Fat loss first or Muscle gain first?

This is one thing I am really confused about, even after reading A LOT of the posts on this forum. I am concerned that I am losing LBM while I lose fat - I haven't done much strength training in the past three weeks, have just been focusing on my diet and getting some cardio in - but I want to start lifting, because I've only heard good things. Here's what I am confused about:

In order to lose fat you must retain a calorie deficit and you absolutely cannot build muscle if you are at a deficit and yet people here are all saying lift heavy and it changes your body comp and you burn fat way fast etc. But how can you lift heavy (and heavier and heavier as the programs require) if you can't build muscle?? And even doing basic things like 30 Day Shred or body weight exercises aren't going to be enough to retain LBM?? I just don't get it.

This is an excellent question.

Look at the amount of muscle you have as your strength 'potential'...not how strong you are. What you're actually doing when strength training on a calorie deficit, is training your BRAIN to more effectively use that muscle. It does this by (loosely put) growing little nervous pathways throughout your muscles in order to help it 'contract' them by using more of the muscle more effectively. It's called 'neuromuscular adaptation'. Most people only use a VERY small percentage of the potential strength they have in their existing muscle.

Now for the second part. What causes your body to retain lean mass while lifting heavy and eating at a deficit, is hormonal response. Again...loosely put, by lifting weight, you're telling your body you NEED those muscles, it responds by sending out hormones that tell your body to burn fat for fuel because the muscle you have is necessary. Remember what I said about neuromuscular adaptation...and think about the fact that it doesn't actually take much strength to perform those cardio based workouts, but it takes a CRAPLOAD of endurance. Strength and endurance are not the same, and your body doesn't respond to those signals the same.

I hope this helps!

Strength train and keep eating a deficit. You are overweight so you can definitely build some muscle while losing.

But, for all that is good and holy, and for your own benefit, start strength training.

She is absolutely not going to build any measurable amount of muscle, no matter how overweight she is. She doesn't have the testosterone for it even if it were possible otherwise. Even slightly measurable newbie gains are really only going to happen in men on a really good lifting program, and usually only for the first month or so.

But you're right, she absolutely SHOULD start strength training!

Yes, but so are push-ups, and other exercises that use your own body weight for resistance.

The bottom line is, if you are losing weight, you are going to lose fat and muscle - there's no way around it. As you become smaller, your body will not require as much muscle for normal every day movement. However, exercise will minimize this, and help keep you strong.

Obese newbie gains are best newbie gains. Eat at a deficit, start a strength based program (SS, SL, 5/3/1, etc.) and do it for about six months. Then switch to a hypertrophy program like DC, HST, PHAT, etc.

So right now I weigh 260 and have about 60 pounds til I get to my goal weight. I wanted to try doing the 30 day shred, because I have seen amazing transformations, but should I wait to lose more weight first?

There's no reason that you can't attempt to do this program while trying to lose weight.

I know it builds loads of muscles, but I have heard that you are supposed to lose weight first!

Actually the only thing that builds loads of muscle is a combination of the following.

1) A calorie surplus
2) Steroids
3) Heavy weight training.


30-day shred will help you burn calories and initially it may help you retain LBM but it will not build loads of muscle.

thanks your reply helped alot, i was looking for the answer to this one too

Okay one more question. Is strength training the same thing as weight lifting? I lift heavy 3-5 days a week.

basically yes

this is false.. I can do strength training without weight lifting for example. (pistol squats for 5 reps max) I can also weight lift and not do strength training. (15 rep squats)

Strength training is clearly defined. atp-cp energy system powering type II muscle fibres in maximal load movements.

Clearly defined by whom?

Did you note that the OP is lifting heavy, and my use of the word "basically" because I considered this context?

Ah I see, I thought it made you build a good amount of muscle because when I saw before and after pictures of people, they looked really toned and muscular compared to their before pictures! I think I would like to start the 30 day shred soon, I hope I am able to lose a good amount of weight with it >.<

That's because their bf% dropped. Most of what your probably seeing is the muscle they already had, it's just not covered by as much fat.

You already have muscle, as long as you maintain it by lifting heavy and eating adequate protein on your way down you'll start to see definition and "tone" as the fat comes off. Definitely look into a lifting program and don't be afraid of heavy weights, they'll make you slimmer, not larger. Good luck!

I wasn't really afraid of gaining too much muscle, what I was afraid of, so I have heard, if you gain too much muscle before you lose weight, you won't lose as much weight! So that's why I was asking if I should lose weight first and then go into heavy lifting.

As thecakelocker said, you will see a FAR greater difference in your body by strength training and eating on a calorie deficit than by doing cardio and eating on a calorie deficit. Ignore the scale, it's only good for very loosely tracking trends.

Believe me, find those groups I mentioned, ask your question in there. You will be flooded with women who did cardio for years to lose fat and became very, very discouraged with their results (one woman was told by her trainer, after years of paying him...that the spare tire around her midsection and thighs was simply her 'bodytype', and that no amount of work would help her lose it so she should just get used to it). Yet in two to three months of strength training, many of them not only surpassed their appearance goals that they'd had initially, but they're stronger than they'd ever imagined.

This but I'd also say the post before makes no sense at all. Muscle does not keep you from losing weight. At all. I have no idea how you came up with that. The biggest complaint I hear about weight lifters who aren't losing weight are the ones that hardly exercise and aren't eating at much of a deficit, are eating to much, haven't exercised before so they don't know about weight fluctuations...and those complaints usually start off with "I've lost this many inches and not very much weight sad face", which I wouldn't consider a complaint.

Also, I'm one of the did cardio forever girls. Lifting, I'm telling you as a cardio bunny, it works better if your goal is to look slimmer and feel firmer.