5:2 Diet
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"having to stick to a strict calorie goal is way more limiting and less appealing than eating at will"
This is a nonsense quote. A 5:2 diet has just the same restrictions. It is all about calories in vs calories out. So if I am limited to 14,000 calories over a week, the restrictions are the same.
Besides, on the mentality of being strict, can you get any more strict than limiting yourself to around 2 calories a day for a quarter of your life?
2 calories a day isn't exactly accurate. You may need to look more into the diet to understand.
It all IS about calorie in vs calorie out, and that is the point. If one way of calorie restriction is easier for a person than another, then why go with what is harder for them when the result is the same? For me, having "a sliver of cake" is harder and way less satisfying than having a normal portion of cake then making up for it on a day when I don't feel like eating much anyway.
For me, limiting my intake every now and then on days when I don't feel like cooking/going out/having something high in calories is barely a limitation, but having to limit on all days even when I do feel like cooking something heavy/going out is much more limiting.
Similarly, having to stuff my face when I barely have an appetite just to hit that arbitrary 1200 requirement is more limiting and annoying than just going with what I'm comfortable with.
The end result: my high and low days balance out and nearly 100 pounds were dropped with absolute ease.
I think you are stuck on the concept of limiting your intake for a quarter of your life when you already do so for 1/3 of it (we call it sleeping). The idea is scary in principle for those who haven't tried it, and bad in practice for those who have tried it and found it hard, but you would be surprised how much easier and less limiting it is for some people to do vs the conventional way of calorie restriction.
My point stands. If it's not for you don't do it, but if it's easier then why torture yourself with what is hard when the end result is the same?0 -
"2 calories a day isn't exactly accurate. You may need to look more into the diet to understand."
I was being ironic, right?
"but if it's easier then why torture yourself with what is hard when the end result is the same?"
Because a 5:2 diet is largely unsustainable, as are all fad diets. They teach a way of living that does not appeal long term and leaves people prone to go back to old ways once thinking they have done the hard work.
I really dont understand how you can claim eating a little less each day is torture but under the same mentality, starving yourself for 2 days is not.0 -
going on your definition of starvation being 'a complete lack of food' 5:2 isn't starving yourself. It's restricting calories for two days and not restricting calories for 5 days. what amusedmonkey is stating is that it is a choice, and if it doesn't work for you then don't do it. 5:2 isn't unsustainable and people have adopted it as a way of life. granted; limited calorie intake 7 days a week is one way of losing weight, but limited calorie intake a bit more 2 days a week is another way of losing weight.
people are different.0 -
"Because a 5:2 diet is largely unsustainable, as are all fad diets. They teach a way of living that does not appeal long term and leaves people prone to go back to old ways once thinking they have done the hard work.
I really dont understand how you can claim eating a little less each day is torture but under the same mentality, starving yourself for 2 days is not.
A few people who this appeals to on this thread have already said that they enjoy it and look forward to keeping this or a maintenance version of it up for life. If you can't see the appeal, no problem. When people say to me "I could never do that!" I reply "no, probably not". By that I don't mean that they'd fail at it due to lack of will power. I mean that if you can't imagine being able to do it then you're probably not the sort of person that should do it.
For mine, I do enjoy it. I've come to experience hunger the same way that you might notice you're tired - you feel it and you move on. I have the luxury of feeling that way because unlike someone who experiences real hunger, I know I can eat at any time. I know I will eat later. Being wary of hunger is natural and human. Being able to conquer fear of hunger through understanding you can eat at any time is an incredibly brave step for an overweight person to come to.0 -
OP- I recommend reading the Michael Mosley book about it. He has lots of tips and it's a quick read. He has an MD education and is a health journalist. It's called The Fast Diet.
Similar diets are in books by James Johnson, MD and Krista Varady, PhD. All three books have lots of tips. Most people don't get shaky and have physical symptoms. Varady's research is also in the health journals. She's been studying it for like 10 years.
I'm on my 10th week of every other day at 500 calories (Varady's plan) and feel fine. I like it. I plan to maintain on some form of IF. I have about 8 more lbs. to lose, so hopefully I can report back how that's working for me next year.
Fasting scares a lot of people so it's often going to be controversial and sound extreme to people who haven't read about it.
Good luck!0 -
I don't know about fasting but I am on a VLCD and honestly, you get used to it. Google VLCD recipe and see what you find.
No thanks.....I'm trying to limit muscle loss.
I don't know about all the "science".....but I know I can diet (albeit strictly) 2 days a week on a consistent basis. Knowing the next day is maintenance keeps me on track.0 -
I have a feeling you won't get a lot of VLCD love from MFP. For me, I don't have 2 days out of 7 where I can feel miserable, hangry, and lightheaded, so I know this "eating plan" isn't for me!
http://www.webmd.com/diet/low-calorie-diets
2nd post is about VLCDs....second post maybe assumes 5:2 is VLCD (like you). That's not what 5:2 is at all.
If I eat 500 calories for 2 days and my maintenance calories for 5 days....that average is not a very low calorie diet. 5:2 is not for everyone. I don't get light headed on 500 calorie days. Yes, I get hungry but that's not the end of the world. A consistent calorie deficit is needed for weight loss....my entire deficit comes from 2 days a week. I can be consistent for 2 days, and I can relax (but not go crazy) the other 5.0 -
Planning ahead will make or break your lo cal days. Get the book with the recipes, pick a few out and plan them. You can actually eat a good amount of food if you plan correctly because it will be low cal but higher volume and satiety0
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wow...ok that was a bit of an extreme reaction I think to some innocent questions...
I thought this forum was all about getting advice, help and SUPPORT, which most of the comments were (others were a little attacking). I was actually doing a LOT of research around this last night, including watching Michael Mosleys original documentary and reading his book. As I said it's not something I've tried yet but I'm considering it, obviously if I feel it's not working for me I'll stop.
It seems most of the comments here are from people who haven't done correct research around this area because if you did I think your opinion may change. My Mum actually first brought this to my attention and I, like many of you, told her it was unsafe and a fad. But after conducting my research it may seem that's not the case.
As far as I see, they're are pros and cons to every 'diet' which differ from person to person. This may work for me... it may not.
Also, I'm not an idiot and believe me I have absolutely NO intention of starving myself. I was considering using this as a bit of a kick-start, see if it will help change my eating habits, maybe help me lose a little weight so I then may have the confidence to start running again (which I did until I became heavier and the thought of running outside made me feel sick).
To those of you who actually posted their own genuine experience, advice and opinion, thank you! They have helped. And thank you to the user who posted the link for the group
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I have a feeling you won't get a lot of VLCD love from MFP. For me, I don't have 2 days out of 7 where I can feel miserable, hangry, and lightheaded, so I know this "eating plan" isn't for me!
http://www.webmd.com/diet/low-calorie-diets
2nd post is about VLCDs....second post maybe assumes 5:2 is VLCD (like you). That's not what 5:2 is at all.
If I eat 500 calories for 2 days and my maintenance calories for 5 days....that average is not a very low calorie diet. 5:2 is not for everyone. I don't get light headed on 500 calorie days. Yes, I get hungry but that's not the end of the world. A consistent calorie deficit is needed for weight loss....my entire deficit comes from 2 days a week. I can be consistent for 2 days, and I can relax (but not go crazy) the other 5.
+1
I am not for or against fasting (each individual will tolerate IF differently) however I agree that this 5:2 plan is clearly NOT a VLCD. Average caloric intake over time is what matters, not specific days.
Most of the people calling IF a fad diet or VLCD have never tried or are uneducated about how it works.
I have never tried 5:2 so I am not promoting it. I am just defending it against the fools who are knocking it without having a clue what they are talking about
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purpleberry2 wrote: »wow...ok that was a bit of an extreme reaction I think to some innocent questions...
I thought this forum was all about getting advice, help and SUPPORT, which most of the comments were (others were a little attacking). I was actually doing a LOT of research around this last night, including watching Michael Mosleys original documentary and reading his book. As I said it's not something I've tried yet but I'm considering it, obviously if I feel it's not working for me I'll stop.
It seems most of the comments here are from people who haven't done correct research around this area because if you did I think your opinion may change. My Mum actually first brought this to my attention and I, like many of you, told her it was unsafe and a fad. But after conducting my research it may seem that's not the case.
As far as I see, they're are pros and cons to every 'diet' which differ from person to person. This may work for me... it may not.
Also, I'm not an idiot and believe me I have absolutely NO intention of starving myself. I was considering using this as a bit of a kick-start, see if it will help change my eating habits, maybe help me lose a little weight so I then may have the confidence to start running again (which I did until I became heavier and the thought of running outside made me feel sick).
To those of you who actually posted their own genuine experience, advice and opinion, thank you! They have helped. And thank you to the user who posted the link for the group
I tried that link and it didn't work. But asked around and got a better one...
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/group/100058-5-2-fasting
I've rejoined the group and I'll send friend too.
Sorry I wasn't much help but this happens all the time with any type of fasting mentioned. As you can see from above poster...there are people not doing this WOE yet understand it.
The fact that you recognised the beauty of adhering for those two days, as in, it's something that seems doable to you is a great starting point. I found it resonated with me. For some obviously it doesn't and as another poster said..then don't! Simple.0 -
Remember, that one time, when discussion and promotion of VLCDs was like, against the rules?0
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I remember watching the 5:2 "documentary" a while back. The day after his fasting day, he hits the drive thru joint and it shows him pigging out on burgers. This all implies you can eat whatever you want on your non-fasting days, which is a crock. 5:2 is no magic. Like all IF versions, you must carefully watch what you eat seven days a week or you will not lose. That being the case, why not just watch what you eat, and just eat moderately every day?0
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herrspoons wrote: »jamesblood13 wrote: »herrspoons wrote: »It's generally understood that if you don't react well on it then you shouldn't continue.
Fluffy...lol
Herrspoon ever smile? C'mon mate you can do it.
All the time, bro.
But let's be honest - OP asks for opinions on 5:2, OP gets positive and negative viewpoints, intolerant poster takes offense at viewpoint that differs from their own.
That screams anger issues to me.
The OP asked for advice on how to do the fast days. Not opinions on the diet.
As for the OP, try going as long as possible without eating on your fast day and eat the 500/600 in the evening (that's what I find works for me anyway). Sometimes I sneak a cup a soup in at lunch time just to tide me over.
The OP said she was considering the 5:2 diet. That's still in opinion territory.
Anyway, the mods will no doubt be waving the post eraser over this topic, so no point carrying on.
Why?? Just because you do not understand it?
5:2 is a legitimate form of Intermittent Fasting. There is 16:8 which is Leangains that gives you an 8 hour window each day to eat your calories. There is also 20:4 which is the Warrior Diet, that only gives you a 4 hour window each day to eat your calories.There are also some people that take the 5:2 a step further and fast every other day.
All those versions are still getting the same amount of calories in a 7 day period but choose to have days of large consumption and alternate days of really low consumption. What difference does it make if it is 15,000 calories spread out over 7 full days or 5 days of 2760 calories and two days of each being 600 calories? How many people on this site repeatedly say it is about weekly intake not daily intake? A can tell you, a lot.
These are not VLCD, they are just another way of eating. Some people like myself are finding it easier to eat at a deficit this way because it allows us to have larger meals when we do eat. If there are no health issues there is no reason this cannot be done for a lifetime.0 -
fluffyasacat wrote: »"Because a 5:2 diet is largely unsustainable, as are all fad diets. They teach a way of living that does not appeal long term and leaves people prone to go back to old ways once thinking they have done the hard work.
I really dont understand how you can claim eating a little less each day is torture but under the same mentality, starving yourself for 2 days is not.
A few people who this appeals to on this thread have already said that they enjoy it and look forward to keeping this or a maintenance version of it up for life. If you can't see the appeal, no problem. When people say to me "I could never do that!" I reply "no, probably not". By that I don't mean that they'd fail at it due to lack of will power. I mean that if you can't imagine being able to do it then you're probably not the sort of person that should do it.
For mine, I do enjoy it. I've come to experience hunger the same way that you might notice you're tired - you feel it and you move on. I have the luxury of feeling that way because unlike someone who experiences real hunger, I know I can eat at any time. I know I will eat later. Being wary of hunger is natural and human. Being able to conquer fear of hunger through understanding you can eat at any time is an incredibly brave step for an overweight person to come to.
I loved this answer!!! Good for you! I understand and totally agree
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I remember watching the 5:2 "documentary" a while back. The day after his fasting day, he hits the drive thru joint and it shows him pigging out on burgers. This all implies you can eat whatever you want on your non-fasting days, which is a crock. 5:2 is no magic. Like all IF versions, you must carefully watch what you eat seven days a week or you will not lose. That being the case, why not just watch what you eat, and just eat moderately every day?
I don't think it shows him pigging out on burgers, it shows him eating A burger. I have tried watching what I eat. As I stated above I'm hoping to change my eating habits, not being so dependent on food, not constantly thinking about food. People will probably say 'well just stop doing those things'.... it isn't that easy for me.0 -
I look forward to fasting days. It makes me feel so much better! This is the only thing I've tried that has actually worked.0
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500 calories per day seems unnecessary and unhealthy. Some girls who self-identify as anorexic eat 500 calories per day. I honestly have no intention of being mean or unsupportive, but please don't deprive yourself. I don't know enough about you to make a quick judgement and say "you're anorexic", or "you have an ED", but I really am just hoping you'll do what's right for yourself. If your goal is to lose weight, then I don't think this diet is right for you. It's true that this diet may help you lose weight, but if you're not eating enough, you will lose muscle. That means that the number on the scale will be lower, but you might actually get "flabbier". I understand that it's not easy to eat healthy. No one said it would be easy. I just want to make sure you know that this diet probably won't make you look better, and it probably won't make you feel better. And please, if anything I said is offensive in any way, I'm sorry. I don't mean to judge you or put you down. People are here to build each other up, not put each other down. Best wishes and good luck
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I remember watching the 5:2 "documentary" a while back. The day after his fasting day, he hits the drive thru joint and it shows him pigging out on burgers. This all implies you can eat whatever you want on your non-fasting days, which is a crock. 5:2 is no magic. Like all IF versions, you must carefully watch what you eat seven days a week or you will not lose. That being the case, why not just watch what you eat, and just eat moderately every day?
The scene you saw was him coming off a 3 day fast of water. It wasn't the 5:2. He based the 5:2 off the work of researchers in that doc and that particular fast was based on the work of a neurologist (from memory no pun unfortunately). I'd have a burger after that. Still do. I know most people imagine coming off a fast day (which with 500/600 cals is not purely fast) means you wake up absolutely ravenous. I don't. Just normal appetite. It still surprises me.
As for moderation every day...I flick back and forth on methods depending on mood, circumstances, practicality. It's entirely flexible. Same deficit just arranged differently depending. What I do like about it is that it gives me an opportunity to peek/play at maintenance and I have a break from calories cos frankly they tick me off sometimes.
It can be abused but I find people in that frame of mind do so with any method.500 calories per day seems unnecessary and unhealthy. Some girls who self-identify as anorexic eat 500 calories per day. I honestly have no intention of being mean or unsupportive, but please don't deprive yourself. I don't know enough about you to make a quick judgement and say "you're anorexic", or "you have an ED", but I really am just hoping you'll do what's right for yourself. If your goal is to lose weight, then I don't think this diet is right for you. It's true that this diet may help you lose weight, but if you're not eating enough, you will lose muscle. That means that the number on the scale will be lower, but you might actually get "flabbier". I understand that it's not easy to eat healthy. No one said it would be easy. I just want to make sure you know that this diet probably won't make you look better, and it probably won't make you feel better. And please, if anything I said is offensive in any way, I'm sorry. I don't mean to judge you or put you down. People are here to build each other up, not put each other down. Best wishes and good luck
Ah, lovely, it's not 500/day so don't be alarmed. Yes 500/day would be terrible. Good luck to you too!
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What I love most about the way I'm currently eating (modified IF) is that it teaches me maintenance better than conventional ways of dieting, as I am able to regulate my food on non-fasting days to be at or around my to-be maintenance at my goal weight, while having enough room to eat whatever I want in moderation and manage days that are higher than maintenance by balancing them out with lower days.
This most resembles how I used to eat before starting to lose weight and what is most natural for me (how most people eat, really), with some days being higher than others but the difference is that back then I had no measure of regulation.
I now know how to eat at maintenance naturally, because I have done it for so long. I believe this will be great for me in the future when I do hit my goal because I won't have to greatly change what I'm doing day to day, all I have to do is reduce the amount of fasting days. It's a much smoother maintenance learning curve than suddenly (or even gradually) increasing my daily calories because I already have a feel of how much I could eat, how my meals look, and when I'm over-eating/under-eating.
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Would you fear anorexia if someone said from midnight to noon they only ate 250 calories out of 1500 total for the day? It's the same thing as having 3000 spread over two days, but with 500 and 2500 the split.500 calories per day seems unnecessary and unhealthy. Some girls who self-identify as anorexic eat 500 calories per day.
The body has no midnight reset like MFP does.
Re. "you can't eat whatever you want X days a week and lose weight". Yes, the studies published on it show that people only choose to eat about 110% of their TDEE on the 'feast' days, when doing alternate day fasting. I imagine for 5:2 it's even lower 'overeating'.
I'm not famished after fast days. I feel the same as I do any other morning. I probably feel less food-obsessed as when I did calorie restriction every day because nothing's off limits anymore.
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Ive been doing 5:2 since beginning of Sept... works for me... I eat my 500 all in the morning... whatever works for you. :-)0
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amusedmonkey wrote: »What I love most about the way I'm currently eating (modified IF) is that it teaches me maintenance better than conventional ways of dieting, as I am able to regulate my food on non-fasting days to be at or around my to-be maintenance at my goal weight, while having enough room to eat whatever I want in moderation and manage days that are higher than maintenance by balancing them out with lower days.
^This. I've never quite understood why people think IF makes for poor maintenance practice, or for that matter, why people think non-fasting days are bacchanalian burger orgies.0 -
I mean, of course we have burger orgies. That's the best part of dieting the IF way!
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fluffyasacat wrote: »I mean, of course we have burger orgies. That's the best part of dieting the IF way!
That was a great day...
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fluffyasacat wrote: »I mean, of course we have burger orgies. That's the best part of dieting the IF way!
hahaha! amazing!0 -
I'm going to try to do the 5:2 diet for personal reasons. I'm doing it slightly different, I'm fasting from 8pm-12pm, so I'm only missing breakfast and morning snacks. But it will drop my calories from 1600 to 1000. So that alone will help.0
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Original_Beauty wrote: »I'm going to try to do the 5:2 diet for personal reasons. I'm doing it slightly different, I'm fasting from 8pm-12pm, so I'm only missing breakfast and morning snacks. But it will drop my calories from 1600 to 1000. So that alone will help.
Huh? That's not how 5:2 works.
You are still eating the same amount of calories a week. You just have them assigned differently, so to speak.
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