Fasting for weight loss vs. anorexia

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  • ediths6
    ediths6 Posts: 72
    dont mean to sound agressive but these kinds of discussions are very upsetting... spend some time in a youth mental facility or talk to someone who is very ill with one of these illnesses... they are NOT diets gone too far

    though diets going too far can obviously be damaging.
  • filomenae
    filomenae Posts: 110 Member
    As someone also in recovery from my ED, I see a huge difference. I didn't choose my eating disorder--it was how I learned to cope with my extreme emotions. It was partially to lose weight, but not for vanity. I was trying to lose weight to disappear, a slow suicide of sorts. I've been dealing with my ED for more than half my life; it's taken so much from me. Fasting for weight loss.. I guess people doing that and not feeling as though they have to (with anorexia, that's how I feet), but want to, are simply ill-educated and looking for the quick-fix, while I was doing it to kill myself. The psychological turmoil of an ED vs. quick weight loss and ignorance, goodness, I could go on forever.. I don't wish the torture in my mind on anyone else.

    Sorry for getting a little personal and deep, but I think there's a huge difference! I guess it depends on the type of eating disorder, severity, causes, etc,.

    **SIDE NOTE: IF is different from water fasting, and my argument/opinion is eating disorder vs. hazardous fasting (water fasting, etc).
  • fteale
    fteale Posts: 5,310 Member
    I would say anorexia was continuing to diet for weight loss when you are already underweight.
  • fteale
    fteale Posts: 5,310 Member
    Humans are built to think anything they personally don't get is strange and perhaps dangerous. Personally, I think long distance runners have a disorder.

    I think people who lift heavy lumps of metal for fun are mentally unhinged.
  • iwant2beskinny1
    iwant2beskinny1 Posts: 2
    in some ways yes.. but when it comes to the end of it no, because you must rember some anarexics (Most) want to get better and start eating normally.. but because it is a mental illness they cant eat their afraid of eatting! cause to the every single calorie is extra fat
  • suziecue66
    suziecue66 Posts: 1,312 Member
    Most are doing intermittent fasting for the health benefits and weight loss. Read Brad Pilon. Intermittent fasting is a good way to control weekly calorie amount for maintenance. It's not an ED but it can be for those that are prone to ED and take it to extremes. I have never done a 16 or 24 hour fast and felt starved. If I planned a 24hr fast and someone invited me to lunch or something I will cut down the length of fast to accommodate.

    "Using Intermittent Fasting in Your Lifestyle
    In reality, IF can be applied in many different ways (as most of us are not going to want to fast that often). Using intermittent times of no food intake along with reduced calories on those days can give people many of the health/weight loss benefits without needing to give up food for a whole day. It also allows more flexibility into how it can be used depending on the person’s goals, activity levels, food choices and schedule. I mean who wouldn’t want to eat in a way that could potentially give you:

    Reduced blood glucose and insulin levels (markers of improved health)
    Increased fatty acid oxidation
    Maintenance of lean mass (muscle)
    Reduced inflammation
    Reduced oxidative damage
    Increased cellular stress resistance (esp of heart and brain)
    Decreased risks associated with degenerative diseases of aging (cancers, heart diseases, diabetes, Alzheimers)"
    http://www.theiflife.com/benefits-intermittent-fasting/
  • papate
    papate Posts: 67 Member
    So if someone were on low calories diet and called it fasting, the negative stigma of anorexia wouldn't be there?
  • fteale
    fteale Posts: 5,310 Member
    So if someone were on low calories diet and called it fasting, the negative stigma of anorexia wouldn't be there?

    That would depend on their starting weight and mental state.
  • suziecue66
    suziecue66 Posts: 1,312 Member
    So if someone were on low calories diet and called it fasting, the negative stigma of anorexia wouldn't be there?
    Intermittent fasting is not missing a meal here and there, constantly trying to stay as low calorie as possible. It's about extending a fast for about 16-24 hrs 1 or 2 times per week to reap the health benefits.
  • Dave198lbs
    Dave198lbs Posts: 8,810 Member
    So if someone were on low calories diet and called it fasting, the negative stigma of anorexia wouldn't be there?
    Intermittent fasting is not missing a meal here and there, constantly trying to stay as low calorie as possible. It's about extending a fast for about 16-24 hrs 1 or 2 times per week to reap the health benefits.

    actually intermittent fasting can be fasting 16-20 hours a day every day of the week
  • yarwell
    yarwell Posts: 10,477 Member
    I am, in a way, attempting to construct a 'definition' of sorts.
    There are plenty of definitions of Anorexia around... for example :

    "Anorexia nervosa is an eating disorder and mental health condition which can be life-threatening.
    People with anorexia try to keep their weight as low as possible, usually by restricting the amount of food they eat. They often have a distorted image of themselves, thinking that they're fat when they're not.
    Some people with the condition also exercise excessively, and some eat a lot of food in a short space of time (binge eating) and then make themselves sick or use laxatives (purging).
    People affected by anorexia often go to great attempts to hide their behaviour from family and friends by lying about eating and what they have eaten, or by pretending to have eaten earlier."

    Whereas Fasting is simply not eating for a period of time.
  • suziecue66
    suziecue66 Posts: 1,312 Member
    So if someone were on low calories diet and called it fasting, the negative stigma of anorexia wouldn't be there?
    Intermittent fasting is not missing a meal here and there, constantly trying to stay as low calorie as possible. It's about extending a fast for about 16-24 hrs 1 or 2 times per week to reap the health benefits.

    actually intermittent fasting can be fasting 16-20 hours a day every day of the week

    Yeh, thats if you are doing the eating window daily. I have done that too. But you do get your required calories in for the day.
  • MoveTheMountain
    MoveTheMountain Posts: 764
    ... Fasting for weight loss.. I guess people doing that and not feeling as though they have to (with anorexia, that's how I feet), but want to, are simply ill-educated and looking for the quick-fix, while I was doing it to kill myself. The psychological turmoil of an ED vs. quick weight loss and ignorance, goodness, I could go on forever.. I don't wish the torture in my mind on anyone else.

    Sorry for getting a little personal and deep, but I think there's a huge difference! I guess it depends on the type of eating disorder, severity, causes, etc,.

    **SIDE NOTE: IF is different from water fasting, and my argument/opinion is eating disorder vs. hazardous fasting (water fasting, etc).

    First off, very sorry you're going through what you're going through. I hope your recovery continues, and that you stay healthy. Having said that, it's short sighted and a little uneducated to say that people who fast to lose weight are ill-educated - although some might be, I have no idea. But that certainly doesn't apply to me, or most of the other posters whose input I've seen on this thread. Fasting is merely an aid to weight loss, not a quick fix; and when done properly it is completely healthy and not in any way related to an eating disorder. When I do it, I go for somewhere in the 20-24 hour range, and then I start eating again as normal. I haven't done any binging, and I have no problem starting to eat again - as a matter of fact, I'm generally really looking forward to dinner (I usually go 8pm to 6pm, or 6pm to 6pm).

    From your perspective, it might be hard to understand, but please try not to be so judgemental about something you just don't agree with based on your experiences.
  • MoveTheMountain
    MoveTheMountain Posts: 764
    So if someone were on low calories diet and called it fasting, the negative stigma of anorexia wouldn't be there?
    Intermittent fasting is not missing a meal here and there, constantly trying to stay as low calorie as possible. It's about extending a fast for about 16-24 hrs 1 or 2 times per week to reap the health benefits.

    actually intermittent fasting can be fasting 16-20 hours a day every day of the week

    Yeh, thats if you are doing the eating window daily. I have done that too. But you do get your required calories in for the day.

    I confess, this one seems curious to me. I'm not judging it, because I really don't know anything about it, but my personal choice is to go the full day (ish) once or twice a week, and then eat my normal calories on the remaining days. I actually look forward to the fasting periods, but I would never want to do it more than twice a week (often once a week is plenty... I go by how I feel during that week).

    Just goes to show you, more than 1 way to skin a cat. (Which I would never do, btw, I love cats - I have a big honkin' orange male who's pretty awesome.)
  • geekyjock76
    geekyjock76 Posts: 2,720 Member
    The way I look at it is that fasting for weight loss can develop into anorexia if certain criteria are met. If a person sees progress and or reaches their goals, then its a non issue as they likely will up their calories and exit the "diet" stage. However, those individuals who chronically restrict caloric intake for much of their adult life are the ones at risk of anorexia and other eating disorders since the fear of getting fat and distorted body image is likely present. Then you have the long-term and permanent health issues that go with anorexia.
  • magj0y
    magj0y Posts: 1,911 Member
    I think it's entirely too different.
    Anorexia = very underweight and still thinking you are too big, it's a mental illness as well. It's constant fasting and does a lot of damage to your body, some of it permanent. Also, it is extremely hard for many underweight people to put weight on.

    Fasting for weight loss for someone who is over weight is less risky, less damaging and doing so to be healthier. So long as it isn't a long term fasting.

    I have known some people who tried, and succeeded to get to a healthy weight, only to become obsessed with it and ultimately anorexic.
  • missworld95
    missworld95 Posts: 131 Member
    People don't understand that anorexia is a mental disorder....
    Fasting, anyone can do. Anorexia is actually inherited and needs to be triggered.
  • GnochhiGnomes
    GnochhiGnomes Posts: 348 Member
    Umm...where exactly do you get this idea from?

    By interacting with other Anorexics and watching various documentaries on Anorexia.
  • MoveTheMountain
    MoveTheMountain Posts: 764
    People don't understand that anorexia is a mental disorder....
    Fasting, anyone can do. Anorexia is actually inherited and needs to be triggered.

    Is it *only* inherited, or just more likely to develop if you have it in your family history?
  • missworld95
    missworld95 Posts: 131 Member
    It runs in the family, so they're thinking its genetic. They're still doing research on it but my guess would be that it's linked to family history.
  • dhakiyya
    dhakiyya Posts: 481 Member
    I'm currently fasting for religious reasons. (well not currently as in right now because right now I'm tucking into my pre-fasting meal which is packed full of calories and healthy carbs) - I'm actually eating 100 cals a day more than when I'm not fasting, because I don't want to combine fat loss with fasting as I tend to lose lean body mass easily. I fast from first light to sunset each day, then cram 1600 cals in during the night. This is my inactive TDEE (I'm eating at that because I move around less while fasting, when not fasting my TDEE is 1700-1800 cals and my deficit calories are 1500)

    Religious fasting and the intermittent fasting fat loss plans, the fast has a start and end point, and you're not fasting all day every day. You have a fast, then a set amount of time in which you eat., and during that time you eat the right number of calories for your body, i.e. if it's for fat loss (e.g. intermittent fasting plans) you eat the same amount of calories that someone on a regular eat 6x a day fat loss plan would eat, just it's crammed into fewer meals and into a particular time of the day. I don't do intermittent fasting for fat loss, it doesn't suit how my body is and when not fasting I eat 6-7 small meals a day. Religious fasting is for God, not fat loss, and for me it's best if I eat at maintenance calories during the night while fasting as I said.

    I think the main difference between this and someone who is starving themselves and saying that they're fasting, is the one who is starving themselves isn't eating enough when not fasting. If someone who's the same religion as me was only eating 500 cals during the night then fasting again the next day, I'd be warning them of the risks to their health in doing that, and yes in that situation it may be a sign that they have an eating disorder (though I'm not a doctor so not qualified to say if it is or not, but I might advise them to see a doctor if they were carrying on like that in spite of warnings of the dangers of not eating enough)
  • seamonkey789
    seamonkey789 Posts: 233
    The "professional" definition of a disorder is when the behavior is impacting your life negatively in 2 or more areas. Work AND home. Home and friendships. School and church. Physically and socially. You get the idea.

    Technically, it isn't a clinical disorder unless you're having some kind of trouble. So if you are fasting, but you aren't changing your social life, work performance, or physical health for the worse, you don't have a clinical disorder.

    You're still playing with fire, imho.

    Actually, no, there are whole DSM criteria for diagnosing anorexia, bulimia, ED-nos, etc. I completed a major, 3 minors, dated, went out with dance friends and was damned good at everything I did the entire time I had an eating disorder

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