Question about the QUALITY (not the QUANTITY) of calories

If you are fairly new here, be aware of what we call trolls. They have nothing to do all day so they post on this site silly things... Pay no attention. You can message to not have to deal with it. It is a big world, many strange people.

If you are fairly new here, be aware of what we call trolls. They have nothing to do all day so they post on this site silly things... Pay no attention. You can message to not have to deal with it. It is a big world, many strange people.

Self disclosure?

OP, you've gotten mostly good info. Calories don't have "quality" they are a unit of measure. Getting adequate macro and micro nutrients is important, so a varied nutrient dense diet is a good thing. Too much restriction is problematic and has a diminishing rate of return along with providing no additional benefit.

I love this quote from Eric Helms a leading nutrition and fitness expert.
"Once our nutrient needs are met, we don’t get extra credit for eating more nutritious food."

You may still lose weight eating crap because you're cutting out less crap. But think about the long-term and what you are doing to your organs. You are fueling your body with sugar, bad fats, and sodium. Why not eat healthy so you can live longer, feel stronger, feel better and feed your body the nutrients it needs. Protein, veggies, little fruit, nuts, seeds, avocado, olive oil, etc.. Aren't you worth it?

If you are fairly new here, be aware of what we call trolls. They have nothing to do all day so they post on this site silly things... Pay no attention. You can message to not have to deal with it. It is a big world, many strange people.

Protip: if someone says you can "message" them or post in their special group, it's because their ideas and advice fall apart when subjected to criticism. They need the privacy because they look like fools when people pick apart their claims.

That or they're trying to sell something.

If you are fairly new here, be aware of what we call trolls. They have nothing to do all day so they post on this site silly things... Pay no attention. You can message to not have to deal with it. It is a big world, many strange people.

Protip: if someone says you can "message" them or post in their special group, it's because their ideas and advice fall apart when subjected to criticism. They need the privacy because they look like fools when people pick apart their claims.

THIS.

From a professional working in the business of helping people lose weight for over 15 years now...............it's calories in/out for weight loss. Nutrients matter though. So eating strategies that provide higher nutrient profiles will help with optimum health and performance.
But one doesn't have to eat "clean" to achieve this.

A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

For those advocating that you 'feel better' eating 'cleaner' - I sure as hell didn't. It made me grumpy and miserable not to mention sluggish and (surprisingly) bloated and just generally pants!

I don't eat clean and I don't like the word 'junk food' - food is food. I eat whatever I fancy at the time - as long as it fits my calories.

For those advocating that you 'feel better' eating 'cleaner' - I sure as hell didn't. It made me grumpy and miserable not to mention sluggish and (surprisingly) bloated and just generally pants!

I don't eat clean and I don't like the word 'junk food' - food is food. I eat whatever I fancy at the time - as long as it fits my calories.

How do you define eating 'cleaner'? What changes did you make when you were eating 'cleaner'?

I believe that excessive sugar and fat are bad for you, however my question isn't about whether certain things are good/bad/stupid/healthy to eat, my question is just on basic biology/physiology etc.

Question: (this is for the sake of argument, and I am not intending to try EITHER extremes of diet)

Will a person lose weight at the same rate if you eat 1500 cals of bacon and donuts per day, as if you ate 1500 cals of healthy foods (veggies, lean proteins, grains, whatever you deem to be healthy)?

People always say "calories in, calories out" but I wonder if it is really true. I know everyone has a theory, but does anyone have an actual personal experience where they changed from eating "whatever they wanted" to "eating clean" or "eating healthy," or changed in the reverse direction (possibly when starting to maintain?)

I know everyone likes to quote "calories in, calories out," but I am interested in personal experience instead of ideas and theories and internet blogs. Anyone with personal experience in changing the QUALITY of their diet, please tell me: when you changed the QUALITY of your diet, in what way did you change your diet, how did it affect your weight loss, if at all?

Just curious to what people's actual experiences have been with this.

Thanks in advance!

Voodoo Lady

the laws of physics says it's true, so yes it's true.

weight loss is about how much you eat.

nutrition is about what you eat.

that won't sell books however, so lots of people (authors and weight loss industry types) try desperately to confuse the issue. they want your $$$ and will say and do anything to get it from you... see Dr. Oz for example.

For those advocating that you 'feel better' eating 'cleaner' - I sure as hell didn't. It made me grumpy and miserable not to mention sluggish and (surprisingly) bloated and just generally pants!

I don't eat clean and I don't like the word 'junk food' - food is food. I eat whatever I fancy at the time - as long as it fits my calories.

How do you define eating 'cleaner'? What changes did you make when you were eating 'cleaner'?

How you described how you felt when you ate 'cleaner' is how I felt after I tried cutting grains out of my diet. When I say I ate 'cleaner' I made sure I ate more fruits and veggies particularly one at every meal. I ate more balanced than 'clean'. Clean to me is a Paleo Diet which I do not agree with at all.

You are right. Calories in .. calories out is out the window these days... There are too many added artificial ingredients and a calorie of one food is not the same as a calorie of another.... look at vitamin water for just one example.

It is about the quality not the quantity and it unfortunate that EVERYONE does not know that and is still listening to the media but the word is spreading... thankfully.

More information is in the group, the Skinny on Obesity.

Joanne Moniz
The Skinny on Obesity Group

And yet I lost over 50lbs eating 'junk' and my blood test results showed what eating this way did-no longer having a glucose number in the pre-diabetic range, a total cholesterol number in the 160s and being pegged 'very low risk' for heart disease. Go figure.

eta: I've spent hundreds of hours researching food/nutrition and how it relates to health, longevity of life etc. I've read all the books, watched the documentaries and lectures, read a ridiculous amount of articles etc. And what it came down to is I had to listen to my body-eating a strict 'healthy' diet was detrimental to me. Now I don't label food as 'good' or 'bad', focus on macros and I feel fantastic. Life is much better now that I've learned to listen to my body's cues.

If you lost weight and improved your health by eating junk, why did you change your diet for maintenance? I took a look at the past couple of weeks in your food diary and saw very little food that wouldn't be considered "healthy" by most.

I hit maintenance this spring and I had a different account here on mfp. I transitioned over to the 'clean' eating movement after that because of all the reading/watching about food/nutrition/health I had done (especially documentaries like Forks over Knives, Food Matters etc). And I went 'hard core'-organic everything, only fresh veggies and fruit and only from the farmer's market, cut out any extra fat (olive oil etc) etc. I even eliminated most dairy because it was still too 'processed' etc. Really jumped in with both feet Tried it for several months over the summer/early fall.

Realized it was causing me way more grief than how I used to eat ever did, gave it up, quit MFP and went into kind of a funk. Then I got over myself, rejoined MFP and got plugged into sidesteel/sarauk2sf's group and I'm now focusing on IIFYM/macros/strength training. I now eat fast food several times a week, drink diet soda, use regular ranch dressing, use protein bars etc. Things that during my clean eating experiment were a big no no.

eta: eating clean sent me over into orthorexia territory. I began looking at food in a totally different way-everything was now 'good' or 'bad' and food was no longer just food. I had to analyze every single thing I ate to see if it was 'safe' to eat. I realize many people who eat a clean/whole foods diet don't get to that point, but there is definitely a push by those in the clean eating movement that say if you don't eat clean, you're harming yourself. It's very easy to get trapped into that extreme mindset and it only leads to bad things.

Personal Experience:

I have found that as long as I keep my calories within range and my portions under control, I can indeed drop weight eating a combination of any foods I like, regardless of quality.

HOWEVER, I choose to eat clean food because I can eat more of it, it keeps me full longer, it makes me feel better, and I truly enjoy cooking and experimenting with fresh ingredients. Also, I am much more likely to stick to it when I can eat large, tasty meals as opposed to teeny, junky ones. It's much more satisfying and keeps me happy.

I used to think certain type of calories were better than others. In other words, if I ate 200 calories of vegetables I would lose weight and 200 calories of fast food I would gain weight.

I don't eat a lot of fast food because I just don't like fast food. I don't eat a lot of foods with processed sugar because it makes me feel crappy. I don't drink a lot of caffeine because it makes me feel jittery and makes my ears ring. I don't drink/eat lactose or soy because I am intolerant to both.

However, I eat approximately 2,000 calories of food each day that is NOT clean eating and I have lost 21 pounds and have one pound to my goal.

In other words, a calorie is just a calorie no matter how you look at it.

Calories in, calories out .

I would encourage you to read up on Dr. Layne Norton's theory of If It Fits Your Macros. IIFYM dieting basically considers that your body cannot differentiate what is what when consumed. That is just uses the calories for fuel, and stores the excess. Check it out.

I love this quote from Eric Helms a leading nutrition and fitness expert.
"Once our nutrient needs are met, we don’t get extra credit for eating more nutritious food."

Personal Experience:

I have found that as long as I keep my calories within range and my portions under control, I can indeed drop weight eating a combination of any foods I like, regardless of quality.

HOWEVER, I choose to eat clean food because I can eat more of it, it keeps me full longer, it makes me feel better, and I truly enjoy cooking and experimenting with fresh ingredients. Also, I am much more likely to stick to it when I can eat large, tasty meals as opposed to teeny, junky ones. It's much more satisfying and keeps me happy.

Let me be the first non-clean eater to say good for you. I'm glad you have something that works for you.

And thanks for not trying to tell someone else how to eat/live. That may be the most non-preachy statement on clean eating I've heard lately.

yep! if all the clean eaters responded just the way she had, they would get much less grief on here. much less.

I am a firm believer in the "to each their own" mentality. Far be it from me to condemn someone else's choices if they're getting the results they want! I know what works for me and what makes me happy, so that's what I stick to. Best wishes to you guys as well! Grub on. :flowerforyou: