Paleo

Some evidence for early humans (and late australopithecines) eating meat:

- the earliest stone tools were made for the purpose of butchering animal carcasses, in particular for smashing up bones to obtain brains and bone marrow, which were excellent sources of fat and protein. the evidence for this is the remains of these early humans being found with stone tools and smashed up bones. the way that the bones are smashed up show that it was done with the kinds of tools found.

- this behaviour predates the origin of the genus Homo, i.e. australopithecines that slightly predate the origin of humans, yet are also the most morphologically similar to humans have similar stone tools, they are the earliest stone tool makers. Not long after, the genus Homo emerges. This strongly suggests that being able to extract brains and marrow from animal carcasses gave these proto-humans the protein, fat and calories needed to maintain a larger brain... the earliest humans were very similar to these australopithecines but had larger brains.

- there was a reduction in the size of proto-human teeth and the masseter muscle around this time as well. being able to subsist off softer foods means that it's no longer necessary to have a huge massater muscle. in apes, the large massater constrains brain size. the mutation that made this smaller - individuals with this would only have survived if they can get enough soft food to eat - thus enabled the skull expansion seen in early Homo to happen.

^^^ both these factors show that without eating meat (in particular, brains and bone marrow, not just muscle flesh) was necessary in order to evolve bigger brains. Compare this with the evolution of Australopithecus boisei, an evolutionary side branch in the hominin family tree, where they had a more gorilla-like diet (coarse vegetation and insects) and instead of evolving bigger and bigger brains, they evolved bigger and bigger teeth. Once nicknamed "nutcracker man" on account of the sheer size of their teeth and jaws. Meat eating = bigger brains. Plant eating = bigger jaws.

- throughout the evolution of humans, tools used for hunting and butchering animals have become more and more complex. Cut marks on animal bones prove that they were butchered using stone tools. The stone tools themselves show evidence in how they're used, i.e. microwear on the tool itself and also molecular evidence of what it's been in contact with. Many of them were hunting weapons (spearheads and much later on arrowheads too) or tools used to butcher animals, or prepare hides (e.g. stone scrapers for tanning hides). As mentioned earlier, stone tool use slightly predates the genus Homo and the earliest stone tools were used to butcher carcasses. Later stone tools were much more complex and used for many different purposes, but hunting and butchery were major uses for many tools.

- the robusticity of the human skull and skeleton increased steadily through the lower and middle palaeolithic era - most likely in response to hunting bigger and bigger animals. Neanderthals had injury rates and patterns similar to modern day rodeo riders, which strongly suggests that they regularly engaged in fighting with large herbivores.

- the animal bones found alongside early humans shows not only that they ate meat, but what species they ate. There is some debate in the earliest humans whether they were predominantly hunters or scavengers, but later humans were systematic hunters that regularly ate meat. Species include very large animals too, including mammoth, bison, hippo, rhino, etc.

- evidence taken from the bones, i.e. molecular analysis of them, can show the kinds of foods eaten by early humans, i.e. whether they ate plants or animals. This evidence is really interesting, for example neanderthals didn't eat fish, they got 100% of their protein from animal sources... while molecular evidence from teeth showed they also ate plant foods, which they cooked, i.e. omnovirous diet... protein from animal sources but plant foods for carbohydrate, vitamins, minerals and fibre.

- Homo sapiens ate a lot more seafood... see the remains of very very early Homo sapiens people in South Africa... humans living on the seashore exploiting coastal resources, evidence that they cooked and ate seafood a lot. Also very early H. sapiens remains elsewhere in Africa showed they ate a lot of hippos.

So you see, the suggestion that humans didn't evolve to eat meat flies in the face of a huge amount of evidence to the contrary... the above is just a brief overview.

Even if you look at other primates and go further back in evolution, e.g. ape evolution, all extant species of great ape are omnivores. Gorillas eat insects; chimps and bonobos eat small mammals, including using tools to hunt them in one subspecies of chimp and co-operative hunting of small monkeys. There's a general rule in primate biology, as in the larger brained primates are omnivorous, and the herbivorous primates have smaller brains. There's only one species of carnivorous primate and that's not related to humans, it has a little evolutionary branch of its own. Humans are omnivores, just like all the other great apes (and it's only due to semantics that humans are not generally considered to be a species of great ape, because we're in that clade).

You might want to join the Paleo/primal group here. The general forums will lead to whole lot of paleo-bashing and people telling you're stupid. Add me if you'd like.

^^THIS^^

The main boards are generally only welcoming to the S.A.D. and embrace the notion of "If it fits your macros".

Threads about alternatives to the S.A.D typically get derailed.

it's not paleo people being bashed in this thread right now

Before you try it, perhaps you should watch all or part of a 71 part analysis of the Paleo myth. Each well referenced chapter is between approx. 4-12 minutes.

.

It is quite thorough and complete, a serious tome of information not to be overlooked. Best of luck with your decision.

QUOTE
Welcome to The Primitive Nutrition Series! Created by someone who was nearly seduced by the Paleo Diet idea before going vegan, these videos provide a wide-ranging response to the evolution-inspired rationale for meat eating which so many have uncritically accepted.

Ever wonder...
Will fruit make me fat? Unlikely. See 49.
Is grass-fed beef an environmentally responsible food? This opens 70.
Weren't the Eskimos healthy eating a completely animal-based diet? 27 answers this.
Isn't there great research supporting low-carb diets? 52 looks at some of it.
Were our Ice Age ancestors low-carbers? Probably not. 11 explains.
Should I trust the advice of the primitive diet gurus? Watch them all!

These videos are intended to be viewed in order, from 1 to 71. See them all and you will never again fall for a fad diet. It's time to move away from gimmickery and hype, and toward a healthy and sustainable future. Let's start something positive!
UNQUOTE

LMFAO - I listened to the last minute of number 71 and heard to word vegan - Seriously dude.

Glad to see that you made an effort. Cheers for that.

One thing I have yet to witness on these threads is meat eater hijacking vegan threads. Do please treat us with the same respect.

You might want to join the Paleo/primal group here. The general forums will lead to whole lot of paleo-bashing and people telling you're stupid. Add me if you'd like.

^^THIS^^

The main boards are generally only welcoming to the S.A.D. and embrace the notion of "If it fits your macros".

Threads about alternatives to the S.A.D typically get derailed.

it's not paleo people being bashed in this thread right now

And meanwhile, another paleo thread has been hijacked with arguing.

well the vegan guy who was saying that paleo is wrong and humans evolved to be the vegan is the one who hyjacked the thread, I was arguing with him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egqf7k5Lzhk

You might want to join the Paleo/primal group here. The general forums will lead to whole lot of paleo-bashing and people telling you're stupid. Add me if you'd like.

^^THIS^^

The main boards are generally only welcoming to the S.A.D. and embrace the notion of "If it fits your macros".

Threads about alternatives to the S.A.D typically get derailed.

it's not paleo people being bashed in this thread right now

And meanwhile, another paleo thread has been hijacked with arguing.

well the vegan guy who was saying that paleo is wrong and humans evolved to be the vegan is the one who hyjacked the thread, I was arguing with him.

I guess I just don't see why EVERY thread that's about an eating style other than S.A.D./IIFYM gets hijacked. Not blaming you, just wishing folks here IN GENERAL could be a little more open minded about other people's health and fitness goals.
HE spams that same crap on every thread.

I have provided a link for reference. The arguments developed can be accepted or rejected by the viewer. It is just a suggestion for the OP to consider without any obligation. It appears that you dont seem to respect that the OP can make their own decisions on their own AFTER considering more than one point of view.

I asked you to explain your beliefs and you systematically refused to do so. I'm not sure you even understand the arguments that you claim to be supporting... or you don't really believe them.... one or the other.... simply providing a link to the same videos over and over isn't providing a reference... it's dodging the question you're being asked.

seriously, you're spamming this stuff all over the forum, yet you can't give an overview of what your beliefs are regarding this diet and the supposed evolutionary evidence it's based on, or explain why you believe it?

You'd make a really good politician, btw. You seem to be expert at not answering questions.

I have provided a link for reference. The arguments developed can be accepted or rejected by the viewer. It is just a suggestion for the OP to consider without any obligation. It appears that you dont seem to respect that the OP can make their own decisions on their own AFTER considering more than one point of view.

I asked you to explain your beliefs and you systematically refused to do so. I'm not sure you even understand the arguments that you claim to be supporting... or you don't really believe them.... one or the other.... simply providing a link to the same videos over and over isn't providing a reference... it's dodging the question you're being asked.

seriously, you're spamming this stuff all over the forum, yet you can't give an overview of what your beliefs are regarding this diet and the supposed evolutionary evidence it's based on, or explain why you believe it?

You'd make a really good politician, btw. You seem to be expert at not answering questions.

Your point is quite amusing. You would rather get bogged down in minutia than look at the broader picture. The link provided has 71 parts covering many topics, and has way more detail than ever could be covered in this string. It woud seem more prudent for the OP to review the information, and perhaps ask *you* some clarifying questions rather than see the exchange opinions in this format. The link was provided as a reference and review. It is too easy to have an opinion, as your posts strongly indicate.

which state (or constituency if you're British) are you running for election in? do you have your campaign all planned out? are you going to be in a particular party or an independent? And what do you plan to do when you get elected?

A broad picture is exactly what I *AM* asking you for.... you haven't given one at all. You haven't presented any kind of picture, you're just repeatedly spamming the same link and dodging questions like a politician.

If it weren't for the fact that you're spamming links all over the forum, I'd believe you were an expert troll. But you seem to have a vested interest in spamming these links all over the forum, while you're not actually prepared to voice your actual opinion on the topic. Are you being paid to spam these links? On commission? Affiliate marketing maybe?

The OP (or anyone else) can ask me whatever he or she wants to about human evolution. I'm quite happy to answer all questions on that topic to the best of my knowledge and direct people to more comprehensive sources to further their knowledge on the subject.