Frustration - Wife sabotages herself - women listen up
diabloben68
Posts: 64
I have been married for 3 years now. I am 27 (190lbs) and my wife is 22 (122lbs). She is a really wonderful, beautiful, sexy woman that I am happy I married. We have our problems like most couples do, but I think we are very lucky to have each other.
My wife has a problem that I think many women have - self confidence. I wanted to write a little about how a woman's lack in confidence is not just destructive to herself, but to those she is closest with. I hope that in some ways I can reach out and inspire women to change for the better. I also want to preface that I am in no way a master of the ways of women, and much of what I say is simply my opinion. All that said, I believe most of you will agree that loving, respecting, and appreciating one's self are unavoidably essential to happiness.
I would rather my wife be 10 lbs heavier and feel sexy, than 10lbs lighter and feel pathetic. She is so much more attractive when she acts like she is worth something, than almost anything else she can do. Thats not to say I want her to gain 50lbs, because I dont, but I do want her to feel good about herself.
I dont know if all women are like this, but for my wife, getting ready and looking presentable is important to her because that means she cares enough about herself to actually invest time in to herself. The times when she hides her hair, and puts on baggy clothes just drives me nuts, not because I dont like the up-do or baggy clothes, but because she is figuratively saying to herself "I am not pretty enough to get ready" We have gotten into arguments about her hair, and I have thrown her hair-bands away (that was wrong) so she wouldn't hide her hair. She has beautiful hair by the way.
It has gotten to the point where I can't even give her a heart felt compliment anymore, like "oh you look really pretty" or "your really good at science" or "your hair looks so nice and shiny" because she thinks I am lying. I still do because I think everyone needs positive reinforcement, and part of me just feels like saying nice things anyway.
One of the biggest places in my opinion, and most men can probably agree with me on this, that is affected by the self image problems is intimacy settings. Having your wife being hung up some self image problem while your trying to be intimate is extremely annoying and frustrating, might I add even selfish on her part. I am trying to express my love in the most sincere and sacred of ways that I have vowed not to share with anyone else, and she is worried about being fat, or not pretty enough.
This leads me directly into my next point, that is, if you self sabotage by thinking you're of no worth, it will inevitably happen. For example, my wife is worried about not being pretty enough for me. On the one hand I am flattered that she cares enough about "my opinion" (ill discuss this in the next paragraph), but after a while of her constant self belittlement, she actually starts to become less attractive to me, hence becoming what she so badly did not want to become.
Is it my opinion she is seeking approval from?. At first, I really thought she was just trying to look good for me. What can I say, I was flattered. Now I can tell you that though she does care somewhat of what I think about her,but an overwhelming majority of her feelings are concerned with the way she feels and thinks about her self. A lot of this is just transposed on to me in such a way that she is asking me what I think. I realized about a year ago that to a degree, it really didn't matter what I thought at all.
So how can this be fixed? Well, I am happy to say that this is open discussion thus helpful hints would be appreciated. What I can say is that things are getting better as far as my wife's self confidence. She's making an increased effort to get ready, workout, and maintain a healthy lifestyle. I think in doing these things, she has learned that she is worth a great deal more than she thought. Thanks for reading, feel free to respond.
My wife has a problem that I think many women have - self confidence. I wanted to write a little about how a woman's lack in confidence is not just destructive to herself, but to those she is closest with. I hope that in some ways I can reach out and inspire women to change for the better. I also want to preface that I am in no way a master of the ways of women, and much of what I say is simply my opinion. All that said, I believe most of you will agree that loving, respecting, and appreciating one's self are unavoidably essential to happiness.
I would rather my wife be 10 lbs heavier and feel sexy, than 10lbs lighter and feel pathetic. She is so much more attractive when she acts like she is worth something, than almost anything else she can do. Thats not to say I want her to gain 50lbs, because I dont, but I do want her to feel good about herself.
I dont know if all women are like this, but for my wife, getting ready and looking presentable is important to her because that means she cares enough about herself to actually invest time in to herself. The times when she hides her hair, and puts on baggy clothes just drives me nuts, not because I dont like the up-do or baggy clothes, but because she is figuratively saying to herself "I am not pretty enough to get ready" We have gotten into arguments about her hair, and I have thrown her hair-bands away (that was wrong) so she wouldn't hide her hair. She has beautiful hair by the way.
It has gotten to the point where I can't even give her a heart felt compliment anymore, like "oh you look really pretty" or "your really good at science" or "your hair looks so nice and shiny" because she thinks I am lying. I still do because I think everyone needs positive reinforcement, and part of me just feels like saying nice things anyway.
One of the biggest places in my opinion, and most men can probably agree with me on this, that is affected by the self image problems is intimacy settings. Having your wife being hung up some self image problem while your trying to be intimate is extremely annoying and frustrating, might I add even selfish on her part. I am trying to express my love in the most sincere and sacred of ways that I have vowed not to share with anyone else, and she is worried about being fat, or not pretty enough.
This leads me directly into my next point, that is, if you self sabotage by thinking you're of no worth, it will inevitably happen. For example, my wife is worried about not being pretty enough for me. On the one hand I am flattered that she cares enough about "my opinion" (ill discuss this in the next paragraph), but after a while of her constant self belittlement, she actually starts to become less attractive to me, hence becoming what she so badly did not want to become.
Is it my opinion she is seeking approval from?. At first, I really thought she was just trying to look good for me. What can I say, I was flattered. Now I can tell you that though she does care somewhat of what I think about her,but an overwhelming majority of her feelings are concerned with the way she feels and thinks about her self. A lot of this is just transposed on to me in such a way that she is asking me what I think. I realized about a year ago that to a degree, it really didn't matter what I thought at all.
So how can this be fixed? Well, I am happy to say that this is open discussion thus helpful hints would be appreciated. What I can say is that things are getting better as far as my wife's self confidence. She's making an increased effort to get ready, workout, and maintain a healthy lifestyle. I think in doing these things, she has learned that she is worth a great deal more than she thought. Thanks for reading, feel free to respond.
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Replies
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I'm a woman who feels more comfortable with my hair pulled back, some jeans, and a t-shirt. If my husband ever threw my hairbands away, and told me that I needed to make myself more presentable, he would not be my husband. Shame on you. She's not your trophy.
Sorry, but after reading that part, I couldn't even make it to the end.0 -
First off, you are awesome. I have great respect for any man who steps up and put thought and effort into why his wife may or may not be feeling a certain way about herself.
Is it possible your wife is suffering from some mild depression? Honestly I remember 22 being a rough age. Newly married, money is tight, still figuring out career stuff, thinking about starting a family, wondering if you can or ever will have the house you really want......it can be more overwhelming for some people than others. She's been married since she was 19-that is pretty young. She could very well be going through some personal issues-not marriage issues just inner self stuff. Does she have some sisters she could talk to or is she close to her mom? Maybe even a doc. There are some great meds on the market. Overthinking at age 22 is very common among women. It can manifest as sadness, depression, or the other spectrum...binge drinking, other things like that. I don't know your "situation" but hopefully this helps.0 -
I'm a woman who feels more comfortable with my hair pulled back, some jeans, and a t-shirt. If my husband ever threw my hairbands away, and told me that I needed to make myself more presentable, he would not be my husband. Shame on you. She's not your trophy.
Sorry, but after reading that part, I couldn't even make it to the end.
^^^What the above poster said.0 -
If you truly want to understand this, watch "Killing Us Softly 4."
And stop trying to control the way she looks. If her self-esteem really does effect her hair style choice, that's something she needs to work through and demanding she do otherwise isn't going to speed up the process. It also could just be that she's feeling lazy that day or wants to feel relaxed. I woke up with so much self confidence this morning and so chirpy that I didn't wear make-up which is unusual for me, but I suppose it could be easily misinterpreted.
Her feelings during intimacy are not selfish. They are her feelings, they are normal, and they come from a lifetime of being told that women can never be good enough or pretty enough. We don't develop these concepts and feelings in a vacuum.0 -
:laugh: I could hardly get past the tossing of the headbands too.
I *did* get through your post though. :huh: point taken.0 -
I thought his post was awesome. Kudos OP.0
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Keep telling her shes pretty. Do little things to show her (like a silky but not just for you nightgown . Leave her little notes. I am at a perfectly healthy weight, but like your wife, I don't feel pretty in my own skin. My husband sees me differently. He recently bought me a matching bra and panty set and left a note that said he hoped it made me feel as pretty as he thinks I look. The token gesture wax wonderful and really made me smile from the inside out. Perhaps you could try something like this instead of her hair ties (I get it-you were mad;). Best of luck. Just be there. (And for the record, u will never see myself the way my husband sees me. And I don't always believe him. But I DO believe that he believes what he sees in me0
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I'm a woman who feels more comfortable with my hair pulled back, some jeans, and a t-shirt. If my husband ever threw my hairbands away, and told me that I needed to make myself more presentable, he would not be my husband. Shame on you. She's not your trophy.
Sorry, but after reading that part, I couldn't even make it to the end.
It is quite possible that one of us or both of us is missing the point. My point is that I really don't care what she looks like, as long as she cares about her self.
What I think you are getting at is that I want her to look a certain way, therefore I throw away her headbands etc.0 -
Keep telling her shes pretty. Do little things to show her (like a silky but not just for you nightgown . Leave her little notes. I am at a perfectly healthy weight, but like your wife, I don't feel pretty in my own skin. My husband sees me differently. He recently bought me a matching bra and panty set and left a note that said he hoped it made me feel as pretty as he thinks I look. The token gesture wax wonderful and really made me smile from the inside out. Perhaps you could try something like this instead of her hair ties (I get it-you were mad;). Best of luck. Just be there. (And for the record, u will never see myself the way my husband sees me. And I don't always believe him. But I DO believe that he believes what he sees in me
Very inciteful, thank you. I believe I am still a novice with the marriage thing, so I think these are good ideas!0 -
I'm a woman who feels more comfortable with my hair pulled back, some jeans, and a t-shirt. If my husband ever threw my hairbands away, and told me that I needed to make myself more presentable, he would not be my husband. Shame on you. She's not your trophy.
Sorry, but after reading that part, I couldn't even make it to the end.
THIS!
Do you think you throwing away her hair ties has pushed her into believing she's only "pretty" when she's wearing make up, or done up for you? Or maybe she's feeling uncomfortable and pushed into intimacy?
Eating healthy, and working out aren't the only thing that makes someone feel good about themselves. Be patient. Give her support. Listen. Do not give your opinion unless she asks for it. Do not make statements about how her actions make you feel bad, or less attracted to her. Ask her what you can do to help her feel supported, and safe.0 -
You're welcome:flowerforyou: We've bend married 7 years but have been friends for nearly 20. Just be her friend is my best advice.0
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If you can't be bothered to read the whole post, why bother to respond?0
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I feel like some people didn't get the point of this post. Jealous maybe.
You sound like a great husband and if you keep on telling her she's pretty, even if she doesn't believe you, and do little things that show her you mean what you say it will go a long way. Perhaps explain to her why your concern about her under dressing (although do realize that sometimes we just don't feel like putting in the effort) and make sure that she gets as much encouragement as possible in whatever it is she is dealing with.0 -
Self-esteem is about a lot more than just how she looks but seems to manifest in appearance for women. One of the best definitions I heard about self-confidence is that a person with good self-confidence believes they can take on anything life throws at them. That they are capable and know it.
Your wife is young. You are relatively newly married. She is probably adjusting to finishing school or is early in her career. These are all huge things that can prey on a woman's self-confidence. Maybe she wont' be able to be the wife you need. Maybe she won't be successful in life. Maybe, maybe, maybe....
Pretty soon that lack of confidence creeps into every part of your life. Work on her confidence overall. Some people (not even just men) are fixers. You love her so much you want to fix her problems. The issue with that is she then believes she isn't capable of fixing them herself. Let her try - and likely succeed. She will feel capable and confident about every part of her life.
Maybe she'll need some additional help. Maybe this is something she can do with just your support or the support of friends/family. Whatever way it happens - it is totally normal. It is only a problem when it gets in the way of her living her life.0 -
Sorry to inform you; however your wife doesn't need your expectations to be a "trophy" or "perfect" looking wife all the time. Perhaps she is suffering and experiencing doubt due to your expectations? Did you ever consider that you convey to her that she is expected to look 100% all the time and when she doesn't she sees it in your eyes? Men comb their hair and put on their clothes to go somewhere, but women have five times that to get to the Barbi doll look men love. It gets old and it is WAY TO MUCH to expect from your wife every day.0
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Pretty soon that lack of confidence creeps into every part of your life. Work on her confidence overall. Some people (not even just men) are fixers. You love her so much you want to fix her problems. The issue with that is she then believes she isn't capable of fixing them herself. Let her try - and likely succeed. She will feel capable and confident about every part of her life.
I like what you said, I agree that I probably take on the fixer role more than I should. I have got plenty of my own problems to be trying to fix hers all the time lol.0 -
I haven't read the whole thing but I think you have some insight there. Every time my husband sends out a text to me or anyone else, at the bottom it says 'My Wife is Beautiful'. I don't know how long he has had that but I am starting to believe it. It is really hard for me to believe it. I would think that he is just trying to convince me that he believes it. And, yes, my confidence is increasing with how I feel about myself. (My weight loss has had a lot to do with how I feel about myself)
Don't have time now. Will finish reading it later.0 -
You can't change her mind. The only person who will be able to fix it is herself. Which is hard, changing the mind is a complex thing. But by changing behavior, it changes the mind.0
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Hmm, my husband loves that I don't dress up because it says that I don't base my self worth on societal norms and gender stereotypes. That's not to say that I never have my insecure moments, but I am comfortable in our relationship and I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that my spouse finds me hot! So, pretty much the opposite of what you said when it comes to dressing down.
And about taking compliments, that's actually really hard for a lot of women to do. Females are taught from a very early age that they must be humble and self-deprecating. There have been quite a few studies and articles written about this. It will certainly take some time to reverse that gender norm....if ever.0 -
Why don't you just have your wife read your post and listen to what she has to say....0
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I'm a woman who feels more comfortable with my hair pulled back, some jeans, and a t-shirt. If my husband ever threw my hairbands away, and told me that I needed to make myself more presentable, he would not be my husband. Shame on you. She's not your trophy.
Sorry, but after reading that part, I couldn't even make it to the end.
Haha, we think alike!0 -
First off, you are awesome. I have great respect for any man who steps up and put thought and effort into why his wife may or may not be feeling a certain way about herself.
Is it possible your wife is suffering from some mild depression? Honestly I remember 22 being a rough age. Newly married, money is tight, still figuring out career stuff, thinking about starting a family, wondering if you can or ever will have the house you really want......it can be more overwhelming for some people than others. She's been married since she was 19-that is pretty young. She could very well be going through some personal issues-not marriage issues just inner self stuff. Does she have some sisters she could talk to or is she close to her mom? Maybe even a doc. There are some great meds on the market. Overthinking at age 22 is very common among women. It can manifest as sadness, depression, or the other spectrum...binge drinking, other things like that. I don't know your "situation" but hopefully this helps.
Really?? Not wanting to dress up means someone should be on meds?
I've been a tomboy my whole life and was more comfortable in pony tails and t-shirts. When I was going out I'd dress up but if I didn't have to I wasn't going to. My self esteem was just fine, I was happy with how I looked either way. My husband and any exes knew that about me from the start and liked that about me. If anything, the OP is probably bringing down her confidence.0 -
Thank you, for posting this. I don't know what the sacred importance to hairbands is about (maybe because I hacked all my hair off!) so I actually read the entire post.
First off, she could just really really REALLY like baggy shirts and sweats because they are convenient! That aside...
You seem to be genuinely concerned about your wife. I don't know what the entire journey has been like for you two, but it seems like she can't see herself beyond whatever started transformation. I think a lot of her rejection to your compliments and support is partially because of that. If she can't see her own beauty without all the fancy get-ups and makeup, then what you say can seem false whether she's dressed up or not. Have you tried sitting down with her to explain how her denial acutally hurts YOU? Maybe, if she sees that you really do support her sincerely, she will be able to start accepting your praise.
A less direct approach might be to find a photo (or ask to take one) of her when she has put the extra effort in. Not evening gown and movie makeup, mind you. Something like Sunday-morning-brunch. Get it sized up. Put it on the wall in the livingroom. Tell her you want it for your office desk. Let her know how much that look means to you. It might not help too much with the self esteem issue, but if she gets enough feedback about looking nicer, she might not turn immediately for her comfort clothes.
Finally...just keep showing her you love her. That will be that absolute best thing you can do for her.0 -
I see what you are saying. Thanks to you I think I might go a little lighter on my fiancé the next time he compliments me.
You just got to keep it up. You sound like you are doing an amazing job as a husband. There are not enough men like you and my fiancé in the world. You made a mistake with the hairbands though, I gotta say it. Even though your intention was to make her see your way, she probably is just holding a grudge now for it.
My fiancé said to me at one point that anything over 190 was TOO BIG for him. WTF who the hell is he. He met me at 215 pounds so he could kiss my butt. So I lied to him and told him I was 185. Well guess what I wasn't I was 215! HA in his face.
=] He couldn't even tell the difference.
Maybe just maybe you could let her give her input on your image a little. The way you cut your hair, your facial hair, even the underwear you wear. I LOVE anytime my fiancé asks for my input. I have SO MUCH that I have to worry about with my image as a woman, and I feel like men have it easy compared to us. So when he shows me some vulnerability about his image I like it.
I want to say here that I have NO self confidence. I ask my fiancé constantly "am I as big as her" or "do I look like her" I know I drive him crazy but I have image issues.
Sometimes my fiancé does things like this, and it helps to lessen the blow to my heart. "I love these pants your wearing, they make your *kitten* look so good, but my favorite pair of pants are the blah blah blah ones because they make everything look amazing."
I am pretty outspoken as well so if he says something about my feet not being done or something I tell him to kiss my butt LoL Then I will tell him that his feet look like Fred Flinstone LOL. He gets the message.0 -
well, i see that some young ladies totally missed your point and are making drama-inspired comments about you being 'controlling' or some such nonsense. i'm old enough to be your mother so i'm going to dispense with the drama.
i think you are a prize. because you think SHE is a treasure.
but she can't see herself through your eyes.
and this is a VERY common problem. you cannot change this, or help her understand, any time soon. it is going to take years. maybe a couple of decades.
i went through it too. after being married to an incredible man for more than 20 years, i read something and it clicked. i can't tell you what i read, or where i read it. but here's what happened:
when my husband told me i was beautiful, i decided to believe him, because I WANTED HIM TO BE RIGHT.
currently she wants the drama/attention more than she wants you to be right.
and i bet you keep having the same conversation over and over. that needs to change. if she wants drama, give her some, but not the same drama you've been giving her. when you give her a compliment, and she blows it off, you can tell her that it hurts you when she dismisses you and makes you feel like your opinion is unimportant. in other words, you need to talk like a female because you are dealing with a female.
if she needs more drama, wait until she gives you a compliment, and then disagree with her and tell her she is cruel for making fun of you.
if that approach is not your style, you could tell her that it makes you hopping mad to hear someone badmouth the woman you love.
also you might just listen to her rant and then ask her to say something positive about herself. one negative comment costs one positive comment.
in any case she needs to stop this crap before you have children or it will affect them.
sir, i have no patience with drama. it comes from having had two teenage daughters at the same time. (they are both grown now.) thanks for listening to me spout off!
but please don't stop giving her compliments. that would be a bad thing for all parties concerned. and perhaps you could say more things like, 'i love being with you', or, 'i love your generous heart', or something like that, rather than complimenting her appearance. that might help. or you could tweak it a little. change 'i think your hair is nice', to, 'your hair is beautiful, in my opinion.' and she can't argue, because it's an opinion. she can disagree, but not argue. what can she say? 'no, you don't think that?' if she does, see above paragraph about blowing you off. which, by the way, is incredibly disrespectful. how about, 'your hair feels so good when i run my fingers through it.' that's an attention grabber!
good luck and God bless. it's going to be a long road.0 -
I would rather my wife be 10 lbs heavier and feel sexy, than 10lbs lighter and feel pathetic. She is so much more attractive when she acts like she is worth something, than almost anything else she can do. Thats not to say I want her to gain 50lbs, because I dont, but I do want her to feel good about herself.
I get that this is a weight loss site and stuff, but that doesn't negate the fact that you're sort of contradicting yourself here. You want her to feel good about herself, but with certain stipulations? 10 pounds is cool but not 50? Again, I get that this is MFP and I get that maybe she wouldn't feel more confident if she gained 50 pounds. The point: It's obvious you do care about how she looks in addition to how she feels. It could be possible that this kind of attitude is (maybe even subconsciously) trickling into your daily lives and the comments you make? Especially with the throwing away of the hair ties and stuff like that. Body policing (in any shape or form – whether it's "positive" or not) has the potential to perpetuate feelings of low self-esteem and the works. I'd try to be positive about her/her body/personality/self worth without ACTIVELY trying to change her. Does that make sense?0 -
I don't believe she wants drama. I think that is wrong. I think she truly doesn't believe she is pretty enough, thin enough, or whatever. I don't want drama when I don't believe my fiancé I just don't believe him.
My fiancé doesn't ever give me drama back. He says you look great and I say no I don't and he is like I THINK you do and that's what matters. That usually snaps me out of it. He will even point out what he loves and gives me some smooches. I still don't believe him but I love him for putting in the effort.0 -
Wow... reading your post was de ja vu for me. My husband said that because I was so uncomfortable about how I looked ( I'd gained weight) that he started to be unattracted to me. That was a year ago and I'm sad to say even though I heard him out and have been making real progress with how I see myself (going to therapy, working on my weight and appearance) I fear it might be too late. Originally I wanted to change for him, but now I'm doing it for me. He doesnt compliment me much anymore and that hurts sometimes, but I've come so far I don't want to throw away my hard work. I love the suggestion the one girl made about leaving notes and being supportive. Be honest with her and be as patient as you can be and I bet you'll slowly see a change. You sound like a good guy that is just confused. I wish my husband would of told me how he felt before it was too late. Please be patient with her and know that if given the choice she would love to be able to see herself the way you do! Good luck. Keep us posted.0
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Yes, self esteem is pretty much the sexiest thing a woman (or man) can possess.So how can this be fixed? Well, I am happy to say that this is open discussion thus helpful hints would be appreciated. What I can say is that things are getting better as far as my wife's self confidence. She's making an increased effort to get ready, workout, and maintain a healthy lifestyle. I think in doing these things, she has learned that she is worth a great deal more than she thought. Thanks for reading, feel free to respond.
"She has made an increased effort to [do the things I think she should]. I think in doing these things, she has learned..." Man, that is just... really uncomfortable for me to read.
I dunno. I wish you and your wife luck.0 -
My fiancé said to me at one point that anything over 190 was TOO BIG for him. WTF who the hell is he. He met me at 215 pounds so he could kiss my butt. So I lied to him and told him I was 185. Well guess what I wasn't I was 215! HA in his face.
=] He couldn't even tell the difference.
ha,ha! that's great! the last time i was on a diet i lost 30 pounds, and so did my boss. she told me that her husband hadn't even noticed. mine hadn't either. but i said he also didn't notice when i gained it!0
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