Low carb diets?

FeebRyan

You should read a book called Wheat Belly... it is a total eye opener regarding bread and wheat It's so well written!

I am GF so i dont eat wheat, bread or many grains but i certainly eat many carbohydrates and am not at all on a 'low carb' diet.

people seem to confuse the two a lot.

where do most of your carbs come from? and do you feel like they help you maintain/lose weight or do you look at calories more?

Rice, potatoes (only have potatoes once a week though) beans, loads from apples, apple juice, bananas etc (would be more varied fruit in the summer but we simply cannot afford such things now) plus rice milk and I have a couple of nutty/dried fruity snack type bars a day because i am always on the go and cannot afford the time it takes to make another 2 gluten-dairy free meals lol

so yeah, i suppose i probably eat too much sugar (with the bars) but mostly from things like rice cakes and fruit.

And I am always around what MFP says i should eat on carbs, sometimes a bit over actually I often wonder if i should be reducing it.

Spartan_Maker

Explain? I'm a science major, and I don't believe that is true. What I'm interested in is how it plays a role in thermodynamincs

I'm an engineer, so I share your curiosity to expand beyond Cal in/out, and I believe that the body works in far more complex ways than that. I've only been on this site for a day and it seems that the tribal knowledge here discounts cellular response to different types of stimuli and refers to calorie counting as the only factor in losing weight. I think there should be a clear distinction in losing weight versus losing fat, as I'm not concerned about the scale but more so what the calipers say.

If you're looking to do some research, check into John Kiefer. His works cited is always worth checking out and he backs everything up with scientifically reviewed publications.

I agree with this. Mostly everyone on here only focuses on cal in/out but i do think the type of calories matters in fat loss also. Would you still lose weight eating 2000 calories of chocolate a day if you also burn 2000 calories a day? (just talking about losing weight, not nutritional value).

You'd maintain

but if you are eating all chocolate calories, there is not a difference if you would eat all protein calories? i just find this strange.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/index.html
Twinkie diet. He ate one can of vegetables, one protein shake, a multivitamin, and filled the rest if his daily calories with snack cakes, potato chips, sugary cereals, cookies, pastries, and other sugary foods. He stuck to a consistent calorie goal, and lost 27 pounds, and all of his health markers improved considerably.

It really is all about calories. Low carb is just another form of calorie restriction, that's really what makes it successful. Everything else is just smoke and mirrors.

Interesting! Thanks for a link.... I like to actually read them for myself

What I've always found most interesting about Professor Haub's experiment is that of the 27 lbs. he lost, 24 were from fat and just 3 were from lean mass; this, in spite of the fact that he appears to have had very little protein in his diet. A protein shake is maybe 26 grams and it's difficult to imagine that the rest of the stuff he ate added up to much more than another 26 grams.

luzmidd

Keep it simple - lean meats, lots of egg whites, lots of fibrous veg (broccoli, spinach, etc), avoid refined carbs (white flour, sugar, etc). The thing about those foods is that none of them are calorie-dense which means that you can eat tons of food and never be hungry. You can't get fat eating broccoli - it's impossible, there are no calories in it. I ate a pound of chicken breast at lunch. Plus broccoli, and I'm still stuffed. I had 6 eggs for breakfast. With a slice of cheese. It was like 350 calories - nothing. So if you focus on the lean things, (organic is bogus btw) and try to hit your calorie targets, just by the nature of it you will be eating a low fat, low carb diet. I view it as a byproduct of retaining muscle and not just simply the goal of eating "low carb" because that is supposed to be the Holy Grail.

What this person said! I am on low carb diet (dukan diet), it is the only way I lose weight! I don't train seriously, but I do exercise for 30 minutes a day, I try and stick to protein and veg only. Remember, there are good carbs and bad carbs... Good carbs = veggies (yes, carbs in veg, not a lot, but still there) carbs in fruit, carbs in nuts etc. Bad carbs = refined, white, starchy rice, bread, pasta etc. I don't follow paleo but what they say makes a lot of sense when it comes to low carbs: If it is from an animal or came out of the ground, its probably good for you. And that includes potatoes, limited, but they aren't all that bad for you!

Wheat, rice, and sugarcane all come out of the ground. Just thought you'd like to know. There's no such thing as a "good" or "bad" carb, that's just mythical marketing that the diet industry uses to make money.

Sugarcane gets processed, unless you add sugarcane to your coffee... same with wheat products and refined white rice. All things processed... Wouldn't you consider those being bad for you? No reason to be rude by the way, I was just stating my point of view, as most people do here...

And yes, I will eventually start adding certain carbs back to my diet once I have reached my goal weight, but again, carbs that are good for you (and no, good carb, bad carb in NOT a myth) good carbs like sweet potatoe, pumpkin etc.

tigersword

Everything is processed. Fruit, vegetables, cuts of meat. All processed by the farmer and prepped for market. There's really no difference between a butcher cutting steaks and a miller grinding wheat into flour, or grinding sugarcane into sugar. And no, I don't think staple crops that humans have lived on for thousands of years are bad for us. Without wheat, roughly two thirds of the world population wouldn't exist, as millions of people would've starved to death decades ago.

luzmidd

Yes, but as a lot of people's mission on this website is to lose weight, starvation isn't really an issue. And yes, everything is processed, but its still natural versus refined. I'd still go for natural. And seeing as I live in one of those deprived third world countries, I actually do know that most of the people here live off the land, and aren't that big into refined anything...

FittyNotFattie2014

"

Wheat, rice, and sugarcane all come out of the ground. Just thought you'd like to know. There's no such thing as a "good" or "bad" carb, that's just mythical marketing that the diet industry uses to make money.
[/quote]"

Am I wrong in thinking that whole foods (Good Carbs) (brown rice, brown pasta, rye bread) "better" that white bread, white rice and white bread? (bad cards)

I.e slower release energy, less sugar, more fiber and so on?
[/quote]

No, you're right

Acg67

"

Wheat, rice, and sugarcane all come out of the ground. Just thought you'd like to know. There's no such thing as a "good" or "bad" carb, that's just mythical marketing that the diet industry uses to make money.
[/quote]"

Am I wrong in thinking that whole foods (Good Carbs) (brown rice, brown pasta, rye bread) "better" that white bread, white rice and white bread? (bad cards)

I.e slower release energy, less sugar, more fiber and so on?
[/quote]

Yes

FeebRyan

I thought it was basically about how much work your body has to do to get the sugar from the food

so because in brown rice and brown bread the husk has been left on, the grain has not been rolled so fine, your body has more work to do in ITS process

therefore the sugar it gets from the product has already been used up a little bit in getting to the sugar.

Bakkasan

I love when people either do not know or just ignore the fact that people who eat low carb have a several hundred calorie advantage over lowfat high carb dieters. There are several different metabolic reasons for it.
It is also an effective treatment for type 2 diabetes.

But ignoring this, and several other good reasons to TRY a low carb diet, blindly bashing it is really cool on MFP. I have consistently lost weight when clearly not in a deficit when adhering to LC. 3000 calories a day. Bacon and eggs, ribeye steaks, chicken wings, lots of high fiber low GI veggies. Sometimes it's just hard to not want taters bread and pasta.

Any diet can work, and if you want to eat 10 twinkies a day or 4 big honkin steaks it does not matter. It's your choice and if it works for you do it.

tigersword

I thought it was basically about how much work your body has to do to get the sugar from the food

so because in brown rice and brown bread the husk has been left on, the grain has not been rolled so fine, your body has more work to do in ITS process

therefore the sugar it gets from the product has already been used up a little bit in getting to the sugar.

That's not it. It's fiber. Fiber slows digestion. That's all there is to it. Eat white rice with a high fiber vegetable and you get the same exact effect. The dirty secret that the "good carb bad carb" proponents always conveniently leave out is the simple fact that insulin responses, blood sugar increases, and all that only applies when you eat that single carb source by itself, and wait until your body digests it before eating anything else. Eat a piece of white bread, and you get a relatively quick influx of sugar. Put butter on that white bread, and you get a much lower blood sugar spike and insulin response. In other words, it's pretty much irrelevant when you consider the way people normally eat.

Acg67

I love when people either do not know or just ignore the fact that people who eat low carb have a several hundred calorie advantage over lowfat high carb dieters. There are several different metabolic reasons for it.
It is also an effective treatment for type 2 diabetes.

But ignoring this, and several other good reasons to TRY a low carb diet, blindly bashing it is really cool on MFP. I have consistently lost weight when clearly not in a deficit when adhering to LC. 3000 calories a day. Bacon and eggs, ribeye steaks, chicken wings, lots of high fiber low GI veggies. Sometimes it's just hard to not want taters bread and pasta.

Care to explain the wizardry that allows for fat loss while not in a deficit

tigersword

I love when people either do not know or just ignore the fact that people who eat low carb have a several hundred calorie advantage over lowfat high carb dieters. There are several different metabolic reasons for it.
It is also an effective treatment for type 2 diabetes.

But ignoring this, and several other good reasons to TRY a low carb diet, blindly bashing it is really cool on MFP. I have consistently lost weight when clearly not in a deficit when adhering to LC. 3000 calories a day. Bacon and eggs, ribeye steaks, chicken wings, lots of high fiber low GI veggies. Sometimes it's just hard to not want taters bread and pasta.

Care to explain the wizardry that allows for fat loss while not in a deficit

To be fair, he said weight, not fat. Low carb means losing significant water weight as glycogen levels drop, you don't need to be in a deficit to drop water weight. You do need a deficit to lose fat however. I've also lost 60 pounds of fat eating 3000 calories a day, not cutting carbs, I just burn 3500 calories a day between my active job and exercise regimen.

chsmith79

What are your opinions and experiences with them and (about) how many calories are you eating on them?

thanks!

I have done a low-carb diet( <30 grams/day) 3 different times. I lost 40+ lbs twice and 20+ the third time. Never kept up with calories. I ate as much as I wanted and never exercised. I can't give any scientific evidence as to why it works other than if your body doesn't have any carbs to burn for "fuel" it turns to the stored fat. They have really worked for me but this last time, after I gained everything I lost back and more, I went to counting calories and basically eating less and doing CF. To maintain the Low-carb diet(for me) is just too hard long term. I believe eating less and exercising is better and healthier for me. That being said I still try to watch what carbs I eat. More veggies/fruit and less starches. I will eat rice,pasta,potatoes,corn, etc. just in moderation. Like 1/4 cup or even just a spoonful, just to get the taste but not go crazy. That's just me, everybody is different.

NovoActive

I love when people either do not know or just ignore the fact that people who eat low carb have a several hundred calorie advantage over lowfat high carb dieters. There are several different metabolic reasons for it.
It is also an effective treatment for type 2 diabetes.

But ignoring this, and several other good reasons to TRY a low carb diet, blindly bashing it is really cool on MFP. I have consistently lost weight when clearly not in a deficit when adhering to LC. 3000 calories a day. Bacon and eggs, ribeye steaks, chicken wings, lots of high fiber low GI veggies. Sometimes it's just hard to not want taters bread and pasta.

Care to explain the wizardry that allows for fat loss while not in a deficit

To be fair, he said weight, not fat. Low carb means losing significant water weight as glycogen levels drop, you don't need to be in a deficit to drop water weight. You do need a deficit to lose fat however. I've also lost 60 pounds of fat eating 3000 calories a day, not cutting carbs, I just burn 3500 calories a day between my active job and exercise regimen.

Care to explain the wizardry that allows for fat loss while not in a deficit ---> When you eat a diet low in carbs you secrete less insulin (the primary anabolic hormone responsible for fat storage) so you sore less fat (this fat can be derived from dietary fat or carbs, However the carbs will only contribute to fat storage if your muscle and liver glycogen is saturated).
Also a comparing two isocaloric diets one with high protein and one with high carb, the thermal effect will greatly contribute to
daily energy expenditure due to the fact that a human body needs to use as much as 25% more energy to digest protein compared to carbs that yields same amount of calories.

"Low carb means losing significant water weight as glycogen levels drop" ---> You do know you dehydrate by only loosing 3% of your bodies water mass? Or do you mean "significant water weight" from the water attached to the glycogen molecules only? That would mean you need to severely deprive your body from its stored energy (muscle and liver glycogen).
This is not a sound explanation.

Spartan_Maker

I love when people either do not know or just ignore the fact that people who eat low carb have a several hundred calorie advantage over lowfat high carb dieters. There are several different metabolic reasons for it.
It is also an effective treatment for type 2 diabetes.

But ignoring this, and several other good reasons to TRY a low carb diet, blindly bashing it is really cool on MFP. I have consistently lost weight when clearly not in a deficit when adhering to LC. 3000 calories a day. Bacon and eggs, ribeye steaks, chicken wings, lots of high fiber low GI veggies. Sometimes it's just hard to not want taters bread and pasta.

Care to explain the wizardry that allows for fat loss while not in a deficit

To be fair, he said weight, not fat. Low carb means losing significant water weight as glycogen levels drop, you don't need to be in a deficit to drop water weight. You do need a deficit to lose fat however. I've also lost 60 pounds of fat eating 3000 calories a day, not cutting carbs, I just burn 3500 calories a day between my active job and exercise regimen.

Care to explain the wizardry that allows for fat loss while not in a deficit ---> When you eat a diet low in carbs you secrete less insulin (the primary anabolic hormone responsible for fat storage) so you sore less fat (this fat can be derived from dietary fat or carbs, However the carbs will only contribute to fat storage if your muscle and liver glycogen is saturated).
Also a comparing two isocaloric diets one with high protein and one with high carb, the thermal effect will greatly contribute to
daily energy expenditure due to the fact that a human body needs to use as much as 25% more energy to digest protein compared to carbs that yields same amount of calories.

"Low carb means losing significant water weight as glycogen levels drop" ---> You do know you dehydrate by only loosing 3% of your bodies water mass? Or do you mean "significant water weight" from the water attached to the glycogen molecules only? That would mean you need to severely deprive your body from its stored energy (muscle and liver glycogen).
This is not a sound explanation.

After contemplating this thread's posts, I think the more likely reason why low carbohydrate diets could result in a better body composition, among other things, is because of the relative respiratory quotients (RQ) of carbohydrates (1), protein (.85), and ketones (.7). An RQ of .7 is pure fat oxidation. A person in ketosis regularly has depleted glycogen stores and doesn't blunt lipolysis at any point in their day. Of course, they have little need for glucose at all, since the brain is running off of ketones. What's more, if someone on a ketogenic diet only performs low-intensity exercise, like walking, and some modest resistance training, there's unlikely to be much, if any, amino acid wasting from gluconeogenesis. If these people also supplemented with branched chain amino acids, that threat is attenuated.

Has anyone come across any study reporting body composition comparisons where protein was held constant, carbohydrates were </= 15% for Group A, and carbohydrates were >/= 50% for Group B, and food was controlled rather than self-reported? For instance, 10/30/60 vs. 50/30/20? It would also be nice if the subjects weren't from a discrete group like athletes or the obese.

Bakkasan

I love when people either do not know or just ignore the fact that people who eat low carb have a several hundred calorie advantage over lowfat high carb dieters. There are several different metabolic reasons for it.
It is also an effective treatment for type 2 diabetes.

But ignoring this, and several other good reasons to TRY a low carb diet, blindly bashing it is really cool on MFP. I have consistently lost weight when clearly not in a deficit when adhering to LC. 3000 calories a day. Bacon and eggs, ribeye steaks, chicken wings, lots of high fiber low GI veggies. Sometimes it's just hard to not want taters bread and pasta.

Care to explain the wizardry that allows for fat loss while not in a deficit

My aren't you just combative?! You entertain me, please do more! You tell me why, because I do. In fact, I lose fat and maintain or gain strength.

If it WORKS FOR YOU, DO IT. That's the wizardry!

Acg67

I love when people either do not know or just ignore the fact that people who eat low carb have a several hundred calorie advantage over lowfat high carb dieters. There are several different metabolic reasons for it.
It is also an effective treatment for type 2 diabetes.

But ignoring this, and several other good reasons to TRY a low carb diet, blindly bashing it is really cool on MFP. I have consistently lost weight when clearly not in a deficit when adhering to LC. 3000 calories a day. Bacon and eggs, ribeye steaks, chicken wings, lots of high fiber low GI veggies. Sometimes it's just hard to not want taters bread and pasta.

Care to explain the wizardry that allows for fat loss while not in a deficit

To be fair, he said weight, not fat. Low carb means losing significant water weight as glycogen levels drop, you don't need to be in a deficit to drop water weight. You do need a deficit to lose fat however. I've also lost 60 pounds of fat eating 3000 calories a day, not cutting carbs, I just burn 3500 calories a day between my active job and exercise regimen.

Care to explain the wizardry that allows for fat loss while not in a deficit ---> When you eat a diet low in carbs you secrete less insulin (the primary anabolic hormone responsible for fat storage) so you sore less fat (this fat can be derived from dietary fat or carbs, However the carbs will only contribute to fat storage if your muscle and liver glycogen is saturated).
Also a comparing two isocaloric diets one with high protein and one with high carb, the thermal effect will greatly contribute to
daily energy expenditure due to the fact that a human body needs to use as much as 25% more energy to digest protein compared to carbs that yields same amount of calories.

So is it the high protein or lower carbs?

My aren't you just combative?! You entertain me, please do more! You tell me why, because I do. In fact, I lose fat and maintain or gain strength.

If it WORKS FOR YOU, DO IT. That's the wizardry!

Lots of people gain or maintain strength while dieting down, but what makes you a special snowflake is that you think you can lose fat without creating a caloric deficit

Matt_Wild

Ultimately its calories in and out, no two ways.

However carbs that are harder to digest do make you feel more satisfied for longer than simple carbs. Net difference tho is zero.

If you can resist snacking further still, you could diet on haribo and protein, plus fats and lose the same as brown rice, protein and fats. No difference in fat lost nor body comp.

lljksilk

Low carb diets are beneficial in situations pre-diabetes or early diagnosed diabetes.

In terms of general weight loss, low carb diets "work" by restricting calories and you feel full because of the increased amount of protein/fat you are taking in.

There are no health risks that I am aware of provided you follow the popular diets to the letter. So my advice is that the best diet is the one you can stick with. But there is no reason to choose a low carb diet over any other if you are looking for any particular advantage in weight loss. Ultimately low carb diets cause a quick decrease in water weight - but over the long term, at best you are getting a 3% metabolic advantage.

So for every 100 calories you'd burn on a normal diet, you might burn 103 on a low carb diet and also have to deal with dreaming of ice cream and cookies.

Bakkasan

Lots of people gain or maintain strength while dieting down, but what makes you a special snowflake is that you think you can lose fat without creating a caloric deficit

Unfortunately my long run of experience trumps the snowflake theory. How much weight did you have to lose in your life just wondering? 4? You put on a little fat last winter? I truly do value your experience over mine.