Child support- what do you think?

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Replies

  • shastacrystal
    shastacrystal Posts: 262
    I TOTALLY agree with this guy!
    :)
    Personal bias admittance: I am a single dad. However, I am not paying child support. I am raising my children. They visit their mom, and I have never sought child support from her.

    The whole child support system is skewed. I know how much money I would have to pay if I did not have custody of my kids, and the amount that actually cost is a small fraction of that. What child support then equates to is ex wife/ex gf/ex mistress/ex whatever support. Because it is way above and beyond what is actually needed to help raise kids, assuming the dad has a decent job.

    I am of the firm belief that if child support were more in line with 1/2 the actual cost of raising kids (two parents, each should pay 1/2 the cost), you would see more people willingly stepping up to take care of it. There is no reason that child support should be based on salary, because the cost of raising the child is not changed by how much dad earns. No guy wants to be saddled paying a ton of money, of which only a fraction is actually needed to raise the kids. The end result is they are supporting a child AND the childs mother. It is immoral to expect a man to financially support a woman for 18+ years because he had a child with her. The child, yes. The woman, no.

    There should be a baseline cost for raising kids, with locality adjustments. When child support is to be paid, the paying parent pays 1/2 that amount. It doesn't matter how much you make, you are equally responsible to support the child. And it should be adjusted to account for visitation. If the dad has the kids 30% of the time, his payment should be reduced to reflect that he is feeding, clothing, and sheltering the child 30% of the time.
  • djeffreys10
    djeffreys10 Posts: 2,312 Member
    I found this just for fun:

    http://www.babycenter.com/cost-of-raising-child-calculator

    But it asks how much you make before it'll tell you how much it costs. :huh: If I'm married and make the maximum my kid is going to cost $300,000 more than if I was single and make the minimum (without college).

    Exactly, it assumes that you are going to provide more than the minimums. And every good parent that can does, to whatever degree they feel is prudent. The problem is when the court decides an arbitrary amount above the minimum, and orders a parent to pay it, which is what they do. They should never make an order above the minimum amount required to meet a kids needs. Anything above the minimum should be at the descretion of the parent paying, just as it is of the two were still together.
  • BusyRaeNOTBusty
    BusyRaeNOTBusty Posts: 7,166 Member
    This is better:

    http://money.cnn.com/2013/08/14/pf/cost-children/

    $241,080 to raise a kid. That comes out to $1,116 a month. That's actually not bad. Oh, except I have 3. Opps.
  • junejadesky
    junejadesky Posts: 524 Member
    Right... I just didn't understand what you were getting at. So basically you think that I am being treated unfairly for having to be required to pay more than 1/2 the cost that they have calculated. And that no state should require more than a 50% contribution from any parent.... right??

    No, you are confusing THE ACTUAL COST TO MEET THE KIDS NEEDS with the amount the court expects that you would pay given your income. The court does not consider the cost to meet the kids needs. The court considers what is likely a much higher amount, which is a percentage of your income they expect you would spend towards the kids. The cost to meet the kids needs has NOTHING to do with income.

    AHHHHH I see what you are saying!! Boy... I sure am frustrating aren't I?? I was confused for a bit there! I had to go through the courts unfortunately because of my specific situation, but now I am totally picking up what you are putting down..... You should feel fortunate that you are able to do it on your own terms!!

    All the cost stuff aside, I do salute you and your situation. There are a lot of men out there that do NOT see parenting as the same way that you do. Your kiddies are very lucky to have you!!

    A lot of people do have to go through the courts. My ex drug out our divorce for 15 months hoping to find dirt on my to use in court. But you can't get dirt from a clean house. So she settled out of court. I gave her more than I should, because my lawyer recommended I do so to keep it out of court. My possesion of a penis put me at serious risk of only getting 50/50, regardless of the facts of the case. So I gave her a better deal than the standard order to end it.

    There is nothing wrong with going through courts, but the way the courts make rulings needs to be seriously modified.

    I 100% agree with you on that. It's so great that you were able to keep it out of court. Sounds like she would stop at nothing to make you look bad!! Not cool!! The best part of your situation is that you came out the better person by FAR and are setting a great example for the kids!! I suppose THAT is what it's all about!!
  • Mobilemuscle
    Mobilemuscle Posts: 945 Member
    Unfortunately there is really no right answer because each case is very unique. The one constant is in every case the Kids are the ones who lose out the most. The only ones who win are the state, family lawyers, and the DCSS( collecting interest on late payments)

    I come from a broken home and was tossed between parents for years who were always wrestling with each other for support neither of them could afford. All it created was drama, tension, and more legal fees. Personally i think the whole system is wrong and should be abolished.

    The system being as it is If I got hit up for support Id just pay a reasonable amount( 1/2 of the kids monthly expenses)and see if the kid wanted me in his life. If so, then great. if not, thats OK too. There are larger battles out there that need to be fought than heckling with baby mamas over this and potentially getting in legal troubles.
  • djeffreys10
    djeffreys10 Posts: 2,312 Member
    This is better:

    http://money.cnn.com/2013/08/14/pf/cost-children/

    $241,080 to raise a kid. That comes out to $1,116 a month. That's actually not bad. Oh, except I have 3. Opps.

    That is bogus, at least for where I live. I do not pay anywhere NEAR 2000 a month to raise my two kids. Hell, my basic expenses aren't a whole lot more than that, and I would be paying most of that without kids.

    I guess if you include day care that would impact it, but I have family to babysit. However, the bloated child support orders ADD daycare costs to the order, rather than including daycare costs.
  • bugaha1
    bugaha1 Posts: 602 Member
    I didnt have time to read the thread, so is the answer Adrian Peterson? =)
  • djeffreys10
    djeffreys10 Posts: 2,312 Member
    Right... I just didn't understand what you were getting at. So basically you think that I am being treated unfairly for having to be required to pay more than 1/2 the cost that they have calculated. And that no state should require more than a 50% contribution from any parent.... right??

    No, you are confusing THE ACTUAL COST TO MEET THE KIDS NEEDS with the amount the court expects that you would pay given your income. The court does not consider the cost to meet the kids needs. The court considers what is likely a much higher amount, which is a percentage of your income they expect you would spend towards the kids. The cost to meet the kids needs has NOTHING to do with income.

    AHHHHH I see what you are saying!! Boy... I sure am frustrating aren't I?? I was confused for a bit there! I had to go through the courts unfortunately because of my specific situation, but now I am totally picking up what you are putting down..... You should feel fortunate that you are able to do it on your own terms!!

    All the cost stuff aside, I do salute you and your situation. There are a lot of men out there that do NOT see parenting as the same way that you do. Your kiddies are very lucky to have you!!

    A lot of people do have to go through the courts. My ex drug out our divorce for 15 months hoping to find dirt on my to use in court. But you can't get dirt from a clean house. So she settled out of court. I gave her more than I should, because my lawyer recommended I do so to keep it out of court. My possesion of a penis put me at serious risk of only getting 50/50, regardless of the facts of the case. So I gave her a better deal than the standard order to end it.

    There is nothing wrong with going through courts, but the way the courts make rulings needs to be seriously modified.

    I 100% agree with you on that. It's so great that you were able to keep it out of court. Sounds like she would stop at nothing to make you look bad!! Not cool!! The best part of your situation is that you came out the better person by FAR and are setting a great example for the kids!! I suppose THAT is what it's all about!!

    Thank you :flowerforyou:
  • BusyRaeNOTBusty
    BusyRaeNOTBusty Posts: 7,166 Member
    This is better:

    http://money.cnn.com/2013/08/14/pf/cost-children/

    $241,080 to raise a kid. That comes out to $1,116 a month. That's actually not bad. Oh, except I have 3. Opps.

    That is bogus, at least for where I live. I do not pay anywhere NEAR 2000 a month to raise my two kids. Hell, my basic expenses aren't a whole lot more than that, and I would be paying most of that without kids.

    I guess if you include day care that would impact it, but I have family to babysit. However, the bloated child support orders ADD daycare costs to the order, rather than including daycare costs.

    Yeah, I pay $35/day/kid for daycare. And I think that includes housing, so the difference in your mortgage vs. what you'd pay for a single bedroom apartment, maybe. And that's average for the country, so includes high cost of living areas. Still interesting.
  • ldrosophila
    ldrosophila Posts: 7,512 Member
    I found this just for fun:

    http://www.babycenter.com/cost-of-raising-child-calculator

    But it asks how much you make before it'll tell you how much it costs. :huh: If I'm married and make the maximum my kid is going to cost $300,000 more than if I was single and make the minimum (without college).

    LOL I've been avoiding that calculator. Too scared to know. Ignorance is bliss.
  • Mobilemuscle
    Mobilemuscle Posts: 945 Member
    This is better:

    http://money.cnn.com/2013/08/14/pf/cost-children/

    $241,080 to raise a kid. That comes out to $1,116 a month. That's actually not bad. Oh, except I have 3. Opps.

    That is bogus, at least for where I live. I do not pay anywhere NEAR 2000 a month to raise my two kids. Hell, my basic expenses aren't a whole lot more than that, and I would be paying most of that without kids.

    I guess if you include day care that would impact it, but I have family to babysit. However, the bloated child support orders ADD daycare costs to the order, rather than including daycare costs.

    Yeah, I pay $35/day/kid for daycare. And I think that includes housing, so the difference in your mortgage vs. what you'd pay for a single bedroom apartment, maybe. And that's average for the country, so includes high cost of living areas. Still interesting.

    Damn I pay $35 a day to have my dogs in doggy day care.... always thought kids would cost more than my little furbabies
  • lglg11
    lglg11 Posts: 344 Member
    I can't read all of this thread , I just don't have time so I don't know what the majority is going with but heres my views :

    I'm a single mother of 4 kids, my husband left when I was pregnant with our youngest (she is now 7)
    I filed for child support about a year later . I worked part time, my husband made close to $90,000/yr.
    The amount of child support the judge wanted to order was over $700 a week.
    I nearly fell over in the courtroom and quickly disagreed.

    Imagine? $2800 a month !

    My opinion at the time was my husband needed to be able to afford a nice place to live in a good area with lots of bedrooms for all those darn kids (lol) . I didn't want all his money . I wanted what I needed to provide a decent living for my kids. It was my responsibility to work and pay for them too so as soon as I could (which was a couple of years since my kids were so young) I went full time.

    The amount that we agreed to was about half of the original amount of over $700. I rec'd very inconsistant payments over the years and to date he owes his kids $52,000. I know they will never see that money although it would be nice for them. I decided to work, budget, cut my expensives, live without and not be to proud to ask my family for help when I needed it.

    My kids havent spent any quality time with their dad in 5 years, they went 2 years without seeing him at all and just got random phone calls every once in a while. For them , I would gladly forgo the $52,000 and any other money in the future so they could have some of his time which is priceless.

    I think its both the mothers and the fathers responsibility to provide for their kids emotionally, physically, mentally and financially. Fathers are soooo important in their kids lives and play such an imperative role.

    This may have been said already so sorry for the repeat if it was :) Off to read some of this very long thread!
  • Establishedn1986
    Establishedn1986 Posts: 306 Member
    She definitely should get child support. If he makes $9 or $90k he is financially responsible for that child. Shame on him for letting his child get less than they deserve,
  • BusyRaeNOTBusty
    BusyRaeNOTBusty Posts: 7,166 Member
    This is better:

    http://money.cnn.com/2013/08/14/pf/cost-children/

    $241,080 to raise a kid. That comes out to $1,116 a month. That's actually not bad. Oh, except I have 3. Opps.

    That is bogus, at least for where I live. I do not pay anywhere NEAR 2000 a month to raise my two kids. Hell, my basic expenses aren't a whole lot more than that, and I would be paying most of that without kids.

    I guess if you include day care that would impact it, but I have family to babysit. However, the bloated child support orders ADD daycare costs to the order, rather than including daycare costs.

    Yeah, I pay $35/day/kid for daycare. And I think that includes housing, so the difference in your mortgage vs. what you'd pay for a single bedroom apartment, maybe. And that's average for the country, so includes high cost of living areas. Still interesting.

    Damn I pay $35 a day to have my dogs in doggy day care.... always thought kids would cost more than my little furbabies

    I do an in-home stay-at-home-mom. A commercial place is going to charge a lot more.
  • Establishedn1986
    Establishedn1986 Posts: 306 Member
    There is so much BS in this thread that I could argue about, so I will just try to stick with the OP. Child Support is NOT government assistance. There is no shame in asking for someone to pay to help care for the child they helped create. Even if he did ask for an abortion and did not stick around....he's still partially responsible for the child being here and should definitely pay his fair share.
    Yessssss!
  • jenilla1
    jenilla1 Posts: 11,118 Member
    ... She should have been more careful about having a kid if she wasn't ready for the responsibility...

    Bahahahaha! This is all HER doing, right? No, THEY should have been more careful. Any man who doesn't want the responsibility of a child needs to choose his partners carefully and he better consider the possibilities of his actions. It's on him to use extra precautions and deal with the consequences if those precautions fail.
  • Mobilemuscle
    Mobilemuscle Posts: 945 Member
    ... She should have been more careful about having a kid if she wasn't ready for the responsibility...

    Bahahahaha! This is all HER doing, right? No, THEY should have been more careful. Any man who doesn't want the responsibility of a child needs to choose his partners carefully and he better consider the possibilities of his actions. It's on him to use extra precautions and deal with the consequences if those precautions fail.

    problem is most parents and authority figures DONT teach their kids the gravity of these life changing decisions...

    Ignorance to these things is a primary cause of many young people having unplanned pregnancies...
  • Beckboo0912
    Beckboo0912 Posts: 447 Member
    And to be fair to this said girl the guy should have kept his pecker in his wife if he didn't want anything other then the family he already had.
  • jeffrodgers1
    jeffrodgers1 Posts: 991 Member
    I am a custodial father of a 17 year old. I have raised her by myself without a nickels worth of support. I fought tooth and nail for custody to the brink of bankruptcy. My ex wife had free legal aid, my lawyer cost me $250 per hour. It was money well spent and I don't regret that part of it. My kid is worth it. That being said... the amount of money I spent on lawyers and the fact that my Ex avoided paying child support is an outrage. Prior to a decision in the courts my wife went so far as to quit her job and have no income. The court offered to reevaluate Child Support pending a change in the Mothers circumstance. Great! Likely spend another 30-40 hours on legal fee's only to have her quit her job again? I would fight for my kids, but this is a sucker bet and I'll

    In my mind here is what I think needs to happen to fix the system;


    1. The Childs needs be met ahead of both parents. It should not be on the state or government to support your child. You had a kid, support it. If you slept around and got someone pregnant good luck explaining it to your significant other... your child comes first. Can't afford it, get a second job.

    2. Establish reasonable guidelines on the cost of raising a child and base them on regional needs. Sorry, but your child doesn't need Gucci or the Gap... Walmart clothes will do.

    3. Established guidelines should be mandatory and not subject to the court system. It should be a basic calculation and nothing more. Provisions should be available for extenuating circumstances (i.e. Special Needs Children, significant hardship) If you can't afford the guidelines, zip it up, stop having kids and get a second job. Your child comes first.

    4. Mediation should be required ahead of lawyer envolvement. Lawyers should not get rich off of money which should be going to children.

    5. Equity in Child Support\Custody proceedings. One party should not be able to bankrupt the other during a court proceeding. If one party qualifies for Legal Aid, both parties should qualify.

    Would I have appreciated the help in raising my daughter yes. I would have also appreciated not being bankrupted by a system that favors paying lawyers ahead of supporting children.

    Am I bitter... to a degree. I don't know to many people who couldn't use an extra $20K. Especially when you consider that my Ex simply walked away a year after our court battle. 15+ years without any significant involvement has been nice.
  • romancefan1983
    romancefan1983 Posts: 88 Member
    Why did she allow him to put it in her without a condom? Men aren't the only ones responsible for whether or not they use one

    Certainly not. But the woman is not the only one responsible for the pregnancy.

    It's a matter of protecting HIMSELF in that case. If he didn't want to get her pregnant, he should have worn one or not had sex with her. Period.

    Both people are equally responsible for the fact there is a child in the world needing food, water, clothing, shelter, education ...

    You don't want a baby with a woman? You don't want to have to pay child support? DON'T HAVE SEX WITH HER.

    I agree. There's no whose at fault arguement. They are BOTH responsible for creating the child and are BOTH responsible for supporting the child.

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