Stop the Low-Cal Insanity!
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That's the catch! That's usually what happens, and it's exactly what happened to me. I tried the 1200 calorie thing for almost a year. I lost 20 lbs, but I could not physically take it anymore. I went from hungry to binging back to hungry all over again. It was a disaster. I'm 5'8" and started at 220 with a BMR of 1800 or so.
this is the argument everyone is making about the 1200 calorie thing! that's exactly the point. that's exactly why we don't want people to eat 1200 unless it's really correct for them based on BMR/TDEE. anybody can try to eat 1200 for a while. a 500lb man can probably do it for a few weeks and lose weight doing it, but he's so severely restricting himself that he will eventually fail and binge. it's not about willpower. it's about 1200 being an unhealthy way to go about it for this very reason.0 -
You can't equate WW points to calories, because of the free fruit and veg.And as for the ones eating below 1200, I have an example to put things into perspective-
Several years ago I had a WW leader who was in her early 60s, about 4'10", very healthy and moderately active for her age. Her maintenance level was 13 points, which at time was only around 900 calories. That was her MAINTENANCE level, and had been for several years since she had reached her goal weight. So it is entirely POSSIBLE for someone to need to eat at 800-900 cals per day if they want to lose weight, and even at that level, the weight loss would only be 1/2 pound or less per week.
I was going to say that too. A cup of blueberries is 82 calories. The cals add up, not to mention the sugar/carbs.
That's why I said "At that time" it was around 900 calories. That was before they started making fruit free and giving you more cals for higher fiber foods. I am sure that her points maintenance level with the new system is even lower than 13 now.
She had figured out how many calories per day that she was averaging to maintain her weight, and it was around 900.0 -
Let me just throw something in here thats been bugging me for months.
A lady who lives around me ate 800 cals a day to try and lose weight...She also went for 2 hour walks everyday.
She lost 40 lbs in 6 months! and I swear all she was eating was junk. Id always see them come home with dairy queen, tim hortons, pizza ect...everyone doesnt understand how she lost the weight on pure JUNK and so little calories a day. And so far it appears as if she hasnt put any of it back on...explain
Most people will lose pounds on 800 cals a day. If they do it forever, they would have a hard time gaining it back in the reasonably near future. Just because it works doesn't mean it's the best thing for your mind or body though.
Also, I love your screen name.
It definitely sounds like something Id want to try. However...I forget what it feels like to just...Feel healthy.
Im always tired, drained and miserable. I think if I had 800 cals a day Ill never know what it feels like to just...feel great.
You eat like chit.....youll feel like chit.....right?
And thanks lol My Screen name likes you too
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Let me just throw something in here thats been bugging me for months.
A lady who lives around me ate 800 cals a day to try and lose weight...She also went for 2 hour walks everyday.
She lost 40 lbs in 6 months! and I swear all she was eating was junk. Id always see them come home with dairy queen, tim hortons, pizza ect...everyone doesnt understand how she lost the weight on pure JUNK and so little calories a day. And so far it appears as if she hasnt put any of it back on...explain
Pizza is exceptionally high cal.
Seriously, like half a pizza is 500-1000 cals depending on brand. I'm not sure you have accurately gauged her eating habits. Unless she had a half a pizza a day and nothing else for 24-hrs........0 -
I have naturally eaten between 1600 - 1800 cals for years without dieting or restricting at all what I wanted to eat.. and gained weight slowly but surely. When I started MFP it put me on 1200 cals which is a 400 - 600 cal deficit from what I was eating.. putting me at probably just slightly below maintenance for being sedentary.
I also had very bad menorrhagia in my non-restricted diet days. It has finally gotten better to become a normal blood loss volume and I don't bleed so excessively anymore, nor feel like fainting or blacking out half the month. My reduced calorie diet and weight loss has cured me of it!!
Now I started exercising 5-6 days a week (30 day shred and/or elliptical trainer), and cut my diet to 800-1100 cals a day depending on how hungry I am and I don't eat my exercise cals. I am steadily loosing 1-2 lb a week which is supposed to be a healthy weight loss rate. When I am at my goal weight (in between 6-11lb to go) I am going to slowly bump my calories up to around 1200-1500 to begin with to see how it goes. Clearly 1600-1800 was too high for me as I kept gaining over the years. I also intend to keep exercising but maybe just 3-4 times a week rather then 5-6 times.
That's just me.. I don't say this would work for everyone but if you say I should eat 1600-1800 cals a day to loose weight.. I did do that and it was not good for me. Although I may go back up to that calorie level if I want to exercise more often while maintaining my goal weight, as I was pretty sedentary in the past when I gained weight.0 -
I really wish everyone would just let everyone else get on with what works for them!!
The other point that many people seem to forget about is the other many factors that make people different. Health issues, exercise restrictions, metabolic syndromes, body composition and how much weight the person needs to lose etc.
You could have 2 individuals of the same height and weight. But person 1 has little fat and a large amount of lbm, person 2 could have 40+% fat and little lbm. You would not tell these people to eat the same, would you? Its obvious!! The difference can be 300cals or more for their BMR!
SO...It's not ALL about calories!
Maybe more people need to realise that everyone is different and you cannot tell someone to eat x amount of calories without knowing more about them and their composition.
i know it sounds all warm and fuzzy to say that, but it's not really true.
the BMR/TDEE calculations are pretty close for everyone except the extremely obese and the extremely muscular. so 2 women of a similar age who are 5'4" and 150lbs are going to have pretty similar BMRs even if one of them has more muscle than the other. if not, then there would be no science behind any of this and you could argue that drinking cow pee was just as good a way to go about weight loss as eating at a moderate calorie deficit and exercising.
BTW, i'm not kidding about the cow pee nonsense either.
http://www.ehow.com/way_5723936_cow-urine-weight-loss.html0 -
Let me just throw something in here thats been bugging me for months.
A lady who lives around me ate 800 cals a day to try and lose weight...She also went for 2 hour walks everyday.
She lost 40 lbs in 6 months! and I swear all she was eating was junk. Id always see them come home with dairy queen, tim hortons, pizza ect...everyone doesnt understand how she lost the weight on pure JUNK and so little calories a day. And so far it appears as if she hasnt put any of it back on...explain
Pizza is exceptionally high cal.
Seriously, like half a pizza is 500-1000 cals depending on brand. I'm not sure you have accurately gauged her eating habits. Unless she had a half a pizza a day and nothing else for 24-hrs........
Or unless she is lying abiout only having 800 cals a day0 -
I'm 5'5" and 50 and weigh 113 my BMR is 1133 I alway make sure to eat 1200 calories at least. If I workout I eat at least half my calories back. I only eat healthy so I can eat a lot of food for 1200 calories!! Nothing premade/prepackaged or processed...nothing fast!0
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Let me just throw something in here thats been bugging me for months.
A lady who lives around me ate 800 cals a day to try and lose weight...She also went for 2 hour walks everyday.
She lost 40 lbs in 6 months! and I swear all she was eating was junk. Id always see them come home with dairy queen, tim hortons, pizza ect...everyone doesnt understand how she lost the weight on pure JUNK and so little calories a day. And so far it appears as if she hasnt put any of it back on...explain
Pizza is exceptionally high cal.
Seriously, like half a pizza is 500-1000 cals depending on brand. I'm not sure you have accurately gauged her eating habits. Unless she had a half a pizza a day and nothing else for 24-hrs........
Or unless she is lying abiout only having 800 cals a day
Exactly! You only really know what you, yourself, are consuming and burning off. And some people either **** that up or willing deceive themselves.....
You just can't look at another person you have contact with and truly know what they eat every hour of the day or what their activity level truly amounts to.
That's why all such anecdotal "facts" don't add up to reliable data about anything......0 -
That's why all such anecdotal "facts" don't add up to reliable data about anything......
Bingo!0 -
My hero!!Very good and thoughtful post. Thanks!!!
I think the main problem is with people's expectations that are not realistic. Yes, it is possible to lose weight super quick, but at what cost? Both physiologically and psychologically! And if weight loss is really the only thing that concerns people (and it should not be, the focus should be on health and fitness!!!), then maybe the argument of sustainability will make them thinking. Easy come easy go, or in case of weight loss, it is the other way round: quickly go, easy and quickly come back. This leads to a cycle of yo-yo dieting and never-ending battle against your body.
I want to stress over and over again, that a person will be much more successful when they get their emotional and psychological issues around food and body-image and self-esteem sorted before they embark on this journey. Some may benefit from serious and honest reflection, some may need professional help. Whatever works for anyone. The concept of 'I will feel good about myself and all my problems will go away once I weigh xx pounds' is a very very shaky one.
Best of luck to EVERYONE on the healthy and fun journey to become healthier and fitter!!! :flowerforyou:0 -
Excellent post OP!!
What never ceases to amaze me is how a common sense post like this based on good information will bring so many people doing VLCDs out of the woodwork to rationalize and justify thier choices. To some degree, the less you eat and the longer you eat that way, you are condemning yourself to eat that way likely for the rest of your life. The metabolic adaptations and downregulation can be fairly permanent short of gaining all the weight back and starting all over again the right way.
And we are not "all different" so much. With the exception of those with some kind of heath condition like PCOS or a thryroid issue, we are much more alike than different with some minor variation from individual to individual.0 -
That's why all such anecdotal "facts" don't add up to reliable data about anything......
Bingo!
Yup!0 -
I really wish everyone would just let everyone else get on with what works for them!!
The other point that many people seem to forget about is the other many factors that make people different. Health issues, exercise restrictions, metabolic syndromes, body composition and how much weight the person needs to lose etc.
You could have 2 individuals of the same height and weight. But person 1 has little fat and a large amount of lbm, person 2 could have 40+% fat and little lbm. You would not tell these people to eat the same, would you? Its obvious!! The difference can be 300cals or more for their BMR!
SO...It's not ALL about calories!
Maybe more people need to realise that everyone is different and you cannot tell someone to eat x amount of calories without knowing more about them and their composition.
i know it sounds all warm and fuzzy to say that, but it's not really true.
the BMR/TDEE calculations are pretty close for everyone except the extremely obese and the extremely muscular. so 2 women of a similar age who are 5'4" and 150lbs are going to have pretty similar BMRs even if one of them has more muscle than the other. if not, then there would be no science behind any of this and you could argue that drinking cow pee was just as good a way to go about weight loss as eating at a moderate calorie deficit and exercising.
BTW, i'm not kidding about the cow pee nonsense either.
http://www.ehow.com/way_5723936_cow-urine-weight-loss.html
I checked my BMR using 30% BF and 50% BF. There was over 200 calories difference between them. (MFP calculator was around the 30% level, and my actual BF was closer to 50%.
I also would ride my stationary bike for an hour and MFP would say I burned 700-800 calories. I started using a HRM and it showed me burning around 300 calories for that hour.
That made a difference of 600-700 calories per day. That is quite a large discrepancy. And the scale supports it. Now my frustration level is much lower, knowing that I am eating at the right level, and losing at the rate I should be.0 -
I really wish everyone would just let everyone else get on with what works for them!!
The other point that many people seem to forget about is the other many factors that make people different. Health issues, exercise restrictions, metabolic syndromes, body composition and how much weight the person needs to lose etc.
You could have 2 individuals of the same height and weight. But person 1 has little fat and a large amount of lbm, person 2 could have 40+% fat and little lbm. You would not tell these people to eat the same, would you? Its obvious!! The difference can be 300cals or more for their BMR!
SO...It's not ALL about calories!
Maybe more people need to realise that everyone is different and you cannot tell someone to eat x amount of calories without knowing more about them and their composition.
i know it sounds all warm and fuzzy to say that, but it's not really true.
the BMR/TDEE calculations are pretty close for everyone except the extremely obese and the extremely muscular. so 2 women of a similar age who are 5'4" and 150lbs are going to have pretty similar BMRs even if one of them has more muscle than the other. if not, then there would be no science behind any of this and you could argue that drinking cow pee was just as good a way to go about weight loss as eating at a moderate calorie deficit and exercising.
BTW, i'm not kidding about the cow pee nonsense either.
http://www.ehow.com/way_5723936_cow-urine-weight-loss.html
Yes understood.. But not everyone on here has lots to lose!! The difference between 2 women both 5'4" both weighing 140lbs, 1 with a body fat% of 30 and the other with a body fat% of 20 can have a difference in BMR of around 150cals. Over the course of a week the extra cals = 1050. These are the calories the fatter one is consuming more than they need! Yes small amounts but add that over the course of a year or so and it all adds up.
The point i was trying to make was that there is not an exact or magic number for everyone and people should not be criticised for doing what works for them
P.S. YUK on the cow pee!!0 -
I didn't just guess, that was the number that MFP gave me when I set it. However, since MFP gave me that number and I've been following it I have lost over 10kg and drastically increased my fitness levels which has got me thinking it might be time for an adjustment.
I understand the concept of BMR/TDEE and that is what has got me thinking that maybe I should up my calories, however, the numbers I have gotten online for my TDEE seem WAY too high (2,994....really?!) which has confused me.
Not only that but if I struggle to make 1200 net on days I work out because I'm too full to eat, why would upping this number benefit me if I can't reach it? And if I feel great and it's working for me then why should I feel like I have to change anything? If it aint broke then maybe I shouldn't fix it?
I'm not saying this as someone who is totally ignorant, I have learned a lot from the forums on here and my own research, but if it's confusing for me then it is definitely confusing for someone at the start of their journey. All the heresay and conflicting opinions would be enough to make someone give up entirely because it all gets made out to be much more complicated than it really is.
(Also I'm 21, 158cm and 71kg....if you don't use the metric system you will have to figure that out)
you're 5'2" and 156 lbs. your base BMR (for spending all day in bed sleeping) is approx. 1526
your daily BMR/TDEE assuming no exercise and a sedentary activity level is 1831.
if you don't exercise at all and want to lose 1 lb per week, you should eat at 1331.
these numbers should all be recalculated every 5 or 10 lbs in weight change though. but for now 1331 or thereabouts is the number for you to lose 1 lb per week, so although 1200 is a little lower than that, it's not really going to be an issue for you and i think you're fine at that number (a 631 calorie deficit assuming you don't exercise).
however, if you are also exercising, then your BMR/TDEE needs to be adjusted for that. if for example, you're burning 500 calories a day by running/jogging/walking/dancing, then 1200 would definitely be too low for you. that would have you at an 1130 calorie per day deficit, which is too big for somebody your size.
so do you exercise?
Thank you!
Yes, I do exercise. Since I bought my HRM (around a month or a bit more) I have been regularly burning 400-700 calories per workout. I do a mix of cardio and strength training and recently just started lifting heavier. I work out, on average, probably 4-6 times a week.
ETA: I also work in retail so spend a lot of time on my feet. I have myself set at "lightly active" but that's probably changed too with my increased exercise0 -
You can't equate WW points to calories, because of the free fruit and veg.And as for the ones eating below 1200, I have an example to put things into perspective-
Several years ago I had a WW leader who was in her early 60s, about 4'10", very healthy and moderately active for her age. Her maintenance level was 13 points, which at time was only around 900 calories. That was her MAINTENANCE level, and had been for several years since she had reached her goal weight. So it is entirely POSSIBLE for someone to need to eat at 800-900 cals per day if they want to lose weight, and even at that level, the weight loss would only be 1/2 pound or less per week.
I was going to say that too. A cup of blueberries is 82 calories. The cals add up, not to mention the sugar/carbs.
That's why I said "At that time" it was around 900 calories. That was before they started making fruit free and giving you more cals for higher fiber foods. I am sure that her points maintenance level with the new system is even lower than 13 now.
She had figured out how many calories per day that she was averaging to maintain her weight, and it was around 900.
Oh I see, I didn't realize it was a recent change. Interesting.0 -
Let me just throw something in here thats been bugging me for months.
A lady who lives around me ate 800 cals a day to try and lose weight...She also went for 2 hour walks everyday.
She lost 40 lbs in 6 months! and I swear all she was eating was junk. Id always see them come home with dairy queen, tim hortons, pizza ect...everyone doesnt understand how she lost the weight on pure JUNK and so little calories a day. And so far it appears as if she hasnt put any of it back on...explain
Most people will lose pounds on 800 cals a day. If they do it forever, they would have a hard time gaining it back in the reasonably near future. Just because it works doesn't mean it's the best thing for your mind or body though.
Also, I love your screen name.
It definitely sounds like something Id want to try. However...I forget what it feels like to just...Feel healthy.
Im always tired, drained and miserable. I think if I had 800 cals a day Ill never know what it feels like to just...feel great.
You eat like chit.....youll feel like chit.....right?
And thanks lol My Screen name likes you too
I completely agree. 800 calories of rice, veggies, and chicken breast could at least be filling. A spicy chicken combo at Wendy's just wouldn't cut it even though, yum. I wouldn't feel healthy.0 -
I really wish everyone would just let everyone else get on with what works for them!!
The other point that many people seem to forget about is the other many factors that make people different. Health issues, exercise restrictions, metabolic syndromes, body composition and how much weight the person needs to lose etc.
You could have 2 individuals of the same height and weight. But person 1 has little fat and a large amount of lbm, person 2 could have 40+% fat and little lbm. You would not tell these people to eat the same, would you? Its obvious!! The difference can be 300cals or more for their BMR!
SO...It's not ALL about calories!
Maybe more people need to realise that everyone is different and you cannot tell someone to eat x amount of calories without knowing more about them and their composition.
i know it sounds all warm and fuzzy to say that, but it's not really true.
the BMR/TDEE calculations are pretty close for everyone except the extremely obese and the extremely muscular. so 2 women of a similar age who are 5'4" and 150lbs are going to have pretty similar BMRs even if one of them has more muscle than the other. if not, then there would be no science behind any of this and you could argue that drinking cow pee was just as good a way to go about weight loss as eating at a moderate calorie deficit and exercising.
BTW, i'm not kidding about the cow pee nonsense either.
http://www.ehow.com/way_5723936_cow-urine-weight-loss.html
I checked my BMR using 30% BF and 50% BF. There was over 200 calories difference between them. (MFP calculator was around the 30% level, and my actual BF was closer to 50%.
I also would ride my stationary bike for an hour and MFP would say I burned 700-800 calories. I started using a HRM and it showed me burning around 300 calories for that hour.
That made a difference of 600-700 calories per day. That is quite a large discrepancy. And the scale supports it. Now my frustration level is much lower, knowing that I am eating at the right level, and losing at the rate I should be.
i don't trust the MFP numbers on exercise. some are way off. i do all of my own calculations for BMR and everything else. i recognize that these online estimators are all giving me estimates. if my numbers are off by 200, that's only 10% for me and an acceptable error because i build pessimism into my calculations.
if you can get more exact numbers, great. i would encourage everyone to inspect their numbers and results with a critical eye and adjust accordingly. this is why i do my real tracking of everything in a spreadsheet. i can play around with the numbers however i see fit. for people not willing to do that, MFP gives them something "close enough" so that they can start their weight loss journey.
but my point isn't that online estimators are 100% accurate for everyone, it's that this whole "we are all different, what works for one person might not work for somebody else" excuse is a fallacy.0 -
Let me just throw something in here thats been bugging me for months.
A lady who lives around me ate 800 cals a day to try and lose weight...She also went for 2 hour walks everyday.
She lost 40 lbs in 6 months! and I swear all she was eating was junk. Id always see them come home with dairy queen, tim hortons, pizza ect...everyone doesnt understand how she lost the weight on pure JUNK and so little calories a day. And so far it appears as if she hasnt put any of it back on...explain
Pizza is exceptionally high cal.
Seriously, like half a pizza is 500-1000 cals depending on brand. I'm not sure you have accurately gauged her eating habits. Unless she had a half a pizza a day and nothing else for 24-hrs........
Or unless she is lying abiout only having 800 cals a day
Or drastically underestimating intake0
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