Going low sugar/low carb!

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  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,252 Member
    Bananas have potassium (good for B/P) and Vit B6. And Schauzers love them.
    Just found out today my 4 dogs not only love broccoli but banana's too.

    It's fun, I get the banana and the Schnauzer heads to the kitchen and sits patiently and waits for me to put pieces in his bowl.
    I make my dogs to tricks for treats or they get nothing...lol
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,252 Member
    I am adding a warning to people who might think you have medical credentials.

    You are giving a testimonial.

    What works for you might not work for others.

    Thanks, but I did that myself.

    And nowhere have I said that PCOS has a one-diet-fits-all solution, in fact I am saying otherwise in response to the OP saying since she has PCOS she should low-carb.

    It's good that you read the thread in its entirety and contributed something useful, though. Good job.

    This is how it's done, and I don't need your approbation:

    http://www.futuremedicine.com/doi/abs/10.2217/whe.12.14

    Evidence-based lifestyle and pharmacological management of infertility in women with polycystic ovary syndrome
    Michael F Costello*1,2 & William L Ledger*1,2
    * Authors for correspondence



    Polycystic ovary syndrome (PCOS) is the most prevalent endocrine disorder in women of reproductive age and by far the most common cause of anovulatory infertility. Lifestyle change alone, and not in combination with pharmacological ovulation induction such as clomifene citrate or metformin, is generally considered the first-line treatment for the management of infertile anovulatory women with PCOS who are overweight or obese. Clomifene citrate should be considered as a first-line pharmacological therapy to improve fertility outcomes. Second-line medical treatments may include ovulation induction with gonadotropins (in clomifene citrate-resistant or clomifene citrate failure women) or laparoscopic ovarian drilling (in clomifene citrate-resistant women) or possibly with metformin combined with clomifene citrate (in clomifene citrate-resistant women). There is currently insufficient evidence to recommend aromatase inhibitors over that of clomifene citrate in infertile anovulatory women with PCOS in general or specifically in therapy-naive or clomifene citrate-resistant women with PCOS.


    So in the obese, weight loss any way it can be done will probably ameliorate many of the symptoms of PCOS. A specific diet is NOT recognized as being better than any other.
    Dietary RCT might be beneifical to look at in regard to PCOS as opposed to pharma intervention.
  • brock_west_houston
    brock_west_houston Posts: 23 Member
    Low carb (a large part of which is the Glycemic Index) has been very effective for me, taking me from 240 lbs to the 180s. The South Beach Diet is safe and extremely beneficial, improving not just weight-loss but cardiovascular health as well. Phase 1, which is only two weeks, excludes fruits and grains. No, these are not bad foods and so I understand the reservations many folks have about eliminating them from the diet. However, it is for the first two weeks only, after which you gradually reintroduce them.

    Phase 1 is slightly challenging and very do-able. What's great is this diet lets you eat as much of the foods as you want that are included in Phase 1 (most proteins and nearly all vegetables, satisfying sugar-free concoctions, and low-fat dairy products). It is not very restrictive at all and the many effects of Phase 1 are very beneficial. Your blood chemistry improves, and remarkably, your cravings for sweets and starchy foods dramatically decrease. Progressing through the diet, you find weeks later that you can enjoy a spoonful of dessert and not want more. You learn to be satisfied. Furthermore, there are no setbacks in this diet as in many others. Having a bad day or two has minimal adverse effects and it is easy to bounce back.

    The average weight lost in the first two weeks of the South Beach Diet is around 8 pounds. It is safe too. I have read so many posts lamenting low carb diets and swearing by calorie counting. I can only attest to my personal experience which is this...I have seen dramatic weight loss, especially in body fat, on the South Beach Diet Phase 1 despite eating 10 times a day and generally staying full. Waking up in the middle of the night and enjoying fried eggs because I was hungry or having a cup or two of my favoriet coffee with sugar-free creamer are basically encouraged. Eat when you're hungry, and lose weight!

    So, I am a low carb (not no-carb) advocate. Moving into the second and third (final/maintenance) stages of South Beach introduces virtually all fruits and whole grains. All you have to sacrifice is, basically, crap like donughts and refined pasta. As I said, the occassional cheat won't thwart you. It's a great way to go.
  • HappyStack
    HappyStack Posts: 802 Member
    This is how it's done, and I don't need your approbation:

    http://www.futuremedicine.com/doi/abs/10.2217/whe.12.14

    (...)

    So in the obese, weight loss any way it can be done will probably ameliorate many of the symptoms of PCOS. A specific diet is NOT recognized as being better than any other.

    Unless you paid for the full study, read it, understood it and it says something different from that abstract, your summation of it is hardly correct.

    It has been known for some time that reduction of body fat in women with PCOS will relieve symptoms... aside from just not wanting to be fat any more, that's kind of a large part of why we do it.
    It is not known what dietary methods of weight loss, if any, are more effective or less effective to achieve weight loss in women with PCOS, and the study you posted does not compare any. If that's "how it's done", I'm confused at what you think the discussion is here.

    Further reading for you, and others, from a well-cited source: http://www.managingpcos.org.au/pcos-evidence-based-guidelines/5-lifestyle-management-in-pcos

    Explains its recommendations here: http://www.managingpcos.org.au/lifestyle-and-pcos/lifestyle-faqs
    And here: http://www.managingpcos.org.au/lifestyle-and-pcos/dietary-approaches

    "Unfortunately, there does not seem to be any one dietary approach that is 'best' for women with PCOS. This means that if you have tried one in the past and did not find it useful for weight loss, there are other options available to try."

    And

    "There are a range of dietary approaches that women with polycystic ovary syndrome (PCOS) can try for weight management. They involve modifying the amount of type of carbohydrate, protein or fat in your diet. There is limited high quality evidence assessing these diets in PCOS. The research generally shows no differences in weight, reproductive, metabolic (risk for diabetes or heart disease) or psychological (quality of life) outcomes for different types of diets. For this reason, it is recommended that weight management (weight loss or prevention of weight gain) should occur in the setting of healthy food choices."

    I hope that sates your desire for "more valid" sources of information.
  • Whambam087
    Whambam087 Posts: 170
    MY experience--people will say a calorie is a calorie and that's ultimately what weight loss boils down to. That may be true, but I have had the greatest sucess with weight control and health following a primal diet (It's naturally lower carb because you cut out all the carby grains. I average anywhere from 75-130 depending on the day). The difference is literally between night and day. I feel a whole lot better eating this way for one, but in terms of weight loss it's been helpful because the food is very nutrient dense and satiating. I eat and I feel satisfied and can go many hours without feeling hungry. On top of that I notice when I don't eat the grains (and wheat in particular) I lose my cravings for processed junk food and I have no desire to snack or cheat. So yeah feeling satisfied with the food your eating, not feeling hungry all the time and having no cravings for junk definitely helps with weight loss...a lot.
  • tennisdude2004
    tennisdude2004 Posts: 5,609 Member
    I've been doing great the gym and have definitley noticed my body changing and have lost almost 10 pounds in the last couple months. However, I know my big area for opportunity is my diet!!

    Since I have PCOS, I really should be low sugar/low carb anyway. To set myself up for success, this weekend I plan to do some prep cooking! I get Bountiful Baskets (they only come every other week to where I live), so I am going to develop my weekly meals based off what is in my basket. I am going to prepare lunches for the week so I can just grab them in the morning and take them with me.

    For breakfast, instead of coffee or an energy drink and some kind of crap snack, I am going to have some hardboiled eggs that I keep at work and bring a banana or apple and peanut butter, and keep some healthy snacks at work for the mid afternoon slump and before I go to the gym after work. Other than tea, I will only drink water and occasionally milk.

    Any other tips for this low carb and sugar change? What helped other succeed? Any recipes in particular you are fond of?

    Just for snacking try a handful if almonds or other nuts and I really like carrot batons to munch on. Keeps you good between meals.
  • joniobrien
    joniobrien Posts: 2
    I must say I've enjoyed reading this thread. Thanks for the education. I am most definitely IR and figured that out from an old book called the "The Endocrine Control Diet", Calvin Ezrin and Robert Kowalski. It is basically a keto diet, low carb.

    What helps me stay on track is to treat myself. Some treats I use are sugarless Jello, an egg custard recipe(6eggs, 2cups coconut milk, 1/4 c maple syrup, cinnamon & vanilla. 325 for 1hr in ramekins in pan of water), and a hot chocolate (Large mug of boiled water, 1TBS heaping unsweetened cocoa, 2pkts sweeter, H&H).
    A recipe I use often works for me: Chicken w/Wine - 8 pieces of boneless/skinless chicken thigh, 2T oil, 1T chopped onion, 1T flour, 1/2 C red wine, 1/2 C chicken broth, 1 clove garlic crushed, 1bay leaf, 1/4 ts thyme, 8 small white onions, 1C mushrooms, sliced.
    In a large skillet cook chicken and chopped onion in heated oil until slightly browned. Stir in flour and cook until well browned. Add all the other ingredients. Bring to a boil. Cover. Simmer for 45 minutes, or until meat is tender.
    Oddly, I seem to lose weight after eating that recipee. I would like to find more that do that.
  • PunkyDucky
    PunkyDucky Posts: 283 Member
    Would the insulin resistance diet help PCOS at all?
    It's not really "low-carb" persay but it does help you eat a variety of carbs (30 grams) per meal linked with (14 grams) of protein.
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,252 Member
    Would the insulin resistance diet help PCOS at all?
    It's not really "low-carb" persay but it does help you eat a variety of carbs (30 grams) per meal linked with (14 grams) of protein.
    Weight loss and exercise with weight resistance and HIIT being the more effective exercises will probably make the biggest difference, not sure about the IR diet, never looked at it.
  • PunkyDucky
    PunkyDucky Posts: 283 Member
    Would the insulin resistance diet help PCOS at all?
    It's not really "low-carb" persay but it does help you eat a variety of carbs (30 grams) per meal linked with (14 grams) of protein.
    Weight loss and exercise with weight resistance and HIIT being the more effective exercises will probably make the biggest difference, not sure about the IR diet, never looked at it.

    I know that weight loss helps PCOS and i'm pretty good in the fitness area, it's my eating that i am having a hard time getting into especially with PCOS. I figured since this thread was about low carb/GI that perhaps linking carbs with protein could help a woman with PCOS/IR also.
  • HappyStack
    HappyStack Posts: 802 Member
    IR diet is pretty complicated, in reality, and it's no more/less effective than any other diet unless you have DM2... at that point you're focusing on management rather than reversal, although some people say you can reverse type-II... I don't really agree with that. Low carb at that point is beneficial.

    IR/prediabetes can be reversed just by becoming more active, making better food choices most of the time, and losing weight as a result.

    ETA: it's basically just a rehash of more healthy eating principles. Plan your meals around protein, which is very satiating, no need to pair specific grams together.
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,252 Member
    Would the insulin resistance diet help PCOS at all?
    It's not really "low-carb" persay but it does help you eat a variety of carbs (30 grams) per meal linked with (14 grams) of protein.
    Weight loss and exercise with weight resistance and HIIT being the more effective exercises will probably make the biggest difference, not sure about the IR diet, never looked at it.

    I know that weight loss helps PCOS and i'm pretty good in the fitness area, it's my eating that i am having a hard time getting into especially with PCOS. I figured since this thread was about low carb/GI that perhaps linking carbs with protein could help a woman with PCOS/IR also.
    If you can reduce carbs, I suggest that. Personally I don't think GI has much to do with it and lowering your overall glucose load is probably better.
  • tennisdude2004
    tennisdude2004 Posts: 5,609 Member
    Would the insulin resistance diet help PCOS at all?
    It's not really "low-carb" persay but it does help you eat a variety of carbs (30 grams) per meal linked with (14 grams) of protein.
    Weight loss and exercise with weight resistance and HIIT being the more effective exercises will probably make the biggest difference, not sure about the IR diet, never looked at it.

    I know that weight loss helps PCOS and i'm pretty good in the fitness area, it's my eating that i am having a hard time getting into especially with PCOS. I figured since this thread was about low carb/GI that perhaps linking carbs with protein could help a woman with PCOS/IR also.
    If you can reduce carbs, I suggest that. Personally I don't think GI has much to do with it and lowering your overall glucose load is probably better.

    ^^^^^^agree.
  • yarwell
    yarwell Posts: 10,477 Member
    but a food's GI is not the same as its GL.

    However it's GL = GI/100 * carbohydrate content (grams)

    so they aren't independent variables. I forget where "low" GI stops, but some medium GI foods like "whole" grain products are 55-65% GI and therefore well above the GI of a Snickers bar.

    Nobody actually eats grains whole of course, if they did they might be low GI.
  • HappyStack
    HappyStack Posts: 802 Member
    but a food's GI is not the same as its GL.

    However it's GL = GI/100 * carbohydrate content (grams)

    so they aren't independent variables. I forget where "low" GI stops, but some medium GI foods like "whole" grain products are 55-65% GI and therefore well above the GI of a Snickers bar.

    Nobody actually eats grains whole of course, if they did they might be low GI.

    Indeed. 55, I believe, qualifies as "low".

    I generally like recommending it because it's a non- or low-restriction diet marketed as a restrictive diet, particularly to PCOS sufferers. Because GI isn't printed on labels of pre-packaged stuff, you end up thinking about the ingredients of things and actively questioning your food choices and the frequency with which you make those choices.

    After a few months it's pretty easy to realise, "actually... this is just making good choices, and it's producing results" lol.

    I maintain that low-carb isn't necessary, but that's like a red rag to a bull in a low-carb thread :tongue:
  • jackaroo1223
    jackaroo1223 Posts: 25
    Thank you to those who responded with their own personal experiences. That was what I was looking for. If I wanted scientific studies I could have looked those up myself... Just saying. I have found different things work for different people regardless of what the experts say. PCOS and hormones are very complicated. First hand experience with these issues and how to manage them far surpasses a google search. While I appreciate everyone's expert opinion here, PCOS is not something men should be thinking of themselves as an expert on. Do you have it? Nope. So how can you have first hand experience with it? People on these forums need to learn to be respectful of opinions and be NICE! If you want to be an internet coward being a jerk to people, seriously go somewhere else. This website is for learning, sharing, motivating and encouraging. But most importantly what worked for one person may not work for another, so SHARE and be respectful. Jeez Louise.
  • jackaroo1223
    jackaroo1223 Posts: 25
    I must say I've enjoyed reading this thread. Thanks for the education. I am most definitely IR and figured that out from an old book called the "The Endocrine Control Diet", Calvin Ezrin and Robert Kowalski. It is basically a keto diet, low carb.

    What helps me stay on track is to treat myself. Some treats I use are sugarless Jello, an egg custard recipe(6eggs, 2cups coconut milk, 1/4 c maple syrup, cinnamon & vanilla. 325 for 1hr in ramekins in pan of water), and a hot chocolate (Large mug of boiled water, 1TBS heaping unsweetened cocoa, 2pkts sweeter, H&H).
    A recipe I use often works for me: Chicken w/Wine - 8 pieces of boneless/skinless chicken thigh, 2T oil, 1T chopped onion, 1T flour, 1/2 C red wine, 1/2 C chicken broth, 1 clove garlic crushed, 1bay leaf, 1/4 ts thyme, 8 small white onions, 1C mushrooms, sliced.
    In a large skillet cook chicken and chopped onion in heated oil until slightly browned. Stir in flour and cook until well browned. Add all the other ingredients. Bring to a boil. Cover. Simmer for 45 minutes, or until meat is tender.
    Oddly, I seem to lose weight after eating that recipee. I would like to find more that do that.


    Thanks for the tips!!! I feel a treat every now and then is important because it's a lifestyle change, it has to be sustainable!

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