I'm conflicted about "Fat Acceptance" morally.. I find

paigemarie93

Tell me one reason why the amount of fat in your body should correspond with who you are as a person. Last time I checked, our personalities are in no way linked to our body composition.

Poor self image equates to low self esteem. Who purposely goes out of their way to be fat?
Cant agree with you at all....

Lots of people purposely want to be fat & gain weight when they are already morbidly obese to begin with; I watched a programme here in the UK called 'My Big Fat Fetish' if you can find it, I recommend. - it's about 'fat' glamour models & how they WANT to get bigger, one of them wants to reach 1000lbs & they have feeders, who in most cases, are their boyfriends...

Contrarian

Wow. Let's calm the quotes down, shall we? It's up to about half a page long, now.

loosesealbluth

I think perhaps you don't realise we ALL sometimes to all the time worry about what other people think of us, regardless of size and looks.

To hang it all up on your weight is where you need to accept yourself and not worry about what they might think about you. You might be overweight, you might be a red head, you might have the wrong accent, you might not be educated enough, you might be over-educated. You might like chameleons as pets, you might be a goth, you might like cheesy musicals, you might be single, you might be married. It's who you are. Some things you might be trying to change, some you might be quite happy with the way they are. Some people are going to be fine with who you are, some won't be. Some may support you in trying to change or they might think you're fine liking chameleons and why would you start to change that about you?

You have to be strong enough to be confident about the decisions you make and stop worrying about what other people think. If you really want something to concentrate on that isn't you and isn't in other people's heads, judge people on their actions - how they treat you and others. They might not say anything about your looks, but always praise you to the boss for your teamwork on the projects. They might say you are beautiful the way you are but always leave a measly tip for the waitress. You get to decide what's important to YOU and walk away from the rest.

Okay. By saying I assume people are thinking about me, what I meant was that I tend to wait for a comment to slip, for them to say something that confirms what I was expecting all along. Doesn't always happen, and eventually I stop "assuming" and grow to trust them. But I am on the defense because it happens, more often than not, that a person does ultimately make a comment about weight and it just confirms what I was anticipating. I have had too many experiences where I blindly trust somebody that ultimately ends up criticizing me (or fat people in general) to simply not worry about what others think. "Not worrying" is a struggle for me, and I was simply pointing out that it's not easy for me to just "not worry," as though there were simply an off switch.

Please don't assume (assuming, you see?) that I hang it all up on my weight. I don't. This just happens to be a discussion about, you know, weight, so that is what I am talking about. It is one aspect of my life, and it's one that I happen to think about a lot, because I am interested in the sociological aspect of it.

At the end of the day, I do accept myself. I get self-conscious sometimes and I worry, but even when people DO comment on my weight, I don't hate myself over it or let it impact how I feel about MYSELF; it just makes me angry that someone thinks that (particularly when it's someone I'm close to). I'm happy with myself. What I don't like is when others can't seem to accept that.

elyelyse

it's really simple: people should be treated with respect regardless of their weight. the end.


To those who think this means that a doctor should not address the situation with a patient, because you think being morbidly obese it totally ok and healthy... well you are the ones being disrespectful, because it's a lie. Anyone who does not believe that there is a very strong direct correlation between weight and health is fooling themselves. I was pre-diabetic and very close to being put on blood pressure meds until I got my weight down. I got better because losing weight is the most effective way to treat those disorders for most people. (not to mention no more swelling in my ankles, and the blessing of being "regular" now, if you know what Im saying lol)

People who are overweight are just as valuable, as human beings, as those who are extremely fit... that doesn't make being fat ok. I can say that, because I'm fat. and it's not ok.

funkyspunky872

Tell me one reason why the amount of fat in your body should correspond with who you are as a person. Last time I checked, our personalities are in no way linked to our body composition.

It's not. I was engaged to be married to a 400-pound woman, and her weight had nothing to do with our relationship going sour. I am still very close to her, still care about her, and still worry that one day I will lose her before it is her time to go.

But tell me one reason why the amount of smoke in my lungs should correspond with my loved ones being concerned with my health-- ohh, that's right. Because it's an unhealthy behavior. Just like being obese.

Oh, I've already covered this multiple times. Everybody is concerned with everybody else's health. I got that. Good for you. I've gone beyond that though... to a place where health and longevity in life mean nothing. I want to know why your body composition is better than your ex-fiance's in terms of "happiness" and "acceptance." Why do you deserve happiness and acceptance because you have less fat than her? Explain that to me. (That's what this whole body acceptance thing is about, you know.)

----

Btw, is there something in fat that drives others to look down on, shame, and disrespect those who have an excess of it? Maybe a pheromone that causes underdeveloped humans to instinctively react with disgust?

devil_in_a_blue_dress

"Fat acceptance" is all about not judging bodies that do not belong to you.

There is nothing morally conflicting about that. If you don't like how somebody else looks, don't look. Weight does not equal health. You are not responsible for anyone but yourself. Encouraging people to feel good about themselves no matter what their weight is, is tremendously positive. It's not about preaching "you don't need to lose weight!" It about preaching "You are worthy just as you are".

Then why is there not "Tobacco Acceptance" or "Alcohol Acceptance" as well? Why are all life choices not praised for us being who we want to be? Clearly, there must be other factors into why it is not socially 'acceptable' to be fat. And telling someone they are physically unhealthy does NOT mean they are unworthy as an individual. I think a lot of pro-Acceptance people here are missing that point.

My boyfriend suffers from major depression. Do I tell him he's worthless? Of course not-- if I thought that, I wouldn't even be with him. But am I going to tell him he's perfectly fine the way he is, and accept him staying in bed all day? Again, of course not. If something is affecting the physical or mental health of someone I love I will speak up about it, BECAUSE I love them. Helping someone face their bad decisions and overcome them is, if anything, the most crucial part of accepting them... because you're willing to support them right now, AND to help motivate them to improve. My boyfriend does the same with me, with my journey to lose weight and overcome anger issues. We accept each other for who we are, but that doesn't mean we have to accept the fact that we can never be better than we are right now!

First all off, not all people who are "fat" are addicted to food. People addicted to alcohol and drugs actually ARE addicts. So please stop using that analogy, it's not as clever as you think.

I'm not 'being clever'. We are not discussing people who are 20 pounds overweight, or even 40. This woman is most likely between 4 and 500 pounds. She did not get to this weight by not being addicted to food in some way, although it's amusing that you seem to find that possible. She didn't wake up one day and go "Oh crap, I put on 300 pounds overnight!" Even if she has some major health issues that left her bedridden in a hospital for months (which doesn't seem likely given that she is apparently healthy enough to pose for softcore porn), that doesn't just excuse a lifetime of poor eating.

Second, weight does not equal health. There are very recent studies (published in the JAMA -- which is about as credible as you can get) the seem to show being "fat" as defined as moderately overweight live longer than their thin counterparts. Here, read: http://jama.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=1555137

There is nothing that prevents a moderately overweight person from living a totally productive life -- aside from how others treat them. Period. That is what fat acceptance is about. You are, presumably, not a medical doctor. Other people's health is not your concern. You are making lifestyle and health assumptions based on appearance alone. Not cool. Also assuming that thin is "better" also isn't cool.

When did I ever say that being 'thin' was better? Oh, that's right... nowhere. I have been talking about health, and health alone. The definition of a healthy weight varies from person to person, and no one has to stay at a specific number on the scale their entire life to be healthy. Again, we are not talking about "moderately overweight", we are talking about people who are 2-300 pounds overweight. That is not 'moderate' by any stretch of the imagination.

Um, fat acceptance is an entire movement that encompasses many body types not just the one pictured. Also, do you know the woman pictured personally? You have NO idea how or what she eats. You are making a LOT of assumptions. LOTS. You don't know her medical history. You don't know if she eats to maintain this size to have work, therefore money to feed her family. She might just like the taste of food.

And you clearly do seem to think thinness is better because you seem to think thinness = health. It does not. Also, the health of other people is NOT your concern. Your concern is unnecessary and misguided. What is it to YOU what I weigh? Is your life positively affected because you are talking to me and I am a "health" weight. No. Don't think so.

Honey, you are just full of the hangry today. How many times do I have to say that I am not advocating being 'thin'? So what if you have a little tummy pooch. So what if you have a double chin. So what if you have cankles, chubby underarms, a big butt, or "thunder thighs". I may have all these things even at my goal weight! I specifically said that healthy weights vary from person to person. It would behoove you to actually read my posts instead of jumping to create ludicrous scenarios for a stranger (feeding her family? really? how is that not an assumption of your own?) instead of admitting that you are taking this too far.

P.S. "Liking the taste of food", in excess, is an eating disorder. I am making an assumption here but I highly, highly doubt that if this woman was eating less than 3,000 calories a day, that she would be at the weight she is in this picture. It is possible to like the taste of food too much, and that is where the addiction comes in.

You know, this conversation is pointless. Thanks for your time.

Ahahahahahaha. Hahahahaha. Oh excuse me. I'm just going to go laugh my head off at how a debate where I was exposing your points as nonsensical turns into a "pointless" conversation. Thanks for your time bb! Go eat something, I think you're hungry.

Look, you apparently don't know forum rules. I stopped because I am not going to get into personal attacks.

I don't know forum rules? Which ones, exactly, am I violating? Go ahead and report me if I am. That doesn't change the fact that you butted out of a conversation because you apparently had nothing to say that wasn't a personal attack towards me. Kind of sad.

Specifically: "Go Eat Something", that would be taunting. I can accept you might not meant that as such, I don't report people. However, what I am saying to you is you are unwilling to have a debate that is based in facts. I have posted a few different links -- you are not responding to any of that info. You just keep saying the same things over and over. So yeah, I have nothing more to say.

I keep saying the same things over and over because you are consistently putting words in my mouth and telling me I believe things I do not believe. So I will respond to your links in numbered points instead, to make it clearer.

1) BMI is not the best way to measure health. Body Fat Percentage, while similar, is much more accurate. That being said...

2) I. Have. Never. Said. That. You. Have. To. Be. "Skinny". To. Be. Healthy. I just don't know how many more times I have to say this!

3) "Conclusions and Relevance Relative to normal weight, both obesity (all grades) and grades 2 and 3 obesity were associated with significantly higher all-cause mortality. Grade 1 obesity overall was not associated with higher mortality, and overweight was associated with significantly lower all-cause mortality."
How is what I've said not relevant to this? I said that someone being morbidly obese-- falling into the grades 2 or 3 obesity rating for the purpose of comparison to this study's results-- is dangerous to their health. I never said that someone who put on a bit of weight after having a baby, the "freshman fifteen", or even gaining 50 pounds over the course of many years is unhealthy. I have been, this entire time, talking about people who are for their height and body stature morbidly obese.

And fat acceptance isn't JUST about morbid obesity.

No, but that is the part that I have an issue with. If it were just about people who are considered 'overweight', I would be 100% on board. But once you pass a certain threshold (and again, this is different for everyone), you are not only overweight, you are unhealthy.

My current body fat percentage is 53%. That means that over half my body is composed of pure fat. No matter how you spin it, that is unhealthy! Just because I don't have diabetes or high blood pressure doesn't mean I'm the picture of health. And just because someone is 120 lbs doesn't mean THEY are the picture of health either!

And as beautiful as I think that model is, I would be sickened if anyone told her that losing weight would be a bad idea! The problem with Fat Acceptance is that it goes too far in the opposite direction and becomes reverse discrimination.

Yeah, but WHY is it wrong for people to feel value and self worth no matter what their weight is? That shouldn't be something a reserve is placed on. If you read all the comments here, you will see a few ended here BECAUSE of FA. It's not about encouraging people not to lose weight, it's about helping people see that people have value and meaning even if they do take up two airplane seats.

It's about overcoming self loathing and accepting that the ideals of other's don't define who you are. That is a liberating experience that empowers people. That seems are more motivational than shaming. Period.

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SoViLicious

I applaud her for loving herself and having confidence. Ever see a fit person who hates their self and have no confidence? That too is neither healthy or sexy. However, when I look at this woman, I think about how much her back must hurt when she walks. Or how even posing to take this picture may have caused her to get out of breath. Maybe all this beauty and confidence is being stifled by her size. Losing weight will only give her more energy to continue to be fabulous. How do I know... Because I am that bish in this photo.

bregalad5

Agreed.
If you get out of breath going up the stairs or have to have "custom", large seats then you definitely need to do something about your health.

Well, even if I were thin I'd still have issues going up the stairs because of my knee issues Just playing devil's advocate there, hehe

Lupercalia

I know I wasn't suggesting fat people are horrible or unworthy of our love, friendship, concern, respect, etc. In my comment, I was speaking specifically about the Fat Acceptance movement and what I personally thought of it, having been morbidly obese at one point, and still being overweight by all standards.

I don't think body shaming helps anyone.

And as I said before, I don't think the FA movement encourages healthy lifestyle changes (weight loss, fitness, healthy diet) at all. That has been my experience. I've seen lots of complaints regarding obese people (celebrities and average joes/janes) losing weight, exercising "too much", etc. I've also seen a lot of "skinny shaming" happening towards women who are not fat on the FA sites.

I didn't grow up fat, and nobody in my family is fat. I got fat on my own, and was never seeking acceptance for my fat body, from anyone. I wasn't well, didn't feel well, nor did I look it. I felt like crap just walking up and down a couple flights of stairs, or a few blocks around town. That isn't right. Our bodies can only take so much stress.

I'm still overweight, but as I get healthier and more physically fit, I feel better. I have little moments where I realise how I felt walking up a certain hill last year when I was 60 lbs heavier, versus how I feel now...and the difference is pretty amazing. Might not seem like much, but if you've been there, you know what I mean. It's big!

You only get one body in this life. Our bodies are amazing, wonderful, and resilient things. But we have to take care of them. I support anyone who seriously wants to take care of themselves, no matter what weight classification they fall under. I don't feel FA is the same thing, at all.

kimad

I used to tell myself I was happy with who I was but in retrospect I sure was not....I made poor choices in all aspects of my life not just in diet and exercise as a result.

Now nearly 80lbs lighter I am so much more confident in who I am and don't need validation from those around me as I did before. I have learned that I can do anything I want to in life.

It is really hard to put into words but I really don't buy into plus sized women saying they are happy with who they are......how can you be happy when you can't even do the simplest thing...but clothes that are pretty for yourself!!!

Just my 2 cents....I wish it were easier to express to people how easy it really is to change yourself if you want it badly enough and are willing to sacrifice to get it.

Ditto. I could have write this myself

keem88

I work in healthcare and am also conflicted about this. People say "It's nobody else's business if I get fat."
Except it is.
When you (general "you") get sick or injured, I have to manually move you from bed to stretcher to commode,etc.
Even with great lifting technique and help from others, I will continue to get hurt. It will be harder us to find an IV site to give you the medications you need and chest tubes and needles are not long enough.
You will be more likely to get a wound infection. Your blood sugar may be more difficult to manage, even if you are not diabetic. If you are a short, round person, we may not be able to fit you into the scanner. It will be difficult to obtain a decent X-ray because of the increased soft tissue.
It will be more difficult for you to walk and move after surgery, so your healing process will be longer.
So my workload will be very increased, and the patient's outcomes will be worse.
I'm not trying to "shame" anyone, I'm just not sure that people realize the consequences of their actions.

My mother is a critical care nurse. She has been injured several times because of the exact scenario that you described here. I want all people to have the confidence to be who they are, but there is nothing wrong with being who you are while reducing your overall size and improving your health.

yup. having to buy new equipment at hospitals because people are getting larger. having to buy and make larger caskets because people don't fit in the normal size anymore, costing more money because the family has to purchase 2 burial plots. it does affect others.

RingSize8

As a former 'fat confident person' - I was like 300lbs, and everyone thought I was SO confident, I call bull****. I wasn't confident, I was just a damn good actress, much like all the the former and current 'fat confident people' I know. So all these people thinking this girl is sooooo confident, think again. That being said, the women in the photo in the original post is grossly overweight, and there is nothing positive about that, period. All this condescending bull**** like, 'she has such a pretty face', is crap. How many times have you seen on this board someone talking about how much they HATE being told that exact phrase? I think of the idea of fat acceptance as a joke, because there is nothing for me to accept with regards to other people, so don't ask me to. You're you, and I'm me, and the only one I'm worried about accepting is myself. If we all loved ourselves and were happy with who we were, we wouldn't need people to 'accept' us, would we? I think the problem here is that people want to be accepted by others when they aren't even accepted by themselves. I've never had a smoker tell me I need to accept them as a smoker. Why would they? I'm sure most smokers don't give a **** what I think about their smoking - and they shouldn't. It's kind of a ridiculous concept. That being said, it's not my place to be a ****head to someone based on anything but my personal experiences with them. I don't treat people differently because they're black, white, gay, straight, short, tall, fat, or skinny. If other people do, why would you want acceptance from those people anyway? ...they sound like *kitten*.

DottieNewton

I was once a healthy weight and looked and felt good about my body. But, I have been overweight, then obese and now morbidly obese for a lot of years. I got this way by eating my feelings. So, yes, being positive about who you are is the key. But, i think it is a mistake to confuse who you are and your worth as a person with being morbidly obese. I am a miniature copy of that woman. When I look at my body it is disgusting. When I look at anyone's body bloated out of all proportion from up it should be, with huge sagging layers of fat I am disgusted. I think it is good and right to love that person despite their food addiction(anyone who eats that much has a food addiction) and I agree that is the equivalence of saying an alcoholic is not addicted to alcohol or a person with a 2-pack a day habit is not addicted to cigarettes. I think a person putting their body out there for viewing is yet another sign of their disturbed inner thinking.

starryfruit

My problem with them is that they try to discourage obese people from losing weight.

What? Why?

dmpizza

Every person deserves acceptance, but not all behaviours should be lauded.
If you stumble across an FA site, they aren't about accepting appearences, they are about entertaining people with displays of gluttonous behavior. Not a few extra sweets gluttony, but forced feeding, etc.... You look away quickly, but the memories take time to fade.

I don't know how we can program that out of society

treenuh_x

I'm conflicted about it as well. I don't think it's right for people to make fun of overweight people, but I don't think promoting being overweight/obese is a good idea at all.. which seems to be the case, more often than not. A lot of people who preach fat acceptance are fat themselves, and a lot of them seem to have no desire to change that fact. If it was more of a "love your body" movement than a "embrace your fat" movement, I'd be more for it - especially since loving your body includes taking care of it.

funkyspunky872

I work in healthcare and am also conflicted about this. People say "It's nobody else's business if I get fat."
Except it is.
When you (general "you") get sick or injured, I have to manually move you from bed to stretcher to commode,etc.
Even with great lifting technique and help from others, I will continue to get hurt. It will be harder us to find an IV site to give you the medications you need and chest tubes and needles are not long enough.
You will be more likely to get a wound infection. Your blood sugar may be more difficult to manage, even if you are not diabetic. If you are a short, round person, we may not be able to fit you into the scanner. It will be difficult to obtain a decent X-ray because of the increased soft tissue.
It will be more difficult for you to walk and move after surgery, so your healing process will be longer.
So my workload will be very increased, and the patient's outcomes will be worse.
I'm not trying to "shame" anyone, I'm just not sure that people realize the consequences of their actions.

My mother is a critical care nurse. She has been injured several times because of the exact scenario that you described here. I want all people to have the confidence to be who they are, but there is nothing wrong with being who you are while reducing your overall size and improving your health.

amandacepstein

I might have a new idea or two to contribute:

I think it is really important to realize that deciding someone is unhealthy JUST because of their size or shape is making a judgement WITHOUT ENOUGH DATA. The problem with using BMI as a proxy for health, is that many heavier people are healthy, while many lighter people are unhealthy. Assuming, "Oh, he (she) is thin, so he (she) is healthy" is a crock and does a disservice to all. A medical professional looking at blood pressure, cholesterol data, and other markers, can be a much better judge of what is unhealthy.

I like Health At Any Size because it advocates taking better care of yourself, no matter what your size. The goal is *health* not a particular pant size or fat %. Many people will become more active and make better food choices, but will not necessarily see a decrease in their size.

I like the idea of body acceptance better than fat acceptance because I see larger people bashing smaller ones sometimes with comments like "stick figure" or "real women have curves"

I have found it EXTREMELY BENEFICIAL to expose myself to images of fatter women such as those found in the fatosphere, and on some other sites where people can post their stats. Pretty much only seeing airbrushed images of about 5% of the female population all the time does lead to body image problems, for me anyway. I think it contributes to that feeling of disgust some have when exposed to images of fat people. Now I feel a more balanced appreciation of people of different sizes, including myself.

Finally, I never appreciated my body when I was thinner. I always criticized myself and compared my self to anyone thinner than me.

spud_chick

I"ll toss out something here as an thought.

How many of us are/were caught in the cycle of self hatred where you eat, feel guilt, look at your self, feel hate, then eat more, et al. (Hopefully you know what I"m talking about here). Part of fat acceptance is accepting yourself, seeing your beauty/worth. By encouraging that, you encourage breaking the cycle of self hatred/guilt and therefore over eating.

Like I said, it's just a thought. Then again I'm all for thinking that there should be size acceptance, period. *shrugs*

Just 2 cents from a fat gal trying to find her inner beauty.

I like this. It is possible to be overweight and basically healthy, though I don't think the woman in the OP's photo is healthy. Neither do I think she should be subjected to humiliation for being her size. The fat-pride contingencies you see springing up are a direct reaction to people treating overweight persons, and especially women, callously and even abusively. The refusal, for example, to acknowledge genetic predispositions to obesity (which is a real thing to anyone who has eyes to see), the insistence not just on moderate fitness but a serious "fitness lifestyle", the criticism and harshness you see everywhere but so very often on this site, have a lot to do with people digging in and saying they aren't going to put up with being bullied or shamed for being who they are. Whenever people get into that mode (for whatever reason, not necessarily weight) they are less likely to be in a frame of mind to want to improve on who they are because they get stuck defending their current state--which is of course their right, to stick up for themselves. It's not ideal but it's mentally healthier than absorbing all the body discrimination and allowing it to become self-loathing. I've seen a few good articles about weight loss that recommend starting out by treating yourself to a new haircut, or mani-pedi, or buying just a couple of flattering articles of clothing in your current size that are more like what you'd like to wear when you will be smaller. It validates who you are now, instead of saying you will treat yourself humanely once you've gotten to a "pretty" weight. And it gives you a better chance of succeeding. Especially if you believe you are a hideous sub-human for being overweight, and most people don't get to that place on their own steam.

I've never been anywhere near "obese" (or maybe I could have? but I've never been more than chubby by most people's estimation). I've lost 20 lbs and two pants sizes since I started in August (on a slow loss plan) and although I'm set to lose 8 more this year, I'm actually pretty happy with my current weight. So I was never noticeably large and haven't had that much to lose, but the difference between the treatment I get in public before the weight loss and after has actually been upsetting. Pragmatically it's nice to get better service pretty much everywhere I go, but it also sucks. Was my money not worth as much when I was 20 lbs heavier? Was I myself not worth as much? I have an aunt who is morbidly obese (and her daughter is pushing it) so I do know that very heavy people are the target of some really awful treatment, but the subtle body discrimination I didn't even notice till now is disturbing by itself.

Ramberta

Tell me one reason why the amount of fat in your body should correspond with who you are as a person. Last time I checked, our personalities are in no way linked to our body composition.

It's not. I was engaged to be married to a 400-pound woman, and her weight had nothing to do with our relationship going sour. I am still very close to her, still care about her, and still worry that one day I will lose her before it is her time to go.

But tell me one reason why the amount of smoke in my lungs should correspond with my loved ones being concerned with my health-- ohh, that's right. Because it's an unhealthy behavior. Just like being obese.

Oh, I've already covered this multiple times. Everybody is concerned with everybody else's health. I got that. Good for you. I've gone beyond that though... to a place where health and longevity in life mean nothing. I want to know why your body composition is better than your ex-fiance's in terms of "happiness" and "acceptance." Why do you deserve happiness and acceptance because you have less fat than her? Explain that to me. (That's what this whole body acceptance thing is about, you know.)

----

Btw, is there something in fat that drives others to look down on, shame, and disrespect those who have an excess of it? Maybe a pheromone that causes underdeveloped humans to instinctively react with disgust?

In response to the last bit, that same 'pheromone' must also exist for people who look down on drug addicts, smokers, and people with mental health issues. Being fat is not, nor will it ever be, the only reason to look down on and disrespect others.

I am a bit bewildered that you seem to be putting words in my mouth-- I never once said that I deserve to be "happier" or more "accepted" than my ex. I am also obese, only less so. I have endured just as much bullying as she has.

But you know what I don't want? I don't want people to tell me I'm beautiful the way I am. I don't want people to like me for being fat, to think of me as their "fat friend". I don't want to be 'accepted' for being at an unhealthy weight, and I am NOT happy with the way my body currently is!

Does that mean I have to be at my goal weight to be happy? No. But does that mean I should just embrace my fat self and never strive for something healthier?? That's crazy talk. I will be happier WHEN I am healthier, and that will be at a lower weight!

chuckponygirl

It's unfortunate that being fat isn't frowned upon the way that being a smoker/drinker/other drug user is, because really, it should be.




^ That statement is shameful! Your ex is better off without you. I sure would not want to read a statement like that from someone I love!

No reason to answer, I already know you frown upon me. After all, I am obese. Good thing I don't value your opinion enough to come back to see what you might have to say. Oh wait, that attitude is probably frowned upon too, huh?

postrockandcats

My problem with them is that they try to discourage obese people from losing weight.

That's my thing. Everyone has a right to be happy and comfortable in their own body, and that includes loosing weight if they want.

carolstartingover

My last comment on this. It can be compared to drinking because some people have a glass of wine when they go out once in a while. That does not mean they are getting trashed every night. They can be compared in that respect. A person should not be treated differently unless it causes another person harm. And in the medical profession, these poor nurses have to struggle with people who are very obese. I have the mind of a food addict. I quit acting on it and grab carrots which I don't particularly like but I am trying to find foods that are filling. I eat way too many carbs, but if my calorie count is ok, then I lose. What can happen is a person starts out slightly obese and says they are going to lose weight but they are young and no major things happen. So, then see themselves in a morbidly obese state, knees hurt, they can't walk far. Then another fifty pounds and they can't walk , so no exercise. Then, they give up and ride in a wheelchair. Oh, yes I see it all the time. My cousin died at 50 just like how I said. She was up too 500 and it was sad. She was the nicest cousin I ever had. So, if you are young and thinking that I am old and don't know crap, then you might wonder if you will live that long. I NEVER look at heavy people and think yuck. I love my daughter will all of my heart and would do anything for her. I just don't want to lose her. I cry as I write this. Her birthday is Monday and she will be 37.

Ramberta

And fat acceptance isn't JUST about morbid obesity.

No, but that is the part that I have an issue with. If it were just about people who are considered 'overweight', I would be 100% on board. But once you pass a certain threshold (and again, this is different for everyone), you are not only overweight, you are unhealthy.

My current body fat percentage is 53%. That means that over half my body is composed of pure fat. No matter how you spin it, that is unhealthy! Just because I don't have diabetes or high blood pressure doesn't mean I'm the picture of health. And just because someone is 120 lbs doesn't mean THEY are the picture of health either!

And as beautiful as I think that model is, I would be sickened if anyone told her that losing weight would be a bad idea! The problem with Fat Acceptance is that it goes too far in the opposite direction and becomes reverse discrimination.
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Yeah, but WHY is it wrong for people to feel value and self worth no matter what their weight is? That shouldn't be something a reserve is placed on. If you read all the comments here, you will see a few ended here BECAUSE of FA. It's not about encouraging people not to lose weight, it's about helping people see that people have value and meaning even if they do take up two airplane seats.

It's about overcoming self loathing and accepting that the ideals of other's don't define who you are. That is a liberating experience that empowers people. That seems are more motivational than shaming. Period.
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I messed this up somehow. My reply starts here:

I have never once said that people are unworthy or have no value as an individual if they are fat. Yet again, you are putting words in my mouth. I am not 'shaming' a fat person in my life that I love by telling them I think they would be healthier if they lost a few pounds, or quit smoking, or driving while drunk! I am telling them, "I care about you, and I love you enough to want to keep you around as long as possible." Please tell me how that is shaming.

I am overcoming my own self-loathing because I am taking steps to CHANGE myself for the better (health-wise), and thus have no REASON to loathe my body. It's not just being fat, it's the fact that I didn't take care of myself. I didn't exercise, I ate crappy foods, and I had many many bad lifestyle habits when I went through periods of depression and anxiety, including a dropoff in basic personal hygeine. When I was pushing 300 pounds, eating probably 5-6,000 calories a day, and so depressed and socially avoidant that I hid in my room and skipped class... would you really tell me in complete honesty to love myself and who I was? Or would you try and gently nudge me in a healthier direction?

I do not think that shaming someone is acceptable, but nor do I think it is acceptable to say that someone who is over 350 pounds is perfect just the way they are. Just like I wouldn't tell a girl with anorexia that she's perfect the way she is, and I wouldn't tell someone who did drugs that they're perfect the way they are. There's a difference between support and understanding, and delusion.

Ramberta

It's unfortunate that being fat isn't frowned upon the way that being a smoker/drinker/other drug user is, because really, it should be.




^ That statement is shameful! Your ex is better off without you. I sure would not want to read a statement like that from someone I love!

No reason to answer, I already know you frown upon me. After all, I am obese. Good thing I don't value your opinion enough to come back to see what you might have to say. Oh wait, that attitude is probably frowned upon too, huh?

Personal attack, much? I'm obese too. Thanks for proving my point that everyone makes judgements of others, this "love everyone for who they are" thread is just full of hypocrisy.

tallvanurse

I work in healthcare and am also conflicted about this. People say "It's nobody else's business if I get fat."
Except it is.
When you (general "you") get sick or injured, I have to manually move you from bed to stretcher to commode,etc.
Even with great lifting technique and help from others, I will continue to get hurt. It will be harder us to find an IV site to give you the medications you need and chest tubes and needles are not long enough.
You will be more likely to get a wound infection. Your blood sugar may be more difficult to manage, even if you are not diabetic. If you are a short, round person, we may not be able to fit you into the scanner. It will be difficult to obtain a decent X-ray because of the increased soft tissue.
It will be more difficult for you to walk and move after surgery, so your healing process will be longer.
So my workload will be very increased, and the patient's outcomes will be worse.
I'm not trying to "shame" anyone, I'm just not sure that people realize the consequences of their actions.

ALL OF THIS....I'm not trying to be mean either, these are just facts.

Ramberta

Final thought before I go take my 3 (or more) mile walk that I couldn't do before I lost weight:

I don't think anyone should be discriminated against purely because of their weight. I also don't think that someone classified as "overweight" (NOT obese) should necessarily obsess over losing pounds, or even losing body fat, so long as they are ambulatory and healthy and confident with their own bodies.

But it cannot be denied that the morbidly obese people of the world, whether they are "healthy" (as healthy as one can be when morbidly obese) or not, impact everyone they come into contact with. I will gladly pay taxes to help give health care to these people, and I will see these people for the individuals that they are instead of a sack of fat, but I draw the line at ENCOURAGING them to stay the way they are, or even encouraging them to get fatter. Say all you want about the noble principles of Fat Acceptance, but the reality is that it is convincing people that being fat is not only okay from a health perspective, but that it is desired!

I don't know about you, but I desire to be able to run a mile someday without stopping even once. A whole mile. Right now it seems impossible, but I know that if I treat my body right, I will do it. I also desire to be able to lift heavy someday, to have more energy, and to feel like an unstoppable force capable of anything.

If people constantly placated me and told me I was fine the way I am now, I would never have these desires. I would continue to treat my body badly, and have a shortened life because of it. That is why I am against Fat Acceptance. Instead, I am into People Acceptance. I accept and appreciate the input and debates of everyone on this thread so far, and I hope the OP does as well. Have a pleasant day everyone.

mmddwechanged

On here, I'm pretty much the unpopular opinion when it comes to issues like this, but I appreciate the fat acceptance movement (which is ultimately part of a larger movement that promotes being body-positive in general). I don't think it's encouraging anybody to be fat or stay fat or get fatter or whatever. I think what it does is it helps people who are fat and are constantly belittled about their weight feel better about themselves. I was (and still am) fat, and the movement has helped me come to understand that whether or not I lose weight SHOULDN'T determine my worth as a human being – although it sadly does. We tend to correlate a person's size with their worth (something losing weight has made me become painfully aware of). You should be able to be fat and still be awesome and look pretty and feel good about yourself.

Fat people are reminded constantly, in even the subtlest ways, that they don't belong. I don't thing it's wrong to remind them that they do and encourage them to embrace themselves, fat or not. It doesn't make fat people suddenly love their bodies and the idea that they mindlessly believe that fat is beautiful and they're healthy the way they are is ridiculous. Fat people who are a part of the FA movement still tend to feel pretty crappy about themselves, because outside of the movement, which is a fairly small community compared to the general public, they are still reminded that they should feel like crap.

I love all of this^. And 100% agree with you! I have absolutely no right to judge other people. ). Nor would it be helpful to others or myself.