Vegan Ratios

Wade406

Don't go low on fat: consider your intake of short chain omega-3s and the conversion rate to the useable long chain format, or take a high strength DHA/ EPA marine algae supplement.

flax seed meal with my oatmeal and almond milk for breakfast.

luciejay

That's fine. If you want to measure your macros, it's better you use net carbs, since fruits and vegetables are carb-heavy but they're GOOD carbs and very high in fiber. I eat 1500-1800 cals a day and around 200-250g carbs a day, and I only eat whole grain and fresh produce. Make sure you keep your protein at around 15% though!

wildfirediva

Protein Protein Protein.....There are some GREAT Vegan Protein Supplements out there....a few of my favorites:
PlantFusion
LifeBasics
Garden of Life - Raw Protein
Nutiva Hemp Protein

Most have 15g or better (PlantFusion has 20+g)

Good way to make sure you are meeting your protein needs.

Wade406

Many people focus on protein. There is however a large body of evidence presented by very credible sources that the average person needs about 10-15% of his/her total dietary intake from protein, assuming the person is consuming adequate calories. In fact, many MD's and PhD's believe that any more or less will increase the risk of chronic disease.

It depends of course on your goals. If you are trying to increase your muscle and bone mass, you will need more protein, calories, and resistance training to achieve those goals.

On the other hand, if your goal is to retain your existing muscle and bone mass, minimize or reduce any unwanted body mass (fat), and prevent chronic diseases like diabetes, heart disease, and reduce your risk of certain types of cancer, a whole foods, plant-based diet that contains 10-15% protein and 10-15% fat may be for you.

http://www.who.int/dietphysicalactivity/publications/trs916/en/gsfao_overall.pdf

Sarauk2sf

Many people focus on protein. There is however a large body of evidence presented by very credible sources that the average person needs about 10-15% of his/her total dietary intake from protein, assuming the person is consuming adequate calories. In fact, many MD's and PhD's believe that any more or less will increase the risk of chronic disease.

It depends of course on your goals. If you are trying to increase your muscle and bone mass, you will need more protein, calories, and resistance training to achieve those goals.

On the other hand, if your goal is to retain your existing muscle and bone mass, minimize or reduce any unwanted body mass (fat), and prevent chronic diseases like diabetes, heart disease, and reduce your risk of certain types of cancer, a whole foods, plant-based diet that contains 10-15% protein and 10-15% fat may be for you.

http://www.who.int/dietphysicalactivity/publications/trs916/en/gsfao_overall.pdf

Care to share these sources that show that maintaining LBM on a deficit is optimized at 10%, especially as half the people here are on a 1,200 calorie diet which = 30g of protein?

Wade406

Many people focus on protein. There is however a large body of evidence presented by very credible sources that the average person needs about 10-15% of his/her total dietary intake from protein, assuming the person is consuming adequate calories. In fact, many MD's and PhD's believe that any more or less will increase the risk of chronic disease.

It depends of course on your goals. If you are trying to increase your muscle and bone mass, you will need more protein, calories, and resistance training to achieve those goals.

On the other hand, if your goal is to retain your existing muscle and bone mass, minimize or reduce any unwanted body mass (fat), and prevent chronic diseases like diabetes, heart disease, and reduce your risk of certain types of cancer, a whole foods, plant-based diet that contains 10-15% protein and 10-15% fat may be for you.

http://www.who.int/dietphysicalactivity/publications/trs916/en/gsfao_overall.pdf

Care to share these sources that show that maintaining LBM on a deficit is optimized at 10%, especially as half the people here are on a 1,200 calorie diet which = 30g of protein?

The suggested range should be seen in the light of the Joint WHO/FAO/UNUExpert Consultation on Protein
and Amino Acid Requirements in Human Nutrition, held in Geneva from 9 to 16 April 2002

I didn't say anything about a deficit, I assume you mean a caloric deficit. And I didn't say anything about "optimized at 10%". I said 10-15% of total calories ASSUMING ADEQUATE CALORIC INTAKE. What I meant by "adequate" is to maintain present body weight. Not everyone here is maintaining a caloric deficit.

Sarauk2sf

Many people focus on protein. There is however a large body of evidence presented by very credible sources that the average person needs about 10-15% of his/her total dietary intake from protein, assuming the person is consuming adequate calories. In fact, many MD's and PhD's believe that any more or less will increase the risk of chronic disease.

It depends of course on your goals. If you are trying to increase your muscle and bone mass, you will need more protein, calories, and resistance training to achieve those goals.

On the other hand, if your goal is to retain your existing muscle and bone mass, minimize or reduce any unwanted body mass (fat), and prevent chronic diseases like diabetes, heart disease, and reduce your risk of certain types of cancer, a whole foods, plant-based diet that contains 10-15% protein and 10-15% fat may be for you.

http://www.who.int/dietphysicalactivity/publications/trs916/en/gsfao_overall.pdf

Care to share these sources that show that maintaining LBM on a deficit is optimized at 10%, especially as half the people here are on a 1,200 calorie diet which = 30g of protein?

The suggested range should be seen in the light of the Joint WHO/FAO/UNUExpert Consultation on Protein
and Amino Acid Requirements in Human Nutrition, held in Geneva from 9 to 16 April 2002

I didn't say anything about a deficit, I assume you mean a caloric deficit. And I didn't say anything about "optimized at 10%". I said 10-15% of total calories ASSUMING ADEQUATE CALORIC INTAKE. What I meant by "adequate" is to maintain present body weight. Not everyone here is maintaining a caloric deficit.

There are many studies showing that the WHO recommendation (I think it is about 44g for women off the top of my head) is not optimal - it also does not take account of activity level. The more active you are the more protein is going to be optimal (even the WHO indicates that but does not go as far as to give recommendations) . As most people on here are on a caloric deficit, then it pays to be clear.

Wade406

"Optimal" is a nebulous word/concept. It really depends on one's goals, don't you agree?

Sarauk2sf

"Optimal" is a nebulous word/concept. It really depends on one's goals, don't you agree?

If your goals are not to maintain as much LBM as possible on a deficit, then yes, I would.

Wade406

"Optimal" is a nebulous word/concept. It really depends on one's goals, don't you agree?

If your goals are not to maintain as much LBM as possible on a deficit, then yes, I would.

So a man recovering from a heart attack trying to avoid quadruple bypass may not care about how much LBM he maintains, he might just be trying to reverse his heart disease eating a whole foods plant based diet like the one I'm trying to encourage my father to get on. Whole foods plant based diets by their nature achieve 10-15% protein. A protein supplement is not a whole food btw. Legumes are.

You relaize this topic is Vegan Ratios. One of the main reasons people become Vegans, hold it, the only reason I became a Vegan is because the data is clear and indisputable that animal based diets lead to heart disease, certain cancers, autoimmune diseases, and other ancillary health risks. I've got another 40 years to live and I don't want to cut that short.

Sarauk2sf

"Optimal" is a nebulous word/concept. It really depends on one's goals, don't you agree?

If your goals are not to maintain as much LBM as possible on a deficit, then yes, I would.

So a man recovering from a heart attack trying to avoid quadruple bypass may not care about how much LBM he maintains, he might just be trying to reverse his heart disease eating a whole foods plant based diet like the one I'm trying to encourage my father to get on. Whole foods plant based diets by their nature achieve 10-15% protein. A protein supplement is not a whole food btw. Legumes are.

You relaize this topic is Vegan Ratios. One of the main reasons people become Vegans, hold it, the only reason I became a Vegan is because the data is clear and indisputable that animal based diets lead to heart disease, certain cancers, autoimmune diseases, and other ancillary health risks. I've got another 40 years to live and I don't want to cut that short.

First of all, what does your example have to do with anything? It should go without saying that anyone with a medical condition needs to assess their diet in that context.

What does being a vegan have to do with recommendations for macronutrient ratios? And why are you bringing up processed v whole food diet? That was not the topic at hand.

Wade406

"Optimal" is a nebulous word/concept. It really depends on one's goals, don't you agree?

If your goals are not to maintain as much LBM as possible on a deficit, then yes, I would.

So a man recovering from a heart attack trying to avoid quadruple bypass may not care about how much LBM he maintains, he might just be trying to reverse his heart disease eating a whole foods plant based diet like the one I'm trying to encourage my father to get on. Whole foods plant based diets by their nature achieve 10-15% protein. A protein supplement is not a whole food btw. Legumes are.

You relaize this topic is Vegan Ratios. One of the main reasons people become Vegans, hold it, the only reason I became a Vegan is because the data is clear and indisputable that animal based diets lead to heart disease, certain cancers, autoimmune diseases, and other ancillary health risks. I've got another 40 years to live and I don't want to cut that short.

First of all, what does your example have to do with anything? It should go without saying that anyone with a medical condition needs to assess their diet in that context.

What does being a vegan have to do with recommendations for macronutrient ratios? And why are you bringing up processed v whole food diet? That was not the topic at hand.

How about we go with: Live and let live. I was trying to illustrate my point that one's goals will affect their choices, e.g. % protein. Evidently I didn't effectively communicate that, or I did and you dispute that.

Additionally, there are numerous vegan diet variants out there. I believed that by being as clear as possible about the point of view from which I speak, that would make our conversation more productive.

You clearly believe that 10-15% protein diet not on a deficit is inadequate. On that we disagree.

Fair enough. No worries. I wish you nothing but success Sara.

Sarauk2sf

"Optimal" is a nebulous word/concept. It really depends on one's goals, don't you agree?

If your goals are not to maintain as much LBM as possible on a deficit, then yes, I would.

So a man recovering from a heart attack trying to avoid quadruple bypass may not care about how much LBM he maintains, he might just be trying to reverse his heart disease eating a whole foods plant based diet like the one I'm trying to encourage my father to get on. Whole foods plant based diets by their nature achieve 10-15% protein. A protein supplement is not a whole food btw. Legumes are.

You relaize this topic is Vegan Ratios. One of the main reasons people become Vegans, hold it, the only reason I became a Vegan is because the data is clear and indisputable that animal based diets lead to heart disease, certain cancers, autoimmune diseases, and other ancillary health risks. I've got another 40 years to live and I don't want to cut that short.

First of all, what does your example have to do with anything? It should go without saying that anyone with a medical condition needs to assess their diet in that context.

What does being a vegan have to do with recommendations for macronutrient ratios? And why are you bringing up processed v whole food diet? That was not the topic at hand.

How about we go with: Live and let live. I was trying to illustrate my point that one's goals will affect their choices, e.g. % protein. Evidently I didn't effectively communicate that, or I did and you dispute that.

Additionally, there are numerous vegan diet variants out there. I believed that by being as clear as possible about the point of view from which I speak, that would make our conversation more productive.

You clearly believe that 10-15% protein diet not on a deficit is inadequate. On that we disagree.

Fair enough. No worries. I wish you nothing but success Sara.

You did not address my second point - however, that is neither here nor there as it was not related to the OP in any event.

Regarding the first point, I said if your goal is not to maintain LBM then I agree that 'optimizing' protein to do such a thing would not be a priority - you just gave an example where it would not be and presented it in such a way that you were disagreeing or proving something, hence, me not being sure of the point of your post.

And yes, I disagree that using a % of 10-15% based on some unstated calorie level without regard to a person's leanness and activity level is necessarily optimal.

CorvusCorax77

I think it depends on your goals. If you just want to survive, apparently is 0.36 grams of protein per lb of body weight (http://www.vrg.org/nutrition/protein.htm).
For me that'd be just about 50 grams of protein a day.

But that is based on sedentary lifestyle.

If you are lifting weights and producing muscle, you want about 1 gm/lb of lean body weight. For me, this is double what it would have been under the RDA.

It can be done vegan. Tempeh and tofu and soy based protein shakes and cliff builder bars are your friends in this endeavor.