Paleo question and recommendations
Replies
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Oh I definitely wouldn't pull important things from the kids meals. AGain, it really is just for myself and my husband. I would love to remove all sugar from my house since my daughter has an addiction to that...of course is skinnier the skinny but she is only 10 so I am afraid of what that sugar will do to her in the future. Just really trying to get more fruits and veggies into their diet since they tend to be picky...more my son then my daughter but you know what I mean.
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I'm just coming off a couple month experiment with primal eating (followed Mark Sisson's book, Primal Blueprint). I came to the conclusion that it's just not a good fit for me, but the experience did teach me about eating healthier. Because of it I've cut way back on eating out, totally cut out diet soda and other artificial sweeteners and I've cut back on processed foods. Op-I'd definitely say go for it and see how it works for you, even if you decided that it's not a good fit for long term, it may help you form healthy eating habits
Yes it will be something we try and see how we feel. 0 -
gary taubes is a moron...Surprised no one mentioned (or I missed it?) earlier in the threads the great reviews of the nutrition literature written by Gary Taubes. http://garytaubes.com/
Supports some of what the paleo crowd says, from a macronutrient stand point. Regardless of your feelings about Paleo diet---he is an outstanding science writer.
he reviews the scientific literature very well. Everything is referenced and if you were interested in seeing for yourself the actual studies, you can plug them into Pubmed. the truly fascinating result to me was the Women's Health Initiative. The diet prescribed did not help prevent invasive breast cancer, reduce colon cancer or anything it set out to do.
in 2007 this was done (it was too late to be in the book) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17635889
ok I digress---this is cancer stuff.
But you get the idea that 'conventional' diet wisdom should probably not be swallowed whole and without questioning.
Really, if you want to check out the data yourself about conventional diets, do pubmed searches and check out the science. It is shocking how basically untested ideas were passed off by our 'experts' as gospel, and there is little revision with updated information. The mistake is not so bad and the inability of people wedded to their ego driven ideas to change them when presented new evidence.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12679447
he believes that laws of thermodynamics do not apply to us0 -
I wondered why my asthma wasnt as bad (its sports induced so not that bad to begin with) and lack of 'carbs' per say hasnt influenced my cardio in the slighest.
Give it a go ! Then you will know
I do not miss bread/pasta/rice in the slighest.0 -
Please join the Paleo and Primal forums. People who choose a lifestyle based on minimally processed foods continually come under attack in the general forums, as seen here.
However, I do not consider Paleo or Primal as a "diet", it's a way of eating that should be permanent. It's unfortunate that the labels get so many people bent out of shape, but the premise is just to eat biologically appropriate, unprocessed foods from the best ingredients. Yup, that easy.
Edit: when a well respected investigative science journalist researches something that challenges his established beliefs and is able to reassess his beliefs (unlike most people) instead of disregarding the information outright, he is hardly a "moron". (Careful with pointing that finger because there's four more pointing back at you!)0 -
I have no issue with paleo or primal as a healthy way of eating as long as you don't severely limit your healthy carbs such as fruit, veggies and good for you starches. Carbs are the preferred fuel source, especially if you workout.
The problems with the forums is the cultish behavior.
I'd be really careful in drastically reducing carbs for too long at a stretch. Primarily as a woman. Know how this can damage your thyroid. You will hear to eat less than 50 grams of carbs a day, fine short term for a few weeks but not longer.
I don't eat wheat but I eat sweet and white potatoes and since incorporating 4-6 fruits a day, have never ever felt better.
I tis all about navigating around the cult, much like here.0 -
Paleo is overall a very healthy way to go if you can actually stick with it and do it. I eat a lot more nutrient dense whole foods now than I ever did, but I'm not going to fool myself into believing I could do anything as remotely restrictive as Paleo; I'd be doomed to fail.
Also, the people who truly have success with Paleo...sustained weight loss, etc make it a lifestyle, not something they just start and stop at some arbitrary point or goal weight. This is true for pretty much any type of diet you choose...it needs to be sustainable for you long term. When I maintain I don't eat any differently than I do when I'm losing...I just eat less. My personal dietary lifestyle is Mediterranean inspired and includes a lot more whole foods than I used to eat, but I'm not breaking the rules if I have some beans or a potato or some milk or something.0 -
This is an interesting read.....
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/its-a-part-of-my-paleo-fantasy-its-a-part-of-my-paleo-dream/#more-253550 -
Oh boy, let's get in the thermo argument---or not.
First of all, Taubes does not claim this---if so please please please prove this---give me the quotes from his writing to prove this. Secondly, based on your 'awesome' arguments (in addition to calling Gary Taubes a moron) earlier in this thread it is not worth my time to argue with you. http://xkcd.com/386/0 -
No science to back up this way of eating........not sure why you would do it....
http://www.nsca.com/uploadedFiles/NSCA/Inactive_Content/Program_Books/PTC_2013_Program_Book/Aragon.pdf
Love ignorance...
You want science, read Robb Wolffs book the Paloe Diet if you want the science. He is a microbiologist....
go back to school and quote me studies, articles, and clinical references. You side like every other brainwashed person on this forum that can only talk about books.
"He is a microbiologist, he knows what he is talking about" LOL
and when you do get evidence, you call the messenger a moron. nice.0 -
First of all, Taubes does not claim this---if so please please please prove this---give me the quotes from his writing to prove this.
It is not worth my time to argue with you.\
LOL?
please go0 -
Oh I definitely wouldn't pull important things from the kids meals. AGain, it really is just for myself and my husband. I would love to remove all sugar from my house since my daughter has an addiction to that...of course is skinnier the skinny but she is only 10 so I am afraid of what that sugar will do to her in the future. Just really trying to get more fruits and veggies into their diet since they tend to be picky...more my son then my daughter but you know what I mean.
I'll say this my Mom pulled all sugar from the house when I was about 3. We could never eat any candy not even Christmas or Halloween.
Well, when I became a teen and started having my own money. I began buying tons of sugar because it was a forbidden secret taboo food. It was above all other food so special it had to be hidden. I would buy sodas at school and only eat candy at lunch. I was a rebellious teen and I did the one thing my Mom could not control...EAT!
Along with a variety of other reasons, but I believe that is one of the reasons I went for a skinny child to an obese teen. Something to think about.
We want to educated or children that there is no good or bad food. It's just food some nourishes better than others but if you eat candy so be it. It's not wrong it's always there nothing to hoard and hide, and keep doing a great job being the Momma you are and teaching her about choices and variety.0 -
there are many dr's who have written on the subject and there are LOTS of people have GREAT success with this.I will listen to Alan Aragon about it....I dont see any science on www.whole9life.com only someone trying to sell you a book.
What's wrong with eating healthy and whole foods not laden with chemicals as well as food that destroys your body in the long run.
It has cured my digestive issues,stopped my eczema,taken away insomnia,stopped ALL of my cravings for sugar.It's been the best thing that has ever happened to me as well as lots of others.
marksdailyapple.com
robbwolf.com
chriskresser.com
http://thepaleodiet.com (Dr Loren Cordain PHD)
As for the whole30 program,this is not a ploy to buy a book,all the information is provided for free as it is with all of these sites.Books are just something extra if you want more information.
These are only a few sites but contain lots of good information and the science behind it.0 -
OP:
I suggest looking at a website called "Mark's Daily Apple." I also highly recommend Mark Sisson's books. These are good places to start to answer any questions you may have about why do it, the theories and science behind it, etc. I also suggest going to YouTube and watching a video called "Mind Your Mitochondria," which is a scientist's testimonial about curing herself from MS. She doesn't come out and say "follow a paleo diet," but her recommendations and approach fit, and it's an interesting look at how foods affect you.0 -
There is nothing wrong with it. It is the cultist action and the fact that taubes blames everything on sugar, and in his WWGF he said thermodynamics do not apply to biological organisms
there are many dr's who have written on the subject and there are LOTS of people have GREAT success with this.I will listen to Alan Aragon about it....I dont see any science on www.whole9life.com only someone trying to sell you a book.
What's wrong with eating healthy and whole foods not laden with chemicals as well as food that destroys your body in the long run.
It has cured my digestive issues,stopped my eczema,taken away insomnia,stopped ALL of my cravings for sugar.It's been the best thing that has ever happened to me as well as lots of others.
marksdailyapple.com
robbwolf.com
chriskresser.com
http://thepaleodiet.com (Dr Loren Cordain PHD)
As for the whole30 program,this is not a ploy to buy a book,all the information is provided for free as it is with all of these sites.Books are just something extra if you want more information.
These are only a few sites but contain lots of good information and the science behind it.0 -
First of all, Taubes does not claim this---if so please please please prove this---give me the quotes from his writing to prove this.
It is not worth my time to argue with you.\
LOL?
please go
You make a claim. You don't back it up. You can spout off whatever they want, but when you don't back it up and and instead turn to insulting the person (me) asking for the supporting evidence, what do you think you've demonstrated? Presumably you have an opinion on what constitutes a health diet, and this forum is meant to allow people to discuss these things. How are your contributions affecting the tone of this message board? Do you really feel you are adding positive value?
So again I will ask, where do you see that Gary Taubes has said the laws of thermodynamics do not apply to human beings? From my reading he says people are misusing the first law to make an over simplified view of calorie consumption--which is not taking into account how all the calories get used, ie more than just BMR + exercise.0 -
No science to back up this way of eating........not sure why you would do it....
http://www.nsca.com/uploadedFiles/NSCA/Inactive_Content/Program_Books/PTC_2013_Program_Book/Aragon.pdf
Love ignorance...
You want science, read Robb Wolffs book the Paloe Diet if you want the science. He is a microbiologist....
go back to school and quote me studies, articles, and clinical references. You side like every other brainwashed person on this forum that can only talk about books.
"He is a microbiologist, he knows what he is talking about" LOL
and when you do get evidence, you call the messenger a moron. nice.
I'm happy for you, and I'mma let you finish.
I know microbiologists, and they are not qualified to talk about nutrition.0 -
i only read the 1st page of replies.
here is my 2 cents.
www.thesmarterscienceofslim.com has a free podcast that I recommend listening too, will give you loads of research broken down into digestible chunks.
I also recommend reading wheat belly and understand how much wheat has changed in history.
www.marksdailyapple.com is also another fantastic website with loads of resources as www.nerdfitness.com
I follow a sane/paleo/primal lifestyle and it works for me.
I'm not celiac but in saying that on the weekend I had way too much gluten and ended up with a wheat belly for 3 days. Eating 100% paleo the next 2 days and no more wheat belly.
good luck either way.0 -
Some paleo people eat tubers and such. I think the concern (granted the all or nothing black and white view of it makes me balk) is that flooding your system with starch -> glucose --> insulin spikes. then the liver makes TGs and this affects LDL particles and all that.
ancestral diets are really interesting. Compare the Maasai to the Sioux. Does anyone know if there has been a book ever written that just lists ancestral diets from around the world? Like hungary planet or What we eat?
I dont see all the out cry to a normal post prandial response in a healthy individual?
However, that would be a very interesting book. I would definitely read it. It would show how adaptable humans are you can go from the mainly meat diet of the inuits to the starch rich diet of the pacific islanders.0 -
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I think it would be interesting to see a survey of diets for that reason---humans really can survive on many diets. And thrive on quite a few too.0
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First of all, Taubes does not claim this---if so please please please prove this---give me the quotes from his writing to prove this.
It is not worth my time to argue with you.\
LOL?
please go
You make a claim. You don't back it up. You can spout off whatever they want, but when you don't back it up and and instead turn to insulting the person (me) asking for the supporting evidence, what do you think you've demonstrated? Presumably you have an opinion on what constitutes a health diet, and this forum is meant to allow people to discuss these things. How are your contributions affecting the tone of this message board? Do you really feel you are adding positive value?
So again I will ask, where do you see that Gary Taubes has said the laws of thermodynamics do not apply to human beings? From my reading he says people are misusing the first law to make an over simplified view of calorie consumption--which is not taking into account how all the calories get used, ie more than just BMR + exercise.
you already said you wouldnt argue with me. so why would I even post evidence?0 -
First of all, Taubes does not claim this---if so please please please prove this---give me the quotes from his writing to prove this.
It is not worth my time to argue with you.\
LOL?
please go
You make a claim. You don't back it up. You can spout off whatever they want, but when you don't back it up and and instead turn to insulting the person (me) asking for the supporting evidence, what do you think you've demonstrated? Presumably you have an opinion on what constitutes a health diet, and this forum is meant to allow people to discuss these things. How are your contributions affecting the tone of this message board? Do you really feel you are adding positive value?
So again I will ask, where do you see that Gary Taubes has said the laws of thermodynamics do not apply to human beings? From my reading he says people are misusing the first law to make an over simplified view of calorie consumption--which is not taking into account how all the calories get used, ie more than just BMR + exercise.
look at his WWGF book.
[/quote
I have read Taubes' books. He does not say we are not subject to the laws of thermodynamics. On which page did you read this?0 -
Oh I definitely wouldn't pull important things from the kids meals. AGain, it really is just for myself and my husband. I would love to remove all sugar from my house since my daughter has an addiction to that...of course is skinnier the skinny but she is only 10 so I am afraid of what that sugar will do to her in the future. Just really trying to get more fruits and veggies into their diet since they tend to be picky...more my son then my daughter but you know what I mean.
Without reading the rest of the posts (esp the Paleo bashers) - I am currently doing a 6 week strict paleo challenge and yes, it's a little harder because you need to plan for - esp the snacks as bread etc is out - in regards to your kids, I would (and do with my son) just add rice/pasta/dairy to their meals because I think he needs it in your diet.
Or you could try Primal which is Paleo with dairy, to ease into it and see how you.
I feel better allready (less bloating) so will continue for the next 5 weeks and see how I go.
Good luck.0 -
mentioned wrong book. thats why I ninja edited it.First of all, Taubes does not claim this---if so please please please prove this---give me the quotes from his writing to prove this.
It is not worth my time to argue with you.\
LOL?
please go
You make a claim. You don't back it up. You can spout off whatever they want, but when you don't back it up and and instead turn to insulting the person (me) asking for the supporting evidence, what do you think you've demonstrated? Presumably you have an opinion on what constitutes a health diet, and this forum is meant to allow people to discuss these things. How are your contributions affecting the tone of this message board? Do you really feel you are adding positive value?
So again I will ask, where do you see that Gary Taubes has said the laws of thermodynamics do not apply to human beings? From my reading he says people are misusing the first law to make an over simplified view of calorie consumption--which is not taking into account how all the calories get used, ie more than just BMR + exercise.
look at his WWGF book.
I have read Taubes' books. He does not say we are not subject to the laws of thermodynamics. On which page did you read this?
In his good calories bad calories he said overweight do not eat more/less calories than lean people do.0 -
I have inflammatory conditions, i.e arthritis, autoimmune spinal condition, and PCOS and insulin resistance. I also am at high risk for Diabetes, which killed my mother last summer.
Since cutting out grains and processed sugars 8 months ago, my pain and inflammation levels have dropped significantly. My energy level is way up, no more extreme fatigue. No psoriasis flare ups. No more crazy mood swings. And I have lost 43 pounds since that time.
I no longer feel like I am 80 yrs old, stiff and hurting in the morning when I wake up. I rarely have to use my cane for walking anymore. I can ride over 5 miles on my trike. And this morning, for the first time in 13 years, I mowed the back yard, with a push mower.
I am not a die-hard Paleoist, but have adapted the plan to what works for me. I would recommend it to anyone who wants to try it, as most people feel so much better. There is nothing in the plan that will harm you.
I still eat cheese, but drink almond milk instead of cows milk, due to the high sugar in dairy milk.
And yes, for me, excess sugar IS the enemy.0 -
I did it for a while - I lost weight initially (and a lot!). But I couldn't give up all the food they wanted me to give up, so I did paleo for 3 months then slowly started adding foods back into my diet.
Paleoplan.com is what I used a lot for recipes... it's free, but you can sign up for a fee and they give you meal plans and such.0 -
mentioned wrong book. thats why I ninja edited it.First of all, Taubes does not claim this---if so please please please prove this---give me the quotes from his writing to prove this.
It is not worth my time to argue with you.\
LOL?
please go
You make a claim. You don't back it up. You can spout off whatever they want, but when you don't back it up and and instead turn to insulting the person (me) asking for the supporting evidence, what do you think you've demonstrated? Presumably you have an opinion on what constitutes a health diet, and this forum is meant to allow people to discuss these things. How are your contributions affecting the tone of this message board? Do you really feel you are adding positive value?
So again I will ask, where do you see that Gary Taubes has said the laws of thermodynamics do not apply to human beings? From my reading he says people are misusing the first law to make an over simplified view of calorie consumption--which is not taking into account how all the calories get used, ie more than just BMR + exercise.
look at his WWGF book.
I have read Taubes' books. He does not say we are not subject to the laws of thermodynamics. On which page did you read this?
In his good calories bad calories he said overweight do not eat more/less calories than lean people do.
I will let Taubes defend himself:
http://www.meandmydiabetes.com/2013/05/20/gary-taubes-explains-thermodynamics-to-jillian-michaels/0 -
I have inflammatory conditions, i.e arthritis, autoimmune spinal condition, and PCOS and insulin resistance. I also am at high risk for Diabetes, which killed my mother last summer.
Since cutting out grains and processed sugars 8 months ago, my pain and inflammation levels have dropped significantly. My energy level is way up, no more extreme fatigue. No psoriasis flare ups. No more crazy mood swings. And I have lost 43 pounds since that time.
I no longer feel like I am 80 yrs old, stiff and hurting in the morning when I wake up. I rarely have to use my cane for walking anymore. I can ride over 5 miles on my trike. And this morning, for the first time in 13 years, I mowed the back yard, with a push mower.
I am not a die-hard Paleoist, but have adapted the plan to what works for me. I would recommend it to anyone who wants to try it, as most people feel so much better. There is nothing in the plan that will harm you.
I still eat cheese, but drink almond milk instead of cows milk, due to the high sugar in dairy milk.
And yes, for me, excess sugar IS the enemy.
Glad to hear you've found a diet that makes you feel better. Do you eat grains? If so, which ones, out of curiosity? I am experimenting with less refined carbs and sugars to see if I feel better. I don't follow a paleo diet---I still like and eat oats, dairy, legumes...0 -
I think that paleo is a great idea if that is what is going to make you happy then go for it. Don't let people get you down. I'm transitioning back to mostly raw vegan. The only non raw things that I'll be eating will be beans, lentils and quinoa and I'll pretty much doing the 80/10/10 when I'm done. Best of luck to you with your new plan.0
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