Paying attention vs. paying compliments

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2

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  • SarahRuth♥
    SarahRuth♥ Posts: 609 Member
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    I want to come back to this. So just marking it to check later. :)
    (Sorry, have to leave for work now!!)
  • kao708
    kao708 Posts: 813 Member
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    The mere fact that we have a 'comments' section under our diary log would indicate that we are inviting people to 'comment'.

    If you dont want comments, dont have a friendsonly/public diary!! It's a simple matter of choice!

    Don't invite comments and then get the hump cos someone isn't an expert!! That's not the point of this site. Your friends are NOT experts, they are just 'friends' trying to support and help you! And perhaps share their successes with you?? The site is called My Fitness PALS, not my fitness EXPERTS!! You'd pay a lot of money for that kind of expert advice! :bigsmile:

    And I agree with the OP if you ARE going to comment then LOOK at the diary first!! :laugh:

    I totally agree. You've saved me from having to type it all out again! :bigsmile:
  • tattoodfreek
    tattoodfreek Posts: 520 Member
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    I think there's probably an appropriate time and place for all comments. The problem is, on here it's hard to tell which is which. If I was doing something wrong that I thought was fundamentally good, and had it pointed out to me with info that I didn't already know, I'd be very grateful. However, I normally log all things, good, bad, or ugly. I had a rough week last week, and made some really bad choices that I felt really crappy about, but chose to log them anyway to keep myself accountable. If someone had come along, looked at my diary, and in an attempt to be helpful commented about how crappy it was, I'd have felt even worse. Unless you've got a close relationship with a friend on here, and know their eating habits and patterns, it's hard to judge when it's appropriate to comment on something they are doing wrong.
  • runningneo122
    runningneo122 Posts: 6,962 Member
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    I think there's probably an appropriate time and place for all comments. The problem is, on here it's hard to tell which is which. If I was doing something wrong that I thought was fundamentally good, and had it pointed out to me with info that I didn't already know, I'd be very grateful. However, I normally log all things, good, bad, or ugly. I had a rough week last week, and made some really bad choices that I felt really crappy about, but chose to log them anyway to keep myself accountable. If someone had come along, looked at my diary, and in an attempt to be helpful commented about how crappy it was, I'd have felt even worse. Unless you've got a close relationship with a friend on here, and know their eating habits and patterns, it's hard to judge when it's appropriate to comment on something they are doing wrong.

    In your example I would ask you, "What's up?" and not bash you. When you make a series of good choices and suddenly change up, something's going on. Changing habits takes time and effort. Support requires interaction to know what is going on. Thanks for mentioning this.
  • binsylad
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    I am kind of sat on the fence with this one.

    I understand that in theory you should have a look at the diary, and then compliment - and of course potentially give constructive criticism.

    The fact that the person is here on this site trying to lose /gain weight - and showing the world how they are trying does NOT deserve a public grilling if they have not done it quite by the book.

    A nudge yes. Not everyone is perfect in anyway shape or form. I suspect amongst other things (Myself included) that many are estimating the Calorie portion v an Average Calorie Burn. ( I estimate the intake high and the exercise low) Instead of an HRM and Scales.

    We are all trying our best, and sometimes all that is needed is a little support, a pat on the back. Regardless of a loss or a gain.

    GO TEAM SOUTH / UK

    Mike
  • kelsully
    kelsully Posts: 1,008 Member
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    I think there's probably an appropriate time and place for all comments. The problem is, on here it's hard to tell which is which. If I was doing something wrong that I thought was fundamentally good, and had it pointed out to me with info that I didn't already know, I'd be very grateful. However, I normally log all things, good, bad, or ugly. I had a rough week last week, and made some really bad choices that I felt really crappy about, but chose to log them anyway to keep myself accountable. If someone had come along, looked at my diary, and in an attempt to be helpful commented about how crappy it was, I'd have felt even worse. Unless you've got a close relationship with a friend on here, and know their eating habits and patterns, it's hard to judge when it's appropriate to comment on something they are doing wrong.

    In your example I would ask you, "What's up?" and not bash you. When you make a series of good choices and suddenly change up, something's going on. Changing habits takes time and effort. Support requires interaction to know what is going on. Thanks for mentioning this.


    That is the other thing. I friend people...thus am willing to hear their input. However I am the type that puts in my News Feed that I am having an emotional time, or that I am kicking butt at the gym etc. Since I am sharing those parts in my life with my "friends" I would hope that would help them make appropriate comments about what is going on. I would not keep a "friend" if they were constantly nit picking my choices etc but if I were frustrated for a period of time and they were noticing a trend in my diary and thought they could help that is so appreciated. No one wants every choice landblasted but by paying attention before commenting...as the OP suggested we would be better prepared to give encouragement, support, advice and maybe even the ugly truth at times.
  • runningneo122
    runningneo122 Posts: 6,962 Member
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    Thanks binsylad and kelsully. Much appreciated.
  • carolinegeorgia
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    Oh God not another debate on eating back your exercise calories please. There must have been at least 10 threads on that last week.

    It's a very individual choice. I'm very active and have been for years. I have never been obese, have no emotional issues with food and merely need to lose a few pounds after an injury. In general I know what I'm doing.

    The last thing I would need is some complete stranger with no expertise in nutrition nor sports telling me what I need to do. Anyone making smart remarks when I haven't eaten back every single exercise calorie (a hugely debated issue anyway), when this isn't how I work, would be instantly de-friended.

    Totally agree, I don't eat all my exercise calories and for me it works, I'm not obese either, for a complete stranger to tell me I have to that is not an expert in this field is kinda strange if you ask me!!!
  • 305muscle
    305muscle Posts: 97 Member
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    great post man
  • backinthenines
    backinthenines Posts: 1,083 Member
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    backinthenines, it's great that you know what you're doing and know what works for you, but a lot of people don't, and those people try and try and don't see progress and become frustrated. Defriending someone because they offered a suggestion on your open diary is silly and just means you aren't interested in having friends that get results with another method and are willing to share.

    It's a pretty poor method of supporting each other to just defriend someone rather than respond in a way to attempt to educate them on why your goal and plan is a particular way and how it's producing results for you.

    God help me....

    I think if someone was constantly nitpicking in an uninformed way I would have every right to defriend them. It has nothing to do with not being able to take the truth or anything, I just couldn't be bothered.

    I'm all for attempting to educate people and that's what the forum is there for not my diary.

    There is also little point in attempting to educate people about my training methods etc unless they're also training for long distance triathlons.

    The point is we all have differet goals. The "friends" on my list who do what I do understand the tarining and comment appropriately. But if there was someone who would carry on telling me all the old wives tales that float around this forum such as "more than 30 mins of cardio is dangerous" and "training your obliques will make you look fat" and other such nonsense.... then I'm afraid I would give up on them eventually.
  • Lazyboy09
    Lazyboy09 Posts: 190 Member
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    God help me....

    ... if someone was constantly nitpicking in an uninformed way...

    ....if there was someone who would carry on telling me all the old wives tales that float around this forum such as "more than 30 mins of cardio is dangerous" and "training your obliques will make you look fat" and other such nonsense....

    I didn't notice in the discussion that these were the kinds of things that was happening, certainly I agree with these points. I'm pretty sure that no one will or has disagreed with this in this thread (I mean really, who would) but I don't think this was the focus of the post at all.

    It seemed to me that this post was against giving blind compliments and you lashed out against the OP and took it off on this tangent because you get hot about people telling you to eat your exercise calories* (and I don't know why people would be telling you this since you're obviously having success with your current plan).

    In conclusion, I think everyone** here would agree that no one likes people constantly nitpicking in an uninformed way and no one likes people to offer bad advice.

    Do you have any thoughts to add about blindly complimenting people when they are obviously acting counter productive to their own individual weight loss? It seems natural in a social environment that people would be willing to share the secrets of their success with people that are not having success left to their own devices rather than just telling them "good job!" every time they make a status update.


    *not to inflame you further if I'm misinterpreting what's happening here, my comments are not meant as an attack
    **yes, I'm taking a gamble and speaking for everyone on this point even though it's possible that some people might not agree because it would give them a reason to have an argument, and I've been accused of liking to argue just for the sake of it
  • backinthenines
    backinthenines Posts: 1,083 Member
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    Do you have any thoughts to add about blindly complimenting people when they are obviously acting counter productive to their own individual weight loss? It seems natural in a social environment that people would be willing to share the secrets of their success with people that are not having success left to their own devices rather than just telling them "good job!" every time they make a status update.
    *not to inflame you further if I'm misinterpreting what's happening here, my comments are not meant as an attack
    **yes, I'm taking a gamble and speaking for everyone on this point even though it's possible that some people might not agree because it would give them a reason to have an argument, and I've been accused of liking to argue just for the sake of it

    LOL You're welcome and I'm not 'inflamed'. :wink: :flowerforyou:

    You're absolutely right and I think if I remember right I did say that "well done you" comments, when someone is doing something counterproductive or even dangerous is of course not helpful.

    I think in terms of how to support people sensitively and effectively, I think I'm going back to what I said previously about chosing the right way to communicate, and sometimes the public wall may not be the right way? There might be cases where a helpful suggestion may be better received when it comes via a personal message rather than the public wall for all to see.

    I think the one thing people need to bear in mind is that although you're "friends" with people, they are essentially strangers, and you're always treading a fine line between patronising someone quite knowledgeable, or taking the wind out of a motivated newbie, or upsetting someone who just had a bad day etc etc.

    I am very careful telling people you must do this or you mustn't do that, because it's different stroke for different folks. Where I give my opinion on a thread (for example advice on how to chose a good running shoe etc) I make sure I know my stuff and give a decent explanation. The running shoe question is a great example actually cos it happens a lot. Someone comes and asks "I am running more often and need to find good running shoes, what do I do?" and someone comes along and say "buy Asics Kayanos they're great"... Well that's probably well intentioned advice, but if that person is a neutral, non-pronating runner s/he he may spend $90 on a pair of shoes that within a matter of month will get them injured because it's not suitable to their gait.

    Of course you can argue it's the thread starter's responsibility to assess which advice might be more valid, but people are sometimes not knowledgeable and take people's word as gospel.
  • SarahRuth♥
    SarahRuth♥ Posts: 609 Member
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    I don't think that anyone should really have expectations of anyone on their friends list. Let me explain why...

    As others have said, everyone uses the site differently. Personally, it makes me happy when others comment on my diary. It keeps me motivated, helps me try and remember to be accountable, and helps keep me coming back to the site. I try to return the favor when I can. When I consider the comments left, I put more weight on the intentions of the person leaving the comment than I do on what they actually said.

    I don't eat *right*. At least not yet. I make small changes where and when I can. I can't, for a number of reasons, do it all at once. So if someone were to analyze my diary they would probably have a whole lot to say about it. And, frankly, I wouldn't want to be constantly in a position of feeling like I have to explain myself. I would appreciate the attempt once or twice, because the person has good intentions, but beyond that I would just get annoyed and frustrated. I know what I need to do, I just can't do it right now... so I don't want people harping on me for it.

    Next, I don't necessarily log everything. I log throughout the day and when I get to the end if I have some calories left I might decide to have a snack after I have already *completed* my diary. So, while you might see that message pop up (and I'm not sure I have any control over that) and you might see that I was low on calories, you wont know if I decided to have something to make that up later. Sometimes I complete the entry to see what it tells me I'll weigh in five weeks... LOL. Another example, I don't log water. I drink a whole lot of water, and I know that I'm okay in that area, and it doesn't affect my calories, so I don't bother tracking it. I have had people mention that I should drink more water... I appreciate the intentions, but I easily drink 10-12 glasses a day, I just don't log it so they wouldn't know that.

    Third, I do not expect everyone on my list to have the time to review the diary of everyone on their list. It's a little much to ask of random people you have met online and only communicate with via a fitness website. Most people here are not nutritionists or fitness expert's, so I take what everyone says with a grain of salt anyway. If someone says something I'm interested in, I will research further on my own and I appreciate the advice and good intentions, but it is NOT expected. I do not have the time to review everyone's diary. Sometimes I do it here and there, but I'm rarely even on the computer to do so. Most of my activity on this site is done from my phone. I'm typing this on my phone right now, and trust me... it's a pain in the behind!! I have actually felt guilty at times because I have some friends who are very active on this site and comment on everything and I feel bad that I miss a lot. I don't want or need the guilt. I log my food from my phone, I log my exercise from my phone, and sometimes I'll go as far as commenting on my news feed or forum threads like this, But my phone doesn't handle the community features of this site well yet, so that's not typical for me.

    Basically, I think we should just accept the support and encouragement for what it is. It is being offered to you with the best of intentions and that is what is important.

    Plus... I think that just the act of tracking your food and exercise and posting it for others to review deserves a pat on the back no matter what the diary itself says!
  • Riliye
    Riliye Posts: 44 Member
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    I'm not sure there's much here to be said that hasn't been said already, but here's my two cents. I have my diary set to friends only for accountability purposes. I suck at self-motivating, so even knowing that the *potential* is there for other people to see if I give in to those horrible cravings and "fall off the wagon" is motivation in itself. By allowing my friends to see my diary I open myself to all sorts of different advice. Some of it may be good; some of it may be awful.

    That being said, I generally follow a personal rule of mine when this happens -- if one person says it, and neither of the two of you are fitness/nutrition experts, their advice is mostly their word against yours. Do you know what you're doing? If so, good! Ignore it. Does what they say make sense? If you think so, look into it. If not...oh well. Now, should more than one person say the same thing...perhaps you should take a look at what you're doing...IF you're just kind of fumbling around in the dark like I am. Advice is just that -- advice, and even with so much fire on the site about exercise calories, I did some digging and decided my own opinion, which weighs more to me than that of some random friend (Though I love my friends...I just can't be as sure they took the time that I did).

    But realistically, I think I agree with one of the previous posters who said they were on the fence about this issue. I would welcome advice, but at the same time if it was about something I was very knowledgeable about and contradicted that knowledge, I'd probably ignore it.

    Just my two cents. =)
  • kittytrix
    kittytrix Posts: 557 Member
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    Very good post. I agree. In one of my posts to someone I made the comment that people should not congratulate people just because they lost weight. While that is a major component of this site, the more important one is to get healthy. I never meant to attack or offend, but I think it may have come across that way. I was more concerned about someone's health. After reaching out to that person, I feel my concerns were put to rest.

    I think this is a great post.

    Uplift each other but not blindly.
  • runningneo122
    runningneo122 Posts: 6,962 Member
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    Thanks for covering my back, LazyBoy!! PresheateYa !!:bigsmile:
  • vixen325
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    yes I agree it is important to be honest and not just tell a person what they want to hear sometimes the truth isn't always pretty
  • smalltowngirl504
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    :) Good post, I enjoyed reading it....!!! and I agree -900 calories cannot be a good thing!
  • SarahRuth♥
    SarahRuth♥ Posts: 609 Member
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    :) Good post, I enjoyed reading it....!!! and I agree -900 calories cannot be a good thing!

    I've eaten 941 calories today. With my exercise, my net calories is 704. I'm just not hungry. I thought about eating more to try and get in *enough* calories, but I'm just not hungry and I won't force myself to eat when I'm not hungry. Yesterday I was way hungry, and I went over. I just think that the number of calories a person eats per day isn't quite so clear cut as we're making it out to be here. Just a thought. :)
  • runningneo122
    runningneo122 Posts: 6,962 Member
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    Sarah, it depends on what you're eating. If you're eating lots of protein and veggies then your calorie count might seem low for how full you feel. It is calories in vs. calories out, but the things to remember is your BMR and TDEE.

    Your body needs food to function. Base Metabolic Rate is what your body needs to function with zero activity. Add in the activity level for your average day and you get what is needed to do your basic functions and move around. Add exercise and you need that much more to keep the body's energy level up. The calorie goal that MFP gives you every morning has your defecit figured in. 500 per day for each pound you want to lose in one week. It assumes that you won't exercise. When you tell it you did, it adds those cals to your daily goal.

    I have read a few books on weight loss and they all say eat MORE to lose weight... the exer cals. All the people on here saying that it's being debated don't ever cite a reliable source if they cite a source at all. I defer to the people who have written books about it based on their experience training thousands of clients as a professional personal trainer and not someone who only says that it is a myth and can't back it up. If you want to read the book I swear by, here are the review links:

    http://www.fitnesstipsforlife.com/burn-the-fat-feed-the-muscle-complete-review.html

    http://www.burnthefatblog.com/archives/2009/12/cheating_on_your_diet.php

    I reccomend you read these also:

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/3047-700-calories-a-day-and-not-losing

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/10589-for-those-confused-or-questioning-eating-your-exercise-calo

    The person in the OP was not at a "defecit" like we are discussing here, but this was a defecit BELOW TDEE. That is headed toward ketosis. Karen Carpenter died in her thirties from eating so little and exercising her butt off. The body needs energy and it will take it from wherever is closest and that means the internal organs and muscle tissue. As I stated before, I defer to the professionals.