Make a heavy lifting routine for a beginner?
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I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
Yeah man, I mean that works for you and me, but asking someone to buy a book when they're just looking to get started is a stretch usually, unless they are specifically asking for a recommendation for one.
I rather give them something simple and solid (though, again, 5/3/1 is only complicated in comparison, the program IS simple) and free that they can get started on. And you can't argue that it focuses completely on the fundamentals, no bs. It is a very good program for someone's first few months, especially the completely untrained.
People can make a choice to spend less time on FB or something else to make time to read the book. It's all a matter of choice, don't make excuses for people's laziness or the choices they make. How is 5/3/1 complicated? Seriously? Westside is a little complicated for sure, Cube Method, is slightly complicated.I think the benefit to 5x5 is you get time to learn the mechanics of the lift whereas I'd say in 5/3/1 you should already have the lift mechanics already down pat.
Honestly, you should learn the mechanics before you start any program anyway. You should learn how to pre-stretch, warm-up, and post-stretch properly as well. You should just sit there and do lots of reps for practice anyway before you really start any method.0 -
I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
But sometimes it's better to start "easy" and gain confidence and enjoyment from it than to start hard and burn out quickly. Recommending something that gives people the basics and hopefully something they can stick to is more likely to ensure that they stick to it longer. Which would seem to me to be a good plan instead of starting out on the harder road and possibly giving up on it.
Agree. If I truly believed the 5/3/1 was "hard" I would not recommend it.0 -
I really like this dudes 5x5 program.
http://www.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/jason-blaha-ice-cream-fitness-5x5-novice-workout0 -
I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
Yeah man, I mean that works for you and me, but asking someone to buy a book when they're just looking to get started is a stretch usually, unless they are specifically asking for a recommendation for one.
I rather give them something simple and solid (though, again, 5/3/1 is only complicated in comparison, the program IS simple) and free that they can get started on. And you can't argue that it focuses completely on the fundamentals, no bs. It is a very good program for someone's first few months, especially the completely untrained.
5/3/1 really isn't that hard to figure out. I believe there is the basics of the program out there. Picking assistance lifts are easy too. You only need 2-4 for each day. And those templates are also available in a lot of places besides the book.0 -
Easy, just google "Stronglifts 5x5". It's a barebones, basic program. It focuses on the fundamentals only, and it's free and easy to understand. It's more than enough to get you started.
One word of advice, and it's a virtue that any serious lifter knows, start LIGHT. The program progresses in weight pretty quickly, so it will get heavy soon enough.
THIS!0 -
Look up the Strong Lifts 5X5! Its an awesome routine...and the results are fantastic :-)0
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I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
^^yep.
And as an FYI, Wendler recommends doing a 5 x 5 for beginners in Beyond 5/3/1.0 -
I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
Yeah man, I mean that works for you and me, but asking someone to buy a book when they're just looking to get started is a stretch usually, unless they are specifically asking for a recommendation for one.
I rather give them something simple and solid (though, again, 5/3/1 is only complicated in comparison, the program IS simple) and free that they can get started on. And you can't argue that it focuses completely on the fundamentals, no bs. It is a very good program for someone's first few months, especially the completely untrained.
5/3/1 really isn't that hard to figure out. I believe there is the basics of the program out there. Picking assistance lifts are easy too. You only need 2-4 for each day. And those templates are also available in a lot of places besides the book.
The amount of people who try to work out their own assist and totally get it messed up is pretty high. A beginner does not have enough experience to program - and assists are part of programming.0 -
I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
But sometimes it's better to start "easy" and gain confidence and enjoyment from it than to start hard and burn out quickly. Recommending something that gives people the basics and hopefully something they can stick to is more likely to ensure that they stick to it longer. Which would seem to me to be a good plan instead of starting out on the harder road and possibly giving up on it.
Agree. If I truly believed the 5/3/1 was "hard" I would not recommend it.
How would, for example, squatting once a week be better than squatting 3 x a week for a beginner?0 -
I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
Yeah man, I mean that works for you and me, but asking someone to buy a book when they're just looking to get started is a stretch usually, unless they are specifically asking for a recommendation for one.
I rather give them something simple and solid (though, again, 5/3/1 is only complicated in comparison, the program IS simple) and free that they can get started on. And you can't argue that it focuses completely on the fundamentals, no bs. It is a very good program for someone's first few months, especially the completely untrained.
5/3/1 really isn't that hard to figure out. I believe there is the basics of the program out there. Picking assistance lifts are easy too. You only need 2-4 for each day. And those templates are also available in a lot of places besides the book.
The amount of people who try to work out their own assist and totally get it messed up is pretty high. A beginner does not have enough experience to program - and assists are part of programming.
Except there's templates Wendler already put together a decent amount of templates. All of which are in the book, and several can be found with a Google search. The Triumvirate is pretty simple.0 -
I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
^^yep.
And as an FYI, Wendler recommends doing a 5 x 5 for beginners in Beyond 5/3/1.
Yes he does, but his version is completely different that SL5x5 and more in line with what is found in 5/3/1. He also discusses adding in "joker sets" for beginners which is not something you get in SL5x5.0 -
I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
But sometimes it's better to start "easy" and gain confidence and enjoyment from it than to start hard and burn out quickly. Recommending something that gives people the basics and hopefully something they can stick to is more likely to ensure that they stick to it longer. Which would seem to me to be a good plan instead of starting out on the harder road and possibly giving up on it.
Agree. If I truly believed the 5/3/1 was "hard" I would not recommend it.
How would, for example, squatting once a week be better than squatting 3 x a week for a beginner?
Is it better to have squat 3 times a week or two squat once or twice a week and work a little bit harder? The answer is obvious, frequency does not guarantee better results.0 -
OP: what are your goals? Mainly strength or hypertrophy?0
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Strong Lifts or Starting Strength.... nuff said0
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I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
Yeah man, I mean that works for you and me, but asking someone to buy a book when they're just looking to get started is a stretch usually, unless they are specifically asking for a recommendation for one.
I rather give them something simple and solid (though, again, 5/3/1 is only complicated in comparison, the program IS simple) and free that they can get started on. And you can't argue that it focuses completely on the fundamentals, no bs. It is a very good program for someone's first few months, especially the completely untrained.
5/3/1 really isn't that hard to figure out. I believe there is the basics of the program out there. Picking assistance lifts are easy too. You only need 2-4 for each day. And those templates are also available in a lot of places besides the book.
The amount of people who try to work out their own assist and totally get it messed up is pretty high. A beginner does not have enough experience to program - and assists are part of programming.
True. But those are the people that are typically not following what Jim writes. He spells things out in the book. Heck, he even has a support site now on T-Nation.0 -
I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
But sometimes it's better to start "easy" and gain confidence and enjoyment from it than to start hard and burn out quickly. Recommending something that gives people the basics and hopefully something they can stick to is more likely to ensure that they stick to it longer. Which would seem to me to be a good plan instead of starting out on the harder road and possibly giving up on it.
Agree. If I truly believed the 5/3/1 was "hard" I would not recommend it.
How would, for example, squatting once a week be better than squatting 3 x a week for a beginner?
Is it better to have squat 3 times a week or two squat once or twice a week and work a little bit harder? The answer is obvious, frequency does not guarantee better results.
Where do you squat 2 x a week in 5/3/1 - the basic version.
I also disagree. Working harder does not always equal better, and frequency does not guarantee it - but frequency and volume gives you a better shot at it.0 -
I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
Yeah man, I mean that works for you and me, but asking someone to buy a book when they're just looking to get started is a stretch usually, unless they are specifically asking for a recommendation for one.
I rather give them something simple and solid (though, again, 5/3/1 is only complicated in comparison, the program IS simple) and free that they can get started on. And you can't argue that it focuses completely on the fundamentals, no bs. It is a very good program for someone's first few months, especially the completely untrained.
5/3/1 really isn't that hard to figure out. I believe there is the basics of the program out there. Picking assistance lifts are easy too. You only need 2-4 for each day. And those templates are also available in a lot of places besides the book.
The amount of people who try to work out their own assist and totally get it messed up is pretty high. A beginner does not have enough experience to program - and assists are part of programming.
True. But those are the people that are typically not following what Jim writes. He spells things out in the book. Heck, he even has a support site now on T-Nation.
There is still an amount of intelligent selection required.0 -
Bump.0
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I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
^^yep.
And as an FYI, Wendler recommends doing a 5 x 5 for beginners in Beyond 5/3/1.
Yes he does, but his version is completely different that SL5x5 and more in line with what is found in 5/3/1. He also discusses adding in "joker sets" for beginners which is not something you get in SL5x5.
Yep. But it follows a 5 x 5 format - the progression is a bit different though.0 -
I'd tend to agree that 5x5 is a better beginner program than 5/3/1. With 5/3/1 you have to figure out what you'll use for assistance, weights to use on that, etc. 5x5 is simple and laid out right in front of you for easy progression.
It's kind of sad that our society will go towards what's easiest rather than what might take a little extra work but is better in the long run.
Yeah man, I mean that works for you and me, but asking someone to buy a book when they're just looking to get started is a stretch usually, unless they are specifically asking for a recommendation for one.
I rather give them something simple and solid (though, again, 5/3/1 is only complicated in comparison, the program IS simple) and free that they can get started on. And you can't argue that it focuses completely on the fundamentals, no bs. It is a very good program for someone's first few months, especially the completely untrained.
5/3/1 really isn't that hard to figure out. I believe there is the basics of the program out there. Picking assistance lifts are easy too. You only need 2-4 for each day. And those templates are also available in a lot of places besides the book.
The amount of people who try to work out their own assist and totally get it messed up is pretty high. A beginner does not have enough experience to program - and assists are part of programming.
Except there's templates Wendler already put together a decent amount of templates. All of which are in the book, and several can be found with a Google search. The Triumvirate is pretty simple.
You still need to select based on goals/strengths and weaknesses.0
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