"Best" protein supplement?

Chadomaniac

iv actually done tests myself , i went from 90g - 150g and my lbm increased 7pounds , bf% dropped 4% over a 3 month period ... calories stayed at maintanance . went on a cut , lost another 3% bf and 1pound lbm even at 150g a day

slkehl

^And I'm sure there were no confounders, right? Had nothing to do with lifting heavier?

uhh what argument did I raise? That it was cheaper and easier to eat 1g of protein per lb of body weight supplementing a protein shake or two if you are over 200+lbs rather than to eat it from just foods alone?.....really?

You seem to be insinuating that it's necessary to eat 1g protein/lb to build muscle. I said you don't and provided articles to prove this when you asked. The optimal levels in the study can easily be achieved through a normal diet.

Chadomaniac

That whole 1 g protein per body weight thing is a myth.

Let me see a peer study review on those who strength train. I strength train and I would rather have more protein than not enough. :drinker:

Oh, there are plenty.

• Tarnopolsky et al. (1992) observed no differences in whole body protein synthesis or indexes of lean body mass in strength athletes consuming either 0.64g/lb or 1.10g/lb over a 2 week period. Protein oxidation did increase in the high protein group, indicating a nutrient overload.
• Walberg et al. (1988) found that 0.73g/lb was sufficient to maintain positive nitrogen balance in cutting weightlifters over a 7 day time period.
• Tarnopolsky et al. (1988) found that only 0.37g/lb was required to maintain positive nitrogen balance in elite bodybuilders (over 5 years of experience, possible previous use of androgens) over a 10 day period. 0.45g/lb was sufficient to maintain lean body mass in bodybuilders over a 2 week period. The authors suggested that 0.55g/lb was sufficient for bodybuilders.
• Lemon et al. (1992) found no differences in muscle mass or strength gains in novice bodybuilders consuming either 0.61g/lb or 1.19g/lb over a 4 week period. Based on nitrogen balance data, the authors recommended 0.75g/lb.
• Hoffman et al. (2006) found no differences in body composition, strength or resting hormonal concentrations in strength athletes consuming either 0.77g/lb or >0.91g/lb over a 3 month period.

Your turn. Show me peer reviewed studies that show you need to be consuming at least 1g/lb.

[/b]

Problems are in bold and also these do NOT show the stats and calories of those in the study.

I am not going to post the entire studies here. You have the source, you can look up the calories and stats. Also I don't see what's wrong with the time frames-those with short time frame are measuring protein OXIDATION, and we've got 1-3 months in the studies as well for body comp. It's just a range of studies that lead to the same overall conclusion.

And I would still like to see peer reviewed studies supporting your argument.

uhh what argument did I raise? That it was cheaper and easier to eat 1g of protein per lb of body weight supplementing a protein shake or two if you are over 200+lbs rather than to eat it from just foods alone?.....really?

this is true

Chadomaniac

lets see if i would have lost only 1 pound lbm on 70-90g protein a day . i highly doubt it , more like 4 pounds

slkehl

lets see if i would have lost only 1 pound lbm on 70-90g protein a day . i highly doubt it , more like 4 pounds

Makes no physiological sense why you wouldn't. Plenty of evidence and tests to back that up.

Shock_Wave

Honestly every ones protein synthesis is different so I would rather be in the .91g per lb than .77 but again I am a bigger active guy so I say again I would rather have more protein than not enough. Also its easier just consuming 1g per lb than trying to add .91g per lb lol just saying I personally eat 1.3 g per lb :drinker:

Chadomaniac

lets see if i would have lost only 1 pound lbm on 70-90g protein a day . i highly doubt it , more like 4 pounds

Makes no physiological sense why you wouldn't. Plenty of evidence and tests to back that up.

lol i know that i need high protein in my diet for calorie purposes aswel , what i must eat 400g of carbs and 100g of fat a day and expect to get shredded because my protein is at 70g lol ... need to make up for the calories from either fats or carbs .
at 400g of carbs and 100g of fat ill look like a seal

slkehl

Honestly every ones protein synthesis is different so I would rather be in the .91g per lb than .77 but again I am a bigger active guy so again I would rather have more protein than not enough. Also its easier just consuming 1g per lb than trying to add .91g per lb lol just saying :drinker:

Keep in mind that those are strength althetes that we're talking about. And that was just the low range they chose; other studies have gone lower and found no increased advantage in protein supplements. Again, I have no problem with them being convenient. What I do have a problem with is people buying into the marketing guise that they're necessary. For you they might be cheap, but as a college student, they're not. I have to stick to eggs, milk, chicken, peanut butter...basically, I'm poor, and I take comfort in knowing my budget isn't holding me back from building muscle.

You ask me for studies to support that you don't need 1g protein/lb; now, I ask you for studies that less than that is not enough. Sounds fair enough to me.

Shock_Wave

Honestly every ones protein synthesis is different so I would rather be in the .91g per lb than .77 but again I am a bigger active guy so again I would rather have more protein than not enough. Also its easier just consuming 1g per lb than trying to add .91g per lb lol just saying :drinker:

Keep in mind that those are strength althetes that we're talking about. And that was just the low range they chose; other studies have gone lower and found no increased advantage in protein supplements. Again, I have no problem with them being convenient. What I do have a problem with is people buying into the marketing guise that they're necessary. For you they might be cheap, but as a college student, they're not. I have to stick to eggs, milk, chicken, peanut butter...basically, I'm poor, and I take comfort in knowing my budget isn't holding me back from building muscle.

You ask me for studies to support that you don't need 1g protein/lb; now, I ask you for studies that less than that is not enough. Sounds fair enough to me.

Another positive of having a high protein diet allows me to eat lower carbs keeping that water weight off and keeping me fuller longer.

Chadomaniac

im also not a millionaire (at the moment) but i can def say that protein powder is a saving ... 30g of protein from a shake and 30g of protein from chicken is a big difference in price

slkehl

^maybe I just get overwhelmed from the up-front price. I have about $15 to spend on food week to week, so if I buy a thing of protein powder, I'm screwed. Although it does last a long time, so if I could save up, it would be a good investment.

Another positive of having a high protein diet allows me to eat lower carbs keeping that water weight off and keeping me fuller longer.

Agreed. High protein diets are great for weight loss.

Shock_Wave

^maybe I just get overwhelmed from the up-front price. I have about $15 to spend on food week to week, so if I buy a thing of protein powder, I'm screwed. Although it does last a long time, so if I could save up, it would be a good investment.

Another positive of having a high protein diet allows me to eat lower carbs keeping that water weight off and keeping me fuller longer.

Agreed. High protein diets are great for weight loss.

Have you read those studies?

Tarnopolsky et al. (1992) Evaluation of protein requirements for trained strength athletes.

High Protein-HP 2.40 g protein kg-1
Moderate Protein=MP 1.40 g protein kg-1
Low Protein=LP 0.86 g protein kg-1
whole body protein synthesis = WBPS

" methods were used to determine the dietary protein requirements of strength athletes (SA) compared with sedentary subjects (S)
For SA, the LP diet did not provide adequate protein and resulted in an accommodated state (decreased WBPS vs. MP and HP)
and the MP diet resulted in a state of adaptation [increase in WBPS (vs. LP) and no change in leucine oxidation (vs. LP)]. The HP diet did not result in increased WBPS compared with the MP diet, but leucine oxidation did increase significantly, indicating a nutrient overload
In summary, protein requirements for athletes performing strength training are greater than for sedentary individuals and are above current Canadian and US recommended daily protein intake requirements for young healthy males."


There's my proof using your studies ....Nuff said .

almonds1

Dang, the OP just wanted to know what type of Protein so buy... Just hit up any nutrition store other than GNC (rip) and ask for a suggestion...

Shock_Wave

Dang, the OP just wanted to know what type of Protein so buy... Just hit up any nutrition store other than GNC (rip) and ask for a suggestion...

Well I guess he will be more educated on the subject of protein while hes at it. Knowledge is power my friend.:drinker:

almonds1

Dang, the OP just wanted to know what type of Protein so buy... Just hit up any nutrition store other than GNC (rip) and ask for a suggestion...

Well I guess he will be more educated on the subject of protein while hes at it. Knowledge is power my friend.:drinker:

lol, true enough... I think now he is just confused haha

Shock_Wave

Dang, the OP just wanted to know what type of Protein so buy... Just hit up any nutrition store other than GNC (rip) and ask for a suggestion...

Well I guess he will be more educated on the subject of protein while hes at it. Knowledge is power my friend.:drinker:

lol, true enough... I think now he is just confused haha

lol :happy:

slkehl

^maybe I just get overwhelmed from the up-front price. I have about $15 to spend on food week to week, so if I buy a thing of protein powder, I'm screwed. Although it does last a long time, so if I could save up, it would be a good investment.

Another positive of having a high protein diet allows me to eat lower carbs keeping that water weight off and keeping me fuller longer.

Agreed. High protein diets are great for weight loss.

Have you read those studies?

Tarnopolsky et al. (1992) Evaluation of protein requirements for trained strength athletes.

High Protein-HP 2.40 g protein
Moderate Protein=MP 1.40 g protein
Low Protein=LP 0.86 g protein
whole body protein synthesis = WBPS

" methods were used to determine the dietary protein requirements of strength athletes (SA) compared with sedentary subjects (S)
For SA, the LP diet did not provide adequate protein and resulted in an accommodated state (decreased WBPS vs. MP and HP)
and the MP diet resulted in a state of adaptation [increase in WBPS (vs. LP) and no change in leucine oxidation (vs. LP)]. The HP diet did not result in increased WBPS compared with the MP diet, but leucine oxidation did increase significantly, indicating a nutrient overload
In summary, protein requirements for athletes performing strength training are greater than for sedentary individuals and are above current Canadian and US recommended daily protein intake requirements for young healthy males."


There's my proof using your studies ....Nuff said .

I will have to go back and read that one. I had thought that protein oxidation increased, but wbs and lbm stayed the same. I would agree that the protein requirements for athletes would be greater than those for sedentary folks, but it surprises me that strength athletes would be in an accommodation state with .86g/lb

Shock_Wave

^maybe I just get overwhelmed from the up-front price. I have about $15 to spend on food week to week, so if I buy a thing of protein powder, I'm screwed. Although it does last a long time, so if I could save up, it would be a good investment.

Another positive of having a high protein diet allows me to eat lower carbs keeping that water weight off and keeping me fuller longer.

Agreed. High protein diets are great for weight loss.

Have you read those studies?

Tarnopolsky et al. (1992) Evaluation of protein requirements for trained strength athletes.

High Protein-HP 2.40 g protein
Moderate Protein=MP 1.40 g protein
Low Protein=LP 0.86 g protein
whole body protein synthesis = WBPS

" methods were used to determine the dietary protein requirements of strength athletes (SA) compared with sedentary subjects (S)
For SA, the LP diet did not provide adequate protein and resulted in an accommodated state (decreased WBPS vs. MP and HP)
and the MP diet resulted in a state of adaptation [increase in WBPS (vs. LP) and no change in leucine oxidation (vs. LP)]. The HP diet did not result in increased WBPS compared with the MP diet, but leucine oxidation did increase significantly, indicating a nutrient overload
In summary, protein requirements for athletes performing strength training are greater than for sedentary individuals and are above current Canadian and US recommended daily protein intake requirements for young healthy males."


There's my proof using your studies ....Nuff said .

I will have to go back and read that one. I had thought that protein oxidation increased, but wbs and lbm stayed the same. I would agree that the protein requirements for athletes would be greater than those for sedentary folks, but it surprises me that strength athletes would be in an accommodation state with .86g/lb

That's because its .86 kg-1not lb-1

slkehl

Oh, that makes a lot more sense!

So HP is about 1, MP is 0.6, and LP is 0.4 g/lb. No wonder low protein resulted in an accommodated state! And it still says that MP and HP had no difference in whole body protein synthesis, if I am reading it correctly. I don't see how this contradicts anything that I've said about 1g/lb not being necessary.

Shock_Wave

Oh, that makes a lot more sense!

So HP is about 1, MP is 0.6, and LP is 0.39 g/lb (correct me if I'm wrong-math ain't my strong point). No wonder low protein resulted in an accommodated state! And it still says that MP and HP had no difference in whole body protein synthesis, if I am reading it correctly. I don't see how this contradicts anything that I've said about 1g/lb not being necessary.

LOL well that is an easy one.. Even though this study supports greater protein intake for strength athletes over sedentary consuming a higher protein intake between .63-1.09 per lb converted, it still has many flaws like I stated above such as the age of the people studied, calorie intake, height, weight, etc. So who's to say a really big muscular guys can or cannot synthesis more protein than some one smaller muscular guy, or a fatter novice one, or one who eats more or less calories per day.. etc. etc.. ?

AnahitaCanDoIt

While I have you all here, just a probably stupid question but...
I've boot camp (full on, not girly) outside on the beach in the freezing cold Irish winter three times a week. It's early so I wake up and drink a protein shake (100% whey, chocolate flavour Gold Standard) with coconut milk (not the one used for cooking, the Kara one w/ calcium added and no sugar) an hour before training. Would it be useful to drink one afterwards, too, as I know there is a magic window of time after training where I burn a lot fat but I don't get home in time to do that and would be driving for the time after training. Would it be worthwhile to take another shake with me and have that and water after training or would a protein source (hardboiled egg, chicken breast) be better?

I'm having trouble with the timing of food intake in general and I'm seeing ZERO movement on the scale. I'm 5'6", 43yrs old, female and was 215lbs and I'm now 159ish. I'd like to get down to 140ish but more about fitness and clothing size, so a US size 6. I'm on week four of 5x a week training (3x boot camp, 2x with a pt doing dynamic weight lifting and small bits of cardio but mostly weights)..and lost 8lbs the first week with the drastic change to my diet (eating paleo, no grains/bread/potatoes/pasta/rice or processed foods at all, lots of veg and protein, limited fruit 3L of water a day)...nothing since then!

Shock_Wave

While I have you all here, just a probably stupid question but...
I've boot camp (full on, not girly) outside on the beach in the freezing cold Irish winter three times a week. It's early so I wake up and drink a protein shake (100% whey, chocolate flavour Gold Standard) with coconut milk (not the one used for cooking, the Kara one w/ calcium added and no sugar) an hour before training. Would it be useful to drink one afterwards, too, as I know there is a magic window of time after training where I burn a lot fat but I don't get home in time to do that and would be driving for the time after training. Would it be worthwhile to take another shake with me and have that and water after training or would a protein source (hardboiled egg, chicken breast) be better?

I'm having trouble with the timing of food intake in general and I'm seeing ZERO movement on the scale. I'm 5'6", 43yrs old, female and was 215lbs and I'm now 159ish. I'd like to get down to 140ish but more about fitness and clothing size, so a US size 6. I'm on week four of 5x a week training (3x boot camp, 2x with a pt doing dynamic weight lifting and small bits of cardio but mostly weights)..and lost 8lbs the first week with the drastic change to my diet (eating paleo, no grains/bread/potatoes/pasta/rice or processed foods at all, lots of veg and protein, limited fruit 3L of water a day)...nothing since then!

Nicely saying I know we were rude and derailed OP thread for this semi off topic protein discussion but I suggest you should start your own thread. :drinker: :flowerforyou:

tigersword

There is no "magic window." That's a myth, just hit your daily nutrient and calorie goals.

slkehl

Oh, that makes a lot more sense!

So HP is about 1, MP is 0.6, and LP is 0.39 g/lb (correct me if I'm wrong-math ain't my strong point). No wonder low protein resulted in an accommodated state! And it still says that MP and HP had no difference in whole body protein synthesis, if I am reading it correctly. I don't see how this contradicts anything that I've said about 1g/lb not being necessary.

LOL well that is an easy one.. Even though this study supports greater protein intake for strength athletes between .63-1.09 per lb converted, it still has many flaws like I stated above such as the age of the people studied, calorie intake, height, weight, etc. So who's to say a really big muscular guys can or cannot synthesis more protein than some one smaller or fatter or one who eat more or less calories per day.. etc. etc..They might require more protein the the "MP" as this study was not thorough.

Well, no study is going to perfectly match the American population. I would call the "flaws" limitations that don't negate the results, but provide further support the rest of the studies, which, together, have a definite trend. And I'm sure people are different levels of protein synthesis depending on their body composition, but that doesn't mean they have to go out and buy protein supplements or eat insane amounts of protein packed food. These guys were strength athletes and didn't have to do that.

slkehl

Nicely saying I know we were rude and derailed OP thread for this semi off topic protein discussion but I suggest you should start your own thread. :drinker: :flowerforyou:

Yeah haha, sorry OP!

Shock_Wave

Oh, that makes a lot more sense!

So HP is about 1, MP is 0.6, and LP is 0.39 g/lb (correct me if I'm wrong-math ain't my strong point). No wonder low protein resulted in an accommodated state! And it still says that MP and HP had no difference in whole body protein synthesis, if I am reading it correctly. I don't see how this contradicts anything that I've said about 1g/lb not being necessary.

LOL well that is an easy one.. Even though this study supports greater protein intake for strength athletes between .63-1.09 per lb converted, it still has many flaws like I stated above such as the age of the people studied, calorie intake, height, weight, etc. So who's to say a really big muscular guys can or cannot synthesis more protein than some one smaller or fatter or one who eat more or less calories per day.. etc. etc..They might require more protein the the "MP" as this study was not thorough.

Well, no study is going to perfectly match the American population. I would call the "flaws" limitations that don't negate the results, but provide further support the rest of the studies, which, together, have a definite trend. And I'm sure people are different levels of protein synthesis depending on their body composition, but that doesn't mean they have to go out and buy protein supplements or eat insane amounts of protein packed food. These guys were strength athletes and didn't have to do that.

Well then you cannot say then for a fact that eating 1g of protein per lb is a myth as a 6'4 250lb guy might absorb more protein than a 5'5 180lb strength athlete. Also they never stated what the strength althetes ate for protein for all we know it may have been nothing but protein supplement shake/s.. But if they didn't take protein shake/s then they would have but no choice but to eat an insane amount of protein packed food for the high intake of protein especially if they were over 200+lbs...right? :drinker:

AnahitaCanDoIt

While I have you all here, just a probably stupid question but...
I've boot camp (full on, not girly) outside on the beach in the freezing cold Irish winter three times a week. It's early so I wake up and drink a protein shake (100% whey, chocolate flavour Gold Standard) with coconut milk (not the one used for cooking, the Kara one w/ calcium added and no sugar) an hour before training. Would it be useful to drink one afterwards, too, as I know there is a magic window of time after training where I burn a lot fat but I don't get home in time to do that and would be driving for the time after training. Would it be worthwhile to take another shake with me and have that and water after training or would a protein source (hardboiled egg, chicken breast) be better?

I'm having trouble with the timing of food intake in general and I'm seeing ZERO movement on the scale. I'm 5'6", 43yrs old, female and was 215lbs and I'm now 159ish. I'd like to get down to 140ish but more about fitness and clothing size, so a US size 6. I'm on week four of 5x a week training (3x boot camp, 2x with a pt doing dynamic weight lifting and small bits of cardio but mostly weights)..and lost 8lbs the first week with the drastic change to my diet (eating paleo, no grains/bread/potatoes/pasta/rice or processed foods at all, lots of veg and protein, limited fruit 3L of water a day)...nothing since then!

Nicely saying I know we were rude and derailed OP thread for this semi off topic protein discussion but I suggest you should start your own thread. :drinker: :flowerforyou:

You're right! How rude of me! Sorry OP and other protein shake people!

Shock_Wave

OP all these flavors are all BOMB *kitten* good for tasty delicious protein they are 10 out of 10 no doubt

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[/img]

slkehl

Oh, that makes a lot more sense!

So HP is about 1, MP is 0.6, and LP is 0.39 g/lb (correct me if I'm wrong-math ain't my strong point). No wonder low protein resulted in an accommodated state! And it still says that MP and HP had no difference in whole body protein synthesis, if I am reading it correctly. I don't see how this contradicts anything that I've said about 1g/lb not being necessary.

LOL well that is an easy one.. Even though this study supports greater protein intake for strength athletes between .63-1.09 per lb converted, it still has many flaws like I stated above such as the age of the people studied, calorie intake, height, weight, etc. So who's to say a really big muscular guys can or cannot synthesis more protein than some one smaller or fatter or one who eat more or less calories per day.. etc. etc..They might require more protein the the "MP" as this study was not thorough.

Well, no study is going to perfectly match the American population. I would call the "flaws" limitations that don't negate the results, but provide further support the rest of the studies, which, together, have a definite trend. And I'm sure people are different levels of protein synthesis depending on their body composition, but that doesn't mean they have to go out and buy protein supplements or eat insane amounts of protein packed food. These guys were strength athletes and didn't have to do that.

Well then you cannot say then for a fact that eating 1g of protein per lb is a myth as a 6'4 250lb guy might absorb more protein than a 5'5 180lb strength athlete. Also they never stated what the strength althetes ate for protein for all we know it may have been nothing but protein supplement shakes.. :drinker:

They did say what the strength athletes ate in the study-it's in the second section. And based on scientific method, everything is only theory. You can't prove anything right, you can only prove it wrong. However, if everything points in a certain direction, it's a good chance that there's some truth to it.

I would still like to see a study in which 1g/lb is considered optimal. Rather than having these studies discredited because of limitations common to all studies.

Matt_Wild

Protein is pretty much protein, not much in them. Find a brand you like and stick with it.