Really hungry after long runs...
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I just start noticing it more at around 4 miles or more. Right now I'm eating pretty low cal/low carb. but this has been something that happens regardless of how my diet looks, including taking in 1800 - 2000 or more calories.
I do like the suggestion of possibly not being hydrated enough. I don't usually drink or eat anything before I run, I get stomach cramps if I do.
Not sure what body size you are, but when i run long, 4+ miles, my calorie burn for the day can top 2500-2700 cals for the day. I'm 5'8" 140lbs. If you're someone who is within 20lbs of a healthy weight, and you're running a huge deficit multiple days a week, you're gonna start feeling REALLY hungry, not to mention the oxidative damage you're doing to your entire body by pounding out all those miles and not fueling the machine properly.
If you want to be a successful, healthy, happy long-distance runner, you're gonna need to do the following-
1- Figure out your TDEE- get some sort of HRM, and find a good calculator. There's an awesome one on iifym.com
2- Don't run more than a 500-cal deficit per day if you're running long. At more than that, you're just hurting yourself more than you're helping yourself.
3- get enough healthy fats!0 -
eat more weight less is not a healthy comment and does not work for everyone I don't like this comment it contradicts common sense and is a problem for over eaters who cannot control how much they eat . One cannot eat more to weigh less unless the are vegetarian and still in that u must be careful. We need more positive and healthy eat right tips.0
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use the monitor on the treadmill, 165 avg. spikes to 170 if I kick it up to 7/mpr for sprints in-between.
I highly doubt that your HR is 165 at a 10 min mile. Unless you are a much larger person. But either way, it would spike to a lot more than 170 if you dropped from 10 to 7 mph.
No idea where you live, but I still cannot fathom why people run on treadmills unless its either below 20 degrees or above 80 (or pouring rain). Get out on the road. That's my first piece of advice.
10/min mile is 6 mph. will run 1 mile in 10 minutes. as of now, it's getting colder, but that's not why I choose the treadmill. Running pavement is too high impact for me knees. I've tried it, I liked it, would love to keep on doing it, but it hurts too much later.0 -
As a runner, I have experienced the same thing, so I did a little research. Seems Runners World recommends 50/20/20 for runners while trying to lose, and 60/20/20 for maintenance.
Bottom line: I wasn't eating enough carbs. Also, I take a sachet of Cliff Gel with me. Nothing worse than bonking towards the end of a long run and having to walk home on wooden legs.0 -
On days that I run hard, 4+ miles, I find that I am starving for most of the morning. I eat breakfast and aim for protein, but I always seem to get very hungry when I run. Is this normal??
It is very normal. I do a low carb diet so I totally get why you are very hungry. Usually when I have long runs planned I'll eat more carbs the night before and after that long run I'll have either a protein shake, chocolate milk or some greek yogurt with flax seed. This usually kills the hunger until I have a regular meal. Also make sure you're properly hydrating before and after those runs.0 -
If you run "fasted," as in first thing in the morning with nothing in your gut, then your body will burn fat as fuel. If you spike your insulin with carbs/sugar before you run, your fat burning will be inhibited as your body will seek the easy fuel of carbs. Best bet is to run fasted and become a blackhole for food when you're done. Eat a serving of peanut butter, hot cereal, chocolate milk, etc to refuel yourself. Carbs are necessary for racing, i.e., anaerobic bursts of speed. You can run at a comfortable pace sans carbs, and dual-fueling is valid marathon strategy (fats first, carbs to push the end). Lots of misinformation in this thread so tread carefully.
No man. Regardless if you are in a fasted state or not your body is going to first use its glycogen stores which are fueled up by mainly carbs from previous eating (like the day before) . When those start to get depleted is going to look for another energy source o keep going or you will have to stop. Yeah, it will use some stored fat but guess what else its going to look for? Protein. If there's none in the fuel tank than take a wild guess or where else its gonna get it? Yep. Not a very good alternative.
She shouldn't be going through her glycogen stores at just a 4 miler unless she is really restricting her carb intake and they aren't being fully replenished before she sets out again.
This is why I asked if she is on a low carb restrictive diet (and low and behold I was right)
Best guess is she is her glycogen stores are crap and her body is trying to inefficiently grab energy from elsewhere causing her to be extra hungry after as her body tries to desperately replinish itself for repair.
If this is misinformation than I'd like to know how/why for my own understanding if you can enlighten me further (not being a smart *kitten*/honestly curious for my own understanding)
I'm with the guy you quoted, that running fasted (and not taking gels as you run) trains your body to use your fat stores rather than burning thru your glycogen stores too quickly, ASSUMING you aren't running at too fast a pace. Then it's going to be your glycogen stores that get wiped out quickly.
Also if as you said her glycogen stores are riculously low, she's probably going to have issues. But at only 4 miles, she's probably running too fast AND has poor glycogen stores.
From what I understand its not really a choice for your body. Glycogen stores are basically ready made energy stores for your body. It going to use them first until you are at a point to where they need to be refueled. Then it will seek other sources.
I really don't think you want to train your body to run on fat stores though. Along with burning fat its going to be grabbing for protein which in a fasted state means its going to result in muscle breakdown for it. Not cool and very counter productive.
I'm all for fasted workouts, I do them myself in the morning but I also feed myself properly beforehand so it never comes to that.
If I'm on a long run though (like anything over an hour and half) then there is no way I'm doing it in a fasted state. It is just an inefficient way to fuel your body at that point.0 -
4 miles is not really running long. I'd hate to see what would happen if you ran 8-10 miles.
Very natural to be hungry after a run. Given that no one usually eats before hand, you've expended a lot of calories and your tank is empty
God: that's ignorant and rude.
that's like saying 200 lbs isn't very heavy. heavy for what? It's heavy for my OHP- but not for my DL... and it's not heavy for my friend who can do both. But it's heavy to my other friend who can barely dead lift 95 lbs. Heavy/long runs are totally relative TO THAT PERSON AND THEIR FITNESS/THEIR GOALS.
It means nothing.
For her THOSE are long runs- for me I realize in the grand scheme it's not a "long run" but for me the current "none runner" runner4 miles would be consider a "long run".
Yes for a marathoner? 4 miles is nothing. But for a 100 yard sprinter 4 miles is long.0 -
I think I'm just going to go do some research to resolve this for myself, lol....although, reading everything that's been posted helps point me in the right direction on exactly WHAT I should be researching.....
Thank you everybody for your input!!! :flowerforyou:0 -
In the aerobic state, the body fuels itself with fat stores using glycogen. Those folks doing ironmans are NOT able to eat enough to run on glucose stores alone. Doing marathons, I would eat a total of 4 GUs. That's only 400 calories. The remainder of the calories I burned came from stored glucose (400 calories or so) and the rest was from fat stores.
http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/articlePages/article/20 -
If you run "fasted," as in first thing in the morning with nothing in your gut, then your body will burn fat as fuel. If you spike your insulin with carbs/sugar before you run, your fat burning will be inhibited as your body will seek the easy fuel of carbs. Best bet is to run fasted and become a blackhole for food when you're done. Eat a serving of peanut butter, hot cereal, chocolate milk, etc to refuel yourself. Carbs are necessary for racing, i.e., anaerobic bursts of speed. You can run at a comfortable pace sans carbs, and dual-fueling is valid marathon strategy (fats first, carbs to push the end). Lots of misinformation in this thread so tread carefully.
:noway:0 -
use the monitor on the treadmill, 165 avg. spikes to 170 if I kick it up to 7/mpr for sprints in-between.
I highly doubt that your HR is 165 at a 10 min mile. Unless you are a much larger person. But either way, it would spike to a lot more than 170 if you dropped from 10 to 7 mph.
No idea where you live, but I still cannot fathom why people run on treadmills unless its either below 20 degrees or above 80 (or pouring rain). Get out on the road. That's my first piece of advice.
You are just wrong on this. My avg HR on my tempo runs is always right around 164 (via Polar FT60). My max HR is at least 202 so that's not an insane HR for a tempo run (81% of max). I'm older than her too. And not a large person (certainly still about 12 to 20 lbs. overweight, but I hardly consider that "larger"). HR is individual like anything else. A trained runner, who has been running for years will likely have a lower avg. HR but that takes time. I've been running for over a year and a half and mine is starting to come down. But, my HR raises REALLY quickly, and lowers REALLY quickly too. My resting HR is anywhere from 51 to 61. I've been working out frequently for over 2 years now and a fast walk still gets my HR up to around 130 pretty quickly. It's just the nature of my HR. I feel fine at higher HR's and don't feel like I'm overexerting myself.0 -
"Box in" you work outs!
meaning.... eat something right before and right after you work out. This will work with your metabolism, help that "hunger" feeling subside and keep you on track to lose weight 0 -
^^^^ Holy crap! that is one hell of a transformation!
&&In the aerobic state, the body fuels itself with fat stores using glycogen. Those folks doing ironmans are NOT able to eat enough to run on glucose stores alone. Doing marathons, I would eat a total of 4 GUs. That's only 400 calories. The remainder of the calories I burned came from stored glucose (400 calories or so) and the rest was from fat stores.
http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/articlePages/article/2
Awesome. I learned something today. Thank you.0 -
If you run "fasted," as in first thing in the morning with nothing in your gut, then your body will burn fat as fuel. If you spike your insulin with carbs/sugar before you run, your fat burning will be inhibited as your body will seek the easy fuel of carbs. Best bet is to run fasted and become a blackhole for food when you're done. Eat a serving of peanut butter, hot cereal, chocolate milk, etc to refuel yourself. Carbs are necessary for racing, i.e., anaerobic bursts of speed. You can run at a comfortable pace sans carbs, and dual-fueling is valid marathon strategy (fats first, carbs to push the end). Lots of misinformation in this thread so tread carefully.
No man. Regardless if you are in a fasted state or not your body is going to first use its glycogen stores which are fueled up by mainly carbs from previous eating (like the day before) . When those start to get depleted is going to look for another energy source o keep going or you will have to stop. Yeah, it will use some stored fat but guess what else its going to look for? Protein. If there's none in the fuel tank than take a wild guess or where else its gonna get it? Yep. Not a very good alternative.
She shouldn't be going through her glycogen stores at just a 4 miler unless she is really restricting her carb intake and they aren't being fully replenished before she sets out again.
This is why I asked if she is on a low carb restrictive diet (and low and behold I was right)
Best guess is she is her glycogen stores are crap and her body is trying to inefficiently grab energy from elsewhere causing her to be extra hungry after as her body tries to desperately replinish itself for repair.
If this is misinformation than I'd like to know how/why for my own understanding if you can enlighten me further (not being a smart *kitten*/honestly curious for my own understanding)
It all comes down to pace. I'm getting into running science here, but myself for instance, I require about 2700 calories to make it to the finish line of a marathon. Fully carb loaded, my body would only store so much glycogen calories. If you start out running too fast, you use all your glycogen and inevitably burn out (the wall). Running slow and easy manages oxygen/HR and doesn't require glycogen for the body to operate, but rather uses the "unlimited" fat stores (how do birds migrate hundreds/thousands of miles without carb-laden aid stations?). A slight increase above your optimal pace will switch you from "fat burning" mode to all glycogen burning without you realizing it, only to feel the effects later. Bottom line, OP isn't eating enough regardless of the exercise, and is underfueled and running too fast for her conditioning level.0 -
In the aerobic state, the body fuels itself with fat stores using glycogen. Those folks doing ironmans are NOT able to eat enough to run on glucose stores alone. Doing marathons, I would eat a total of 4 GUs. That's only 400 calories. The remainder of the calories I burned came from stored glucose (400 calories or so) and the rest was from fat stores.
http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/articlePages/article/2
I don't understand the eye roll, we pretty much said the same thing. I'm able to run about 20 miles on nothing but what I normally eat. No gels, no bottomless spaghetti dinner. But my heartrate doesn't get above 135 on my LSD runs. At the *proper pace for conditioning level*, anyone can bang out an optimally-paced 4-mile run and not be hungry, unless they were starving on 1200 calories before lacing their shoes.0 -
use the monitor on the treadmill, 165 avg. spikes to 170 if I kick it up to 7/mpr for sprints in-between.
I highly doubt that your HR is 165 at a 10 min mile. Unless you are a much larger person. But either way, it would spike to a lot more than 170 if you dropped from 10 to 7 mph.
No idea where you live, but I still cannot fathom why people run on treadmills unless its either below 20 degrees or above 80 (or pouring rain). Get out on the road. That's my first piece of advice.
Temperature, breathing technique, cadence, etc can all contribute to an elevated HR. And +1 to your treadmill sentiment, but everyone's got their own reasoning.0 -
If you run "fasted," as in first thing in the morning with nothing in your gut, then your body will burn fat as fuel. If you spike your insulin with carbs/sugar before you run, your fat burning will be inhibited as your body will seek the easy fuel of carbs. Best bet is to run fasted and become a blackhole for food when you're done. Eat a serving of peanut butter, hot cereal, chocolate milk, etc to refuel yourself. Carbs are necessary for racing, i.e., anaerobic bursts of speed. You can run at a comfortable pace sans carbs, and dual-fueling is valid marathon strategy (fats first, carbs to push the end). Lots of misinformation in this thread so tread carefully.
No man. Regardless if you are in a fasted state or not your body is going to first use its glycogen stores which are fueled up by mainly carbs from previous eating (like the day before) . When those start to get depleted is going to look for another energy source o keep going or you will have to stop. Yeah, it will use some stored fat but guess what else its going to look for? Protein. If there's none in the fuel tank than take a wild guess or where else its gonna get it? Yep. Not a very good alternative.
She shouldn't be going through her glycogen stores at just a 4 miler unless she is really restricting her carb intake and they aren't being fully replenished before she sets out again.
This is why I asked if she is on a low carb restrictive diet (and low and behold I was right)
Best guess is she is her glycogen stores are crap and her body is trying to inefficiently grab energy from elsewhere causing her to be extra hungry after as her body tries to desperately replinish itself for repair.
If this is misinformation than I'd like to know how/why for my own understanding if you can enlighten me further (not being a smart *kitten*/honestly curious for my own understanding)
It all comes down to pace. I'm getting into running science here, but myself for instance, I require about 2700 calories to make it to the finish line of a marathon. Fully carb loaded, my body would only store so much glycogen calories. If you start out running too fast, you use all your glycogen and inevitably burn out (the wall). Running slow and easy manages oxygen/HR and doesn't require glycogen for the body to operate, but rather uses the "unlimited" fat stores (how do birds migrate hundreds/thousands of miles without carb-laden aid stations?). A slight increase above your optimal pace will switch you from "fat burning" mode to all glycogen burning without you realizing it, only to feel the effects later. Bottom line, OP isn't eating enough regardless of the exercise, and is underfueled and running too fast for her conditioning level.
Thank you for the explanation. Never realized before this thread that pace could make your bottle toggle like that. It will actaully help me with my longer runs now.0 -
She said she was running 10 min pace at 165. Learn how to read0
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Is this new - how long have you been running early in the morning? This takes some getting used to. I have been doing it for years and at the start I was hungry, but I worked out it was because I was tired. I adjusted my bed time to get some extra sleep and as I got used to the early starts, the hunger subsided. The thing is if you are getting up at 4.30 and going to bed at 10.30 you are regularly doing an 18 hour day and are probably only getting 5 hours of quality sleep. Numerous studies have been done on the value of sleep in the weight / exercise equation and this is often overlooked.0
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If you run "fasted," as in first thing in the morning with nothing in your gut, then your body will burn fat as fuel. If you spike your insulin with carbs/sugar before you run, your fat burning will be inhibited as your body will seek the easy fuel of carbs. Best bet is to run fasted and become a blackhole for food when you're done. Eat a serving of peanut butter, hot cereal, chocolate milk, etc to refuel yourself. Carbs are necessary for racing, i.e., anaerobic bursts of speed. You can run at a comfortable pace sans carbs, and dual-fueling is valid marathon strategy (fats first, carbs to push the end). Lots of misinformation in this thread so tread carefully.
No man. Regardless if you are in a fasted state or not your body is going to first use its glycogen stores which are fueled up by mainly carbs from previous eating (like the day before) . When those start to get depleted is going to look for another energy source o keep going or you will have to stop. Yeah, it will use some stored fat but guess what else its going to look for? Protein. If there's none in the fuel tank than take a wild guess or where else its gonna get it? Yep. Not a very good alternative.
She shouldn't be going through her glycogen stores at just a 4 miler unless she is really restricting her carb intake and they aren't being fully replenished before she sets out again.
This is why I asked if she is on a low carb restrictive diet (and low and behold I was right)
Best guess is she is her glycogen stores are crap and her body is trying to inefficiently grab energy from elsewhere causing her to be extra hungry after as her body tries to desperately replinish itself for repair.
If this is misinformation than I'd like to know how/why for my own understanding if you can enlighten me further (not being a smart *kitten*/honestly curious for my own understanding)
It all comes down to pace. I'm getting into running science here, but myself for instance, I require about 2700 calories to make it to the finish line of a marathon. Fully carb loaded, my body would only store so much glycogen calories. If you start out running too fast, you use all your glycogen and inevitably burn out (the wall). Running slow and easy manages oxygen/HR and doesn't require glycogen for the body to operate, but rather uses the "unlimited" fat stores (how do birds migrate hundreds/thousands of miles without carb-laden aid stations?). A slight increase above your optimal pace will switch you from "fat burning" mode to all glycogen burning without you realizing it, only to feel the effects later. Bottom line, OP isn't eating enough regardless of the exercise, and is underfueled and running too fast for her conditioning level.
This is what I was trying to say0
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