feud with the gym teacher

RGv2

All this has gotten me thinking about the Presidential Fitness Test they do in gym class....
At my son's age, he has to run a 9 minute mile to pass, a 7 minute mile to get an award. That's 6-7 mph, and I know a lot of adults who can't do that.

If students do not pass this test, are there consequences for the teacher? Much like if students fail the proficiency tests for academics? Could this be why the gym teacher is doing this, so he can push the kids to pass the test and not get in trouble himself?

No, there are no concequences for the teacher.

1223345

I say the teacher needs a talking to. I took up running after I quit smoking years ago and it took me a good year to get good at running. Your son may be nervous because of the teacher and this may also be preventing his proper breathing. It would be a good idea for him to practice his running/breathing rhythm outside of class. I started out at a VERRRRRRY slow jog and this made it easier to find my rhythm. As a runner your self I am sure you know what I mean. For a non-runner to master this takes a little longer. Especially if he does not enjoy running.

RGv2

The gym teacher is an idiot. Like they say, those that can do, do. Those that can't, teach Phy Ed.

Fixed

melinda3792

The teacher is lucky I am not in your shoes. I would be going to the school during said running class and in the middle of it, clamp my hands over his nose and mouth and whisper "just breath through it"

RGv2

The teacher is lucky I am not in your shoes. I would be going to the school during said running class and in the middle of it, clamp my hands over his nose and mouth and whisper "just breath through it"

Internet Toughguy?

vim_n_vigor

Has you son been tested for asthma? If he is having a very hard time breathing, it may be worth getting him checked. He could have exercise induced asthma.

While you are beating the crap out of the teacher for having your son hold his breathe while he is running, you can tell your son that one thing to try is to breathe in for 3 steps and out for 3 steps. It can help keep the rhythm steady. Also, something like saying his ABC's or multiplication tables while running are things that can help him focus his energy away from just the breathing and can calm him which could help. These are things that got me through running in grade school anyway...

ijavagypsy

I'm of the "children should be seen and not heard" era. I became winded easily in a swimming leader's training class in high school but got pulled from the group because of plantar warts. As an adult, I never did better that 56 minutes in a 10 K, and I ran six miles a day for three days a week from 1982 through 1993. Finally had a pulmonologist check me out and discovered that I have an obstructive pulmonary defect (asthma). Then had a checkup by a noninvasive cardiologist and was found to have mitral valve prolapse upon medical imaging. To be honest, I also have a hearing defect and couldn't understand the calls during square dance instruction in gym class. The gym teachers assumed that I was either stupid or inattentive. I earned two regents' college scholarships and admission to a college that used competitive scores to assess admissions (only the top 5% of every graduating class was considered for entrance). What I'm trying to say is that some "teachers" really don't know which end is up. I suggest that your son get a consult from a physician who is skilled in sports medicine, get a note for your son prescribing his exercise parameters, and express your willingness to confer liability upon anyone who exceeds those parameters.
Rant over.
Hope this helps.

1223345

Has you son been tested for asthma? If he is having a very hard time breathing, it may be worth getting him checked. He could have exercise induced asthma.

While you are beating the crap out of the teacher for having your son hold his breathe while he is running, you can tell your son that one thing to try is to breathe in for 3 steps and out for 3 steps. It can help keep the rhythm steady. Also, something like saying his ABC's or multiplication tables while running are things that can help him focus his energy away from just the breathing and can calm him which could help. These are things that got me through running in grade school anyway...

This sounds wierd but, I used to count my foot falls and breath in on "1 and 2 and 3" and breath out on "and 4 and 5 and " when I got to numbers with more than a syllable, each syllable would be a count as well "se ven and eight and" or "twen ty one and" sometimes the breath would only a 4 count if I was doing well as far as my pace. I knew that when I could not count in this way I was not pacing myself properly.

Doodlewhopper

Maybe the teacher said it and maybe he didnt. Assuming that the OP's son related the teacher's instructions accurately....what's the big deal? Kids hold their breath all the time.

drgndancer

Whoa, whoa, whoa here. Exercise physiologists? Asthma testing? Physical violence to the teacher? Guys, we have a kid that isn't used to running, and he got out of breath doing it. This is normal. The teacher gave (poor in my opinion, though the child may have misunderstood as someone else points out) advice. Talk to the teacher, tell him you think the breath holding thing is bad, and help the child by showing him the correct way to improve. If after a legitimate attempt to improve there is still a breathing issue, then start thinking about talking to a doctor. Jumping to asthma at this point is like assuming that every time you have the sniffles you should get a meningitis test.

Nearly everyone gets out of breath when they first start trying to run any distance, this is becasue nearly everyone tries to run too fast. The speed at which you should start distance training is always slower than seems reasonable.

jimmmer

It sounds pretty damn sketchy to me as far as the physiological reasoning, but even then you're talking about a technique for athletes intended to improve an already fit swimmer's cardiovascular system to an even greater level of fitness. Not something you tell an out of breath 4th grader.

Well, I don't know if it works for trained athletes or untrained 4th graders, and that's the point I suspect. It's been a bit controversial in it's natural home (i.e. swimming coaching) so I don't doubt it's even more controversial for running coaching. I had two observations:

1) Why couldn't a school coach be a fitness expert? I mean they could be a useless tool for all I know.... but they could really know their stuff also. Not enough information has been supplied to make a determination at this point. Dan Johns is/was a school coach and he's pretty awesome. This guy is probably no Dan Johns though.....

2) Just because something sounds "weird" doesn't mean it has no merit in coaching athletes......

I've not coached many world class runners, so I'm going to hold off on whether this technique actually works for that demographic or not. I suspect it's one of those things where your coach believes in it, you believe in your coach and it enables you to dig deep and find something extra. In that regard it's probably more psychological than physiological. In this particular case, with this particular 4th grader, it seems to have had no physiological benefits and seems to have had bad psychological effects. Time for coach to go back to his bag of tricks and find something that works for this 4th grade athlete!

meg7399

Whoa, whoa, whoa here. Exercise physiologists? Asthma testing? Physical violence to the teacher? Guys, we have a kid that isn't used to running, and he got out of breath doing it. This is normal. The teacher gave (poor in my opinion, though the child may have misunderstood as someone else points out) advice. Talk to the teacher, tell him you think the breath holding thing is bad, and help the child by showing him the correct way to improve. If after a legitimate attempt to improve there is still a breathing issue, then start thinking about talking to a doctor. Jumping to asthma at this point is like assuming that every time you have the sniffles you should get a meningitis test.

Nearly everyone gets out of breath when they first start trying to run any distance, this is becasue nearly everyone tries to run too fast. The speed at which you should start distance training is always slower than seems reasonable.

voice of reason. He is a 4th grader he was sprinting and is now winded. Also, let me say again he is a 4th grader, who knows what the teacher told him! My kid comes home saying that her teacher said the darnedest things, and as I teacher I know thats not true for a teacher to say! Kids misunderstand lots of what gets said to them...especially while trying to run a 9 minute mile.

nancycaregiver

When my son was in the 4th grade, he came home telling me he ran the mile in 9:03, missing getting his shirt by 3 seconds. Since he was so close, they let him try again the next day. So I gave him some advice. I told him that he did not need to start off running as fast as he can. I told him to take it easy at the start, keep a steady pace, then kick it on on the last corner of the soccer field his last time around. Pretty sound advice, right?
So he comes home the next day and I asked how it went. His time was 12:58. WHAT? He said, I did exactly what you said! I walked until my last turn of the field then I started running. Sometimes 4th graders hear advice differently that it is actually said. I'm hoping this is the case with your son. Tell him the correct way to deal with it and if it continues, go talk to the teacher. If you are not satisfied, THEN go talk to the principal. You don't have to beat anybody up till you get all the facts. Then if the guy turns out to be as big an idiot as your son says, beat him to a pulp!

orapronobis

First, realize that your son may not have understood the instruction. When you approach this, watch out how you come off to the teacher. When my daughter was little, my goal was to never have the teacher looking at my innocent little girl and seeing my angry face. Approach him as if you want his advice. Explain that "maybe my son didn't understand...." Be sure not to get him on the defensive. You want him to feel that you are working together for the child's benefit, and you should be doing that. Teachers can make life MISERABLE or WONDERFUL for your child when you are not there. So, get him on your side, and on your child's side. I'll never forget my very first parent/teacher meeting with my daughter's kindergarten teacher (15 years ago). She said to me, "I wish I had scheduled you last so that my day would end nicely." She appreciated my respect for her and always treated my daughter like the child of a good friend. It's a model I followed throughout my daughter's school years and I never met a teacher or administrator who didn't bend over backward to listen and help when needed.

Azdak

So I am not a marathon runner, but I have always been taught that while running, you should aim to breathe in a natural, steady, rhythmic pattern with your footfalls....in through the nose, out through the mouth.

So...

My son came home from school the other day complaining about running in gym class. Mind you, he is not a runner and gets winded pretty quickly, but he tries. He stopped to catch his breath and his gym teacher told him that when he is struggling to breathe while running, he should hold his breath as long as he can and push through it. My son says that he feels like he's going to pass out when he does this but the teacher insists.

We're not talking about track & field or cross country here...we are talking about 4th graders.

Am I right to be upset or is there a benefit to holding your breath while running???

Unless your son misheard (always possible), there is no sound physiological basis for the gym teachers' instructions.

Breathing rates are closely synched with the metabolic demands of activity. If someone is struggling to breathe, it's because the demands of the activity are greater than their fitness ability (exceptions listed below). Trying to stop breathing at that point is absurd and potentially unhealthy--like shutting off the gas line to a car to make it run faster.

Now, there are a couple of instances where excessive shortness of breath might be caused be something other than metabolic demand. One is tension/stress/anxiety, which certainly is not going to be helped by subjecting the child to an unpleasant activity like trying to hold his breath. The other is an asthma-like reaction.

The response to almost all of those possibilities is a more gradual warm up, or to engage in a gradual interval-like program (not high-intensity intervals, but just alternating work and recovery) to build up stamina and gain confidence.

BTW, the whole "breathe in through the nose and out the mouth" thing is misguided as well. As intensity of effort increases, you need to be able to ventilate as much air as possible and restricting that by nose-breathing is like putting a plastic bag over your head.

Using a rhythmic breathing pattern to reduce body tension or dissociate from exercise effort can be a helpful technique, but the actual breathing still has to match the metabolic needs of the effort---and ultimately those needs will override everything else.

Rays_Wife

First, realize that your son may not have understood the instruction. When you approach this, watch out how you come off to the teacher. When my daughter was little, my goal was to never have the teacher looking at my innocent little girl and seeing my angry face. Approach him as if you want his advice. Explain that "maybe my son didn't understand...." Be sure not to get him on the defensive. You want him to feel that you are working together for the child's benefit, and you should be doing that. Teachers can make life MISERABLE or WONDERFUL for your child when you are not there. So, get him on your side, and on your child's side. I'll never forget my very first parent/teacher meeting with my daughter's kindergarten teacher (15 years ago). She said to me, "I wish I had scheduled you last so that my day would end nicely." She appreciated my respect for her and always treated my daughter like the child of a good friend. It's a model I followed throughout my daughter's school years and I never met a teacher or administrator who didn't bend over backward to listen and help when needed.

Words of wisdom right here. I'm going to remember this!

cubbies77

Whoa, whoa, whoa here. Exercise physiologists? Asthma testing? Physical violence to the teacher? Guys, we have a kid that isn't used to running, and he got out of breath doing it. This is normal. The teacher gave (poor in my opinion, though the child may have misunderstood as someone else points out) advice. Talk to the teacher, tell him you think the breath holding thing is bad, and help the child by showing him the correct way to improve. If after a legitimate attempt to improve there is still a breathing issue, then start thinking about talking to a doctor. Jumping to asthma at this point is like assuming that every time you have the sniffles you should get a meningitis test.

Nearly everyone gets out of breath when they first start trying to run any distance, this is becasue nearly everyone tries to run too fast. The speed at which you should start distance training is always slower than seems reasonable.

This.

Also, the Presidential Fitness Test is just something that's done every year. Our PE teacher marked down our results, and that was that. If you got an award, cool. If not, no biggie. It's not a standardized test like the ACT. It's just criteria to show which kids are fit and which kids might need some help. I always failed rope climbing.

To those who said, "It's just a gym teacher, not someone with training," there are some gym teachers who studied PhysEd in college. A friend of mine did that program. It was under the education department, like secondary ed, and her major involved lots of sports, how to teach sports, nutrition classes, etc. I thought it was just "let's go play kickball and get our degree" and kind of teased her at first (not meanly, just two friends drinking wine and bantering), and then she showed me her class requirements.

ijavagypsy

That makes sense.

ijavagypsy

So I am not a marathon runner, but I have always been taught that while running, you should aim to breathe in a natural, steady, rhythmic pattern with your footfalls....in through the nose, out through the mouth.

So...

My son came home from school the other day complaining about running in gym class. Mind you, he is not a runner and gets winded pretty quickly, but he tries. He stopped to catch his breath and his gym teacher told him that when he is struggling to breathe while running, he should hold his breath as long as he can and push through it. My son says that he feels like he's going to pass out when he does this but the teacher insists.

We're not talking about track & field or cross country here...we are talking about 4th graders.

Am I right to be upset or is there a benefit to holding your breath while running???

Unless your son misheard (always possible), there is no sound physiological basis for the gym teachers' instructions.

Breathing rates are closely synched with the metabolic demands of activity. If someone is struggling to breathe, it's because the demands of the activity are greater than their fitness ability (exceptions listed below). Trying to stop breathing at that point is absurd and potentially unhealthy--like shutting off the gas line to a car to make it run faster.

Now, there are a couple of instances where excessive shortness of breath might be caused be something other than metabolic demand. One is tension/stress/anxiety, which certainly is not going to be helped by subjecting the child to an unpleasant activity like trying to hold his breath. The other is an asthma-like reaction.

The response to almost all of those possibilities is a more gradual warm up, or to engage in a gradual interval-like program (not high-intensity intervals, but just alternating work and recovery) to build up stamina and gain confidence.

BTW, the whole "breathe in through the nose and out the mouth" thing is misguided as well. As intensity of effort increases, you need to be able to ventilate as much air as possible and restricting that by nose-breathing is like putting a plastic bag over your head.

Using a rhythmic breathing pattern to reduce body tension or dissociate from exercise effort can be a helpful technique, but the actual breathing still has to match the metabolic needs of the effort---and ultimately those needs will override everything else.

That makes sense.

NicoleHernandezz

So I am not a marathon runner, but I have always been taught that while running, you should aim to breathe in a natural, steady, rhythmic pattern with your footfalls....in through the nose, out through the mouth.

So...

My son came home from school the other day complaining about running in gym class. Mind you, he is not a runner and gets winded pretty quickly, but he tries. He stopped to catch his breath and his gym teacher told him that when he is struggling to breathe while running, he should hold his breath as long as he can and push through it. My son says that he feels like he's going to pass out when he does this but the teacher insists.

We're not talking about track & field or cross country here...we are talking about 4th graders.

Am I right to be upset or is there a benefit to holding your breath while running???

I would be heated and the "teacher" and I would have a serious encounter!