drop sets

HOSED49

skullcrushers are covered in my post, just using DB instead of the bar.
For those that might not know though:
Lying flat, arms extended, DB in each hand, lower the Db to your face(skull), extend back up. Again using triceps to lower and raise, skulls provide motivation for you as you tend to not want to smash your skull with the weight! You can use the 1 1/4 or 1 1/2 resp for these also or 3 seconds up 3 seconds down...

stroutman81

Looking to break a plateau, or add a new dimension to your workout, try drop sets. You can drop set just about any exercise you're doing, for example, bicep curls, do two sets at whatever weight your comfortable...actually let's use me as an example. I would fo two sets of 8-10 reps with 40lb dumbells (with a 30-45 sec rest in btw sets) my next set would look like this, 40lbs, drop (no rest) the weight to 30lbs, another 8-10 reps, drop again (no rest) to 20lbs. You'll be at muscle failure by this point and your arms will be screaming!! I tend to drop set every once in awhile to keep things progressing.

I have a couple of questions:

1. Do you mean a strength plateau? A hypertrophy plateau? A fat loss plateau?

2. What's important about muscular failure in your opinion?

Thanks!

lvfunandfit

"Drop sets hit the "stubborn" muscle fibers "deep down," causing growth that normally couldn't be achieved by stopping after a single set of six to twelve."

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/dropsets.htm

stroutman81

I wouldn't rely on bb.com for your information. Granted, there are some authors I respect (some whom I personally know) that have content there, but the vast majority of information there is based on what I call "bro-science."

In actuality, with regards to fiber recruitment... we have full recruitment at about intensities equivalent to 85% MVIC. Knowing this, we can deduce that we don't need drop sets or "deep fatigue" to recruit the majority of our fibers.

imagymrat

Talk about people hijacking a thread...wow....wether or not you like the smith machine, is a personal opinion, I though tI stated I LIKE IT...it wrks for me, bodyweight squats are covered in other posts i've put up....but I don't get muscle growth with bodyweight squats, like I used to...I need to push really heavy, As far as a plateau goes, it depends on which level you're stuck, it was a general statement, The drop sets worked for me when I needed a shock to help my biceps grow, I don't do them as often now, i've moved on to more tatic moves to create strength, it was a general comment, breaking the plateau, because it could very well be the extra push some people made need, others may be already incorporating them. I'm interested in debating, wether or not you agree or disagree, or wether free weights or machines are the way to go. I'm a firm beleiver in balance, you need both in your workouts to attain maximum muscle performance. I posted this as a way for someone to add some interest to their workout....that's it..nothing more nothing less.

toots99

Talk about people hijacking a thread...wow....wether or not you like the smith machine, is a personal opinion, I though tI stated I LIKE IT...it wrks for me, bodyweight squats are covered in other posts i've put up....but I don't get muscle growth with bodyweight squats, like I used to...I need to push really heavy, As far as a plateau goes, it depends on which level you're stuck, it was a general statement, The drop sets worked for me when I needed a shock to help my biceps grow, I don't do them as often now, i've moved on to more tatic moves to create strength, it was a general comment, breaking the plateau, because it could very well be the extra push some people made need, others may be already incorporating them. I'm interested in debating, wether or not you agree or disagree, or wether free weights or machines are the way to go. I'm a firm beleiver in balance, you need both in your workouts to attain maximum muscle performance. I posted this as a way for someone to add some interest to their workout....that's it..nothing more nothing less.

I appreciated the advice!

And I'm glad you put it in regular people terms, instead of saying something like "with regards to fiber recruitment... we have full recruitment at about intensities equivalent to 85% MVIC." I have no idea what that means. :indifferent:

XFitMojoMom

ditto what toots said.

I always appreciate the recommendations from gymrat. She rocks.

stroutman81

Talk about people hijacking a thread...wow....

I'm sorry... could you point out what you felt was specifically a hijack? Obviously you think some of the commentary pertaining to machines vs. free weights was a hijack, but I couldn't tell if you felt the same about my post/questions.

I suppose I'm unsure because you answered one of my questions (about plateaus) so it's hard not to assume you felt my post was a hijack.

Thanks for your clarification.

Also, I'm hoping you can discuss your feelings pertaining to muscular failure and how that relates to muscle and strength gains.

stroutman81

I appreciated the advice!

And I'm glad you put it in regular people terms, instead of saying something like "with regards to fiber recruitment... we have full recruitment at about intensities equivalent to 85% MVIC." I have no idea what that means. :indifferent:

Ya, sorry about that! If you read my blog here on MFP, you'll have a different opinion on how I disperse information. I assure you I typically give it my all to put the facts in "mentally digestible" terms that everyone can understand.

MVIC stands for Maximal Voluntary Isometric Contraction which is simply a fancy way of saying the heaviest weight you can hold in a particular movement. So if your max strength in the squat allows you to lift 135 lbs, I'm saying 85% of that weight will typically recruit the majority of your muscle fibers.

By recruit, I'm referring to your nervous system's ability to send electrical impulses to your muscles which, through multiple steps, "activates" the cells that make up your muscle. This activation causes your muscles to contract or shorten, which is how we exert force and move objects.

Many folks mistakenly believe they need to "feel the burn" and go to muscular failure (which is the point where they're unable to lift the weight anymore) in order to recruit all of our muscle fibers or cells. In actuality, we get near full activation (or recruitment - however you want to put it) when we lift weights that our around 85% of our maximum ability.

In other words, there's A LOT more that goes into hypertrophy (muscle growth) and strength improvements than going to muscular failure.

Sorry again, for not explaining things originally. Hopefully that helps you understand what I originally meant.

HOSED49

I understand what works for you, however I also understand a world renowned strength coach(Charles Poliquin) who trains olympic athletes and beyond, is saying when he warns aganst the use of a Smith Machine for squats and the dangers of the effects it has on your knees. We tend to stick with what makes things easier for us to do and ignore the long term effects. I apologize for trying to save some peoples knees here by offering scientifically proven advice from Mr. Poliquin, he doesnt want elite atheletes doing it so I am sure that translates to the average joe also.

toots99

I appreciated the advice!

And I'm glad you put it in regular people terms, instead of saying something like "with regards to fiber recruitment... we have full recruitment at about intensities equivalent to 85% MVIC." I have no idea what that means. :indifferent:

Ya, sorry about that! If you read my blog here on MFP, you'll have a different opinion on how I disperse information. I assure you I typically give it my all to put the facts in "mentally digestible" terms that everyone can understand.

MVIC stands for Maximal Voluntary Isometric Contraction which is simply a fancy way of saying the heaviest weight you can hold in a particular movement. So if your max strength in the squat allows you to lift 135 lbs, I'm saying 85% of that weight will typically recruit the majority of your muscle fibers.

By recruit, I'm referring to your nervous system's ability to send electrical impulses to your muscles which, through multiple steps, "activates" the cells that make up your muscle. This activation causes your muscles to contract or shorten, which is how we exert force and move objects.

Many folks mistakenly believe they need to "feel the burn" and go to muscular failure (which is the point where they're unable to lift the weight anymore) in order to recruit all of our muscle fibers or cells. In actuality, we get near full activation (or recruitment - however you want to put it) when we lift weights that our around 85% of our maximum ability.

In other words, there's A LOT more that goes into hypertrophy (muscle growth) and strength improvements than going to muscular failure.

Sorry again, for not explaining things originally. Hopefully that helps you understand what I originally meant.

Much clearer, indeed!

stroutman81

I understand what works for you, however I also understand a world renowned strength coach(Charles Poliquin) who trains olympic athletes and beyond, is saying when he warns aganst the use of a Smith Machine for squats and the dangers of the effects it has on your knees. We tend to stick with what makes things easier for us to do and ignore the long term effects. I apologize for trying to save some peoples knees here by offering scientifically proven advice from Mr. Poliquin, he doesnt want elite atheletes doing it so I am sure that translates to the average joe also.

As an aside... I've been to a few Poliquin seminars. It's too bad he's gone off the deep end with much of his information he puts out. His old stuff was brilliant.