Are the poor fat?

I make less than $20, 000 a year. Grew up in a trailer where often times we didn't have running water or electricity because of inability to pay bills. I've even been homeless for short periods of time. The only reason I share this with you is that you know that I know what it's like to be in at the lower end of the income spectrum here in the states. Right now I feel pretty well off making that much annually.

The point is, I can still make smart food choices. One thing that me and my family growing up noticed is that eating out costs WAY more than cooking ourselves. When I first started trying to eat healthy I had to pay more becuase I didn't have basics like olive oil or spices and what not. Now I don't have to spend too much. I can get all my produce for the week for about $20 bucks and then buy chicken/beef for an additional $15 bucks. I'd say that's pretty affordable. Now it does take a bit of extra time to actually cook it but it's worth it in the end. I actually ended up saving quite a bit of money just from cooking at home rather than going and grabbing junk at the store and "cheap" fast food.

That's just my own experience. Maybe I am lucky that I live in an area where I have access to produce but I do have to take about a 5 hour round trip bus ride for 20-30 minutes of shopping. Just saying. We can always find excuses for something... or we can just suck it up and do what we have to do. When I make poor choices in food it's because I am making poor choices, not because there are not better options.

(I should also mention that I do all this cooking and everything while also working two full times jobs.)

I love what you said. I think a lot of the problem with the obesity epidemic is convenient food. It takes less time and planning to make hotdogs and boxed mac 'n cheese for dinner than to make something healthier.
There are many times that I don't feel like making dinner, but ordering a pizza or eating fast food when I fail to plan isn't good for my family.
We do regularly order pizza and have a carpet picnic and our kids think that is great, but it is because we plan to do it not because we are too busy to do a healthier option.

I'll just add that there have been times in my life - even while fully employed and technically unable to qualify for government assistance programs - the $35 listed as used for making good food choices for the week was in the ballpark of what I had to buy food for the month, not counting transportation or cooking expenses. I was not a gambler nor a drug user, either, so I wasn't 'squandering' my paycheck.. . . just something to consider.

Point taken. One set of my grandparents (and parent) lived in similar monetary circumstances and often went hungry, so I hear you.

The thing is, when you have that little money, you can't buy enough at even a fast food place to make you overweight, let alone obese. And if you started that way, you're going to be losing weight. So, the 'very' poor aren't really part of this discussion because by definition, they can't be overweight/obese.

To be fat, you must be able to buy or barter for enough calories to get you there and keep you there.

Counterpoint: when you have that little money and get anything that resembles a surplus, your body is seriously craving calories more than it is worrying about nutrition. You're at that point, monetarily, and find a dollar on the ground: Do you buy a dollar's worth of bananas, or a dollar's worth of ramen noodles?

If you are actually starving you, you take the ramen! But then you wouldn't be fat and this post is about if the poor are fat, not malnourished. Besides, haven't you heard? Americans aren't "hungry," they are "food insecure." I wonder why they changed the term. I'd be interested to know.

Let me connect the dots. A person who experiences the level of money shortage/food shortage I described learns to prioritize calories/dollar (peso, looney, pound, whatever) over almost all other food considerations. This learned behavior becomes almost habitual.

Food shopping is largely habitual, as well; stores have done studies tracking eye movements of shoppers, and most shoppers don't focus their eyes on the shelves until nearing the items they're intending to buy.

Combine these factors, and folks who are used to not knowing how far their next paycheck is going to get them will habitually reach for the highest calorie/dollar items they can reasonably afford. . . even when their financial situation improves. They have to learn new habits to change this cycle.

Yes poor people are fat.

Not because food is expensive (although it is)

But because it's not readily available in the same way as McDonalds. Come to 125th street in Harlem and I'll point out 5 fast food places in one square block and not one grocery store. within 10 blocks either direction

How can they afford that? I keep hearing this, but I don't understand how they can even buy McD's every day. I am a bit above the federal poverty line, and I sure can't pay for all that. Bread, ground beef, and a squeeze bottle of Heinz is much cheaper. Ten blocks you say? Don't they have buses and a subway up there? We have buses here, not especially convenient, but they do just fine for people without vehicles.

How is it cheaper???

Burger patti's 1 for 1 dollar or ground beef 5.99 lb = 4 4oz burgers
1 package hamburger rolls - 1.50
ketchup - 2 dollars (or steal teh squeeze packets from mcdonalds)
= $7.50 for 4 burgers (or if you get the ready made patti's $5.50)
and you still have to cook it so add in butter/oil/pam
and no lettuce or anything right?
assuming you have access to a stove of course...

McDonalds - 4 bucks for 4 burgers. they come with everything you need and I believe even lettuce and you don't have to cook it..
Sometimes they are even cheaper then a dollar and you can take the extra dollar and get a small bag of fries.

even if you buy premade frozen patti's 6.99 for 8 that's still more expensive then McDonalds and you are assuming they have a way to store and cook the meat.

My prices listed above are less then what I have to pay for it meat. I can get 80/20 patti's 10 for 10 bucks, but you have to buy 10.

Ok, so you don't buy "burger patties." *EVER* They are expensive. You buy *ground beef* 5 pounds at a time for $2.5/pound. Then you use your hands and *make* patties, at 3 ounces per patty. And for the price of one Mc'Ds french fry, you can get the generic frozen fries, or *better yet* get potatoes and cut them yourself. Three medium-sized potatoes will be enough fries for four people, plus 12 ounces of meat, plus a slice of cheese, and then you use bread instead of a bun.

When my my family gets fast food, it runs us about $35 for four. Whereas, I can get a week's worth of groceries for about $80 for all four of us. It blows my mind that anyone would whine about being poor, then pay someone to cook for them. I wish I had a personal chef too, but not being wealthy precludes that idea.

It makes no sense that any poor person would eat fast food every day, unless they are single with no kids. A single person could probably manage it.

I've gone through moments, especially as a single mom, when money was so tight I had to get creative. It's not hard to spend $20 on enough food to get you through pay day, especially when you buy store-brand.

Whole wheat bread 99¢
Peanut butter $2
Brown rice in a bag 99¢
Banana 89¢ a bundle
Beans 99¢
Block of cheese $2
2 cans tuna $1
4 bag of frozen veggies $4
Bag of frozen boneless chicken breast $7

$20 grocery list.

ETA: I never see people on food stamps buy healthy food and the program doesn't really give them any reason to.. Indiana just reduced food stamps a bit and people were outraged... people who get between $400 and $700 a month in food stamps. HOW THE HELL do you spend that much on food a month? Even my family of 3, with big appetites, spends about $250 a MONTH on food and we budget loosely. For people who get WIC, it's not hard for them to follow a list of approved items such as bread, milk, beans and cheese.. Why can't the food stamps program ALSO have a list of approved items? Things like $6-7 frozen DiGiorno pizzas don't belong in a cart of someone on assistance when they are buying 5 at a time. That's money that could be well spent on many other meals.

Where do you live? The prices here are not that cheap. Even at Walmart whole wheat bread is around $3, good peanut butter is $3-4 for a small jar, bananas are about the same as you listed, a block of cheese is also around $3-6, tuna is $1 a can, frozen chicken breast is $11 or more. 1Where do you shop? The only really cheap items I know of are beans and rice. Eating vegan can save a lot of money too. I have gone through a whole month eating vegan and only spent $300 for my family.

Yes poor people are fat.

Not because food is expensive (although it is)

But because it's not readily available in the same way as McDonalds. Come to 125th street in Harlem and I'll point out 5 fast food places in one square block and not one grocery store. within 10 blocks either direction

How can they afford that? I keep hearing this, but I don't understand how they can even buy McD's every day. I am a bit above the federal poverty line, and I sure can't pay for all that. Bread, ground beef, and a squeeze bottle of Heinz is much cheaper. Ten blocks you say? Don't they have buses and a subway up there? We have buses here, not especially convenient, but they do just fine for people without vehicles.

How is it cheaper???

Burger patti's 1 for 1 dollar or ground beef 5.99 lb = 4 4oz burgers
1 package hamburger rolls - 1.50
ketchup - 2 dollars (or steal teh squeeze packets from mcdonalds)
= $7.50 for 4 burgers (or if you get the ready made patti's $5.50)
and you still have to cook it so add in butter/oil/pam
and no lettuce or anything right?
assuming you have access to a stove of course...

McDonalds - 4 bucks for 4 burgers. they come with everything you need and I believe even lettuce and you don't have to cook it..
Sometimes they are even cheaper then a dollar and you can take the extra dollar and get a small bag of fries.

even if you buy premade frozen patti's 6.99 for 8 that's still more expensive then McDonalds and you are assuming they have a way to store and cook the meat.

My prices listed above are less then what I have to pay for it meat. I can get 80/20 patti's 10 for 10 bucks, but you have to buy 10.

Ok, so you don't buy "burger patties." *EVER* They are expensive. You buy *ground beef* 5 pounds at a time for $2.5/pound. Then you use your hands and *make* patties, at 3 ounces per patty. And for the price of one Mc'Ds french fry, you can get the generic frozen fries, or *better yet* get potatoes and cut them yourself. Three medium-sized potatoes will be enough fries for four people, plus 12 ounces of meat, plus a slice of cheese, and then you use bread instead of a bun.

When my my family gets fast food, it runs us about $35 for four. Whereas, I can get a week's worth of groceries for about $80 for all four of us. It blows my mind that anyone would whine about being poor, then pay someone to cook for them. I wish I had a personal chef too, but not being wealthy precludes that idea.

It makes no sense that any poor person would eat fast food every day, unless they are single with no kids. A single person could probably manage it.

wow.. 35 dollars at MdDonalds??? that's must have been "value meals" which were never in my budget and honestly still aren't. I'd rather take my 6 bucks and do something better with it. I've taken my son there once in the last 2 years.. We spent 3 dollars. he got some sort of sandwich, a small fry and a small ice cream. Oh.. excuse me.. 3.20ish cause of tax. that was lunch. I only took him because I told him he could pick anywhere and that's where he picked..

Where is ground beef $2.50lbs?? Not here.. not even the 80/20 stuff. Certainly not where I'm from either. Try 5-6 bucks a pound and start there.

Yes poor people are fat.

Not because food is expensive (although it is)

But because it's not readily available in the same way as McDonalds. Come to 125th street in Harlem and I'll point out 5 fast food places in one square block and not one grocery store. within 10 blocks either direction

How can they afford that? I keep hearing this, but I don't understand how they can even buy McD's every day. I am a bit above the federal poverty line, and I sure can't pay for all that. Bread, ground beef, and a squeeze bottle of Heinz is much cheaper. Ten blocks you say? Don't they have buses and a subway up there? We have buses here, not especially convenient, but they do just fine for people without vehicles.

How is it cheaper???

Burger patti's 1 for 1 dollar or ground beef 5.99 lb = 4 4oz burgers
1 package hamburger rolls - 1.50
ketchup - 2 dollars (or steal teh squeeze packets from mcdonalds)
= $7.50 for 4 burgers (or if you get the ready made patti's $5.50)
and you still have to cook it so add in butter/oil/pam
and no lettuce or anything right?
assuming you have access to a stove of course...

McDonalds - 4 bucks for 4 burgers. they come with everything you need and I believe even lettuce and you don't have to cook it..
Sometimes they are even cheaper then a dollar and you can take the extra dollar and get a small bag of fries.

even if you buy premade frozen patti's 6.99 for 8 that's still more expensive then McDonalds and you are assuming they have a way to store and cook the meat.

My prices listed above are less then what I have to pay for it meat. I can get 80/20 patti's 10 for 10 bucks, but you have to buy 10.

Ok, so you don't buy "burger patties." *EVER* They are expensive. You buy *ground beef* 5 pounds at a time for $2.5/pound. Then you use your hands and *make* patties, at 3 ounces per patty. And for the price of one Mc'Ds french fry, you can get the generic frozen fries, or *better yet* get potatoes and cut them yourself. Three medium-sized potatoes will be enough fries for four people, plus 12 ounces of meat, plus a slice of cheese, and then you use bread instead of a bun.

When my my family gets fast food, it runs us about $35 for four. Whereas, I can get a week's worth of groceries for about $80 for all four of us. It blows my mind that anyone would whine about being poor, then pay someone to cook for them. I wish I had a personal chef too, but not being wealthy precludes that idea.

It makes no sense that any poor person would eat fast food every day, unless they are single with no kids. A single person could probably manage it.

Ok, I hate to admit this, but if you get inexpensive foods for most meals and eat off the dollar menu at fast food places you can eat for pretty cheap. We have gotten hamburgers at Mcdonalds for all of us for $7. it is still way cheaper to buy your own food and healthier.

Yes poor people are fat.

Not because food is expensive (although it is)

But because it's not readily available in the same way as McDonalds. Come to 125th street in Harlem and I'll point out 5 fast food places in one square block and not one grocery store. within 10 blocks either direction

How can they afford that? I keep hearing this, but I don't understand how they can even buy McD's every day. I am a bit above the federal poverty line, and I sure can't pay for all that. Bread, ground beef, and a squeeze bottle of Heinz is much cheaper. Ten blocks you say? Don't they have buses and a subway up there? We have buses here, not especially convenient, but they do just fine for people without vehicles.

How is it cheaper???

Burger patti's 1 for 1 dollar or ground beef 5.99 lb = 4 4oz burgers
1 package hamburger rolls - 1.50
ketchup - 2 dollars (or steal teh squeeze packets from mcdonalds)
= $7.50 for 4 burgers (or if you get the ready made patti's $5.50)
and you still have to cook it so add in butter/oil/pam
and no lettuce or anything right?
assuming you have access to a stove of course...

McDonalds - 4 bucks for 4 burgers. they come with everything you need and I believe even lettuce and you don't have to cook it..
Sometimes they are even cheaper then a dollar and you can take the extra dollar and get a small bag of fries.

Don't buy the premade patties - buy the 85/15 burger (that's what McD's burgers are anyway) at 3.39 a lb and make eight burgers (the ones you get for $1 are no more than 1/8 lb). $3.39
A package of buns comes in an 8 count - $1.50
Ketchup - you probably already have this, you don't buy it everytime you make burgers. Even if you do, $1.50 for store brand, so $1.50
85/15 burger has a lot of fat in it so you don't use butter or pam or anything in the pan, hello.
So for $6.39 you now have 8 burgers.

3.39 a lbs??? not here.. maybe.. MAYBE for 80/20 meat it's around that price. And I didn't even include the cost of ketchup in my total above..

Well i just learned that a hamburger is only 2 oz of meat at most at Mcdonalds. I haven't eaten there in years and don't remember much about the food sizes. However.. to be realistic. How many of those to feed you? 8 burgers feeds 2? By your figures I have saved 1.61 and still have to figure out how to cook it. (I was poor enough at one time to not own a stove.. so there's that too) . Plus I think you can get a double cheeseburger on the dollar menu now.. So now i'm getting double the meat at Mcdonalds then you are the grocery store. So my 4 dollars just bought me 8 hamburgers with cheese and 4 buns,

Cheaper.

How are you getting there?

"Good" peanut butter? Surely the store brand qualifies here?

Yes poor people are fat.

Not because food is expensive (although it is)

But because it's not readily available in the same way as McDonalds. Come to 125th street in Harlem and I'll point out 5 fast food places in one square block and not one grocery store. within 10 blocks either direction

How can they afford that? I keep hearing this, but I don't understand how they can even buy McD's every day. I am a bit above the federal poverty line, and I sure can't pay for all that. Bread, ground beef, and a squeeze bottle of Heinz is much cheaper. Ten blocks you say? Don't they have buses and a subway up there? We have buses here, not especially convenient, but they do just fine for people without vehicles.

How is it cheaper???

Burger patti's 1 for 1 dollar or ground beef 5.99 lb = 4 4oz burgers
1 package hamburger rolls - 1.50
ketchup - 2 dollars (or steal teh squeeze packets from mcdonalds)
= $7.50 for 4 burgers (or if you get the ready made patti's $5.50)
and you still have to cook it so add in butter/oil/pam
and no lettuce or anything right?
assuming you have access to a stove of course...

McDonalds - 4 bucks for 4 burgers. they come with everything you need and I believe even lettuce and you don't have to cook it..
Sometimes they are even cheaper then a dollar and you can take the extra dollar and get a small bag of fries.

Don't buy the premade patties - buy the 85/15 burger (that's what McD's burgers are anyway) at 3.39 a lb and make eight burgers (the ones you get for $1 are no more than 1/8 lb). $3.39
A package of buns comes in an 8 count - $1.50
Ketchup - you probably already have this, you don't buy it everytime you make burgers. Even if you do, $1.50 for store brand, so $1.50
85/15 burger has a lot of fat in it so you don't use butter or pam or anything in the pan, hello.
So for $6.39 you now have 8 burgers.

3.39 a lbs??? not here.. maybe.. MAYBE for 80/20 meat it's around that price. And I didn't even include the cost of ketchup in my total above..

Well i just learned that a hamburger is only 2 oz of meat at most at Mcdonalds. I haven't eaten there in years and don't remember much about the food sizes. However.. to be realistic. How many of those to feed you? 8 burgers feeds 2? By your figures I have saved 1.61 and still have to figure out how to cook it. (I was poor enough at one time to not own a stove.. so there's that too) . Plus I think you can get a double cheeseburger on the dollar menu now.. So now i'm getting double the meat at Mcdonalds then you are the grocery store. So my 4 dollars just bought me 8 hamburgers with cheese and 4 buns,

Cheaper.

How are you getting there?

I don't know how much your gas bill was last quarter but nobody is taking this into account, my GAS bill was £200 for the last 3 months and I never use my heating, its all for cooking or hot water! Alot of people can't afford the utensils and stuff that you need to cook properly in the first place! A decent set of pans can run you 100 dollars EASILY - alot of poorer people have cash in small amount regularly but never accumulate enough to achieve escape velocity from their situation. its achieving escape velocity which lifts you out of your situation - not getting doled out a few dollars every so often

This really makes no sense. We're not talking about someone just starting out in life. We're talking about the average household buying food. Typically most households already have the utensils and pots and pans, etc.

I don't know how much your gas bill was last quarter but nobody is taking this into account, my GAS bill was £200 for the last 3 months and I never use my heating, its all for cooking or hot water! Alot of people can't afford the utensils and stuff that you need to cook properly in the first place! A decent set of pans can run you 100 dollars EASILY - alot of poorer people have cash in small amount regularly but never accumulate enough to achieve escape velocity from their situation. its achieving escape velocity which lifts you out of your situation - not getting doled out a few dollars every so often

This really makes no sense. We're not talking about someone just starting out in life. We're talking about the average household buying food. Typically most households already have the utensils and pots and pans, etc.

Right. When I was 20, I had nothing, but I didn't have kiddos to feed either. It took many years, but I gradually built a decent kitchen, one pan/utensil at a time.

And I have *NEVER* spent $100 for anything kitchen-wise, though my husband once saved up money and bought me a stand-mixer, which is the only *fancy,expensive* item in my kitchen. We still do dishes by hand and get everything at Kmart. (and they have the best layaway for higher-priced items) Also, in the US, the working poor with kids get the EITC at income tax time. For many, that's several thousand in cash that is often spent on things like kitchen items (or mattresses, etc., basically the things that the working poor could never otherwise afford to buy)

Around here, gas is for heating. Electric heat is too expensive. (But either way, you gotta use energy, regardless of the source of it.) Also, our stove is electric, but when we lost our electricity due to being unable to pay the bill, we cooked on a propane camping stove. We also have a fire pit in the back yard, if need be.

That is very true.. A friend of mine.. 3 incomes (husband has 2 jobs), 2 kids, a dog,. living in a house that is really too small for them, is currently finding herself buying hot dogs, pasta and ramen because of all the furlough days her husband was forced to take for both jobs, since both his jobs are government. They are considered the working poor despite her masters degree and him having 2 jobs.. It's really sad when a family with that level of education and that many jobs are having their electricity turned off and cancelling their phones, just to keep their mortgage paid and their kids fed. Oh.. and they didn't get a tax refund or that earned income credit, they owe, despite claiming 0 at all the jobs. It's really sad.

I was 20, with a kid. It seems we are talking about things from a completely different view point. It's all relative to experience, where you live and what is available to you. You can have the whole "i pulled myself out of it, so you should be able to" mentality as long as you recognize that it's not easy, it's not the same for everyone and it's not always as easy as.. go buy chicken at the grocery store and cook it. Esp when you have other priorities that take presence over what ends up on your plate.

I totally agree with the escape velocity idea mentioned above. I also agree that people often squander their tax returns, if they get one, on things others deem frivolous. That's not the case always, but it does happen.

It does cost more to eat healthy. Some people say it isn't, but I have experienced it first hand.

I don't know how much your gas bill was last quarter but nobody is taking this into account, my GAS bill was £200 for the last 3 months and I never use my heating, its all for cooking or hot water! Alot of people can't afford the utensils and stuff that you need to cook properly in the first place! A decent set of pans can run you 100 dollars EASILY - alot of poorer people have cash in small amount regularly but never accumulate enough to achieve escape velocity from their situation. its achieving escape velocity which lifts you out of your situation - not getting doled out a few dollars every so often

This really makes no sense. We're not talking about someone just starting out in life. We're talking about the average household buying food. Typically most households already have the utensils and pots and pans, etc.

Right. When I was 20, I had nothing, but I didn't have kiddos to feed either. It took many years, but I gradually built a decent kitchen, one pan/utensil at a time.

And I have *NEVER* spent $100 for anything kitchen-wise, though my husband once saved up money and bought me a stand-mixer, which is the only *fancy,expensive* item in my kitchen. We still do dishes by hand and get everything at Kmart. (and they have the best layaway for higher-priced items) Also, in the US, the working poor with kids get the EITC at income tax time. For many, that's several thousand in cash that is often spent on things like kitchen items (or mattresses, etc., basically the things that the working poor could never otherwise afford to buy)

Around here, gas is for heating. Electric heat is too expensive. (But either way, you gotta use energy, regardless of the source of it.) Also, our stove is electric, but when we lost our electricity due to being unable to pay the bill, we cooked on a propane camping stove. We also have a fire pit in the back yard, if need be.

That is very true.. A friend of mine.. 3 incomes (husband has 2 jobs), 2 kids, a dog,. living in a house that is really too small for them, is currently finding herself buying hot dogs, pasta and ramen because of all the furlough days her husband was forced to take for both jobs, since both his jobs are government. They are considered the working poor despite her masters degree and him having 2 jobs.. It's really sad when a family with that level of education and that many jobs are having their electricity turned off and cancelling their phones, just to keep their mortgage paid and their kids fed. Oh.. and they didn't get a tax refund or that earned income credit, they owe, despite claiming 0 at all the jobs. It's really sad.

I was 20, with a kid. It seems we are talking about things from a completely different view point. It's all relative to experience, where you live and what is available to you. You can have the whole "i pulled myself out of it, so you should be able to" mentality as long as you recognize that it's not easy, it's not the same for everyone and it's not always as easy as.. go buy chicken at the grocery store and cook it. Esp when you have other priorities that take presence over what ends up on your plate.

I totally agree with the escape velocity idea mentioned above. I also agree that people often squander their tax returns, if they get one, on things others deem frivolous. That's not the case always, but it does happen.

I think I'm gonna buy that 5lb bag of potatoes for $1.69 deal next time I see it. I had potatoes for lunch twice this week and they were great! Easy to nuke in the microwave in the morning and pack for work, and since I'm pretty much "meh" about potatoes they won't disappear during the week or weekend unless I'm packing a lunch. I've always tended not to buy potatoes since they'd go bad due to being ignored but you guys have inspired me! Here goes nothing :laugh:

:drinker:

Just be careful on storing them. Sometimes, I have found 10 lb bags for $2.49. You gotta buy it when it's a good deal like that and just figure out how to store it. I love potatoes, and a little goes a long way. Plus they are versatile. They can be a side or the main dish.