Conflicting info EVERYWHERE: Eating back exercise calories, or not? ? ? ? ?
Remaking_Me
Posts: 62 Member
I've been really lacking energy lately, eating between 1375-1500 cals a day. I weigh 180lbs approx, and I workout 1 hr, 6 days a week: 3 lifting, and 3 cardio or cardio and a little abs.
In my previous experiences with MFP I never lost enough weight to stay motivated--- for a number of reasons. In June 2014, I met a woman who sells herbalife, and she encouraged me to increase my protein intake until I was full enough that I didn't have room for excess carbs, and to help me curb cravings.
CHA-CHING. !!! That was it. Once I was eating 80-110 grams of protein daily, my meal sizes shrank, my energy boosted, and the fat began to melt off. Even if I was eating 1600+ cals a day!
Since then, I switched gyms, and have now had 5 'professionals' give me different advice. I work out with two friends who are 50+lbs and 30+lbs lighter than I. Their trainers told them to NEVER eat back their workout cals (in fact, they've been told not even to TRACK their cals burned) and I, on the other hand, had been having good luck eating as MANY PROTEIN CALORIES as I want, even into the evening- and the weight still came off.
In front of those friends, I was told I was doing things wrong, and that they would help me do it right and get better results. I was embarrassed and frustrated.
I decided to 'trial' this eating less thing, and here's whats happened.
I have less energy, I am dragging my body to the gym and forcing my workouts, and, my weight plateaued solidly. That was my whole month of Mid-Aug through Sept- eating 1250-1400 cals max, with the same workout schedule. It sucked.
Now its October, and Im back to the way I was doing things before. After only 10 days my inches have dropped again; Im not hungry, Im sleeping better and have decent energy.
I am SO confused about this topic, as I have read explanations for:
-eating back NO exercise calories
-eating back some/a percentage of exercise calories
-eating back ALL your exercise calories (making your "Net" and "Goal" calories on MFP match)
....and each explanation I have, makes total sense in and of itself when discussing only that perspective. Start comparing these perspectives and there is so much conflicting data out there, I want to lose my mind.
Are bodies all so different that the plan that works for each person, varies so much?
Is there no constant here, so I can know if I am doing it right?
I want to lose weight and inches, though I know inches are more important 24/7.
Someone give me some advice here- I dont want to talk to the people at my gym about it.
They're jerks.
Sincerely,
Working-my-A**-off-Emily
I dont wanna work in circles here. HELP.
In my previous experiences with MFP I never lost enough weight to stay motivated--- for a number of reasons. In June 2014, I met a woman who sells herbalife, and she encouraged me to increase my protein intake until I was full enough that I didn't have room for excess carbs, and to help me curb cravings.
CHA-CHING. !!! That was it. Once I was eating 80-110 grams of protein daily, my meal sizes shrank, my energy boosted, and the fat began to melt off. Even if I was eating 1600+ cals a day!
Since then, I switched gyms, and have now had 5 'professionals' give me different advice. I work out with two friends who are 50+lbs and 30+lbs lighter than I. Their trainers told them to NEVER eat back their workout cals (in fact, they've been told not even to TRACK their cals burned) and I, on the other hand, had been having good luck eating as MANY PROTEIN CALORIES as I want, even into the evening- and the weight still came off.
In front of those friends, I was told I was doing things wrong, and that they would help me do it right and get better results. I was embarrassed and frustrated.
I decided to 'trial' this eating less thing, and here's whats happened.
I have less energy, I am dragging my body to the gym and forcing my workouts, and, my weight plateaued solidly. That was my whole month of Mid-Aug through Sept- eating 1250-1400 cals max, with the same workout schedule. It sucked.
Now its October, and Im back to the way I was doing things before. After only 10 days my inches have dropped again; Im not hungry, Im sleeping better and have decent energy.
I am SO confused about this topic, as I have read explanations for:
-eating back NO exercise calories
-eating back some/a percentage of exercise calories
-eating back ALL your exercise calories (making your "Net" and "Goal" calories on MFP match)
....and each explanation I have, makes total sense in and of itself when discussing only that perspective. Start comparing these perspectives and there is so much conflicting data out there, I want to lose my mind.
Are bodies all so different that the plan that works for each person, varies so much?
Is there no constant here, so I can know if I am doing it right?
I want to lose weight and inches, though I know inches are more important 24/7.
Someone give me some advice here- I dont want to talk to the people at my gym about it.
They're jerks.
Sincerely,
Working-my-A**-off-Emily
I dont wanna work in circles here. HELP.
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Replies
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You've found what works for you, but you don't stick with it because people tell you to do something different?0
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Carry on doing what works for you and don't talk to the people at your gym about it. I hear they're jerks.0
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You know you're doing it right because it's working. You're losing weight AND feel healthy. That's gold right there. If they keep bugging you tell them what you're doing is working for you, but thanks for the advice. The best way to figure out what works for you is exactly what you've been doing, experiment, track your results and stick with what your body responds best to.0
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As I see it, I need to maintain a calorie deficit to lose weight - every calorie counts. I work hard to get a calorie deficit and I am not going to waste that hard work for a few seconds of eating pleasure. So no eating back any exercise calories for me.
If someone can come up with a science-verifiable reason why I MUST eat back my exercise calories, I will look at their evidence. Rumour, anecdotes, the guy at the gym, Aunt Flossie, TV shows, iffy web sites do not count as science-verifiable evidence.0 -
If it's getting you the results you want and you feel good, you're doing it right. I've always eaten a portion of my exercise calories back. Otherwise my workouts suffer and I end up stuffing my face from undereating.0
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It sounds your way of doing things is working for you and you feel much better and healthier going it your way. I congratulate you on your successes so far and the others to come!
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Personally, I try not to eat back exercise calories. However, some days I do because of cravings or eating out or whatever. And when I do, I don't beat myself up over it.
I figure - listen to your body and do what works for you.0 -
If it's getting you the results you want and you feel good, you're doing it right. I've always eaten a portion of my exercise calories back. Otherwise my workouts suffer and I end up stuffing my face from undereating.
YES!!! That is what happens to me! I'll be fine til 7:30pm and suddenly I want to eat a house. ////Which is why Im so angry at the imbecilic advice Ive been given- nay, harassed with.\\\\
--- Time to set my dairy to private and tell everyone to piss off....... or so it sounds like.
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As I see it, I need to maintain a calorie deficit to lose weight - every calorie counts. I work hard to get a calorie deficit and I am not going to waste that hard work for a few seconds of eating pleasure. So no eating back any exercise calories for me.
If someone can come up with a science-verifiable reason why I MUST eat back my exercise calories, I will look at their evidence. Rumour, anecdotes, the guy at the gym, Aunt Flossie, TV shows, iffy web sites do not count as science-verifiable evidence.
Evidence? Easy. MFP is designed to have you eat back your exercise calories. The calorie deficit is already built into your calorie goal, before factoring in exercise.
OP the confusion you're experiencing is due to different methods of calculating calorie goals. MFP is set up with a deficit not including exercise, so you can lose weight without exercising. When you exercise, you add those calories back into keep a consistent deficit. People who don't use this site use a different method of calculating a calorie goal. That method includes exercise, so you wouldn't eat them back in that case. It's really six of one, half a dozen of the other, as both methods, when calculated correctly, should give about the same overall result.0 -
Keep doing what works for you. If you're losing weight at a reasonable rate and you feel good then you're doing it right. Everybody has their pet theory, just look at all the different dietary regimens there are and everybody swears theirs is the best. It is confusing.
I try to net somewhere between my BMR and sedentary TDEE. It very easy to overestimate exercise calories so people often don't eat all of them back, only some. Some people eat all of them, some people half, some people none. You don't want to go below 1200 net calories because you'll start losing muscle.0 -
You have a method that works for you so stick with that.
I think its pretty straightforward.
The other explanations are to do with the size of the deficit you want.
1. -eating back NO exercise calories- means if you are using the net calories method, then you are increasing the deficit by how much you exercise on top of the amount already factored in by MFP i.e 500 cal per day per 1lb you have agreed to lose.
i.e 2000 normally nut you decide you wnat to lose 1lb a week so MFP stes you at 1500.
Any exrcise will add to the size of the deficit. 500+ exercise.
2. -eating back some/a percentage of exercise calories
As you already have 1lb of weight loss factored in by the 500 deficit, if you dont wnat to be as severe, then you can eat some of the exercise calories. The reason people suggest a % is usually because the estimates by MFP are overgenerous or peoples estimation of their own calories burned or effort put in is exaggerated. To avoid eating too many back people select a % so the deficit is intact. Eating 50% would mean you can allow for the inaccuracy of estimate to be 100% more.
3. -eating back ALL your exercise calories (making your "Net" and "Goal" calories on MFP match)
This relies on having an accurate record of burns, maybe you use a HRM in the correct way. the danger is if you are using the wrong number then you could eat more than you burned which will carry over and decrease the diet deficit. This will make your diet deficit smaller and you will lose less weight.
If you get it right then you get to eat more food but lose at a slower rate.
So what should you do? your choice it depends whether you wnat to eat more food in which case choose option 3 if you have an accurate record or option 2 and guess how much the estimates are out by or use 2 as a compromise.
Pick option 1 if you want to emphasise max deficit/weight loss.
I choose 1 because exercise doesnt make me hungrier unlike many people. If im hungry though or want a treat then I will eat some exercise calories knowing that the inbuilt deficit based on diet alone will still be intact.
The only other point is that if you are using the tde method then your exercise is already factored into your calorie allowance. Only exercise in excess of that which has already been inccluded might be eaten back. I use the net method.
Hope that makes sense but its late....
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If you listen to all the fitness gurus, you will receive tons of different opinions. Whatever you want to do, there is some fitness guru out there to support it. Want to weigh 250 pounds? Someone will tell you it's quite healthy. Want to starve yourself for days? Someone else will tell why that's a good idea. Cut carbs, cut fat, no meat, junk food all the time - no matter WHAT you want to do, someone will tell you that's a good choice.
You have to make up your own mind about what you want to do.
A lot of people eat half back. I eat to my hunger. You have to do what is right for you.
Good luck.0 -
You've already found your solution. If you're hungry, try eating back a portion of the exercise calories.0
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As mentioned above, everyone is different. You have found what works for you, then it IS THE RIGHT THING regardless of what the supposed gym experts have said. You said it yourself, you have energy, sleep well, feel full, working out hard and loosing inches -
Continue the way YOU have been doing it, and you are using a winning formula, well done to you Emily (*)0 -
If you listen to all the fitness gurus, you will receive tons of different opinions. Whatever you want to do, there is some fitness guru out there to support it. Want to weigh 250 pounds? Someone will tell you it's quite healthy. Want to starve yourself for days? Someone else will tell why that's a good idea. Cut carbs, cut fat, no meat, junk food all the time - no matter WHAT you want to do, someone will tell you that's a good choice.
You have to make up your own mind about what you want to do.
A lot of people eat half back. I eat to my hunger. You have to do what is right for you.
Good luck.
So true. (unfortunately)
Thanks. I think because I 'dont know what Im doing' I was just looking for someone to give me permission to feel good about the choices I am making, in lieu of being told by everyone that I am 'wrong'.
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I do think our bodies all respond differently. I can totally understand your frustration with the conflicting answers. I over research things and I drive myself crazy until I just throw my hands up n the air and give up. This time dieting I'm trying to just figure out what works for me and not worry about what works for others. Eating back the excercise calories is working well for you. That's wonderful becaus it means you get more food (YAY!) Keep doing that and if for some reason it stops working, well then try the other way. For now, I am eating back 75% of my excercise calories. If I don't lose weight doing that then I'll re-adjust.
Good luck and congrats on your success thus far!0 -
Studies of pro athletes who fast for Ramadan show their energy levels and performance don't suffer during fasts. I think for most people it's a placebo effect. They feel like eating more gives them more energy. I fast regularly and probably feel more energetic on fasting days. Fullness causes lethargy and sleepiness.
We're designed to use stored fat calories for energy just like we don't need to eat in the middle of our workouts or work out on a full stomach. We have energy stores from past meals, be they today or yesterday or last month.
But do what works for you. There is no one right way.0 -
The sooner you stop giving a chit what other people think, the happier you'll be. If the know-it-alls and crabapples are disapproving, so what.SetFreeEmily wrote: »If you listen to all the fitness gurus, you will receive tons of different opinions. Whatever you want to do, there is some fitness guru out there to support it. Want to weigh 250 pounds? Someone will tell you it's quite healthy. Want to starve yourself for days? Someone else will tell why that's a good idea. Cut carbs, cut fat, no meat, junk food all the time - no matter WHAT you want to do, someone will tell you that's a good choice.
You have to make up your own mind about what you want to do.
A lot of people eat half back. I eat to my hunger. You have to do what is right for you.
Good luck.
So true. (unfortunately)
Thanks. I think because I 'dont know what Im doing' I was just looking for someone to give me permission to feel good about the choices I am making, in lieu of being told by everyone that I am 'wrong'.
Everyone does things differently, which makes life more interesting and more fun.
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Use the empirical method, meaning learn what works by experimentation. It is likely to be different for different people. I get weirdly hyper on very low calories and have an edgy energy that would have me working out 3 hours a day when I have time. But you mention on MFP that you've had only 600 calories today but worked out for hours and a million people would attack you.
Do what works for you and ignore people who are pushing an agenda 0 -
When using MFP NEAT (non-exercise activity thermogenesis) approach, the calories that you are given to net are your calories for daily, non-exercise activity. Once you exercise, you log it in order to eat at a similar deficit each day. Not exercising doesn't remove your deficit.
So... log and eat back all your calories. If your weight loss is less than ~4lbs a month (or ~2lbs if you don't have much to lose) then either drop your net a bit or eat back 75% of the exercise calories instead (so log 75% of the time and eat all of those calories back to make this easier).
If you don't eat back exercise calories you are doing the wrong method. TDEE method does not involve eating back exercise because it's already included into your daily intake.0 -
The sooner you stop giving a chit what other people think, the happier you'll be. If the know-it-alls and crabapples are disapproving, so what.SetFreeEmily wrote: »If you listen to all the fitness gurus, you will receive tons of different opinions. Whatever you want to do, there is some fitness guru out there to support it. Want to weigh 250 pounds? Someone will tell you it's quite healthy. Want to starve yourself for days? Someone else will tell why that's a good idea. Cut carbs, cut fat, no meat, junk food all the time - no matter WHAT you want to do, someone will tell you that's a good choice.
You have to make up your own mind about what you want to do.
A lot of people eat half back. I eat to my hunger. You have to do what is right for you.
Good luck.
So true. (unfortunately)
Thanks. I think because I 'dont know what Im doing' I was just looking for someone to give me permission to feel good about the choices I am making, in lieu of being told by everyone that I am 'wrong'.
Everyone does things differently, which makes life more interesting and more fun.
Agreed about not worrying about what other people think. But as you practice that, if it helps any I'll add another to the bandwagon of if your way works for you and you feel good then do it.
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This is what my doctor & dietician told me:
1 - Don't eat back exercise calories. Most people underestimate what they eat, most machines & computers overestimate calories burned.
2 - Eat 10x your healthy goal weight (based on BMI) in calories.
In reality, what I do is most of the time I'm doing both of those, but once in a while I go over, eat back some of my exercise calories, and I don't stress about it... because I'm usually well under. It's working for me.
(And don't worry too much about BMR. My total/actual calorie intake has been consistently under my BMR for months. Net is waaaaay under. My doctors are happy with my health, in every possible way.)
If that's what works for you, do it. Why listen to anyone else? You're feeling better, sleeping better, losing inches. Keep doing what you're doing!I've been really lacking energy lately, eating between 1375-1500 cals a day. I weigh 180lbs approx, and I work out 1 hr, 6 days a week.
I decided to 'trial' this eating less thing, and here's what's happened:
I have less energy, I am dragging my body to the gym and forcing my workouts, and my weight plateaued solidly. That was my whole month of Mid-Aug through Sept- eating 1250-1400 cals max, with the same workout schedule. It sucked.
Now it's October, and 'Im back to the way I was doing things before. After only 10 days my inches have dropped again; I'm not hungry, I'm sleeping better and have decent energy.
It was wrong of them to embarrass you & castigate you, especially in front of anyone else.In front of those friends, I was told I was doing things wrong, and that they would help me do it right and get better results. I was embarrassed and frustrated...
Someone give me some advice here - I don't want to talk to the people at my gym about it.
They're jerks.
I'd avoid them too. I might talk with the manager.
I'm guessing that they probably charge for their services, and that's why they're trying to tell you you need their help?
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If it ain't broke, don't fix it 0
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Well, they're also only fasting during daylight hours.WalkingAlong wrote:Studies of pro athletes who fast for Ramadan show their energy levels and performance don't suffer during fasts.
It's traditional to have feasts & parties late into the night, and eat a large breakfast before dawn, so they're probably getting about the same calories as usual, perhaps even more.
Think of it like the "OMAD" binge eating, only for religious purposes.
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tigersword wrote: »As I see it, I need to maintain a calorie deficit to lose weight - every calorie counts. I work hard to get a calorie deficit and I am not going to waste that hard work for a few seconds of eating pleasure. So no eating back any exercise calories for me.
If someone can come up with a science-verifiable reason why I MUST eat back my exercise calories, I will look at their evidence. Rumour, anecdotes, the guy at the gym, Aunt Flossie, TV shows, iffy web sites do not count as science-verifiable evidence.
Evidence? Easy. MFP is designed to have you eat back your exercise calories. The calorie deficit is already built into your calorie goal, before factoring in exercise.
OP the confusion you're experiencing is due to different methods of calculating calorie goals. MFP is set up with a deficit not including exercise, so you can lose weight without exercising. When you exercise, you add those calories back into keep a consistent deficit. People who don't use this site use a different method of calculating a calorie goal. That method includes exercise, so you wouldn't eat them back in that case. It's really six of one, half a dozen of the other, as both methods, when calculated correctly, should give about the same overall result.
This, and I think when people say their trainer or doctor said not to it's comparing apples and oranges as the calorie goal was arrived at differently.
Many (most?) trainers don't really know much about nutrition, though, so may not get that whether you eat exercise calories depends on how the goal was reached. To start with an aggressive goal based on a sedentary status and then exercise hard and not do anything to compensate is not the same as not eating back when your goal assumes you will be doing some exercise. I'm doing the latter now, and eating the same overall weekly calories, or thereabouts, as when I started with a lower goal and added exercise calories.
I hate how some seem to portray not eating back as being stronger or more virtuous. I know I wouldn't make the fitness advances I have -- which I care about -- if I didn't eat enough to fuel them.0 -
"Thanks for your concern, but I'm on a program that's working well for me."0
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Try the last. If that doesn't provide result. Try the middle. If that doesn't provide result, try the first.SetFreeEmily wrote: »-eating back NO exercise calories
-eating back some/a percentage of exercise calories
-eating back ALL your exercise calories (making your "Net" and "Goal" calories on MFP match)
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The trainers advice to eat a fixed amount and not log or eat back exercise calories is actually given, believed, and used by lots of members on here (TDEE method), but for me personally it just wouldn't motivate me or work for my psyche. Adding to everyone else that says you've done great work finding what works for you AND seeing progress. You seem to be eating enough - no need to change at all!0
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Do what works for you. Personally I've never eaten back exercise calories, and the trainers I've worked with have all been against eating back exercise calories, and they all suggest lots of protein.
My current trainer has suggested I do carb cycling, so I've been doing it for a month. I eat a lot of protein. He says not to worry about getting x amount of calories, just stick to the low carb foods, but I do track as that's what I've done for ages.
In the past I've gone for the low calories approach and just eaten a lot of salad mainly, and I lost weight that way too.
I also lost weight after my 2nd baby (66lbs) by working out my TDEE and subtracting a percentage and just eating healthily, with an emphasis on high protein. It worked really well, and I'd still be slim if I hadn't got pregnant again lol.
I think so long as you have a deficit and aren't eating above your carb/fat allowance it works.
Don't forget you said the others in your gym are 50 and 30lbs lighter than you, so they will need fewer calories anyway.0 -
It's not that there is conflicting advice- there are just two different distinct methods- it does appear confusing- but it's not that its' conflicting- there are just two separate methods.
NEET + eat back (which is what MFP uses)
or TDEE- which accounts for your level of acticvity through the week- and gives you a daily average.
The actual averages of both amount of caloires across a weekly basis will be roughly the same.
i.e. if I use MFP- and I set i at 1500- no workout- then I workout- I get about 1800.
i workout 3 x a week so that's 5,400 calories
add in the other 4 days at 1500 = 6,000.
5,400 + 6,000 = 11,400 calories for the week.
11,400/7 = 1,628 calories I average a day.
If I use the TDEE calculator and say I workout 3 times a week-
TDEE- 15% deficit = 1755 calories.
TDEE- 20% deficit =1655 calories.
See? They average out daily to about the same. TDEE essentially just takes the guess workout out of how much workouts are "worth" and means on your down days you get to eat a little more than if you were eating back workout calories.
The nice thing about TDEE- it means as long as you were honest about your level of activity when you plug the numbers in- (meaning you don't put extremely active and all you do is walk 3 times a week for 30 minutes)- you won't ever OVER guess yoru workouts- which is one of the most common problems with NEET/Eat Back... people over estimate workouts- and underestimate food- and they wind up with a much smaller deficit than they thought then they wonder why they weren't losing weight.
Downside- when you do extra work- or have a particularly brutal workout- you aren't going to be getting to eat more like you normally do.
either one is fine if you are honest with yourself- do what works for you.0
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