Obesity and poverty...

fattyfoodie

This makes sense for the US and Canada and other countries, but....

I live part of the year in the Dominican Republic. I rarely see over weight, fat, obese people there. The usual monthly income is around 200-300 dollars or less! But people aren't starving, they are a healthy weight.

Not to mention that Dominican people spend a huge part of their monthly income on things like their hair, cell phones and other things.

How do they do it?

Well...rice and beans is cheap and healthy. Veggies actually only cost a little bit less or the same as here in Canada in the summer time, but they eat them regularly. A chicken there is about three dollars. But when you look at the cost of living, that is still more than the 6 dollars I spend on a chicken here ( all things adjusted)

They very rarely crap or processed food. Those things are imported and very expensive.

Not to mention that most of my Dominican friends are a lot less active than we are....they all hate to walk anywhere and I have never seen one exercise on purpose.

The point is...you can be poor and eat properly, it is cheaper to eat properly if you eat the basics and stay away from processed food.

I have learned a lot from the Dominican people on how to live healthy, that is for sure.

You can be poor and not be fat. A bag of rice is a few dollars, a bag of beans is a few dollars...a chicken is a few dollars, basics that you actually cook into meals that are healthy, can be pretty cheap.

I would agree with you to a point, but:

What is the cost of living there? What do people pay monthly to live in a home?

I would also point out that cooking cheap healthy meals seems to be a way of life here. In North America, cooking, and the knowledge of how to prepare cheap, healthful meals is becoming a lost art.

ninerbuff

If poverty was the cause of obesity, then 3rd would countries should be having the same issues.

While some of the stats are legit, you would think that making less and having less meant one would eat less. Unfortunately that's usually not the case. And lots of people would rather have "fun" stuff like computers and phones to spend their money on rather than actual whole food.

Before the cell phone boom (I'm not against them), how did families keep in touch or safe if they were away from each other? What's my point? Lots of families have phones and pay well over $150 a month for them rather than actual food.

A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

Acg67

I was reading through the thread about who is to blame for obese children. The unanimous consensus is that it's the parents' fault. While I agree to a certain extent, I think people are forgetting a few key pieces of info. Let's take a look at Mississippi. It's the #1 poorest state in the nation. It's also the #1 most obese state in the nation. It's also the #1 most hunger stricken state in the nation. How could that be? How can people be starving AND obese!? It doesn't make sense. Or does it?

If you go to the grocery and buy enough fresh, whole food to feed a family of four for a week, you'll likely spend no less than $200. Good, fresh, real food is terribly expensive. Crap food is not! A cheeseburger, fries, and coke at McDonalds cost $3. A salad at McDonalds cost $6. Fresh produce and meat is expensive compared to ramen noodles and Vienna sausages. It's next to impossible for people living in poverty to eat healthy food!

I don't know how to fix that, but I know that something needs to change if we're going to solve the obesity epidemic in this country!

How much you eat plays a much larger role than what you eat.

Why isn't Haiti the most obese nation on earth?

fattyfoodie

If poverty was the cause of obesity, then 3rd would countries should be having the same issues.

While some of the stats are legit, you would think that making less and having less meant one would eat less. Unfortunately that's usually not the case. And lots of people would rather have "fun" stuff like computers and phones to spend their money on rather than actual whole food.

Before the cell phone boom (I'm not against them), how did families keep in touch or safe if they were away from each other? What's my point? Lots of families have phones and pay well over $150 a month for them rather than actual food.

A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

Your logic is flawed. In third world countries, people don't have immediate access to cheap food like substances. In third world countries, people still know how to prepare real food.

In North America, the problem is that convenience food is readily available and cheap because people need it- single working moms don't have a lot of time to prepare meals, so they don't teach their kids how to prepare meals. So when their kids grow up, they don't cook for their kids and rely on cheap, readily available convenience food. It's a vicious cycle.

theCarlton

As someone who actually came from a poverty-stricken background, allow me to shed a little light on a lot of people's situation. I'm not going to give my opinion on the topic itself, just some information for other people to consider before they do. If you haven't been horribly poor you really do not have any idea of how to guess what you'd do in the situation.

1) Sometimes your family has no way to get to a grocery store often, so you shop at what's nearby, usually at convenience stores. Most convenience stores do not sell fruits and vegetables, only non-perishable items. Sometimes the nearest grocery store sucks, and you can't afford any better.

1.5) When you have little money, you want your food to feed many mouths and/or last a long time. With most perishables being at a week or so, the incentive to buy is very low.

2) Sometimes there is literally no yard or even a patio/balcony. You are apartment 15F in a 20-story building full of people just like you. No one is doing any gardening.

2.5) No grocery store owner in is right mind wants to open a grocery store in your neighborhood because he doesn't want to be robbed, or have people steal his merchandise.

3) Your live with your mother who works 2 jobs.

4) Your dad pays no child support and doesn't pick you up to have dinner or go to the park for a run.

5) When your mom wants to make you smile, she buys you candy and "treats". The neighbors give you candy and treats, too, because you and your friends are good kids, and candy is cheap.

6) You're not taught nutrition in school. You go to a school that sucks because it gets almost no funding because the students do poorly on their tests, and your teacher spends half the day disciplining other students. He or she spends one third of the school year preparing you for standardized tests that most students will fail.

6.5) Schools themselves are serving students things that are not healthful. Pizza (recently deemed a vegetable in the US, by the way) tater tots, and brown meat served with instant potatoes isn't setting the best example.

7) People in poverty usually have very little education. Don't assume they should know they need to eat healthier.

8) They are raised to keep hunger away (just as our public school food system continues to model), not to be nutritionally balanced. Think of comfort foods, and remember why they bring comfort. They're filling and swimming in salt and butter or grease, and they make you feel good.

9) Your brain associates hunger with stress. Your mom can't afford to buy a better car, a couch that has all 4 legs and no rips in it, a coffee maker to replace her old one, but she will be damned if she can't feed you and you have to feel what she felt when she was a hungry little kid living just like you do now.

RunsOnEspresso

HBO's Weight of the Nation and the documentary A Place at the Table do an excellent job of explaining why poor (in the US) tend to be more obese. A Place at the Table talks a lot about food insecurity.

Marcia661

Interesting fact.........in third world (or developing Countries) obesity is a sign of great wealth, while in first world (or so called developed nations) it is definitely a sign of poverty.

Does anyone else see the irony in this?

NYCNika

Yes, there is some truth to that. BTW, there is an episode on "obesity and poverty" from HBO's Weight of the Nation documentary. (can be found on youtube, I think).

However, it is true to a degree. The fact that you have little money does not explain why you buy soda's and chips for your children. Logically, those most unnecessary things should be the first ones to go.

BeachIron

Obesity is a matter of too many calories and not enough exercise. Poverty is not going to cause that. Yes, there is a correlation between poverty and obesity in some countries, but that doesn't equal causation.

I'd put my money on a lack of self control (which all children naturally have), combined with parents who either don't care, or who lack the ability to say "no" to their children, along with the parents modeling poor eating behavior.

I'm sorry, but do you know how elitist this sounds? I do a lot of advocacy work with the poor in my community particularly around food security for families. We live in a middle class neighbourhood on the edge of an impoverished area and I was shocked to find out that most of the kids my son goes to school work don't get any meals other than the ones provided by the breakfast program. It's not a lack of care from their parents, it's a complete and total lack of resources. A lot of people are also too ashamed to ask for help because they face discrimination and shaming, as so eloquently modeled in your post above.

Yes, thank you, my thoughts exactly!! It is hard enough for people to be struggling under the poverty line, when especially in expensive urban centres many companies are barely paying a living wage even for positions requiring advanced degrees. To be labelled as uneducated and ignorant simply due to low income is outrageous!

Elitist? I'm amused by people call those who advocate for personal or parental responsibility, "elitist." I have known plenty of struggling families, several of whom happen to be relatives of mine or my wife, and frankly I've been there. Some of their children are lucky to have the parents that are keenly aware of the outside influences on their children. Others are not.

I'm not going to go back and forth with you, but there was no discrimination and shaming in my statement. Parents are responsible. If they don't have the resources then they should reach out for help. Their embarrassment shouldn't prevent their children from eating. Besides, you should also know that if there is an issue of food security, you are talking about too few calories.

fattyfoodie

Obesity is a matter of too many calories and not enough exercise. Poverty is not going to cause that. Yes, there is a correlation between poverty and obesity in some countries, but that doesn't equal causation.

I'd put my money on a lack of self control (which all children naturally have), combined with parents who either don't care, or who lack the ability to say "no" to their children, along with the parents modeling poor eating behavior.

I'm sorry, but do you know how elitist this sounds? I do a lot of advocacy work with the poor in my community particularly around food security for families. We live in a middle class neighbourhood on the edge of an impoverished area and I was shocked to find out that most of the kids my son goes to school work don't get any meals other than the ones provided by the breakfast program. It's not a lack of care from their parents, it's a complete and total lack of resources. A lot of people are also too ashamed to ask for help because they face discrimination and shaming, as so eloquently modeled in your post above.

Yes, thank you, my thoughts exactly!! It is hard enough for people to be struggling under the poverty line, when especially in expensive urban centres many companies are barely paying a living wage even for positions requiring advanced degrees. To be labelled as uneducated and ignorant simply due to low income is outrageous!

Elitist? I'm amused by people call those who advocate for personal or parental responsibility, "elitist." I have known plenty of struggling families, several of whom happen to be relatives of mine or my wife, and frankly I've been there. Some of their children are lucky to have the parents that are keenly aware of the outside influences on their children. Others are not.

I'm not going to go back and forth with you, but there was no discrimination and shaming in my statement. Parents are responsible. If they don't have the resources then they should reach out for help. Their embarrassment shouldn't prevent their children from eating. Besides, you should also know that if there is an issue of food security, you are talking about too few calories.

I'm not advocating against personal responsibility or parental responsibility, not at all.

What I am saying is that saying that people who live in poverty are obese because they don't care is a completely naive statement.

It's a cycle. People trying to feed their family on $7 a day but cheap processed convenience food. Often times, they have never been taught how to cook and prepare meals. And if Mom is working two jobs and Dad isn't in the picture, how do you think these kids are supposed to get any physical activity?

erickirb

Obesity is a matter of too many calories and not enough exercise. Poverty is not going to cause that. Yes, there is a correlation between poverty and obesity in some countries, but that doesn't equal causation.

I'd put my money on a lack of self control (which all children naturally have), combined with parents who either don't care, or who lack the ability to say "no" to their children, along with the parents modeling poor eating behavior.

I'm sorry, but do you know how elitist this sounds? I do a lot of advocacy work with the poor in my community particularly around food security for families. We live in a middle class neighbourhood on the edge of an impoverished area and I was shocked to find out that most of the kids my son goes to school work don't get any meals other than the ones provided by the breakfast program. It's not a lack of care from their parents, it's a complete and total lack of resources. A lot of people are also too ashamed to ask for help because they face discrimination and shaming, as so eloquently modeled in your post above.

Yes, thank you, my thoughts exactly!! It is hard enough for people to be struggling under the poverty line, when especially in expensive urban centres many companies are barely paying a living wage even for positions requiring advanced degrees. To be labelled as uneducated and ignorant simply due to low income is outrageous!

Elitist? I'm amused by people call those who advocate for personal or parental responsibility, "elitist." I have known plenty of struggling families, several of whom happen to be relatives of mine or my wife, and frankly I've been there. Some of their children are lucky to have the parents that are keenly aware of the outside influences on their children. Others are not.

I'm not going to go back and forth with you, but there was no discrimination and shaming in my statement. Parents are responsible. If they don't have the resources then they should reach out for help. Their embarrassment shouldn't prevent their children from eating. Besides, you should also know that if there is an issue of food security, you are talking about too few calories.

I'm not advocating against personal responsibility or parental responsibility, not at all.

What I am saying is that saying that people who live in poverty are obese because they don't care is a completely naive statement.

It's a cycle. People trying to feed their family on $7 a day but cheap processed convenience food. Often times, they have never been taught how to cook and prepare meals. And if Mom is working two jobs and Dad isn't in the picture, how do you think these kids are supposed to get any physical activity?

You keep missing the point, calories in vs. calories out. If you burn 1800 cals a day with no exercise, you will not get obese eating 1500 cals of junk food/day, even without exercising. Most likely in this case you would not be healthy, but you will not be obese, it would be impossible to be.

homerjspartan

Excuses are like ***holes. Everybody's got one, and they all stink.

Nobody is fat because of inability to buy healthy food. That's a bunch of Marxist bull****.

Here's a theory. Maybe children in poor families are fat because their parents feed them crap because their parents are idiots. Poor idiots, but idiots nonetheless.

And before anyone calls me "elitist," I grew up poor. I was chubby (not obese, but plump, for sure). My brother and sister were rail thin. I'll give you two guess as to why that was the case, but you're only going to need one.

Because you ate their food?

FATJAKE5

I was reading through the thread about who is to blame for obese children. The unanimous consensus is that it's the parents' fault. While I agree to a certain extent, I think people are forgetting a few key pieces of info. Let's take a look at Mississippi. It's the #1 poorest state in the nation. It's also the #1 most obese state in the nation. It's also the #1 most hunger stricken state in the nation. How could that be? How can people be starving AND obese!? It doesn't make sense. Or does it?

If you go to the grocery and buy enough fresh, whole food to feed a family of four for a week, you'll likely spend no less than $200. Good, fresh, real food is terribly expensive. Crap food is not! A cheeseburger, fries, and coke at McDonalds cost $3. A salad at McDonalds cost $6. Fresh produce and meat is expensive compared to ramen noodles and Vienna sausages. It's next to impossible for people living in poverty to eat healthy food!

I don't know how to fix that, but I know that something needs to change if we're going to solve the obesity epidemic in this country!

So,............are you from Mississippi or near by?

workout_fish

While i agree with you to an extent i'll also argue that yes you can feed a family of 4 for less than $200 a week. My Weekly grocery budget is 1/2 of that! I buy in bulk and also shop seasonal fruits and veggies. I also shop at farmers markets and a little amish shop that is in my neighborhood. Its not just what they are eating, but the quantity.

I totally agree with you! Plus you can buy fresh if things are on sale and always freeze things if you know you wont use it before it goes bad. if youre a smart shopper it can be do-able to eat very healthy on a tight budget. It does take a little more time and energy when it comes to shopping and food prep, but if its worth it to you, you will find the time/means to make it happen.

That being said..i do think a lack of education on smart shopping/food choices is something that contributes to the problem as well. I know from experience that it can be difficult for people to make these kind of smart choices when they have never been educated about them in the first place.

BeachIron

Obesity is a matter of too many calories and not enough exercise. Poverty is not going to cause that. Yes, there is a correlation between poverty and obesity in some countries, but that doesn't equal causation.

I'd put my money on a lack of self control (which all children naturally have), combined with parents who either don't care, or who lack the ability to say "no" to their children, along with the parents modeling poor eating behavior.

I'm sorry, but do you know how elitist this sounds? I do a lot of advocacy work with the poor in my community particularly around food security for families. We live in a middle class neighbourhood on the edge of an impoverished area and I was shocked to find out that most of the kids my son goes to school work don't get any meals other than the ones provided by the breakfast program. It's not a lack of care from their parents, it's a complete and total lack of resources. A lot of people are also too ashamed to ask for help because they face discrimination and shaming, as so eloquently modeled in your post above.

Yes, thank you, my thoughts exactly!! It is hard enough for people to be struggling under the poverty line, when especially in expensive urban centres many companies are barely paying a living wage even for positions requiring advanced degrees. To be labelled as uneducated and ignorant simply due to low income is outrageous!

Elitist? I'm amused by people call those who advocate for personal or parental responsibility, "elitist." I have known plenty of struggling families, several of whom happen to be relatives of mine or my wife, and frankly I've been there. Some of their children are lucky to have the parents that are keenly aware of the outside influences on their children. Others are not.

I'm not going to go back and forth with you, but there was no discrimination and shaming in my statement. Parents are responsible. If they don't have the resources then they should reach out for help. Their embarrassment shouldn't prevent their children from eating. Besides, you should also know that if there is an issue of food security, you are talking about too few calories.

I'm not advocating against personal responsibility or parental responsibility, not at all.

What I am saying is that saying that people who live in poverty are obese because they don't care is a completely naive statement.

It's a cycle. People trying to feed their family on $7 a day but cheap processed convenience food. Often times, they have never been taught how to cook and prepare meals. And if Mom is working two jobs and Dad isn't in the picture, how do you think these kids are supposed to get any physical activity?

Some don't care. Claiming otherwise is naive. Sorry, but if you have the experience you claim, you know this. I've seen way too much of it firsthand.

Besides, read what I wrote. "I'd put my money on a lack of self control (which all children naturally have), combined with parents who either don't care, or who lack the ability to say "no" to their children, along with the parents modeling poor eating behavior." Note the word "either."

NYCNika

Some people are also idiots. Sorry, but it is true. I've been watching a program on diabetes, and this poor 10 year old overweight kid already had diabetes and a grandma militantly stated "I'm not going to deny him my biscuits! If he wants them, he can have as many as he wants!" with that "f all of you elitists" attitude. I felt so bad for the kid. The kind of damage that will be done to his body at his age, leaves him no chance for a healthy life.

xampx

Same here, my mum worked full time, we were a single parent family on low income, but we ate healthy. Every Saturday we each dragged 2 heavy bags from the market.

My mum shopped at Iceland and Aldi (as I still do!) and very rarely bought convenience food because although fresh meat and vegetables were more expensive, they would go further than just one meal if she took the time to cook.

And I think we went to McDonalds maybe twice a year as a treat.

misseseaj2010

I live in South Mississippi, but commute to New Orleans, as does my husband and my dad. Wages are very low in Mississippi, one company tried to pay me less to be an admin. assistant than I would get paid working in fast food and finding full time work is damn near impossible.

I think the problem is lack of education. I posted on my own profile that I am amazed how much I have learned from mfp and what a shame that I didn't learn this stuff in school.

Another problem is apathy. People don't care that they are fat/unhealthy.

I was watching a documentary about poverty/obesity, and it was showing a correlation between low-income areas (in New Orleans) and less grocery stores, stating that they have to buy "convenience foods" because that's all that's available to them. But this definitely isn't the issue in Mississippi, not in my area anyway. There is a Walmart about every 15 miles, and food giant and winn dixie, etc.

One theory is the "Stress" of low income fuels unhealthy eating.

misseseaj2010

Just bought food to feed my family of 3 (big appetites) for $110 and it will last us about 10 days. Cart was full of nothing but meat, produce and a couple dairy products (milk and cheese).

So not true if you are a frugal shopper.

100% agree with this.

ilovedeadlifts

I agree to a certain extent, healthy foods are going to cost a bit more, but a lot of people use that for an excuse.

It's hard to change it when the corn industry pretty much controls everything. You have things like HFCS in nearly everything you buy in a box.

A good start would be educating children about nutrition, so they can make better choices as adults.