Not getting the whole "Eat more to lose more" mentality
Replies
-
Hi there! my highest weight was 240. I'm down 80 lbs. I'm not a nutritionist or anything, but I thought I'd comment because I think I've been in a similar place. So I'm trying to be a LITTLE critical, but know that it comes from a place where I feel like I know what you're going thru, ok?
I think you might be the kind of person where the old addage "a calorie is a calorie" doesn't apply. As in, if you are really going to try to eat at the "low" end of your calorie range, you have to make sure that every calorie is as healthy as possible. Frozen pre-packaged lunches, pudding cups, and chocolate covered pretzles might fit into your CALORIE goals for the day, but they might not fit into the goals you're trying to reach ultimately. I'm not saying never have snacks or processed food. But if ANYONE out there is only eating 1200-1500 calories every day, then every calorie has to be filled with as much nutrition as possible. Eating more whole, nutritious foods thruout the day will leave you feeling better and more full.
I don't know if all of the things you're logging as "snacks" are eaten at the end of the day, but if you find yourself making poor choices after dinner, you could try eating more calories earlier in the day. That way you're not as hungry late in the day and less likely to grab something unhealthy, like a tub of ice cream.
I'm not suggesting you eat more calories. I'm suggesting that you try making the calories you DO eat, more nutritious. It might help you start losing again when you're giving your body the fuel it needs to succeed.
Nope, need the honesty! Thank you for it and for letting me know about your own experience.
(I do know the tub of ice cream was not a smart choice...that won't happen again)
I do find myself trying to make up calories at the end of the day. I am a teacher and have to be at school by 7 AM, so my breakfast has to be quick and I don't have time to eat during the day outside of lunch. I may be able to get a quick snack in, but not many.
Also, I am trying to choose "healthy" foods (green pepper slices, cheese sticks, nuts, yogurt). So I feel like after those, with my breakfast, and my lunch, I always have something like 900 calories for the rest of the day! That is when I just eat what we have around to make up for the calories - especially on days when I am working out and I need to eat MORE.
As for the chocolate covered pretzels and sugar free pudding - I crave something sweet after I eat meals. I don't know why. I usually satisfy that craving with a pudding or two chocolate covered pretzels. Becuase they are "under my calorie limit" I thought they would be okay. I guess not. Any suggestions on how to satisfy that craving without eating something terrible?0 -
HA!!! Even that's okay every now and then, you'll find chocolate in my diary daily! I've lost 29 pounds and working on the last 15! :-)There's so much more to this. More than I have time to explain at the moment but I'll search for the info I used and I'll message it to you. Your diary looks great, you just need more information to work with.
You mean except for the pint of Ben and Jerry's frozen yogurt I had last night...pretend you didn't see that.0 -
it's not about whether 1500 cals/day will put you in starvation mode or not. It's simply about why deprive yourself when you don't have to...?
Based on what the calculators said for your height/weight/activity levels:
You can lose weight on 1500 cals/day, you'll lose it more quickly, but unless you have a lot of fat to lose you'll risk losing lean body mass with it and making your metabolism slower, and also feeling grumpy and hungry a lot, and having to deprive yourself of stuff you'd rather eat, and you'll have a greater risk of putting the weight back on again and a greater risk of plateaus
OR
You can lose weight on 1900 cals/day. You'll lose it more slowly, but you'll have less risk of losing lean body mass, you won't feel hungry, you'll be able to enjoy your favourite treats more and enjoy a wider variety of meals and bigger serving sizes, you'll have more energy, your metabolism is more likely to stay fast and you'll find it easier to maintain your goal weight once you get there.
Which would you choose?0 -
The reason why people who eat less may not lose weight is because when you cut calories too much you are putting a stress on your body. Your body responds by releasing cortisol which is a stress hormone. This tells your body that it needs to hold on to every ounce of fat, because there is too much stress on it. Adding exercise also puts stress on your body. If you are not eating enough to fuel the exercise, it is only adding stress hormones. Not eating enough also affects the hormones called leptin and ghrelin. These are the hormones that tell your body when you are hungry, and when you are full so that you stop eating.0
-
There's an important piece missing.
Eat more to lose more, and workout more (strength and cardio).
0 -
without eating something terrible?
Well, don't see it as "terrible." Food isn't really "negative" or "bad." There's just probably better choices in any given situation, but it's hard for me to make suggestions without knowing you. My cravings now are different than the ones I had at the start. My sweet snacks early on when I'd exhausted my daily calorie limit were sugar-free jello, diet soda, ANYTHING with no calories. But as I ate more whole foods, I stopped craving processed sugars so much. My sweet snacks now are oranges and apples or a banana smoothie. Quick snacks for me are nuts or trail mix (satisfying, but high in calories, so portion control for these are necessary) or chocolate milk. But honestly, I only have a sweet tooth in the mornings.
I'm tempted to tell you this: if you have time to make homemade dinner each night, then I'm suggesting to make yourself 3 servings of a balanced dinner each night. Then eat the second serving when you get hungry later in the evening. Then eat the 3rd serving for lunch the next day. Or, to add more variety. Make 3 servings each time, but save two of them for lunches & 2nd dinners later in the week.
Really, each calorie has to be as packed as possible with nutrients. If you're going to continue eating at the low end of your allowable calorie range, then every calorie should give you as much bang for your (calorie) buck. For instance, you might want to try eating less sodium and more fiber.0 -
I recently got a bodymedia armband and it has me burning between 2300 and 2700 calories a day with usually only 200-400 coming from formal exercise. Using the best calculators I could find on the internet they all had my TDEE at less than 1200 so no wonder I was having trouble. At 1200 where MFP had me start I really was starving. I lost great for about 4 days and then I got so sick. I am a little person 132 and 5'2" but I am very active in little ways all day long taking care of 4 little kids. I had been eating 1400 calories and not losing. After getting the armband I started eating 1650 and I started losing again. Now I am still eating that and have stopped losing with the same workout regiment, I am actually going to up it again to 1800 and see how that goes since that will be at least 500 per day deficit for me. The long and the short is that if you eat too little your metabolism slows down to make the food stretch to fill you bodies needs.
I bought one at the beginning of the year, started wearing it january 1st, and like a super geek I've been tracking my calorie deficits daily on an excel spreadsheet. By tracking my calorie deficits, I can figure out my total deficit for the month, divide by 3500, and that should give me how many lbs I lost for the month, and I weighed myself this morning, and it's only off by 0.07% over the course of the whole month (yes, I'm THAT much of a geek). Losing weight is now a science project for me. Anyway - I highly recommend getting one of these and wearing it religiously to figure out exactly how many calories you are burning. It's easy to account for, pretty accurately, how many calories you eat, but it's harder, IMO, to accurately track how many you burn. But the armband seems to work pretty well from my 'data'...0 -
bump...0
-
it's not about whether 1500 cals/day will put you in starvation mode or not. It's simply about why deprive yourself when you don't have to...?
Based on what the calculators said for your height/weight/activity levels:
You can lose weight on 1500 cals/day, you'll lose it more quickly, but unless you have a lot of fat to lose you'll risk losing lean body mass with it and making your metabolism slower, and also feeling grumpy and hungry a lot, and having to deprive yourself of stuff you'd rather eat, and you'll have a greater risk of putting the weight back on again and a greater risk of plateaus
OR
You can lose weight on 1900 cals/day. You'll lose it more slowly, but you'll have less risk of losing lean body mass, you won't feel hungry, you'll be able to enjoy your favourite treats more and enjoy a wider variety of meals and bigger serving sizes, you'll have more energy, your metabolism is more likely to stay fast and you'll find it easier to maintain your goal weight once you get there.
Which would you choose?
And you can keep your tub of ice cream... 0 -
it's not about whether 1500 cals/day will put you in starvation mode or not. It's simply about why deprive yourself when you don't have to...?
Based on what the calculators said for your height/weight/activity levels:
You can lose weight on 1500 cals/day, you'll lose it more quickly, but unless you have a lot of fat to lose you'll risk losing lean body mass with it and making your metabolism slower, and also feeling grumpy and hungry a lot, and having to deprive yourself of stuff you'd rather eat, and you'll have a greater risk of putting the weight back on again and a greater risk of plateaus
OR
You can lose weight on 1900 cals/day. You'll lose it more slowly, but you'll have less risk of losing lean body mass, you won't feel hungry, you'll be able to enjoy your favourite treats more and enjoy a wider variety of meals and bigger serving sizes, you'll have more energy, your metabolism is more likely to stay fast and you'll find it easier to maintain your goal weight once you get there.
Which would you choose?
And you can keep your tub of ice cream...
Hahaha! No, I felt so crappy in bed last night that I vowed to never see Ben nor Jerry ever again....0 -
This forum has me so confused. What is TDEE and BMR? Have I been missing something to help me lose weight!? :huh: How do I calculate these? can someone give me some info on these. Thanks!0
-
I am in your court inviting you to take a rest, then cheer you on towards your goal. There is so much information out there and most of it is probably sound. What I have concluded for myself, is that everyone's body is unique in space and time. Hence, in general many things are true. BUT in practice on any one body at any one point in time, the application can be limited.
Over the years, how many things have you tried? Lower Carbs - Lower Kcal - Not eating past 4 - Eating twice daily - Grazing all day - Heavy Cardio - Free weights - High protein - No fat? What have you learned about your body? Which worked for a short time. Which ones made you feel lousy. Which ones shaped your body? Which ones cleared up your skin, but had no effect on your weight?
You already know at least one thing: your optimal kcal intake at your current activity/stress/age level. What else? Go for everything that improved your health, including weight, but not excluding other results that indicate improved health.
Then go to your diet (perhaps with a nutritionist or equivalent) and decide upon ways to HAPPILY tweak it so that it is better. Better BUT NOT Perfect. Get is better for awhile and appreciate your health improvements that those tweaks made, then make some more tweaks. This journey is a marathon and not a race.
Sending Love and Care0 -
I just read the Road Map post everyone talks about. First of all, I am confused in general, but basically according to that I should be eating close to 1900 calories a day.
MFP has me at 1810 a day if I want to lose one lb a week. I never even get close to that (I probably average around 1500-1600 a day) unless I make a conscious effort to eat 1800 calories - and usually that involves me having two helpings of dinner to get there (so I think I am doing it wrong...)
So if I don't eat 1800 calories a day, and only eat 1500 people say "YOU ARE NOT EATING ENOUGH!" and tell me that is why I am not losing weight. However, if I change my goals in MFP to where I want to lose two lbs a week, MFP tells me I shoudl be eating 1320 calories a day.
So, it makes sense to me that, as long as I am eating between 1320-1800 calories a day, I should be losing, right? Which means, if I am averaging 1500 calories a day, I should be losing 1-2 lbs on a weekly basis, but I have lost only one pound in the last three weeks.
As for "starvation" mode, I would think that if I were eating below 1200 calories, that my body would freak out, but I really don't understand how 1500-1600 calories would send my body into starvation mode, especially if MFP says I could eat 1320 and lose weight.
I AM SO CONFUSED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And beyond frustrated.
(It all makes me want to go eat a donut then take a nap. Kidding - kind of).
think of it this way... if you eat too low for too long, there are internal metabolic changes relating to hormones that can affect the efficiency at which your body burns stored fat. you "eat more" to avoid those internal changes.0 -
This forum has me so confused. What is TDEE and BMR? Have I been missing something to help me lose weight!? :huh: How do I calculate these? can someone give me some info on these. Thanks!
BMR - basal metabolic rate. The amount they would feed you in a coma for your basic bodily functions.
TDEE - total daily energy expenditure. This is BMR plus all of the energy you need for your day for everything you do.
These are estimated by your gender, age, height, weight.
Here is one place to start: http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/0 -
also, based on your stats, your BMR is 1726, but a sedentary TDEE is 2072. Small difference, but you would take your percentage from 2072.
Where did you find this? I used the fit2befit link that was posted in message boards a while ago, and it said my BMR was 1733 (and my TDEE 2383 - I don't know, that was the number associated with "light activity" that I was told to use). So the TDEE - 20% was 1906.
I don't know if I am using the right link/calculator...
BMR comes from one of these equations:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basal_metabolic_rate
You multiply the BMR by an activity factor to get your total energy expenditure:
http://www.fao.org/docrep/007/y5686e/y5686e07.htm0 -
I truly believe it is about how often you eat...I notice that I can workout 2+ hours and eat about 1200 calories and not lose weight, but when I workout 1 hr a day, and make sure to eat at least every 2-4 hrs and not more than 1600 calories a day, I lose weight like crazy, I have lost at most 5 pounds per week, eating more than ever! High protein foods, enough water, and please make sure that you eat something within the 1st hour of waking up, I often wake up and drink a glass of cold water then 30 minutes later i have 1/2 banana...2 hrs later I have a small breakfast...2 hours later another snack...2 hrs later small lunch...get it? be consistent and keep that metabolism reved up!!! i PROMISE it will work for you, just like it has worked for me in the past when I have hit a plateau. Good Luck!0
-
I truly believe it is about how often you eat...I notice that I can workout 2+ hours and eat about 1200 calories and not lose weight, but when I workout 1 hr a day, and make sure to eat at least every 2-4 hrs and not more than 1600 calories a day, I lose weight like crazy, I have lost at most 5 pounds per week, eating more than ever! High protein foods, enough water, and please make sure that you eat something within the 1st hour of waking up, I often wake up and drink a glass of cold water then 30 minutes later i have 1/2 banana...2 hrs later I have a small breakfast...2 hours later another snack...2 hrs later small lunch...get it? be consistent and keep that metabolism reved up!!! i PROMISE it will work for you, just like it has worked for me in the past when I have hit a plateau. Good Luck!
you are attributing your weight loss to a behavioral pattern that has no actual effect on it.
all 3 things i boldfaced have been shown to be irrelevant to weight loss by researchers.
sorry, not trying to be harsh. continue doing those things for yourself if you believe them to be helpful, but as advice for newbies, these tips won't make any difference.0 -
In the evenings I usually drink unsweetened black tea. It cleanses my palate, which erases "a taste" for something sweet or salty.0
-
per MFP member WBB55
DOUBLE UNDERSCORE & EXCLAMATION POINTS--> make every calorie count0 -
Hi there! my highest weight was 240. I'm down 80 lbs. I'm not a nutritionist or anything, but I thought I'd comment because I think I've been in a similar place. So I'm trying to be a LITTLE critical, but know that it comes from a place where I feel like I know what you're going thru, ok?
I think you might be the kind of person where the old addage "a calorie is a calorie" doesn't apply. As in, if you are really going to try to eat at the "low" end of your calorie range, you have to make sure that every calorie is as healthy as possible. Frozen pre-packaged lunches, pudding cups, and chocolate covered pretzles might fit into your CALORIE goals for the day, but they might not fit into the goals you're trying to reach ultimately. I'm not saying never have snacks or processed food. But if ANYONE out there is only eating 1200-1500 calories every day, then every calorie has to be filled with as much nutrition as possible. Eating more whole, nutritious foods thruout the day will leave you feeling better and more full.
I don't know if all of the things you're logging as "snacks" are eaten at the end of the day, but if you find yourself making poor choices after dinner, you could try eating more calories earlier in the day. That way you're not as hungry late in the day and less likely to grab something unhealthy, like a tub of ice cream.
I'm not suggesting you eat more calories. I'm suggesting that you try making the calories you DO eat, more nutritious. It might help you start losing again when you're giving your body the fuel it needs to succeed.0 -
The way I visualize it reminds me of an old video game from the 80's called Track & Field. You ran the 100 yard dash by spazzing on the left/right buttons, the faster you pushed them the faster your runner went. Your opponent was the computer player, who would run at a slow pace for the first second, and then do exactly everything you did from then on, with a one second delay.
So if you started out super fast and then slowed down (like everyone naturally does) the computer would be behind for the first second, and then it would have the burst of speed you started with, and pass you up, and then you would never be able to catch up because you had already used up your biggest burst you were capable of. The winning strategy was to start slower and build up speed so your top speed was all in the last second of the race and the computer was always too late to keep up with you.What you have to realize in that your metabolic rate decreases in response to a caloric deficit.
So, let's say you're eating 1500 calories and losing one pound a week at a 500 cal/day deficit. After a while, through several mechanisms, you don't have a 500 cal/day deficit anymore. So, to reestablish a deficit, you have to lower calories a bit more and/or increase your calorie expenditure. You can stave off this lowering of your metabolic rate for a longer time by taking frequent diet breaks.
The problem with jumping right into something like 1,100 calories a day is that yes, initially you will lose weight, but, just as before, your body will catch up, and you'll stall. So what do you do then? Lower calories? Not likely. Increase activity? You're luck if you have the energy. The only solution at that point is to increase your caloric intake for an extended period of time, where weight loss will eventually stall, and you may even gain some, and give your hormones a chance to return to baseline. Most people on MFP aren't going to do that. So, the most intelligent course of action is to use the smallest deficit possible that allows you to lose weight, so you have more wiggle room to adjust things later.
As for people that "eat more and start losing," I suspect that an increase in calories relieves some of those stress hormones which cause you to hold on to some water, causing people to see relatively rapid weight loss after raising calories. I also suspect that eating enough food gives people enough energy to train with intensity, which actually leads to a higher net deficit.
The thing I don't get with scooby's calc is that apparently you cannot do 1-3 hours of strenuous exercise, nor can anyone do 5-7 hours of light exercise. Maybe it's just poorly worded, but I found that part annoying.
If I enter lightly active on scooby and MFP, my goals are 1980 and 1910 respectively. They're well within tolerance considering I probably miscount more than that per day since I don't measure/weigh everything to death.
I think a lot of people also have problems with determining their activity level due to a Dunning-Kruger corollary where everyone thinks of themselves as typical, so it's hard to decide what is "moderate" or whether one's exertion is more than or less than moderate, or actually moderate.0 -
also, based on your stats, your BMR is 1726, but a sedentary TDEE is 2072. Small difference, but you would take your percentage from 2072.
Where did you find this? I used the fit2befit link that was posted in message boards a while ago, and it said my BMR was 1733 (and my TDEE 2383 - I don't know, that was the number associated with "light activity" that I was told to use). So the TDEE - 20% was 1906.
I don't know if I am using the right link/calculator...
He calculated your TDEE at sedentary and you calculated at lightly active. Actually, that's the tricky part...most people who utilize the TDEE method include their exercise in their calculation and others prefer sedentary and then log if they do their exercise and eat those back (pretty much like the MFP method). Having done both, I prefer including my exercise in my TDEE and taking off that 20%...I don't have to worry about over estimating caloric burns, etc. I'm set as lightly active with 1-3 hours of exercise weekly and I've been averaging about 1 Lb per week loss. Just remember to actually do your exercise and to increase intensity over time if you include that as activity in your TDEE. I know some people who've started off good, but then started slacking on their exercise without changing their activity setting...obviously you can imagine what the result was.
Also remember that none of this is an exact science and all calculators use estimates based on averages so it's not uncommon to have to play with your numbers just a little bit. As has been posted, pick a method and stick to it for 4-6 weeks...then tweak a bit from there if necessary.0 -
I didn't read most of the responses, but just wanted to jump in and add that those online calculators can be very inaccurate for some people. They take the information you plug in and give you an estimate based on the average for someone with your stats. We all know people's bodies and metabolisms are different. A couple of years ago I had my RMR tested in a lab and found it was like 300 calories lower than the online calculators. I don't know why because I wasn't in starvation mode or anything (it was done as part of a study at the university here). I don't know if it's related, but my resting heart rate is also particularly low (42ish).
Anyway, my point is to realize that what the online calculators give you are estimates. It's up to you to do your own research and figure out what works for your body. That will likely involve some trial and error, but be sure you're giving what you're trying enough time to see if it's working before you give up completely and go try something else.0 -
I just read the Road Map post everyone talks about. First of all, I am confused in general, but basically according to that I should be eating close to 1900 calories a day.
MFP has me at 1810 a day if I want to lose one lb a week. I never even get close to that (I probably average around 1500-1600 a day) unless I make a conscious effort to eat 1800 calories - and usually that involves me having two helpings of dinner to get there (so I think I am doing it wrong...)
So if I don't eat 1800 calories a day, and only eat 1500 people say "YOU ARE NOT EATING ENOUGH!" and tell me that is why I am not losing weight. However, if I change my goals in MFP to where I want to lose two lbs a week, MFP tells me I shoudl be eating 1320 calories a day.
So, it makes sense to me that, as long as I am eating between 1320-1800 calories a day, I should be losing, right? Which means, if I am averaging 1500 calories a day, I should be losing 1-2 lbs on a weekly basis, but I have lost only one pound in the last three weeks.
As for "starvation" mode, I would think that if I were eating below 1200 calories, that my body would freak out, but I really don't understand how 1500-1600 calories would send my body into starvation mode, especially if MFP says I could eat 1320 and lose weight.
I AM SO CONFUSED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And beyond frustrated.
(It all makes me want to go eat a donut then take a nap. Kidding - kind of).
think of it this way... if you eat too low for too long, there are internal metabolic changes relating to hormones that can affect the efficiency at which your body burns stored fat. you "eat more" to avoid those internal changes.
I am so with you on this - the top post - I am as confused as you. I had my bmr done at the weekend and it was 1770. Sedentary lifestyle so plus about 500 cal. Then I need to lose weight so minus about 500 cal. So I am at 1770 again. Forget about adding in teh calories in for the exercise that i do for now, but why does the calc work out at 1770 but MFP tells me it should be 1200. I have been in plateu for about 5 months now
I have a high body fat %. Should I try eating 1770 cal plus my exercise calories and you think i will start losing weight? 0 -
This is precisely why I have a BodymediaFit on the way, since there is simply too much loosy-goosyness in these calculations for my taste. I don't want to waste 4 weeks operating at an inaccurate TDEE, only to discover the issue and have to change it then.The thing I don't get with scooby's calc is that apparently you cannot do 1-3 hours of strenuous exercise, nor can anyone do 5-7 hours of light exercise. Maybe it's just poorly worded, but I found that part annoying.
If I enter lightly active on scooby and MFP, my goals are 1980 and 1910 respectively. They're well within tolerance considering I probably miscount more than that per day since I don't measure/weigh everything to death.
I think a lot of people also have problems with determining their activity level due to a Dunning-Kruger corollary where everyone thinks of themselves as typical, so it's hard to decide what is "moderate" or whether one's exertion is more than or less than moderate, or actually moderate.0 -
I think it is important to realize that TDEE equations represent the maximum amount of calories needed to maintain when not restricting calories. You can use TDEE equations to estimate what the maximum amount of calories would be to maintain weight relative to activity. As Fire Rock stated, your RMR will be in a declined state as long as you are restricting calories. So it isn't necessarily that the predictions are terribly off, it's that there is a bias established due to restriction.
The best way to discover your actual TDEE is to gradually up calories to the maximum amount which leads to relative weight homeostasis. Since it's strongly recommended that persons take diet breaks after several months of chronic restriction, people can use that time to establish their actual TDEE.
As long as you provide your body with less energy in the form of calories relative to your TDEE needs, you will lose fat mass. But it is best for people to start with smaller deficits so they experience less alterations to the endocrine system and have more "wiggle" room to adjust calories.0 -
This is what works for me...every time, and if it can work for someone else that would be great! and no you are not being harsh, and as for the studies...there are also studies that support some of the items that you have mentioned...This was actually advice I received from a personal trainer at my gym who just so noticed that I worked out a lot but did not lose weight...we met and discussed my eating pattern and he suggested i eat more often at only 1200 calories, and still I did not lose weight, so he suggested I add another 200 calories, and then another 200, until BOOM, I was losing weight and eating constantly (healthy food) I honestly lost that stubborn last 25 pounds in about 2 months and this he did for FREE! I did not pay him nor did I come to him for advice, that was very nice of him to help me out just because.
Things work for different people, our bodies are all different, so this here is just an idea!0
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 393.4K Introduce Yourself
- 43.8K Getting Started
- 260.2K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.9K Food and Nutrition
- 47.4K Recipes
- 232.5K Fitness and Exercise
- 427 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.5K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.5K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 153K Motivation and Support
- 8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.7K MyFitnessPal Information
- 24 News and Announcements
- 1.1K Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.6K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions