Why choose other diets over calorie counting?
Replies
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Slim fast or herbalife in particular, or even the Atkins diet or other fad diets?
Atkins isn't a fad diet. You eat real food like nuts and greens and cheese and meat. You watch your carbohydrate count. Been around since the 70s and sustainable. Not a fad. SlimFast drinks shakes and asks you to eat sensibly the rest of the time. Herbalife, shakes. Not equal. It's the orange in your apple comparison.Lots of those diets are just ways to create a deficit without having to count.
I agree. Non-fad diets like Atkins and Weight Watchers are basically this.^^
Some people need this structure. Some people struggle with cravings that are hard to manage and ignore.
Sometimes just the accountability to a community and/or the fact that you've spent money on it, is enough to keep you on course. This does work for some people.
I use self-education and the accountability of free resources and communities/forums to keep me on track.
There is really no shame in needing a little structure or help. I'm working it and succeeding. You have to want it bad and no matter how hard it is, keep working it. Regardless whether you need support or not.
Well said.
I agree about the structure comment especially.
As for people saying why spend 'loads of money'. Many of those mentioned do not cost 'load's. Buying a book or two, paying £5 a month for an online service or £10 for a meeting isn't loads...I mean, if I wasn't spending £21 for my gym membership and £5 for WW online I guess I would just use that money to buy cheap games on steam :laugh:0 -
And also groups like weight watchers etc where you have syns or points and complicate thing? And how do certain diets have "free foods" where you can eat as much fruit and veg as you want? Surely if you're going in to surplus with these "free foods" you're still going to put on weight?
My friend is a big lad, he's been on a diet with free foods and syns etc and hasn't really lost much at a all. In the same time I've lost 22lb for free using just portion control and very loose calorie counting. Some people think if you pay for a diet plan, it seems more worthy for one reason or another..
I mentioned an apple was around 100kcal but that was "free" for some reason?..
Just because the fruits and veggies are free doesn't mean you go overboard on them... I was doing weight watchers and started transitioning to MFP as I was near goal and tightening up the budget. I found I was only eating 1200 calories a day on WW even with the free fruits and veggies. They DO still recommend to eat a reasonable amount of them. ETA: Also wanted to say that the WW points calculations assume you will be eating the fruit and veggies already - much like setting your daily activity to lightly active, MFP assumes you will exercise. When WW switched from points to points plus - people complained that they had fewer daily points they could use, but loved that fruits were free! See what they did there?
Also - for me - there is no way I would have gotten as far as I did with WW if I'd been on a free site. I'm cheap and I won't waste money. So if I'm paying for it, I'm darned well going to use it. That's how I was with my diet back when I started. I honestly didn't really care much if I lost weight, but I cared about losing money. So I did both. I've been able to switch to MFP because I've become motivated by other things now. But it still took a while for that to come. You can't force yourself to be motivated by something after all, and money worked for me for a while! Now I'm motivated by feeling good digestively...
I think those kinds of diets have their place (the pay for ones that are still basically calorie counting).
I agree with OP though about the cleanses and stuff. I wouldn't be able to live on shakes alone. I also agree that some of the programs people go for might be absurdly expensive.
That being said, if I were a person who really liked drinking stuff and didn't really like chewing (you know a person could be this way), then maybe shakes are the way to go... if it's nutritionally balanced (which I think would be the hardest thing to find).0 -
Because other diets spend millions convincing us that their's is the best way. Because they use statements in their advertising that include phrases like "scientific studies", "doctors", and "research" and sometimes make the formula and rationale just a little too difficult to understand, making us rely on their current book, and the next one to come so they can make more money. This is a good thing for entrepreneurs to do. Because the before and afters are astonishing! And they promise results within the shortest period of time. Most of us would prefer a quick fix rather than long slow tedious work. Because celebrities who we trust and admire are endorsing a specific diet and we want to be just like them.0
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Unlike others here, I don't have any problem with people who try different "diets" in order to find out what works for them, and makes it easy for them to limit calories. As long as you're not convincing yourself that ridiculous pseudo-science like "cleanses" and fake miracle pills like raspberry keytones are anything but placebos, then try whatever you want.
Here's the thing to remember:
If you have to pay for it, it's BS. Shakeology, Slim Fast, etc., don't want to you lose weight; they want you to buy their products. So forget them. Instead of clinging to *products* to help you reach your goals, stick to *ways of eating.* Atkins works for some, and there's nothing to buy (if you don't want to), so as a beginner there's nothing wrong with finding out if that will work for you. Ditto for Paleo. And intermittent fasting. And even Weight Watchers.
All of these things make it easier for some people to more easily control their food intake, and so there's nothing wrong with them. If one doesn't work, move on and try something else. Or just count calories.0 -
I mix intermittent fasting with calorie counting but that's mostly cause I'd prefer to eat a few big meals in the after noon than eat small meals all day and be hangry all day. Never been much of a morning eater and eating first thing just leaves me hungry.0
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Lots of those diets are just ways to create a deficit without having to count.
I also prefer counting and the freedom and good sense of being able to construct my own food plan, based on what matters to me.
^ This is also what I wished I had said first
Most diets create a deficit and most diets do work, if you stick to them. Many diets are also sustainable to certain people. I speak from personal experience and I have friends who have been successful for decades doing different things that work for them. 0 -
I can think of so many reasons.
1. Marketing. Jenny Craig/Weight Watches/Slim Fast/etc. have put tons of money into advertisements, so when people think "I should go on a diet" they'll probably be likely to think of one of those. MyFitnessPal isn't really putting out lots of ads, I only know about it from a friend who suggested it.
2. Simplicity. For some people, the ease of having a prescribed meal plan is helpful, if they don't have time for planning all their own meals. I actually enjoying planning all my own meals, but it does take a lot of work to figure out all the nutrition info.
3. Accountability- A lot of those programs have check-ins and so forth that help people stay on track.
Idk, there's probably lots more reasons. It's never been something I've been interested in personally, but I've always been the highly independent type. Apparently one of my first complete sentences in life is "I want to get my own." Haha. So following someone else's plan would drive me nuts because I'd want to do my own thing, but I can understand the appeal, especially for busy people.0 -
Don't be ridiculous. There's just as many educated dieters opting for alternative approaches as there are those blindly following any diet. We're not stuck, we're not deprived, we're not unaware.Because people don't want to sound obsessed and think it's too much work to count calories... and they're all stuck in the 'good food, bad food' mentality and it doesn't even occur to them that they don't have to completely cut some foods to lose weight.
We're also just as successful (or unsuccessful) losing the weight and maintaining that weight loss as anyone else.0 -
Some people really benefit from the social aspect of group meetings. Heck we all have different learning styles and just reading something online may not work for some people.0
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I was on WW, and it worked when I was doing meetings. The social aspect and accountability was helpful. But when my schedule changed and I needed to do online-only, it wasn't worth the money and I had issues sticking with it. MFP has the same stuff and it's free.
I have no problem with different approaches - as long as they work. Different things work for different people as everyone is an individual - why judge their work ethic or commitment to losing weight?0 -
Low carb/Atkins isn't a fad. You can do low carb/Atkins without buying anything but the food itself.
Depends on who you talk to about it..lots start them but can't sustain them...they are hard to follow. I can't imagine eating very low carb...and I am not a big carb eater...
Low Carb and Atkins are not guarantees...you can gain weight while doing those particular eating plans...but you don't gain weight if you count calories and stay in maitenance or in a deficit...0 -
I have spent too many dollars to count over the years and I have been on too many diets to count.
BUT I can tell you my biggest downfall is always weighing and measuring my food and tracking what I eat. Bottom line is every diet does come down to deficit eating as was said in the first post.
This time I am being honest with myself and using myfitnesspal to track everything I eat even if I don't like what it says.
Attitude is everything. This time I am going to make it to my goal no matter how long it takes.
The best thing about weight watchers or any other group that you can join Including this one is the support you get from other people.0 -
Low carb/Atkins isn't a fad. You can do low carb/Atkins without buying anything but the food itself.
Depends on who you talk to about it..lots start them but can't sustain them...they are hard to follow. I can't imagine eating very low carb...and I am not a big carb eater...
Low Carb and Atkins are not guarantees...you can gain weight while doing those particular eating plans...but you don't gain weight if you count calories and stay in maitenance or in a deficit...
Just as lots of people start MFP and do calorie counting and stop.
The key about eating low carb and Atkins are understanding why they work. Several people count carbs AND calories.0 -
people are lazy and don't want to measure everything they eat0
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Lots of folks start MFP and then can't sustain it....Low carb/Atkins isn't a fad. You can do low carb/Atkins without buying anything but the food itself.
Depends on who you talk to about it..lots start them but can't sustain them...they are hard to follow. I can't imagine eating very low carb...and I am not a big carb eater...
Low Carb and Atkins are not guarantees...you can gain weight while doing those particular eating plans...but you don't gain weight if you count calories and stay in maitenance or in a deficit...0 -
To me, MFP, lose it, and low carb, slow carb, south beach, paleo, etc. etc. etc. have a lot in common. They all provide structure Do you want structure in terms of what to eat? Or how much?Slim fast or herbalife in particular, or even the Atkins diet or other fad diets?
Atkins isn't a fad diet. You eat real food like nuts and greens and cheese and meat. You watch your carbohydrate count. Been around since the 70s and sustainable. Not a fad. SlimFast drinks shakes and asks you to eat sensibly the rest of the time. Herbalife, shakes. Not equal. It's the orange in your apple comparison.Lots of those diets are just ways to create a deficit without having to count.
I agree. Non-fad diets like Atkins and Weight Watchers are basically this.^^
Some people need this structure. Some people struggle with cravings that are hard to manage and ignore.
Sometimes just the accountability to a community and/or the fact that you've spent money on it, is enough to keep you on course. This does work for some people.
I use self-education and the accountability of free resources and communities/forums to keep me on track.
There is really no shame in needing a little structure or help. I'm working it and succeeding. You have to want it bad and no matter how hard it is, keep working it. Regardless whether you need support or not.
BOTH have their place and value. If your issue is portion control, counting/weighing/measuring may make sense (to learn). If you are like I was and have no clue what or how to eat to lose and maintain, then having something with more structured food goals may make sense. And for some, doing both makes sense.
And, of course, folks grow and change. Their needs grow and change as well.
Why the need for a dichotomy at all? Why the need to make one be better than another?
They all have value, if we learn from them and can use some of what we learn to lose and then, IMPORTANTLY, to maintain.0 -
yeah, no.My mom has done multiple diets over the years: Jenny Craig, Ideal Protein, Visalus, a variation of the Bernstein diet, and a trainer she worked with for a short time gave her many different "detox" teas.
She's spent loads of money over the years, and ALWAYS gains the weight back, and then some. When I asked her why she doesn't try to do it on her own, her reply was "That's too hard".
I think laziness is a big factor for many people (I won't say all, because I'm sure some people have had success with some of these programs). They don't want to have to count, or think about it. They pay loads of money so that someone else will tell them what to eat & when.
Sorry, I'm not sure what part you disagree with? My mom and many others like her HAVE spent a lot of money over the years looking for a quick fix. And if you don't like that I think people are lazy, I did mention that I am not saying all people are.0 -
WW doesn't tell people they can eat all the fruit they want and it won't affect their weight loss. That is just a common opinion from people who glance at the plan and don't understand it. In effect, your produce for the day is pre-logged. You can skip eating it but you don't get to eat cookies instead.
The other day I added up the calories in my daily calcium chews, adult gummy vites and omega-3 supplements and it was close to 100 calories. I can log those items every single day, or I can just aim for say 1300 calories in food every day if I want my intake around 1400. Then I'm not tempted to skip the supplements in order to have some ice cream. That's all the 'free produce' thing is. I think it makes a lot of sense.
Anyway-- Different diet methods suit different people. Some of us rotate through a whole bunch of plans. Diet ADD, I guess. Each has its own advantages and disadvantages. What's best for you today isn't best for everyone today.
One con people don't seem to mention much about calorie counting is a lot of people will go to lengths to avoid math. With calorie counting, you usually need to estimate a reasonable intake goal, translate oz. to grams, fluid ounces vs. dry, learn logging tricks like '50 servings of a 1g food', dry pasta calories vs. cooked, recipe calories, etc. To the people it appeals to, it's no biggie. But most people don't like math or apps when it comes to their eating.0 -
I was referring to your false dichotomy: MFP and everything else. And the rest. I was not to your mom, obviously.
yeah, no.My mom has done multiple diets over the years: Jenny Craig, Ideal Protein, Visalus, a variation of the Bernstein diet, and a trainer she worked with for a short time gave her many different "detox" teas.
She's spent loads of money over the years, and ALWAYS gains the weight back, and then some. When I asked her why she doesn't try to do it on her own, her reply was "That's too hard".
I think laziness is a big factor for many people (I won't say all, because I'm sure some people have had success with some of these programs). They don't want to have to count, or think about it. They pay loads of money so that someone else will tell them what to eat & when.
Sorry, I'm not sure what part you disagree with? My mom and many others like her HAVE spent a lot of money over the years looking for a quick fix. And if you don't like that I think people are lazy, I did mention that I am not saying all people are.
I see that you've tried several times before (your profile) best of luck and I hope this time what you're doing works for you. cheers.0 -
One other con that comes immediately to mind: accounting for restaurant meals. This seems to be a challenge often mentioned here. Folks come up with good strategies...many end up looking like how I eat most days. Which is interesting.WW doesn't tell people they can eat all the fruit they want and it won't affect their weight loss. That is just a common opinion from people who glance at the plan and don't understand it. In effect, your produce for the day is pre-logged. You can skip eating it but you don't get to eat cookies instead.
The other day I added up the calories in my daily calcium chews, adult gummy vites and omega-3 supplements and it was close to 100 calories. I can log those items every single day, or I can just aim for say 1300 calories in food every day if I want my intake around 1400. Then I'm not tempted to skip the supplements in order to have some ice cream. That's all the 'free produce' thing is. I think it makes a lot of sense.
Anyway-- Different diet methods suit different people. Some of us rotate through a whole bunch of plans. Diet ADD, I guess. Each has its own advantages and disadvantages. What's best for you today isn't best for everyone today.
One con people don't seem to mention much about calorie counting is a lot of people will go to lengths to avoid math. With calorie counting, you usually need to estimate a reasonable intake goal, translate oz. to grams, fluid ounces vs. dry, learn logging tricks like '50 servings of a 1g food', dry pasta calories vs. cooked, recipe calories, etc. To the people it appeals to, it's no biggie. But most people don't like math or apps when it comes to their eating.
One real "pro": if you eat a lot of pre-packaged convenience foods, you just have to scan. Which, then is interesting, in that it's easier to eat at chains...0
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