Whole mess 'O' research to peruse.

Bump - for later reading, can't read it all in one hit! Phew!

I'm really looking forward to the bit titled "a fat cell is more than just a bag of fat" LOL!

But as to article one it's all very interesting but what does it mean?
All the steroid hormones are fat soluble so what do lower plasma levels actually mean - is the hormone all in the fat rather than the blood?
Does the change in adiposity lead to a change in hormone production/sequestration?
Or does the change in hormone production lead to the change in body composition?

Chicken or Egg? Let them researches keep researching until then, diet and exersize it is.

Aahh, back to some intellectual discussion. remind me never to go back to that "other" topic again, beginner mistake I guess!
I shouldn't have used "inflammatory" language. Hah Pun based on further reading.

I get the point about the previous article, I guess it doesn't matter if it's chicken or egg, if you have tummy fat, fasting doesn't help you burn fat, but if you're normal weight it does - maybe the source of all the arguments here - those of us overweight and larger will not burn fat by fasting - even the shortish periods from dinner/night before until breakfast, but those in the normal weight range will??

I just read the?editorial "Intergrative view of obesity" and I found it really interesting.

Firstly on a purely intellectual level ( I am medical, but not much to do with nutrition) I found it interesting that fat cells die if you are obese. I had this wierd idea (or maybe 15 years ago when I was at uni the research wasn't out) fat cells didn't die they just got bigger and smaller and the only way you reduced the number was by removing them surgically! The activation of macrophages is also really interesting because this whole "inflammatory" activation thing is usually bad and results in medical events related to clotting - heart disease, DVT/PE and stroke amongst others . So we've always known obese people are at risk of these things statistically but it seems researches are really filling in the "why".

But some really overweight people never seem to get any heart disease or obvious medical complication (other than the gallbladder that's getting removed or the knee that's getting replaced which is why I see them) and I wonder if it's to do with some of the stuff later in the article under "intergrative solutions" like maintaining a high fresh fruit and vegetable/antioxidant diet most of the time? My mum has been obese most of her life but has always loved blueberries - maybe they truly deserve the "superfood" title!

It would be nice to spread the word that metabolic syndrome was
"positively correlated with
high-glycemic-index food intake (high-fat meats, cheeses, and
processed foods) and negatively correlated with a low intake of
low-glycemic-index foods (vegetables, soy, fruit, green and
black tea, low-fat dairy desserts, seeds and nuts, and fish)"

and that (with editing)
"the DASH diet- increased fruit, vegetables, low-fat
dairy, and whole grains, resulted in a lowered intake of saturated
fat, total fat, and cholesterol and higher HDL (good) cholesterol and
lower triglycerides, systolic blood pressure, diastolic blood
pressure, and fasting blood glucose in men and women,
and reduced most of the metabolic risks in both men and
women that are known to be associated with insulin resistance
and metabolic syndrome"

I guess we all have been told that fruit and veg, wholegrains and low fat are good for us but it's nice to see some research. (not that I went and read those studies but I trust the editor and peer review process - risky I know just go to retractionwatch!)

Edited to add that dodgy pun at the beginning :laugh:

I tried to read the 3rd article but it makes my brain hurt. This is my summary:

"We studied 2 day long low calorie diets but we did it in normal weight people who never diet so they wouldn't consciously avoid overeating after the calorie restriction ended. All we noticed was they eat more carbohydrates (but not calories) afterwards and this correlates with the decreased insulin levels during the calorie restricted time and even though the leptin was reduced during calorie restriction time it wasn't associated with an increase in calories eaten after."

Umm.... is this a useless study?? Or does it show normal weight people do not over eat after a severe (60%) calorie restricted 2 days. I guess we need the study that shows that obese or overweight people do overeat after the end of severe calorie restriction I wonder if it's coming up....

Again maybe the source of the arguments - it seems normal weight people don't suffer if they fast or calorie restrict.

Bump to read later

bump to read later

I thought this study was important for 2 reasons.
1st because it shows that at least for the short term, men with no perceived food issues don't have a problem with varying their food intake for short periods. I found this to be interesting. Psychologically, they did what comes naturally, when being deprived of food their body tried to preserve blood sugar somewhat, and when in "recovery" they eat a little extra. this is exactly what one would expect. They didn't gorge themselves after a short famine state as people with food issues may do. And their insulin responded in kind, jumping up a little to balance out the extra carbohydrate intake.

and

2nd leptin, the hormone that tells us we are hungry, was not raised proportionally on the days that the "re-feeding" occurred, saying that in a healthy normal person, the body doesn't "panic" and overeat. It's only in people that there is already a strong psychological connection to food in some way that the brain does "weird things" with regard to re-feeding. Just thought it was an interesting study in contrast to what we on MFP normally read. I.E. most of the stuff we (I at least) look at are related to obesity and eating disorders, it's good to look at the other side sometimes and see what there is to see.

Ok, but it seems to me that another important aspect of this is that, while they did NOT overeat in cals, they were inclined to eat carbs. Particularly, this could be key for overeaters. To me, this sounds like carb-loading. Obviously not on purpose, but even in a moderate amount, an important result. We don't know the result would be the same in obese subjects, but my guess would be that, if anything, the tendency to overeat and increase carb intake could be even worse. Because this would possibly contribute to "yo-yoing" - especially IF this same scenario happened with a person who had dysfunctional relationships with food. Basically, if you try to diet for a few days, on a greatly decreased cal intake, and then return to normal eating - or, more likely in an overeater, to binge - and there is an "instinctual" high ratio of carbs, that could certainly contribute to a "starve/binge" diet pattern. Obviously, this could mean weight increase - and a repeating cycle.