Being overweight is good? Wait, what?

BinaryPulsar

Oh, I see. In North America that is called an autopsy (or at least that's all I've personally heard it called). I looked up inquest and it says that is a legal investigation into the cause of death.

Even though they were unable to find the cause of heart attack, something caused it or else she would not have had a heart attack.

etoiles_argentees

AWARENESS of what we are eating is the key in changing our habits. I have already exceeded my sodium intake today, and I'm freaking out because I'm going out for a fancy dinner which the appetizer is very salty. Awareness of this is making me rethink the appetizer choice.

I'm sorry it scares you.

From The Way To Cook, written by Julia Child and published in 1989.

"Because of media hype and woefully inadequate information, too many people nowadays are deathly afraid of their food, and what does fear of food do to the digestive system? ... I, for one, would much rather swoon over a few thin slices of prime beefsteak, or one small serving of chocolate mousse, or a sliver of foie gras than indulge to the full on such nonentities as fat-free gelatin puddings."

"The pleasures of the table — that lovely old-fashioned phrase — depict food as an art form, as a delightful part of civilized life. In spite of food fads, fitness programs, and health concerns, we must never lose sight of a beautifully conceived meal."


and....

“Life itself is the proper binge.” ― Julia Child

nikilis

stop listening to the radio. its full of ****.

nettip

Oh, I see. In North America that is called an autopsy (or at least that's all I've personally heard it called). I looked up inquest and it says that is a legal investigation into the cause of death.

Even though they were unable to find the cause of heart attack, something caused it or else she would not have had a heart attack.

in the uk we have 2

an inquest for things like this ( unknow death)
post morn tum if say ur in hospital and die but they need to be sure its say the cancer that killed you not mrsa.

neandermagnon

one problem with BMI is that there are a lot of larger framed and very athletic people who are at a healthy body fat percentage while they're in the overweight range according to BMI. These people will be confounding the results of the study, i.e. inflating the average healthfulness of the overweight by BMI population, while people who are starving themselves or suffer from health problems that cause them to lose weight will be lowering the average healthfulness of the healthy by BMI population.

carrying too much fat is what leads to the health risks. having greater muscle mass and denser bones actually improves health, while frame size has no effect on health, it's just how someone is.

I'm right at the very top of the BMI range for my height and i have 22-23% body fat. I'd still be healthy if I put on a little bit more fat or gained a little bit more lean body mass and went into the overweight according to BMI range, I'm only about 3lb away from it as it is. I'm not even that experienced at lifting, I just have a large frame. So I'd be one of those people who would skew the results of a study like this. I'm heavier than average for my height and much healthier than someone who doesn't exercise and eats junk but stays within the healthy BMI range because they skip meals or crash diet every time they start to get a bit heavier.

Studies like this should be based on body fat percentage, not on BMI. Body fat percentage is the same for everyone regardless of frame size, height or how big the muscles are. 35% body fat is obese for women, 30% for men. slightly below that is less than ideal, and the healthy range is 18-28% for women, although very athletic women who exercise a lot and eat well can still be healthy a little lower than that range. If this study was based on body fat percentage, would they really find that women with a body fat percentage between 29 and 35 are more healthy than those with body fat percentages between 18 and 28?

greyoutside

I heard on the radio that apparently a study had come out saying overweight people live longer. http://www.npr.org/blogs/health/2013/01/02/168437030/research-a-little-extra-fat-may-help-you-live-longer

I've also been seeing quite a few people on facebook posting things like "Don't tell me I'm fat, that's "fat shaming" me!" and things like "if size 2 is beautiful, my size 22 must be divine!" and guys saying they will only date overweight and obese women.

I'm not saying that everyone has to be skinny. I understand some people have higher BMI than is considered "normal" due to being muscular. I'm not referring to that. I'm referring to FAT overweight. When did it become a good thing to be at a higher risk of all sorts of diseases, including diabetes and fun stuff like that? Is this a sign of the whole "special snowflake" generation that refuses to be told they are wrong about anything? Is it that our perception of what is healthy is changing?

I don't know about you, but I know there was a point when I finally said "omg enough is enough". I'm nowhere close to where I need to be, but I'm miles ahead of where I was. I try not to judge, and I'm all for being full of self-esteem and liking your body, but should self-esteem come at a price of health when your body is just genuinely too big?

If this post made any sense, let me know your thoughts. If I just rambled nonsensically, well, still let me know your thoughts!

As I recall, that study followed people who were slightly overweight, not morbidly obese. It is absolutely true that people who are a bit overweight have longer lifespans than people who are underweight. There will have to be more studies on life spans of overweight people before we can confirm who tends to live longer than whom.

The idea of fat shaming is that it's no one else's problem if someone is fat. Fat can still be beautiful. Beauty really is in the eye of the beholder, and what one person finds beautiful is purely subjective. It has nothing to do with "fat is healthy" and everything to do with the idea that people should be able to make their own decisions. It's a rejection of the media's implication that you have to be extremely thin to be happy and successful.

You're still mean and a bully if you make someone feel awful about themselves by pretending to care about their health. If someone does not want to change their diet or lifestyle or is not ready to, they do not need to hear about how gross and unhealthy they are. That's cruel. It is also NEVER up to people other than you and your doctor to tell you when you are "genuinely too big". Weight loss is a personal journey and a personal decision.

Guys only dating overweight women, on the other hand, is just yucky fetishism.

greyoutside

Studies like this should be based on body fat percentage, not on BMI. Body fat percentage is the same for everyone regardless of frame size, height or how big the muscles are. 35% body fat is obese for women, 30% for men. slightly below that is less than ideal, and the healthy range is 18-28% for women, although very athletic women who exercise a lot and eat well can still be healthy a little lower than that range. If this study was based on body fat percentage, would they really find that women with a body fat percentage between 29 and 35 are more healthy than those with body fat percentages between 18 and 28?

There's no indication that this study was based on BMIs. As a confounding variable, BMI would also be taken into account when interpreting findings. Researchers and medical professionals are well aware that BMI is nothing more than an extremely basic starting point for identifying who might be over or under weight.

greyoutside

This is why I engage very little in the forums here and mostly use MFP for the tools. The rampant body shaming is just so disheartening.

The only body you need to worry about is yours. You have no right to an opinion about anyone else's. No, not even if you're just ~worried about their health, because let me tell you, you're really not. You're making a judgement about someone based on what you can see and what you have been taught is bad and unhealthy. I would suggest that you read up on healthism and medicalization, but I know that in general, the MFP forums are not big on progressive thought.

Being fat is not bad or good. A person's size and shape have absolutely no bearing on their morality. Obesity is not a problem for you to fight for others. It is not a virus to be eradicated. If you're worried about it for yourself, deal with it for yourself and then let it be. You don't need to worry that fat people are being coddled. Believe me, we really, really aren't. By all means, do not coddle fatties about their weight. But also, by all means, shut the **** up about it, period. It's not your business. Go live your own life. If someone only wants to date fat people, that is fine. If someone thinks their size 22 is divine, that is fine. If someone asks that you not call them fat, THAT IS MORE THAN FINE. That is a request for human decency. Accomodate it.

You sound like you need to be coddled. It IS our business. Being fat is a choice that costs taxpayers money. To deny the fact that obesity leads to a bevy of related health issues is denial. Yes cupcakes taste good, and yes, running is often a big pain in the *kitten*, but that's no reason to try to justify ones inability to make the choice of health. I have no sympathy for obesity, and most of the people who say they are perfectly happy overweight are either A)lying, have never experienced life in shape, and/or c) have subconciously convinced themselves they are happy as a coping mechanism for their failure to make change.

Do you realize how obnoxious you sound? I don't know what kind of bizarre insecurity makes people think that they need to take it out on other people's lives, but other people's lives really aren't your problem after, say, middle/high school, when all anyone can think of to do is gossip and be mean to each other.

LiftAllThePizzas

OK I totally get what they are saying, look at it like is - all of us on this site are over weight and not one of us have just died but since ive been with my husband i know of 4 footballers, 2 runners and 3 school kids all fit and healthy that have just died!!

I have been in hospital the last week for tests on my lungs ( wheezing and collapsing) my lungs should only be working at 70% for my height and age but are working 90% , have family history of diabetes and heart disease and was checked in december and passed `with flying colours my blood pressure is fine,

medically all that is wrong with me is migraines started by my periods and controlled by meds, and my lung now which they think is a type of bronchitis unrelated to weight.

so in this way i am healthier than the girl in my brother inlaws college class that just died of heart attack ( un explained cannot find a reason)

now i am not saying i dont need to drop 100lbs but ive made sure ive been active and still eaten my veg aswell as half of cadburys

Wow, that's about as obvious as cherry picking can get.

Lalouse

Here's a New York Times analysis of that article.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/02/health/study-suggests-lower-death-risk-for-the-overweight.html

AnnaMarieDinVa

I don't have that much to lose, but my doctor, who has always has FABULOUS advice, wants me to lose weight, and get back to the weight I have been most of my life (which is 5'8" 130 lbs). She has never steered me wrong, so I'm going with her recommendation.

neandermagnon

Studies like this should be based on body fat percentage, not on BMI. Body fat percentage is the same for everyone regardless of frame size, height or how big the muscles are. 35% body fat is obese for women, 30% for men. slightly below that is less than ideal, and the healthy range is 18-28% for women, although very athletic women who exercise a lot and eat well can still be healthy a little lower than that range. If this study was based on body fat percentage, would they really find that women with a body fat percentage between 29 and 35 are more healthy than those with body fat percentages between 18 and 28?

There's no indication that this study was based on BMIs. As a confounding variable, BMI would also be taken into account when interpreting findings. Researchers and medical professionals are well aware that BMI is nothing more than an extremely basic starting point for identifying who might be over or under weight.

An article I read on this study a week or two ago indicated that it was based on BMI (though I guess there are issues when you read articles about studies rather than the studies themselves, as I haven't read anything published in a peer reviewed journal about it)

etoiles_argentees

Studies like this should be based on body fat percentage, not on BMI. Body fat percentage is the same for everyone regardless of frame size, height or how big the muscles are. 35% body fat is obese for women, 30% for men. slightly below that is less than ideal, and the healthy range is 18-28% for women, although very athletic women who exercise a lot and eat well can still be healthy a little lower than that range. If this study was based on body fat percentage, would they really find that women with a body fat percentage between 29 and 35 are more healthy than those with body fat percentages between 18 and 28?

There's no indication that this study was based on BMIs. As a confounding variable, BMI would also be taken into account when interpreting findings. Researchers and medical professionals are well aware that BMI is nothing more than an extremely basic starting point for identifying who might be over or under weight.

Wait, are you referring to this study? Body Mass Index = BMI.
Association of All-Cause Mortality With Overweight and Obesity Using Standard Body Mass Index Categories
A Systematic Review and Meta-analysis
Katherine M. Flegal, PhD; Brian K. Kit, MD; Heather Orpana, PhD; Barry I. Graubard, PhD
JAMA.

http://jama.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=1555137#qundefined

fIashforward

I typed the below in response to a a friend posting a link about the proverbial "fat shaming". Forgivme me I am copying so I don't have to retype....


"I think shaming would do little good and likely make it worse. I do think the problem should not be coddled or ignored. I don't think forcing any new regulations on the industries will do anything. They are just responding to demand. More regulations will help NOTHING. They give us what we ask for. What will help is being truthful about ourselves. Admitting when we have a problem. Not blaming it on our body, metabolism, environment, friends, etc.....but realizing we each have a purposeful and willful choice to make. Only by changing our choices will we really make a difference. WE have to do that. No one can do it for us. If WE change, then that is the best motivation for others. Leading by positive example will win more folks over than anything else will."


http://todayhealth.today.com/_news/2013/01/24/16664866-fat-shaming-may-curb-obesity-bioethicist-says?lite

I added the link to the article we had been discussing....so you know what I was talking about. I think it applies to what you are saying.

Obesity begins in the home. That's where we need to begin the fight -- with childhood. I am a teacher, and I will be teaching health to 6th graders next quarter. The focus, for us, will be on nutrition. I make them do a full blown research project on all types of fast food, making them aware of what exactly they are putting into their bodies. I'm not telling them HOW or WHAT to eat, but I am letting them know how their bodies react to bad food. In fact, I've begun working it into my science lectures about cell structures and the importance of eating right and being healthy and how it plays in the role of cell stability, energy and reproduction.

I think we have become less concerned with the issue of obesity, and more complacent with children who are overweight. I find it unsettling that pediatricians are not really pursuing the issue. Yes, it's uncomfortable to tell a parent their child is obese, but I think there are ways we can do this that doesn't offend the parents. IT NEEDS TO BE DISCUSSED AND ADDRESSED.

We've become a nation of fatties, and it's getting harder and harder to change our country's situation, mostly because nobody is willing to admit that what we are a nation of junk food junkies (well, a lot of us are)/

I'm not referencing anyone in particular here, but the nation as a collective.

Teaching about health is obviously good. But if it was I would talk more on the positives of healthy food than the negatives of bad foods. Classes like these often make fat people feel worse about themselves, or embarrassed.

etoiles_argentees

We've become a nation of fatties, and it's getting harder and harder to change our country's situation, mostly because nobody is willing to admit that what we are a nation of junk food junkies (well, a lot of us are)/

How do you define junk food? And don't you make your own choices when it comes to eating?

shmoony

This is why I engage very little in the forums here and mostly use MFP for the tools. The rampant body shaming is just so disheartening.

The only body you need to worry about is yours. You have no right to an opinion about anyone else's. No, not even if you're just ~worried about their health, because let me tell you, you're really not. You're making a judgement about someone based on what you can see and what you have been taught is bad and unhealthy. I would suggest that you read up on healthism and medicalization, but I know that in general, the MFP forums are not big on progressive thought.

Being fat is not bad or good. A person's size and shape have absolutely no bearing on their morality. Obesity is not a problem for you to fight for others. It is not a virus to be eradicated. If you're worried about it for yourself, deal with it for yourself and then let it be. You don't need to worry that fat people are being coddled. Believe me, we really, really aren't. By all means, do not coddle fatties about their weight. But also, by all means, shut the **** up about it, period. It's not your business. Go live your own life. If someone only wants to date fat people, that is fine. If someone thinks their size 22 is divine, that is fine. If someone asks that you not call them fat, THAT IS MORE THAN FINE. That is a request for human decency. Accomodate it.

You sound like you need to be coddled. It IS our business. Being fat is a choice that costs taxpayers money. To deny the fact that obesity leads to a bevy of related health issues is denial. Yes cupcakes taste good, and yes, running is often a big pain in the *kitten*, but that's no reason to try to justify ones inability to make the choice of health. I have no sympathy for obesity, and most of the people who say they are perfectly happy overweight are either A)lying, have never experienced life in shape, and/or c) have subconciously convinced themselves they are happy as a coping mechanism for their failure to make change.

Do you realize how obnoxious you sound? I don't know what kind of bizarre insecurity makes people think that they need to take it out on other people's lives, but other people's lives really aren't your problem after, say, middle/high school, when all anyone can think of to do is gossip and be mean to each other.

I apologize for thinking fat poeple make a choice to be lazy and cost me money. I will no longer say that the inability to put down the cookie and go for run is purely a weakness and that hiding behind statements like "big is beautiful" is a mere justification for their lack of will.

cncrafton

I apologize for thinking fat poeple make a choice to be lazy and cost me money. I will no longer say that the inability to put down the cookie and go for run is purely a weakness and that hiding behind statements like "big is beautiful" is a mere justification for their lack of will.

Is the kid in your signature yours? I guarantee that he/she costs me more money in taxes than me being fat costs you, considering I have had ONE health problem in my entire life. Please get off (better yet, fall off) your high horse.

Regarding your first (and equally unbelievably stupid) post, luckily, I am not asking for your sympathy. I am asking that you learn what matters involve your input and what matters you should stay blessedly silent on. The body of anyone who is not you is one of them.

CrazyTrackLady

We've become a nation of fatties, and it's getting harder and harder to change our country's situation, mostly because nobody is willing to admit that what we are a nation of junk food junkies (well, a lot of us are)/

How do you define junk food? And don't you make your own choices when it comes to eating?

I'm sure you understand the difference between junk food and nutritious food. Adults make their own choices when it comes to eating. Children eat what their parents feed them. which means parents make the choices for the kids. If parents make lousy choices for their children on a regular basis, then therein lies the problem.

CrazyTrackLady

Teaching about health is obviously good. But if it was I would talk more on the positives of healthy food than the negatives of bad foods. Classes like these often make fat people feel worse about themselves, or embarrassed.

Actually, I make all the fat kids in the class come up to the front of the room so I can pinch their fat rolls, ridicule them in public and make them do push ups until they puke in front of the super skinny, beautiful kids. Fat shaming is the ONLY way these kids are going to listen to me.

LiftAllThePizzas

Is the kid in your signature yours? I guarantee that he/she costs me more money in taxes than me being fat costs you, considering I have had ONE health problem in my entire life. Please get off (better yet, fall off) your high horse.

This isn't a good comparison. Raising kids is a necessary part of the continued functioning of our civilization. Obesity is not. Plus the prior generation had to pay for your childhood, too, unless you incubated/raised yourself in a vacuum.

As far as only having one health problem, you're only 21. Lots of people make it to 21 without any health problems. Lots of 21 year old smokers don't have lung cancer or emphysema either...