One month with no weight change :(
Replies
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Thanks for the extra notes people. As you can tell, I'm wary about eating more calories. In fact, I'm not sure where the more calories would come from. But like I said, one easy thing I can do is add an extra serving of brown rice every day and see how that works. That will still be within both my doctor-prescribed and MFP-recommended daily calorie limits.
Thanks again,
doug0 -
your weight fluctuates every day, it can fluctuate as much as 2 kg. a day! Take some measurements, take some before and after pictures. Theres more results than just the number on the scale. Up the intensity on your workouts. Also, you may have just hit a plateau. To get out of this, you could try zig zagging your calories every day :
monday : net intake = 1900 cal
tuesday : net intake =1300 cal
wed, : net intake = 1800 cal
thurs. : net intake =1500
fridday : net intake = 2000 calories
you get the point. And also, watch your sodium levels, and make sure your eating clean foods, and staying mostly away from processed foods. Drink lots of water as well. Good luck, hope I helped!
Feel free to ask me if you have any more questions!:)0 -
Heading into 2 months with no weight change.
Unfortunately I can't take *everybody's* advice, because different people suggest different things.
Some of the suggestions don't seem to work. Some seem impractical. Some - I just don't know.
Between these forums and the others it still seems the best and most consistent advice I've had is to eat less and exercise more.
doug0 -
there would be nothing wrong with eating a small serving of nuts? more calorie dense, easy to add a bit of calories if
you're already pretty full from lots of fruits and veggies.
also, the bmr is the calories burned if you are laying in bed all day.
we're supposed to always eat more than our bmr, but less than TDEE which is the bmr PLUS calories burned from activity.
if we want to lose weight.
eating equal to TDEE is maintenance.0 -
Everybody has different calorie requirements for the activity and life style that they live. If you are not meeting those requirements in your diet then you will have great difficulty in meeting your goals. Your body has an amount of calories that it burns off in a 24 hour period from doing absolutely nothing. This comes from your body's natural processes to keep you alive and is called a basal or resting metabolic rate (BMR/RMR). That number of calories plus about 200-500 calories more will balance an individuals intake versus expenditure in an individual with a sedentary to moderately active day. Any additional energy expenditure needs to be compensated by the appropriate intake. In order to "burn off" 1 lb of body mass you would need to expend 3500 calories. The same is true vice versa in order to gain 1 lb of body mass you would need to take in an extra 3500 calories. A safe way to do this is to burn 500 more and intake 500 less for a net loss of 1000 calories a day, over the course of a week that is 7000 calories resulting in a 2 lb loss in body mass. This will only apply if your adequately meeting your body's calorie needs BEFORE. Prolonged time in a calorie deficit can lead to negative results. If you are already at a significant calorie deficit, which it seems like you are, then expect to gain some weight as your body adjusts to the increase in calories.0
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Well, I just got back from the doctor. I showed him my daily calorie intake, and my exercise output and my net calorie intake and he insists for a 56 year old 174 cm man trying to continue weight loss at my weight that I am eating and exercising just right and that it's just a plateau and that I should not change anything and just be more patient.
He says absolutely, definitely I am not eating anywhere near starvation levels, which would be int he 600-800 calories/day range for me.
It's been 8 weeks stuck in the 95-96 kg range, but I will try to be more patient.
doug
p.s. On my "heart disease reversal diet" no added oils or nut are allowed.0 -
I think my diet break worked.
I upped my calories from 1310 net, where I was losing maybe 1 or 2 pounds a month to 1900 + half my exercise calories for 3 weeks. Although I initially fluctuated up a pound or two up, by the end of three weeks I was back at my lowest weight again. I take this as evidence that my metabolism has returned to normal.
Started cutting again to 1310 two days ago and am a pound down. At 1900 net, I should have been losing 0.5 a pound a week according t MFP calculations. Close enough for me.0 -
Well, I just got back from the doctor. I showed him my daily calorie intake, and my exercise output and my net calorie intake and he insists for a 56 year old 174 cm man trying to continue weight loss at my weight that I am eating and exercising just right and that it's just a plateau and that I should not change anything and just be more patient.
He says absolutely, definitely I am not eating anywhere near starvation levels, which would be int he 600-800 calories/day range for me.
It's been 8 weeks stuck in the 95-96 kg range, but I will try to be more patient.
doug
p.s. On my "heart disease reversal diet" no added oils or nut are allowed.
Older people have slower metabolisms and are often less active than younger people, so they require fewer calories. Generally speaking, a 40- to 60-year-old man weighing 200 lbs. requires about 2,600 calories, and a 60- to 80-year-old man requires about 2,400 calories.
Read more: http://www.livestrong.com/article/339852-how-many-calories-does-a-200-pound-man-need/#ixzz2OsKYDaxx
I have no clue what information your doctor has on nutrition but him telling you that you could restrict yourself 850 calories seems borderline dangerous thing for a doctor to say. I would really get a second opinion from a qualified nutritionist in your area.0 -
My doctor didn't at all say I could restrict my calories to 850 calories! He said what I wrote in my message: that I should stick with what I am doing - aiming for a high of 1800/day but if I eat in the 1400-1500 calorie/day range + exercise that's fine.
Anyway, my experiment with "eating more" has been a disaster. Today was my weekly weighing and I'm up 1.4 kg from last week to 96.6 kg. That was my weight 2 months ago.
I'm not going to try to "eat more to lose weight." I'm going to eat the right amount of calories to lose weight. And that is apparently not anywhere near 2,000 calories a day.
So thanks for everybody's suggestions. I do appreciate it. Naturally I can't agree with everybody. I can just do the best I can.
Thanks!
doug0 -
Well, I'll try to eat more and see if that helps.
But starvation mode isn't supposed to kick in until under 1,000 calories per day.
Anyway, I'll add some extra tofu or something with protein in it to add a few hundred calories a day and see if that (despite what seems like common sense to me) actually sparks weight loss again.
Thanks,
doug
no, just no ...
True starvation mode only 'kicks in" when you do not eat for 72 hours and even then the initial effects are minimal....
What MFP defines as "starvation mode" is in reality not accurate, and at best a myth....0 -
Yes, I suspect starvation mode is mostly wishful thinking, unless you really are drastically undereating - like my doctor said. And that should only be done under medical supervision.
For the most part I think the less you eat and the more you exercise the more weight you will lose. I just need to eat less and/or exercise more.
doug0 -
Still haven't been able to break through the plateau. Weight up today.
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I'm at exactly the same weight I was 2 months ago.0
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How much fat do you get? Are you sure you are having healthy amounts of fat. We need it for homones etc..0
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I've read a few of your threads/posts, and I have to say, the scale is not your friend. You might be less frustrated if you make a reasonable, achievable plan, and follow it consistently for 6 weeks, and NEVER once step on the scale.
I second the recommendation that you check out the Eat, Train, Progress group and fill out SideSteel and Sarauk2sf questionnaire. But you need to be willing to follow their advice and not push back with how it won't possibly work for you. Good luck!1 -
Hang in there!! I've given up a few times after being stuck and put weight back on, and regret it now.
Have you tried changing your exercise? Sometimes just doing something different will tell your body to get out of it's rut.0 -
Well, I just got back from the doctor. I showed him my daily calorie intake, and my exercise output and my net calorie intake and he insists for a 56 year old 174 cm man trying to continue weight loss at my weight that I am eating and exercising just right and that it's just a plateau and that I should not change anything and just be more patient.
He says absolutely, definitely I am not eating anywhere near starvation levels, which would be int he 600-800 calories/day range for me.
It's been 8 weeks stuck in the 95-96 kg range, but I will try to be more patient.
doug
p.s. On my "heart disease reversal diet" no added oils or nut are allowed.
Did you have blood work done? The most important thing here is how your blood work is coming along.0 -
But starvation mode isn't supposed to kick in until under 1,000 calories per day.
Who told you that? Knowledge is power my friend read this and you will be in control. http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/912920-in-place-of-a-road-map-3-2013
www.leangains.com
no food for 72 hours and then you are barely in starvation mode. All the studies are posted.0 -
I don't get much fat at all - intentionally. I'm on the Ornish program, which like the Esselstyn program is vegan + no added oils + no nuts. So my total fat intake is extremely low - intentionally.0
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Hang in there!! I've given up a few times after being stuck and put weight back on, and regret it now.
Have you tried changing your exercise? Sometimes just doing something different will tell your body to get out of it's rut.
I've tried increasing my cycling and varying it with walking.0 -
Did you have blood work done? The most important thing here is how your blood work is coming along.
I have blood work done regularly. It is doing fantastic. I started out with a very high HbA1c (like over 10) and it's down to normal range and I'm off blood sugar meds now. My total cholesterol has dropped to 129 with an LDL of just 70. All my blood values are in a normal range. My blood pressure, without meds, is just 120/64. And I don't know if you are familiar with EF (cardiac ejection fraction) but when I was in the hospital after my heart attack last year it was down to 50% (normal range is 55% to 70%) and in my most recent test it was a very healthy 67%.
So my blood tests results are constantly very good.0 -
When you increase your calories, you need to give it some time for the weight to go back down. You will end up gaining a little bit until your body recognizes that it doesn't need to store the fat any longer from when you were eating a lower amount of calories.
I hit a plateau like this in December. I hovered between 152 and 154 lbs. Started a higher calorie intake in February, and after two weeks, I finally dropped below the 150 lb mark. I ended up gaining weight up to 155 lbs during that time, and then my weight finally dropped below 150. I am currently sitting at 147-148 lbs.
Just give it time. Hope this helps!
So glad to read this, gives me hope0 -
I haven't read through all the posts but this sounds like adaptation to me. Change things up, have one very high calorie day, then a low one with increased activity. Keep changing things up until it starts to work. You may see a small spike but it will start to move again.
If you do anything too long your body figures it out and you have to outsmart it. I do this every 15 lbs, or at least every 3-4 weeks. It's been a big factor in my loss of 87 lbs.0 -
Read this! I did and it explained so much, things I should have known.
"Living With Obesity At 700 Calories Per Day!
By: David Greenwalt
I want you to consider a common female client. She's a woman about 5'5" and 185 pounds. A combination of a mostly sedentary lifestyle, quick-fix, processed foods and consistent excessively low calories has resulted in an incredibly stubborn fat loss scenario. Not only has it created a stubborn fat loss scenario but her ability to add body fat is remarkably strong.
Most would believe there is simply no possible way she could be 185 pounds eating mostly low calories. While it's true the average obese American created their own obesity by being a huge over consumer, a sedentary glutton if you will, many are able to maintain their level of obesity with the following formula in very precise ratios: starvation + binges + sedentary lifestyle.
An initial review of this woman's calories indicates she is just above starvation level in the 400-700 per day range. The food choices are mostly protein in this case (low-carb is all the rage you know) and there are virtually no vegetables or fruits to speak of.
Five or six days per week the calories remain low in this range, however, there are nighttime binges from time to time and weekend binges where carbs loaded with fat (doughnuts, rolls, cookies, pizza etc.) are consumed.
So while the calories are very low the majority of the time, there are one to two days per week where this isn't always the case. Even so, the nighttime binges and weekend slack offs don't amount to what you might presume would be thousands of extra calories, thus explaining the 185-pound body weight.
Very few foods are prepared from home. There are lots of fast foods being consumed. Convenience and taste rule.
I must say. Early on in my coaching and teaching career this woman was a real head scratcher for me. Isn't it calories in and calories out? Even if she's not active she's starving!
How in the heck does she stay at 185 eating an average, including all binges, of maybe 750 calories per day? She's frustrated beyond belief. She sees her friends and coworkers eating more and weighing less. Is she simply unlucky? Is everyone else blessed? And what in the world is she supposed to do to fix this, if it can be fixed?
Why Is She Not Losing Weight?
First, let me tell you why she's not losing weight. Then I'll tell you what she has to do to fix the situation. With a chronic (months and months) intake of less than 1000 calories per day and a 185-pound body weight her metabolism is suffering greatly. It's running cool, not hot. It's basically running at a snail's pace.
Think of it this way. Her metabolism has matched itself to her intake. She could, indeed, lose body fat but she's in that gray area where she is eating too few calories but not quite at the concentration-camp level yet.
If she were to consume 100-300 calories per day her body would have virtually no choice but to begin liberating stored body fat. This is NOT the solution. It's unhealthy and, in fact, quite stupid.
The Practical Way To Lose Fat!
Today's society is about speed. We no longer have to wait for the oven to warm our food because we have microwaves ready to do the work in less time. The same is not true when it comes to fat loss.
Not only has her metabolism matched her intake, her body has maximized production of enzymes that are designed to help store any additional calories as fat. Anytime additional, immediately-unnecessary calories are consumed the enzymes are there and waiting to store the additional calories as fat. Her body is starved nutritionally and it has one thing on its mind - survival.
Being mostly sedentary, her metabolism (hormones play a large role here) can do a pretty good job of keeping things slow enough so that the pathetically low calories she's consuming are just enough to maintain.
But since certain enzymes are elevated, waiting for more calories so more bodyfat can be stored, every nighttime binge or weekend mini-feast will contribute to fat stores.
So on the days she's not bingeing her body does not lose fat, or if it does, it's very little. And on the few days or times she does binge a bit her body is quite efficient at storing fat. So, while she may lose a smidge of fat from starving it is quickly replaced with every binge.
Remember, these binges aren't a gluttonous 4000-calorie feast. Oh no, a binge might be 4-5 cookies worth about 500-700 calories. Nevertheless, since the binge foods are mostly carbs and fat it's very easy for the enzymes to shuttle the dietary fat into stored body fat. It's what they were designed to do.
So, What's The Solution?
Well then, now that we presumably know some valid reasons why she's not seeing a scale change and definitely no body fat change how do we fix her? We have to do something she's going to freak out over.
We have to get her eating more. Not only do we have to get her eating more but more of the right, whole foods need to be eaten. Foods lower in fat that aren't as easily STORED as body fat have to be consumed. And we have to warn her.
A Discouraging Start
We have to warn her that since she's been sedentarily living on protein with binges of carbs and fats she is likely to see a weight gain right away. It's true.
Once we begin really feeding her body with nutritious carbohydrates so she can become more active, her glycogen-depleted body will hang on to some of those carbohydrates (in skeletal muscle and liver) so she has stored energy for activity.
When her body hangs on to those carbohydrates it has no choice but to hang on to more water too. For every gram of glycogen (stored carbs) she stores she'll hang on to three grams of water.
This is not a negative response by the body but it will be interpreted by her as quite negative when she steps on the scale.
It's quite likely she'll see a five to seven pound weight gain when she really starts eating properly again. This weight gain will remain for one to three weeks before it starts moving in the other direction.
For argument's sake let's assume my Calorie Calculator and Goal Setter at Club Lifestyle suggests a 1500-calorie per day average in week one for a one-pound loss per week. First, she is going to freak out about this many calories.
For months she's been eating less than 1000 and usually around 400-700 in one to three feedings total per day. To her 1500 calories is a ton of food. And if she even begins to eat less fast and packaged-foods it will be a ton of food.
There is no doubt whatsoever that she will resist the increase. This resistance may take one to three weeks to overcome. During this period no weight loss will occur. She is too fat already in her mind and believes it will only hurt her to increase her food intake.
I mean, after all, isn't that how she got fat to begin with? In her early stages of fat gain this was probably true. She overconsumed. But as I've said already, that's not why she's staying heavy.
In addition to a freaked-out mindset about adding more food to her already overfat body she will simply find that it's all but impossible to eat four or more times per day.
She's just not hungry at first. Makes sense when you think about it. Why would she be hungry three hours after eating a 300-calorie, balanced breakfast? Her body is used to 400-700 calories per day!
So, even though she gets a plan and begins using my nutrition analyzer to log foods and meals she finds after having a balanced breakfast of 250 calories she couldn't force herself to eat meal number two on time.
It'll take several more days of realizing what is going on and being one-hundred percent honest and diligent with her logging and planning before she begins to eat her meals as planned no matter what - even if she's not hungry.
By now two to four weeks have passed and the only thing she's seen on the scale is it going up--not very encouraging if I say so myself.
Raising The Grade
After the first two to four weeks have passed she's probably beginning to consume her meals as planned although not quite like an "A" student yet. That is coming. She feels better because she's working out and is more active.
And she feels like she has more energy throughout the day because she's feeding her body more calories and the right kinds of calories.
She has finally begun eating the right kinds of fast foods (low in fat, moderate in protein) and less packaged food overall. She is making more meals from home and taking them to work for lunch rather than always grabbing something quick from a vending machine or the break room that always has some treat another employee brought in.
After another two weeks or so she's moved from a "B" grade to more consistent "A"s. She's planning her days one day ahead in the Nutrition Analyzer; she's consuming fresh veggies and fruits on a daily basis.
Her calories are almost ALWAYS in line with what is recommended by my Lean Account and she has seen her first signs of the scale moving in the right direction.
She is now dropping from 190 pounds (her high after reintroducing food and carbohydrates again) to 189.3! "Progress at last!" she says. In actuality, the entire process was progress. But that's not how she saw it in the beginning.
With a total of two to four weeks of increased caloric intake behind her and eating more consistently the right kinds of foods her metabolism has truly begun to rebound.
She didn't kill it as she thought. She only wounded it. And since our metabolisms are like kids (they are quite resilient) and she doesn't have thyroid issues or diabetes or any known wrench that could be thrown into the spokes of fat loss, she will begin, for the first time in months or years, to see results that make sense and that one would expect of someone who is active (30-60 minutes five or more days per week) and consuming a caloric intake of 1300-1500 calories per day.
Butterfly Effect: The Basics Of The Thyroid - Part 1.
Avoiding Sabotage
This process is in no way easy. I think you can see a plethora of ways it could be screwed up, sabotaged, given up on too early and so forth.
A key to success for this very common woman (men too) is not giving up too soon, having faith in the fix, and moving sooner rather than later to the increased, quality food intake.
It's going to take effort to overcome the mental hurdles of eating more food as well as the increase in scale weight that is going to occur in weeks one to three or so. It's disheartening, however, to charge hard down the weight-loss field only to get to the one-yard line and decide it's time to quit.
Don't Let Your Metabolism Fall.
These are the top ten ways you can boost your metabolism and keep it high - even through Fall.
Many don't realize they only had one more yard to go and they'd have had a touchdown. You gotta hang in there with this plan. It's going to take some time for the glycogen levels to be replenished and level out. It's going to take some time for mental adjustments to occur.
It's going to take some time before hunger signals are restored to anything close to normal. It's going to take time for the metabolism to rebound and not be in its protective mode.
Giving A Stubborn Body The Message
In certain, very stubborn cases, it may be necessary to eat at a eucaloric (maintenance) or hypercaloric (over maintenance) level for a few weeks to ensure the metabolism does get the signal that everything is alright and you aren't going to kill the body.
Remember, your body could care less about your desire for fat loss. It just wants to survive.
Some Take-Home Points
The most common cause of obesity is Americans are sedentary overeaters/drinkers. Nothing in this article should be construed as to say that under eating is the root cause of obesity. It's not.
It IS common for many men and women to be under eating with sporadic binges as I described here. This creates a perfect environment for continued obesity even if total caloric intake is quite low on average.
Low-carb followers or "starvers" WILL see the scale go up when calories are consumed at reasonable levels again and carbohydrates are reintroduced. Live with it. Deal with it. It's going to happen. 98% of the gain will be water.
The time it takes for mental acceptance and other adjustments to occur will vary but one should expect a two to four week window for these things to take place. Being forewarned with an article like this may speed this process up some.
Once the right types of foods are consumed and the right caloric intake is consumed and the right ratios of carbohydrates, proteins and fats are consumed on a consistent basis, then, and only then, will metabolism begin to be restored and the key to fat loss be inserted into the lock with a noticeable drop in the scale resulting.
This may take an additional two to four weeks to occur. Your metabolism is never dead or broken for good. But it may take several weeks of proper eating and activity for it to be restored.
From day one, until the first, noticeable drop in the scale occurs may be four to six weeks--maybe one to two weeks longer. Those who give up on the one-yard line will never see the scale drop as will occur when intelligent persistence and consistency over time are adhered to."0 -
I've been stuck at one weight for months and months. I upped my calories and still the weight stayed the same. Bodies are weird.0
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I've been stuck on my own plateau for the last month or two and it has been frustrating as well. I'm 5'4 - currently 179 and have been eating at around 1450 calories a day. Almost everyone I talk to tells me to eat more. But the thing is, my body fat % is around 50%. I had it tested in the bod pod. Because of that, I need to eat less than someone with a BF% around 30%.
There is a registered dietician that comes on here sometimes and he claims there is no such thing as starvation mode. He also says that for the most part - if you're not losing weight, you're eating too much. Now, I would take this with a grain of salt because I know there are people that aren't losing on 800 calories and I don't think the right answer for them is to eat even less. I do like his point about tracking. Is it at all possible that you are over tracking your exercise and under tracking your food intake?
That is what I'm thinking may be my issue.
I think in the end, you're just going to have to try some different things and be patient. I think the recommendation is to try something for a month to give your body time to adjust.
Is there a bod pod near you that you could check your BF? Might be another useful number to help.0 -
But starvation mode isn't supposed to kick in until under 1,000 calories per day.
I'm pretty sure that number applies to small women. Men have more muscle mass to start with anyway, compared to women, and therefore need more calories.0 -
You said your BMR is ~1870, and your doctor told you to eat around that number, too. I would not worry at all about eating at your BMR, and it's probably the safest number for you to default to eating. I would really suggest trying to force yourself to that number like your doctor recommended and sit there for a while and see what happens. You're not in 'starvation mode' but eating your BMR will make sure you are getting all you need for your basic daily life.0
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But starvation mode isn't supposed to kick in until under 1,000 calories per day.
I'm pretty sure that number applies to small women. Men have more muscle mass to start with anyway, compared to women, and therefore need more calories.
ummm no..starvation mode is when you eat nothing for 72 hours....you can't eat every day and be in starvation mode...0 -
Well, I spoke with a nutritionist, and she suggested:
(1) I limit my daily eaten calories to 1600.
(2) If my exercise causes my net calories to fall below 1000 then eat enough to bring it up to at least 1000.
But I don't think that's going to work.
Maybe I need to eat less calories, but if so, 1600 calories isn't it. I just entered all the calories (ignoring exercise) each day since February 1st, about when the latest plateau began:
1237 1453 1246 1168 1307 1208 1276 1755 1296 1558 1394 1254 1442 1296 1398 1113 1484 1301 1749 1228 1202 1074 1300 1478 1451 1356 1486 1451 989 1353 1549 1605 1774 1724 1436 1260 1304 1770 1996 1372 1713 1644 1666 1608 1602 1616 1613 1488 1426 1487 1591 1647 1591 1772 1515 2044 1937 2016 1920 1553 1854 1850 1586 1690
The average calories eaten per day is just 1508.
And most days I had 220-280 calories of exercise on top of that.
I'm not sure what to do.
doug0
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