I'm trying to find out though.
I'm still seeing a lot of "can't build muscle doing cardio". Running and biking are cardio...yes? You build leg muscle doing those this I know from experience. The implication from many is that muscles only develop when lifting.
It seems to me they can only develop so far without lifting but they will develop to a degree without it... Is that incorrect?
Sure! Now that we've got that squared away, let's get to the good stuff, you know, the actual working out. What's the plan for this week.0 -
Thank you for the link it was an interesting read. It didn't really get to the heart of what I'm trying to find out though.
I'm still seeing a lot of "can't build muscle doing cardio". Running and biking are cardio...yes? You build leg muscle doing those this I know from experience. The implication from many is that muscles only develop when lifting.
It seems to me they can only develop so far without lifting but they will develop to a degree without it... Is that incorrect?
Sure! Now that we've got that squared away, let's get to the good stuff, you know, the actual working out. What's the plan for this week.
I'm way out of shape so I've been doing walk away the pounds twice a day everyday but Sunday (off day). Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays I am adding to that pushups, situps and squats from the 100 pushups, 200situps, 200 squats porgram.
Next week I'm going to replace one session of walk away the pounds with a session of Tae Bo.
I don't have any weights right now so that's it. I lost 3 pounds (possibly water weight though) in week 1. However my main goal is to get back to at least a size 9 and not be flabby.0 -
Mainly it is because in far too many studies, those that ate and deficit and only did cardio exercise lost lean body mass, some of it muscle.
Those that ate at same deficit and only did resistance (strength) training maintained their LBM.
Those that did no exercise lost the most LBM.
In all those studies I've seen, the deficit is pretty big compared to previous eating levels, 1000 or more, and that may not be realistic.
Haven't seen the study that was done with moderate deficit, and would the cardio and no exercise group still lose LBM?
So no, cardio exercise doesn't work the muscle the same way as strength training. For use in aerobic exercise the muscle need not get bigger.
Ever seen the difference in muscle between sprinter and distance runner?
And it's not like the sprinters (outside of football anyway) are doing upper body lifting to increase muscle. Carrying more weight than needed for your sport at pro level is never good, so they don't need it. They just get it because sprints is like weight lifting, it can build muscle.
At a deficit though, you can build muscle if you have a small deficit, eat enough protein, and lift heavy.
And it won't be much actually built up.
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/447514-athletes-can-gain-muscle-while-losing-fat-on-deficit-diet
When you do cardio, your body just learns to store more glucose/water in the muscle for future energy needs.
If you want to see the difference in muscle soreness between say a long hard run and strength training, next 45 min run you do, after 5 min warm up and running at normal pace, sprint all out for 30 sec pushing as hard as you can, just count it out. Recover jog for 4 min.
Do it again, 6 times total. Cool down.
Now see how the muscle feels the next day.0 -
Thank you for the link it was an interesting read. It didn't really get to the heart of what I'm trying to find out though.
I'm still seeing a lot of "can't build muscle doing cardio". Running and biking are cardio...yes? You build leg muscle doing those this I know from experience. The implication from many is that muscles only develop when lifting.
It seems to me they can only develop so far without lifting but they will develop to a degree without it... Is that incorrect?
Muscle gets stronger when you place a harder load on it.
What harder load are you placing on it by cardio? Mainly a load that is improved by better heart and lung functions, that's what improves.
You may use some of the fat stores in the muscle, and on top of the muscle, but the muscle itself doesn't have to grow much for that kind of load.
Hence the reason athletes have very specific training that puts a real load on the muscles outside the aerobic system. Some of it is anaerobic training, dealing with lactate acid, ect, but mainly it is putting a real load on it to grow more muscle.
And that's not from cardio, but from lifting for their sport or intervals.0 -
Thank you for the link it was an interesting read. It didn't really get to the heart of what I'm trying to find out though.
I'm still seeing a lot of "can't build muscle doing cardio". Running and biking are cardio...yes? You build leg muscle doing those this I know from experience. The implication from many is that muscles only develop when lifting.
It seems to me they can only develop so far without lifting but they will develop to a degree without it... Is that incorrect?
Muscle gets stronger when you place a harder load on it.
What harder load are you placing on it by cardio? Mainly a load that is improved by better heart and lung functions, that's what improves.
You may use some of the fat stores in the muscle, and on top of the muscle, but the muscle itself doesn't have to grow much for that kind of load.
Hence the reason athletes have very specific training that puts a real load on the muscles outside the aerobic system. Some of it is anaerobic training, dealing with lactate acid, ect, but mainly it is putting a real load on it to grow more muscle.
And that's not from cardio, but from lifting for their sport or intervals.
So what you're saying is... back when I was distance running. My muscles weren't developing I was just losing some fat that was covering them up?0 -
Thank you for the link it was an interesting read. It didn't really get to the heart of what I'm trying to find out though.
I'm still seeing a lot of "can't build muscle doing cardio". Running and biking are cardio...yes? You build leg muscle doing those this I know from experience. The implication from many is that muscles only develop when lifting.
It seems to me they can only develop so far without lifting but they will develop to a degree without it... Is that incorrect?
Sure! Now that we've got that squared away, let's get to the good stuff, you know, the actual working out. What's the plan for this week.
I'm way out of shape so I've been doing walk away the pounds twice a day everyday but Sunday (off day). Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays I am adding to that pushups, situps and squats from the 100 pushups, 200situps, 200 squats porgram.
Next week I'm going to replace one session of walk away the pounds with a session of Tae Bo.
I don't have any weights right now so that's it. I lost 3 pounds (possibly water weight though) in week 1. However my main goal is to get back to at least a size 9 and not be flabby.
Sounds like an excellent plan. You can do plenty of work with just bodyweight exercises. Hopefully on your walking path there will be something that you can use for chin ups, even if the best you can do right now is static arm hangs. Also, once or twice a week add in something like this :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yoQOcrjNQs&feature=youtube_gdata_player 0 -
Thank you for the link it was an interesting read. It didn't really get to the heart of what I'm trying to find out though.
I'm still seeing a lot of "can't build muscle doing cardio". Running and biking are cardio...yes? You build leg muscle doing those this I know from experience. The implication from many is that muscles only develop when lifting.
It seems to me they can only develop so far without lifting but they will develop to a degree without it... Is that incorrect?
Sure! Now that we've got that squared away, let's get to the good stuff, you know, the actual working out. What's the plan for this week.
I'm way out of shape so I've been doing walk away the pounds twice a day everyday but Sunday (off day). Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays I am adding to that pushups, situps and squats from the 100 pushups, 200situps, 200 squats porgram.
Next week I'm going to replace one session of walk away the pounds with a session of Tae Bo.
I don't have any weights right now so that's it. I lost 3 pounds (possibly water weight though) in week 1. However my main goal is to get back to at least a size 9 and not be flabby.
Sounds like an excellent plan. You can do plenty of work with just bodyweight exercises. Hopefully on your walking path there will be something that you can use for chin ups, even if the best you can do right now is static arm hangs. Also, once or twice a week add in something like this :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yoQOcrjNQs&feature=youtube_gdata_player
That looks very challenging. I saved it for later. Thanks for the link I'll have to browse through her other ones as well. she's close to the shape I'm aiming for. Maybe not quite as muscular...I'll see.0 -
So what you're saying is... back when I was distance running. My muscles weren't developing I was just losing some fat that was covering them up?
Distance running? So you were already running for a bit?
Yep, mainly fat loss.
Now, if you are doing Couch to 5K and running for the first time in years, yes, muscle will get stronger too, because compared to before, that is a load to build stronger for. But first current muscles have to be tapped out, and the cardio improvements will come first.
But if eating at a big deficit and not enough protein, and cardio is it, no, no extra muscle being built.
You add on 5 miles to your running in a week, no, no extra muscle needed. Better glucose stores, better fat usage.
You try to increase your pace by 15 sec / mile, no, no extra muscle needed. Better lung/heart/oxygen delivery, better dealing with lactic acid.
You sprint up a hill and do a series of that, and allow proper rest the next day, and eat enough and enough protein, yes, extra muscle needed for that. Once the cardio system has improved what it can first, since that's easiest to improve.
No need having extra muscle that needs oxygen if your delivery system isn't as good as it needs to be.0 -
You might see slight gain in size from cardio, but nothing major. A good bit of it will be increased water and nutrient storage vs real muscle growth.
Yes, there ARE different types of muscle i.e. Type I fibers Type IIA Type IIB etc, and different types of growth i.e. myofibrillar vs sarcoplamsic, but that is of no consiquence here.
If you want to get serious with lifting and looking like the best you possible, check this out http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/686963-large-collection-of-info-for-beginners0 -
You might see slight gain in size from cardio, but nothing major. A good bit of it will be increased water and nutrient storage vs real muscle growth.
Yes, there ARE different types of muscle i.e. Type I fibers Type IIA Type IIB etc, and different types of growth i.e. myofibrillar vs sarcoplamsic, but that is of no consiquence here.
If you want to get serious with lifting and looking like the best you possible, check this out http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/686963-large-collection-of-info-for-beginners
I don't want a gain in size. I mainly want to prevent muscle loss. I might want to increase muscle on my arms and core but I will worry about that later. My legs are fine once I trim that fat off so long as I don''t LOSE any muscle.0 -
You might see slight gain in size from cardio, but nothing major. A good bit of it will be increased water and nutrient storage vs real muscle growth.
Yes, there ARE different types of muscle i.e. Type I fibers Type IIA Type IIB etc, and different types of growth i.e. myofibrillar vs sarcoplamsic, but that is of no consiquence here.
If you want to get serious with lifting and looking like the best you possible, check this out http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/686963-large-collection-of-info-for-beginners
I don't want a gain in size. I mainly want to prevent muscle loss. I might want to increase muscle on my arms and core but I will worry about that later. My legs are fine once I trim that fat off so long as I don''t LOSE any muscle.
You won't gain significant size. Even if you were to try really really hard, it would take a few years.0 -
I'd love to read your post and reply but the kitten in your avatar is impossibly adorable and keeps distracting me.0
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To the OP: yes, there is a big difference b/w slow twitch and fast twitch muscles fibers.
-Endurance exercise hits the slow twitch muscle fibers, which do not have that much potential for hypertrophy. They can get much stronger, but they don't get huge like the fast twitch muscle fibers do. However, you can definitely increase strength and muscle size with cardio. Nor will you lose much muscle if you start off from being sedentary (you dont' have much to begin with afterall). Look at the upper bodies of people who do crew. Are they small, no. Look at the legs of runners and bikers. Even marathon runners have leg muscles:
http://rwdaily.runnersworld.com/2012/01/behold-ryan-halls-left-quadriceps.html
-Resistance and High intensity exercise hits the fast twitch fibers that have much more potential for hypertrophy. So that's the way to get large muscles and maintain them while burning fat.0
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