5:2 Diet

LazyButHealthy wrote: »

herrspoons wrote: »

Honestly? It's another fad diet which doesn't teach good long term eating habits.

I agree.

A woman who sits next to me at work talks about her 5:2 all the time.

It's far, far healthier to have a standard daily intake to either reduce weight or to maintain.
This has been proved over and over again

How has it been proven? People's food intake fluctuates naturally if left unwatched. We all know that thin individual who can eat anything and never gain weight, when in reality they simply appear to be eating a lot when on some days or meals they may not eat all that much.

Without restricting anything, and eating at will, my intake fluctuates anywhere between 800 and 3000 calories depending on what I feel like eating (or not eating) that day.

For me, it's far healthier to eat things I like in quantities that leave me happy and satisfied and stick to my diet than to restrict daily and stress over portion sizes then quit soon after. I have gone from almost diabetic to normal sugar range because I found a method that makes calorie restriction easy for me. How is that not healthy?

LazyButHealthy wrote: »

amusedmonkey wrote: »

LazyButHealthy wrote: »

herrspoons wrote: »

Honestly? It's another fad diet which doesn't teach good long term eating habits.

I agree.

A woman who sits next to me at work talks about her 5:2 all the time.

It's far, far healthier to have a standard daily intake to either reduce weight or to maintain.
This has been proved over and over again

How has it been proven? People's food intake fluctuates naturally if left unwatched. We all know that thin individual who can eat anything and never gain weight, when in reality they simply appear to be eating a lot when on some days or meals they may not eat all that much.

Without restricting anything, and eating at will, my intake fluctuates anywhere between 800 and 3000 calories depending on what I feel like eating (or not eating) that day.

For me, it's far healthier to eat things I like in quantities that leave me happy and satisfied and stick to my diet than to restrict daily and stress over portion sizes then quit soon after. I have gone from almost diabetic to normal sugar range because I found a method that makes calorie restriction easy for me. How is that not healthy?

It has been proven as a long-term, healthy objective to monitor a daily calorie plan for weight loss than fad diets. 5:2 is hugely en vogue right now, until the next one comes along.

'restrict daily and stress over portion sizes then quit soon after' implies that it's a daily diet, when it's just eating healthily and sensibly, and not have days of minimal calories that leave you hungry.

None of that has been proven. What has been proven is that most diets fail long term, including daily calorie restriction. The best a person can do to help their chances is to find something they are comfortable doing long term.

Eating healthily and sensibly would mean maintenance, where you are able to eat regular portions of food, and that is my main focus even before I reach my goal weight. Calorie restriction is a temporary measure taken to lose weight. No one keeps a deficit for life and calls it healthy and sensible. Diet portions are not the same as maintenance portions.

fluffyasacat wrote: »

I mean, of course we have burger orgies. That's the best part of dieting the IF way!

I'm just requoting your hilarious gif, to remind us some of the reasons why IF eating protocols works well...for some of us. I don't feel deprived. I know I can eat what I want, if I can show self-discipline enough to just wait a day or until it fits my macros. I'll carb up around heavy workout days, for example.

To me, that makes the treats MORE special. Not something I take for granted.

For those who are very negative about IF eating protocols, despite numerous stories about how it works both here and everywhere if you care to google a bit.
That's ok. But can you honestly say you did your research first and gave it 2-3 weeks before you gave up?

Please keep in mind that headaches, dizziness, heart palpitations, "hunger" etc. are all very common symptoms of carb crashing. If you go from a high carb diet directly to a low carb diet, which most fasting days will be for many of us, then you're maybe experiencing what is commonly known as "Atkins flu". Could it be that those symptoms were caused by something else than your attempt at IF?

Suffice to say you need to make sure you get all the nutrients needed. If you go low-carbing, you need to take a bit more salt. I'm not gonna go into mcg, because as someone who exercise hard regularly, I get dizzy and generally "jumpy" at night with too little salt. What YOUR body needs, I don't know.

Some discomfort is expected in ANY diet. At least until your system has adjusted to the new rules. Being a bit hungry is the price we pay for wanting to lose weight. Some days I can literally hear whale songs in my tummy. Some days it's unbearable, other days I brush it off. Though it might sound smug, I actually like the rumbling sound, if I'm having a good day.

If I can't finish my fasting day as planned, I reschedule it. Which is one of the best things about IF, it's VERY FLEXIBLE. I have now taught my body to function without the constant nagging for food every 4 hours. Frankly, it's very liberating.

[/quote]I've tried it. I'm not afraid of hunger, I'm afraid of headaches, vision problems, and passing out at work.[/quote]

[/quote]If that's you, see a doctor.[/quote]

[/quote]Definitely. Unless someone is just invoking hyperbole for fun and fud.[/quote]

[/quote]Why? I know what causes it. Going too long without eating. It happens to hypoglycemics all the time. Why do I need to see a doctor about that when I know what causes it and how to fix it? I just think it's absurd to say everyone who doesn't do well with fasting is
"afraid of hunger." It seems a bit hypocritical for you to criticize those people, when your mantra is supposedly "do what works for you."
[/quote]

I got what you were saying fatcity and wish I'd have clarified that for you now. Without going back through thread, I think the will power comment was aimed at 5:2. Laughable as the harnessing of or failure to apply willpower is overrated on ANY method.

As for the comments from other posters on performance on the fast days...I train fasted but I plan for that the day before. They are also my busiest days. I think it was Pilon from "lean gains" who said "nobody thinks about food when they're skydiving".

I've used the 5:2 to get off the 1200cal mindset, which served me well at MO and then obese but as it does it came to a point that I needed to up those cals. I noticed when I ate higher my performance the next training day was better (I never eat before training on the day anyway) so this became my goal. The structure of the 5:2 helped me relax about increasing calories. I tried gradually increasing but fear would make me drop it back down again. I didn't like the way I was thinking. I didn't like the fine line day after day which meant for me personally I felt I was having to be more obsessive to get that 10-20% deficit.

Before I used MFP I started to lose with mindful eating, smaller portions etc. I rue the day I found this app sometimes. The 5:2 gave me an opportunity to practice maintenance with the same approach I started with yet having the mental safety net of fast days for that deficit which aren't difficult for me. Even at 1200/day, 1500/day, 1800/day I was naturally a 16/8 IF. "Breaking fast" was lunch time. The transition was easy for me, minor sacrifice, relaxed adherence.

It doesn't affect me mentally or physically one way or the other but bear in mind that if you get in the middle of a shift and have a bad experience, you can just eat something. 500 is quite a bit of food, really, and even if you 'mess up' and hit 700, it beats 2000.

The books suggest many people do best with a 400-500 calorie meal around 2. Can you have your main meal be lunch at work? Or have like a Quest bar at work then a healthy, light dinner after?

purpleberry2 wrote: »

I was going to start this week but I'm now working everyday.... what do people think about me having my first fastings when I'm working? I do 7-8 hour shifts, work in healthcare so on my feet for pretty much all of the shift, I don't think it's such a good idea really since I've obviously not tried it before, what do people think? to fast or not to fast?

Although I agree with others that I actually find it easier to fast on days when I'm busier, I agree that maybe it's risky to do your very first fast on a work day. You aren't used to it yet so you don't know how your body will react. But you can always try it out and then if you find yourself with a headache, or feeling faint, break the fast early.

Gmemacho wrote: »

Actually its very easy to loss weight. Discipline yourself to eat healthy food + carb in small portion every 4 hours. Not eating too long make your body feel that you are fasting, signal for your body to reduce metabolisme rate. Eliminate sugar in your diet, then exercise as much as you can.... good luck.

Lol

Well, 5:2 and the other IF regimens ARE eating every day, just typically one small-medium meal.

And I've been at this for ten years, including WW and low carb and all else, so I'm not so sure it's the baby pool of dieting, per se. I think it's more like the deep end, especially as far as discipline goes.

I don't do intermittent fasting on purpose, but sometimes it happens. I'm on a low-carb diet (15% carb/25% protein/60% fat). Sometimes, I just don't need to eat. Or I get too busy in the day so I skip lunch and then by dinner I'm not hungry anymore. I'm still on the fence about what to do on these days, but that's beside the point.

Based on my experience, I offer these points for anybody that wants to try intermittent fasting:
- Try low-carb for a while. I start at 75 grams/day and work down to 50 g/day. When transitioning to a low-carb diet a lot of people experience what we call a carb-flu. I've read that this is because our bodies can't quickly switch between burning carbs and burning fat. So restricting the carbs makes our bodies react like we're starving once the carbs are burned. Until we can switch to burning fat that is. Eating a low-carb diet for a while seems to help increase what I've heard called "metabolic flexibility" by retraining your body to burn fat. Last summer (when I was eating a lot of high-carb convenience foods) if I skipped a meal I felt horrible. After restarting low-carb this fall, I can skip meals and hardly notice.
- Exercise. I've read that exercise helps improve metabolic flexibility as well. Don't try to exercise while you're adapting to a low-carb diet, though. But you can start exercising after you've been dieting for a few weeks, or skip low-carb altogether and just start exercising.
- Pay attention to your body. If you're hungry, eat. On those days that I only eat 500-600 calories, I don't feel awful. If you feel awful while fasting (or the day after), then you're body can't handle it. It might be that it can't remember how to burn fat during starvation, or it might be something else that I'm not smart enough to know. You might be able to work up to fasting at some point, but pay attention to the cues.

I've seen intermittent fasting promoted - not as weight loss gimmick - but to break your dependence on scheduled meals.

dbmata wrote: »

fatcity66 wrote: »

WalkingAlong wrote: »

Maybe that's why I don't go blind and pass out when I skip a meal... My hormones went "down the pan". (From eating at maintenance, no less.)

I'm not talking about "skipping a meal." I'm talking about going 8-12 hours without eating, while having to be active, and thinking (at work). It doesn't work for me. And also, you, or someone else implied I must "have no willpower." If that were true, would I have lost over 35 lbs (20 since joining MFP) just by reducing calories, yet not restricting any food groups? Look at my diary if you care to. I do very rarely get hungry. I call that success.

I don't know if you do, nor do I care if you have willpower. Your response, indicates that you may not.

8-12 hours is nothing, if you are exhibiting issues like going blind and passing out, talk to your doctor. 8-12 hours isn't going to do that to anyone who eats decently and isn't jacked up. Normal folks can easily go a day or two without having issues like that. I'd go talk to a doctor.

Once again, I've lost 35 lbs...if I had no willpower, that wouldn't have happened. What do you think willpower is, exactly? Being able to go as long as possible without eating? Or maybe, is it being able to eat 2 cookies, or a slice of pizza, and then stopping? People on this site love to jump and say "see a doctor" for everything. I see my doctor, and I had blood work done just a month ago. It was all good. I asked my doctor about having issues when I don't eat for a long period, and you know what he said? "Well, you probably shouldn't go that long without eating, then." So, do you know something my doctor doesn't? If so, maybe I should just go to you for all my health issues, instead of a doctor.
But I'm done trying to talk to a brick wall.

dbmata wrote: »

fatcity66 wrote: »

What do you think willpower is, exactly? Being able to go as long as possible without eating?

The ability to keep oneself from acting out in a less than adult manner. Like I said. Whether you have it or not is immaterial, you aren't really demonstrating possession.

People on this site love to jump and say "see a doctor" for everything. I see my doctor, and I had blood work done just a month ago. It was all good. I asked my doctor about having issues when I don't eat for a long period, and you know what he said? "Well, you probably shouldn't go that long without eating, then." So, do you know something my doctor doesn't? If so, maybe I should just go to you for all my health issues, instead of a doctor.

Great willpower.

People say go to a doctor, because people ask stupid questions on this site, when instead they should be engaging their treatment team. Granted, a reason people don't see their doctors is that they want to be sick, so people can give them a shoulder, and a cry, and attention they crave but haven't earned. The other reason is that because a lot of people have no clue how to talk to a doctor, and generally forget basic things, like how to ask questions. At the end of the day though, if they don't engage their treatment properly, it's because they are choosing not to.

If you're going blind, and passing out because you haven't eaten for 8 hours. Go see a better doctor, and get a second opinion. Because that is not normal, and there is something wrong with anyone who has that happen to them. 8-12 hours is nothing, except for *maybe* an infant or a very young child.

After looking at your diary, your comment about me not having willpower seems hilarious. It's obvious now that I can justifiably disregard everything you've said. LOL Have a good one!

TimothyFish wrote: »

If I were trying to limit myself to 500 calories per day, I would probably wait until late in the day to eat, so I could be thinking about what I would eat later instead of thinking about how I can't eat any more.

- im on 1250 and actually without realizing it this is what i do

LazyButHealthy wrote: »

herrspoons wrote: »

Honestly? It's another fad diet which doesn't teach good long term eating habits.

I agree.

A woman who sits next to me at work talks about her 5:2 all the time.

It's far, far healthier to have a standard daily intake to either reduce weight or to maintain.
This has been proved over and over again

Interesting.

A. "Standard daily intake to either reduce weight or to maintain" has abysmal long term success rates that have been "proved over and over again". Do you really want me to pull out the statistics that show ALL weight reduction efforts typically fail in the long run for most people?

B. Funny that you should suggest daily calorie variations is a "fad". One of the ways many "naturally thin" people maintain their weight effortlessly, without thought, actually mirrors a lot of intermittent fasting. As in some days they over eat and some days they under, just naturally, creating an equilibrium.

Looking back, the thinnest I was ever in my life, for the longest, was when I was maintaining my weight loss quite unintentionally by varying my caloric intake severely day to day, based solely off hunger cues. It's what I'd now called intermittent fasting, but never would have back then. And I was not even conscious of what I was doing.

Human beings have been following eating patterns that mimic IFing for thousands of years. I guess you're just not abreast of our actual food history? Hint: It didn't involve three squares a day.

zenner22 wrote: »

I'm not sure if anyone is reading this thread anymore, but I found it interesting. I've been following 5:2 now for 2 months and I love it. I am more alert on my fast days. Hunger pains are minimal. I don't over-eat on my non-fast days, but I do eat what I want. I've been yo-yo dieting for 20 years and I've never felt this in control of my eating. I'm obese, but on my way out of that category. I log my food everyday in MFP because I think it's a wonderful tool.

Well done Zenner22!

I've been on ADF for 114 days, but yesterday I had my first fast day with not a single hunger pang. Not one. It is so weird, I never would have though that fasting is the sort of thing you get better at.