Stop treating food like the boogie monster...

I raise my wine to you lol.

Food= yum
though I do use some lower cal options if it doesn't affect the overall flavor of the meal

If you look at my diary you will continuously see low-fat milk. These low-fat etc options aren't bad by any means and if you can get flavor with less calories... well... that means more food for you to eat!

What makes me angry is when folks go on about regular yummy foods!

I don't understand what you are saying. first you say that people go on about fat free, low cal, gluten free, etc and say that they should learn to eat regular food in limited portions. then you say that you use low fat milk. Then you say that people go on about regular yummy foods. Which side of the fence are you sitting on?

I agree with you, Taunto.

I eat a largely "paleo" diet, as I'm a mess of allergies and dealing with insulin resistance. However, I really dislike the good food/bad food way of thinking and the creepy groupthink that goes on when a bunch of paleo enthusiasts get together and start talking shop. The paleo group here on MFP makes me want to stab people on a regular basis, for instance.

There is a lot of moralistic weirdness that happens with respect to diet--not just from the paleo people, but all the "clean" eaters and vegan/vegetarians are guilty of this bizarre behaviour as well. What you eat doesn't make you morally superior, more pure, more enlightened or better than anyone else in any way. Yes, everyone likes to think their way is best. Before I was eating paleo, I was a vegetarian and even a vegan for about 20 years, so I've seen it all, haha. My wish is that everyone would just STFU about whatever they eat or don't eat and stop trying to use their diet as a cane to beat others with, or as a device to judge others by.

I wish that someone who is genuinely interested in why another person eats a certain way, and considering whether or not it might be helpful for them to do so was instead offered a book or two as suggestions, so the inquiring person could read and do their own critical thinking about the info presented. I don't feel it's appropriate to jump up on your soapbox and rant about how much better, healthier, smarter you are because you don't eat X. Let people think for themselves, let them be their own N=1 experiment, and come to their own conclusions about whatever info is out there.

Good post. :flowerforyou: :drinker:

I agree! Food is good for you, generally speaking, and necessary. And lack of calories aren't a measure of goodness.

I also agree that portion control is key, but it's not easy with the kind of treat foods that you mention. Buying a cream cake and having half of it or quarter of it and throwing the rest away? Difficult. I have done that sort of thing, but what I've found is that PART of the appeal of some of those treat foods IS the portion size! I seem to get a sense of well-being from slightly overeating delicious, rich food. Maybe it's my imagination, but I really don't seem to get the same feeling from a small portion of the same food. I have to admit that I have, very occasionally, eaten until I feel properly satisfied, and that I intend to continue to do that very occasionally. A day off from portion control .

90% of the food sold in supermarkets these days did not exist 100 years ago. Mock me if you must!

That's a wild claim....where on Earth did you uncover that gem of a statistic? I hope you invented that one yourself and it's not something you actually read somewhere. Virtually every single food item I buy at the supermarket existed 100 years ago. :laugh:

I raise my wine to you lol.

Food= yum
though I do use some lower cal options if it doesn't affect the overall flavor of the meal

If you look at my diary you will continuously see low-fat milk. These low-fat etc options aren't bad by any means and if you can get flavor with less calories... well... that means more food for you to eat!

What makes me angry is when folks go on about regular yummy foods!

I don't understand what you are saying. first you say that people go on about fat free, low cal, gluten free, etc and say that they should learn to eat regular food in limited portions. then you say that you use low fat milk. Then you say that people go on about regular yummy foods. Which side of the fence are you sitting on?

I am sitting on the side where people don't scream "OMG you're going to get fat by eating a steak" or that "if you wanna be skinny, you better not use any oil, carbs meats or anything". From the place I sit, I get to eat a huge cheesecake slice and still lose weight because I was eating under my TDEE

I like this side of the fence!

One of the saddest phrases I see on this site is "do not reward yourself with food, you are not a dog".

I'm sorry but I like food - one of the great pleasures in life is good food cooked or prepared well and enjoyed in the company of friends and family. Not to mention fine wine!!

Unfortuately I have to balance those pleasures by exercising some restraint at other times. That's a price well worth paying.

YES,, here is my reasoning also. I am a man, it has been said that all men are Dogs, therefore I can reward myself with food.

There is a lot of moralistic weirdness that happens with respect to diet--not just from the paleo people, but all the "clean" eaters and vegan/vegetarians are guilty of this bizarre behaviour as well. What you eat doesn't make you morally superior, more pure, more enlightened or better than anyone else in any way. Yes, everyone likes to think their way is best. Before I was eating paleo, I was a vegetarian and even a vegan for about 20 years, so I've seen it all, haha. My wish is that everyone would just STFU about whatever they eat or don't eat and stop trying to use their diet as a cane to beat others with, or as a device to judge others by.

This is pretty much where I am at. I am gluten free, I don't eat foods with added sweeteners, etc. etc. I don't do those things because I feel better when I don't. When I got sober I gained 65 pounds in six months because I suddenly had a bingeing disorder. Like the other poster who is a recovering alcoholic, I learned that alcohol is basically sugar on steroids, and when I stopped drinking booze, SUGAR became the object of my obsession. Today I live comfortably because I stay away from sugar -- and booze hah hah. No big deal, and I'm not asking anyone else to make that choice, I just want my choice to be honored.

Oh but anyways, that was all about me and not about the topic. People can eat any damn food they want to. They can lose, gain, or maintain on any food they want to. They're adults and can make CHOICES for themselves because they have the God-given right to freedom. We need to live and let live. The food nazi stuff on these forums is despicable. That was mostly what I saw when I first came to the forums and it still leaves a bad taste in my mouth (pun intended!).

Like you Taunto I am learning how to fit in the steak and loaded baked potato (hey, I had that two weeks ago and did fine!), the bacon cheeseburger, the omelette & homefries. Food should be enjoyed and we shouldn't get nuts about it. And we should butt out of each other's business when it comes to our food choices

High fructose corn syrup and food loaded with sugar is as addictive as any drug. Your body will literally go into withdrawals once you cut it out because it's addicted. Your body can't process artificial sweeteners and preservatives so while you may lose the weight, you're internal organs are still pumping away as though you weighed a lot more than you actually do. If you aren't eating real food and are going for the processed "delicious" food, you are literally starving yourself and making yourself fat at the same time. If you wanna indulge, go for real sugar and whole foods like whole milk. NEVER eat fat free, sugar free or "light" ANYTHING. It's either the real deal or nothing, and even that is probably not doing you any favors because it has a bunch of unnatural BS in it that your body literally has no use for and can't process.

To each person their own. Eat what you want and look how you want, but don't be shocked when you're within a normal BMI on paper and then have a heart attack you never saw coming from plaque buildup you could've avoided if you had gotten over your sugar addiction. You gotta be smart about it, at least.

Does sugar cause plaque buildup?? Did I miss something?

Bump!

Boogity, Boogity, Boogity, Amen.

I raise my wine to you lol.

I second that.

Nobody is keeping me away from peanut butter, fro yo, wine, tater tots...

or any of the other foods I enjoy. I just watch portion size and try to eat healthier foods more often than less healthy foods.

Some people struggle a lot with eating just a little of some foods-often it results in eating more than they planned to and then they feel bad...moderation is not as easy for some as others...just takes practice. But you're right. Turning food into the bad guy is not helpful for anybody.

High fructose corn syrup and food loaded with sugar is as addictive as any drug. Your body will literally go into withdrawals once you cut it out because it's addicted. Your body can't process artificial sweeteners and preservatives so while you may lose the weight, you're internal organs are still pumping away as though you weighed a lot more than you actually do. If you aren't eating real food and are going for the processed "delicious" food, you are literally starving yourself and making yourself fat at the same time. If you wanna indulge, go for real sugar and whole foods like whole milk. NEVER eat fat free, sugar free or "light" ANYTHING. It's either the real deal or nothing, and even that is probably not doing you any favors because it has a bunch of unnatural BS in it that your body literally has no use for and can't process.

To each person their own. Eat what you want and look how you want, but don't be shocked when you're within a normal BMI on paper and then have a heart attack you never saw coming from plaque buildup you could've avoided if you had gotten over your sugar addiction. You gotta be smart about it, at least.

What is artificial about Corn? sugar is sugar wheather it is corn syrup or cane sugar or beet sugar. and please cite some kind of source for all these claims? is there a study? This kind of stuff is just as bad as the people scared of real food.

I agree. Sugar is sugar. In fact, high fructose corn syrup has about the same percentage of fructose as table sugar has. Metabolically, they're basically identical. So all that stuff about use "natural" beet sugar or "healthier" palm sugar is just marketing.

Food is good. Let's eat it. Totally not saying that I eat tons of sugar though. I just just choose to eat fruit and sweeten things w fruit as diabetes runs in both sides of my family.

I think a perfectly valid reason to eat completely clean is that you can generally eat more food for less calories. While I acknowledge that everyone is definitely not the same when it comes to eating habits (with respect to amount, taste, and frequency), for those who do like to eat frequently throughout the day, it is relatively important to consume low calorie dishes during this time. And although exercising is a wonderful way to add to the number of calories allowed, I don't think it is feasible, in every case, to just keep exercising more to achieve a surplus sufficient enough to eat "normal food", in particular, to not eat clean.

At the same time, I 100% agree that eating in moderation (learning to control portions) is incredibly important (though not essential, I'm sure there are those that make this work). I am a little confused at the part where you start by talking about eating in moderation, but then continue to the seemingly unrelated point that it will be difficult to lose weight by eating super clean. I can see the connection between eating in moderation and in difficulty in losing weight, but why/how does clean eating tie into that?

For your third paragraph, I can't think of anyone who wouldn't agree that losing weight is literally that simple (i.e. eating less, but eating tasty, "normal" foods), but, as constantly demonstrated on these forums, it is very difficult for a large portion of people to employ this technique. Obviously this sort of issue is completely personal; one cannot generalize the difficulty he has in staying on track to another person, so I'm not sure if it is that simple. Of course, if everyone could easily just switch to eating in moderation, then your point would follow immediately. In fact, it would probably be trivial.

We're all here for 1 reason and for most of us that reason is NOT just weight loss. Its FITNESS. Many of us would like to continue living a healthy, fit life for the rest of our lives. That includes eating yummy, delicious, butter, full of salt and/or sugar food.

While I can agree that food should not be feared and it's good to enjoy the food you eat. Whether or not a diet needs to include butter or much salt or sugar is purely personal preference.