Starvation mode. Myth or Fact?
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WholeFoodHealthy wrote: »It's quite possible that you haven't given your body enough time after eating to tap into your fat stores. Think about it, even though you reduced your calorie intake you're still eating regularity. Your body needs to be trained to access your fat stores, which usually happens after 18 hours of fasting.
How late are you eating dinner usually? Ideally you should give yourself 12 hours between dinner and breakfast for a bunch of reasons, I won't list them but do feel free to google it [search "dinner breakfast 12 hours"]
If, and only if you think you'd be able to do it, I HIGHLY recommend IF (intermittent Fasting) Specifically Brad Pilon's 24 hour version from his book "Eat Stop Eat". He's got a degree in human biology and cites numerous studies throughout his book, and multiple articles reference his book when discussing IF. Basically, he's legit.
24 hour intermittent fasting is just what it sounds like, it's going a full 24 hours (I usually begin around 6 or 7 PM, that way each day I'm still kind of eating, just skipping dinner the first day and skipping breakfast and lunch the second) without eating. You can (and NEED TO) drink plenty of water, as well as coffee and tea (I cheat and add as much as 35 calories of 2% milk and a little bit of sugar to 1 cup coffee) People typically fast 1-2 times per week. There is NO set schedule, do it whenever you like. It's important though, to NOT gorge yourself after your fast is over (you will be tempted to, I promise haha) simply go back to normal eating, of course I recommend eating good healthy whole foods and not Immediately devouring a pizza. I usually have a 500-600 cal meal (my daily is ~2200) with a good balance of macros (think 3 eggs, sauteed spinach and a little mayo on whole wheat toast, followed by a banana) then give myself about 1 hour to take it all in. If I still feel hungry I go for more.
While not fasting you simply eat normally, you CAN go out to eat. You don't even HAVE to count calories (I still do usually though). Because think about it, if you're fasting 2 days a week. You're tapping into your fat stores (like I said, it starts at the 18 hour mark so you're running on your body's stored fat for SIX HOURS each time you fast). In addition, you aren't eating for 2 days out of a week. That's a caloric deficit of whatever your daily "maintenance" calories are (for me: 4,400). Therefore it doesn't really matter how much you're eating when you aren't fasting. Oh one more thing, your appetite will go WAY down!
Caloric restriction is simply the only way to lose weight, we can all agree on that, you will feel hungry especially during your normal meal times, and especially when fasting for the 1st few times, but the hunger WILL pass and about mid afternoon I actually tend to get a kick of energy.
24 Hour IF is NOT by any means for everyone. It works best with men, but there are plenty of women who have done IF successfully. If you are successful though, and can do a couple fasts a week (once the weight is off, and it WILL go I promise, you can drop to 1 fast every other week or something like that, as there are a whole lot of benefits from IF besides just losing weight)
If you think you could do it, as you can tell, I highly recommend it. I can't cover all the benefits of IF in a post though, so here are a couple more good reads including the book which I highly reccomend if this seems like something you'd be interested in. It's really a no brainer, you won't have a problem losing weight if you can stick to it. Best of luck! - David
P.S. I'm guessing there will be a lot of skeptics\critics out there as even my girlfriend is one of them haha, when I told her after the fact that I had just gone 24 hours without eating she was almost furious. I later talked to her about how it's not as bad as it sounds (most people hear "I just starved for a day" when you mention it haha) She eventually tried it, and we came to the conclusion that it is NOT for her.
If you have any questions, ask away, I'll do my best to answer everything.
Huffington Post: Intermittent Fasting: Who's It For? (And, if It's Not for You, What to Do Instead)
Eat Stop Eat by Brad Pilon
EDIT: I just saw that you lost 20 pounds as well. Good job! But this still counts. For you as well as anyone else looking to lose weight or simply maintaining good health\weight.
@WholeFoodHealthy I agree 100%. Very well written. I also do IF
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aziapatrick wrote: »I don't understand why I'm not losing weight. I weigh 333 lbs and the scales haven't really moved in 2 weeks. I'm eating healthy but I'm restricting my calories to 1250-1400 per day and having a cheat meal for dinner every other Saturday. Also working out for an hour 3 days per week. I've looked up info on your body going into "starvation mode" and all I could find was information about how it is a myth. Help?
It's a myth and non-existent in the common dieter. If you were truly starving, you would be emaciated and have lost a whole lot of body fat and muscle.
My guess is you are underestimating calorie intake, and perhaps even overestimating calorie burns, meaning you are unintentionally eating more than you realize.
Do you weigh your food and and log everything you eat, even on what you call cheat days?
Be careful of cheat days because they can kill your deficit if you don't know how much you are eating.
Do you log exercise burns? If so, where do you get those estimates from?0 -
aziapatrick wrote: »Pandapotato wrote: »Is your cheat meal a "go to TGI Fridays and get appetizers, dinner, and drinks?" because that could be A LOT of calories. 3500 cals = 1 lb.
It's a going to the mexican restaurant and eating chips and cheese and fried things, this last time it was also 2 drinks.
Looks like it's time to cut out the cheat meal.
A good hearty Mexican meal with two sugar drinks, chips, and the fixings, can come to at least 2,000 calories or more, depending on what you eat. My small burrito with just whole black beans, salsa, rice, and chicken or steak comes to about 850 calories, the add in the chips and salsa and I've eaten about 1200 calories (I don't like soda much, so I don't drink it). I try to save up calories for these special lunches, or eat only half and take the rest home.
I suggest you eat maybe half of your meal and take the rest home. Or, get nutrition information if they have it so you have an idea about how much you are really eating.0 -
christinev297 wrote: »@WholeFoodHealthy I agree 100%. Very well written. I also do IF
@christinev297
Woohoo! Glad to "meet" another IFer, and thank you, I discovered it by complete accident. I used to work for Starbucks (best job in the world, at the right location lol) and I'd work long days as I was an hours hog. Some days when we were busy I'd eat basically nothing but drink a LOT of coffee and I had a crapton of energy. Of course I attributed it to the coffee until recently (I no longer work there) when I had a bunch of errands to run and accidentally ended up not eating for ~22 hours. The whole day I was extremely energetic and alert, so I googled something like "No eating energy" and came across IF. I was amazed and read into it a whole lot more and it made perfect sense!0 -
aziapatrick wrote: »I really appreciate all of the advice that has been given, I have lost 20 lbs since 1/5 so obviously I must be doing something right, even without owning a food scale. I completely agree that I haven't given myself enough time before getting concerned and will keep doing what I'm doing, minus a cheat meal (which isn't necessary for me) and review again in a month.
You've lost 20 pounds in 4 weeks? What's the post for? You're doing awesome!0 -
Starvation mode is a myth. Metabolic adaptation, however, is another story.0
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WholeFoodHealthy wrote: »christinev297 wrote: »@WholeFoodHealthy I agree 100%. Very well written. I also do IF
@christinev297
Woohoo! Glad to "meet" another IFer, and thank you, I discovered it by complete accident. I used to work for Starbucks (best job in the world, at the right location lol) and I'd work long days as I was an hours hog. Some days when we were busy I'd eat basically nothing but drink a LOT of coffee and I had a crapton of energy. Of course I attributed it to the coffee until recently (I no longer work there) when I had a bunch of errands to run and accidentally ended up not eating for ~22 hours. The whole day I was extremely energetic and alert, so I googled something like "No eating energy" and came across IF. I was amazed and read into it a whole lot more and it made perfect sense!
I've tried a lot of "diets, and alternate day fasting is the ONLY thing that has worked to get the weight off, rather quickly and effortlessly.
ETA: it's also the only woe that has saved me money lol I've spent a crap ton of money on supplements and stuff like plexus etc none of which worked
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I started at a lower weight, at 5'7 and on sedentary level and MFP set my calories to approximately 1810, like yourself, but I ate hundreds more calories per day than you're giving yourself. I've lost relatively consistently at 2lb per week and always have one day off a week. To me it's a change of lifestyle, not a punishment. You're doing so well and sound like you're being a little tough on yourself.
Remember that times of the month can also have an impact? Best wishes! 
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Yeah I was just confused as to what the problem is. Seems like people are generating a problem.
There is so much analysis being performed in this thread when in reality it's so simple. Hopefully someone mentioned it and I just missed it.
- The OP has been at this for 1 month which isn't to long.
- She lost 20 lbs in that month which is normal for someone with that much weight to lose.
- She hasn't lost weight in 2 weeks which is nothing. Weight loss isn't linear.
- The OP has sloppy tracking and is still losing weight because she has a large margin of error available to her. She might be able to ride that out for a little bit or a long time, it all depends on how far off her tracking actually is. As she loses more weight and she begins to require less calories then her margin of error gets smaller and maybe catches up to her.
Class dismissed.
You are one class act!!
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You have lost 20 lbs in 30 days. I don't see the issue.0
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and getherrspoons wrote: »aziapatrick wrote: »herrspoons wrote: »You're consuming more calories than you think and burning less. Log everything, ditch the cheat meal and half the exercise calories you claim.
I don't log exercise because I don't want to be tempted to eat back the calories. I honestly have no idea how many calories I'm burning while exercising.
Ok. Log everything and ditch the cheat meal. See where you are in 3 weeks.
and get a good scale0 -
Starvation mode is a myth, and metabolic slowdown is extremely over-exaggerated0
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christinev297 wrote: »WholeFoodHealthy wrote: »christinev297 wrote: »@WholeFoodHealthy I agree 100%. Very well written. I also do IF
@christinev297
Woohoo! Glad to "meet" another IFer, and thank you, I discovered it by complete accident. I used to work for Starbucks (best job in the world, at the right location lol) and I'd work long days as I was an hours hog. Some days when we were busy I'd eat basically nothing but drink a LOT of coffee and I had a crapton of energy. Of course I attributed it to the coffee until recently (I no longer work there) when I had a bunch of errands to run and accidentally ended up not eating for ~22 hours. The whole day I was extremely energetic and alert, so I googled something like "No eating energy" and came across IF. I was amazed and read into it a whole lot more and it made perfect sense!
I've tried a lot of "diets, and alternate day fasting is the ONLY thing that has worked to get the weight off, rather quickly and effortlessly.
ETA: it's also the only woe that has saved me money lol I've spent a crap ton of money on supplements and stuff like plexus etc none of which worked
If only more people knew... I mean it seems like almost common sense: Don't eat=Lose weight, but people (myself not excluded) don't think of it because no one talks about it as an option. Makes sense I guess, I mean there would be no $$$ made by supplement manufacturers, diet food companys, diet plan companies, myfitnesspal (haha) hell if every overweight person didn't eat for 2 days a week all major food companies (suppliers, restaurants, EVERYONE) would be losing money. So there's that lol.0 -
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WholeFoodHealthy wrote: »christinev297 wrote: »WholeFoodHealthy wrote: »christinev297 wrote: »@WholeFoodHealthy I agree 100%. Very well written. I also do IF
@christinev297
Woohoo! Glad to "meet" another IFer, and thank you, I discovered it by complete accident. I used to work for Starbucks (best job in the world, at the right location lol) and I'd work long days as I was an hours hog. Some days when we were busy I'd eat basically nothing but drink a LOT of coffee and I had a crapton of energy. Of course I attributed it to the coffee until recently (I no longer work there) when I had a bunch of errands to run and accidentally ended up not eating for ~22 hours. The whole day I was extremely energetic and alert, so I googled something like "No eating energy" and came across IF. I was amazed and read into it a whole lot more and it made perfect sense!
I've tried a lot of "diets, and alternate day fasting is the ONLY thing that has worked to get the weight off, rather quickly and effortlessly.
ETA: it's also the only woe that has saved me money lol I've spent a crap ton of money on supplements and stuff like plexus etc none of which worked
If only more people knew... I mean it seems like almost common sense: Don't eat=Lose weight, but people (myself not excluded) don't think of it because no one talks about it as an option. Makes sense I guess, I mean there would be no $$$ made by supplement manufacturers, diet food companys, diet plan companies, myfitnesspal (haha) hell if every overweight person didn't eat for 2 days a week all major food companies (suppliers, restaurants, EVERYONE) would be losing money. So there's that lol.
That's... not really how it works. Someone doing IF is getting the same weekly deficit as someone just lowering their everyday calories. If I eat a big sandwich and a curry today, then eat nothing tomorrow, then eat the sandwich and curry again the next day, I'm not saving any money than if I'd just eaten the sandwich today, the curry the next day, etc... but either way you get the same weekly deficit. I think you should probably have just said 'if every overweight person were eating in a calorie deficit (regardless of how they get there)' rather than 'if every overweight person didn't eat for 2 days a week'. I've tried both IF and daily calorie deficit and saved the same amount of money doing either.
Regardless, back to the OP, two weeks isn't a stall and is nothing to worry about 0 -
You don't need to ditch "a" cheat" meal - but you should definitely log it and probably quit that one. Margarita's usually have about 400 cal each. Chips are very high in calories and then add fried food and lots of cheese. You are probably getting well over 2000 calories in that meal. So you can still cheat and allow yourself to go over your calories - but I would suggest at least looking at how much it really is to see if it is worth it to you.
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But this is not really the reason for you stalling at this point - it was mostly water weight you lost and it is readjusting. You are losing some real weight as well but think about it - there are 3.5k cal in a pound of fat. So 20# would be 70,000 calorie deficit. That would be pretty hard to do even if you ate nothing and exercised in 2 weeks. If you are not hungry I do not think you need to up your calories - but the concern is that you need to be in this for the long haul. You need to develop new healthy habits and if all you have are extreme habits (either 1200 cal with lots of exercise that you are not adding back in) or the habits that got you to 333# - well neither is likely to be realistically maintained long without burn out or health issues.0 -
OP, it seems like you have no idea how many calories you are consuming (eyeballing?!) and no idea how many calories you are burning (your words).
This method can not work if you estimate and just throw random numbers out there.
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aziapatrick wrote: »yopeeps025 wrote: »aziapatrick wrote: »The only things I may be off about are the ounces in the chicken (by 1 or 2 oz) and the amount of broccoli I eat (it could be slightly more than a cup). Everything else I use a measuring cup or measuring spoon for.
I used to measure everything with a cup or spoons but then I started actually weighing them and it is a HUGE difference. For instance, the popcorn bag said I could have 1/2 cup or 50g so I just used the 1/2 cup; but one day I decided to weigh it and the 1/2 was actually 180g! More than 3x's what I though I was eating!
But to get back to you main question; starvation mode in a way exists but not to the extreme. I have done lots of research on this and met with a nutritionist and came to the conclusion that if your body doesn't get enough food (ie energy) your metabolic rate, as well as most body functions, slows down to conserve energy. I am not sure how many calories you need to eat but I suggest making and appointment with a nutritionist. Mine helped me a lot!0 -
Yeah I was just confused as to what the problem is. Seems like people are generating a problem.
There is so much analysis being performed in this thread when in reality it's so simple. Hopefully someone mentioned it and I just missed it.
- The OP has been at this for 1 month which isn't to long.
- She lost 20 lbs in that month which is normal for someone with that much weight to lose.
- She hasn't lost weight in 2 weeks which is nothing. Weight loss isn't linear.
- The OP has sloppy tracking and is still losing weight because she has a large margin of error available to her. She might be able to ride that out for a little bit or a long time, it all depends on how far off her tracking actually is. As she loses more weight and she begins to require less calories then her margin of error gets smaller and maybe catches up to her.
Class dismissed.
This^
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aziapatrick wrote: »The only thing I don't log is the cheat meal, which is every other Saturday night. I figure I've went over my calories for the day so it doesn't matter. Everything else is on point. I'm also drinking 1-1.5 gallons of water per day. As for not moving, one morning I'll lose a pound the next I'll gain, so overall it is staying the same (I'm OCD and guilty of weighing every day but I know it'll fluctuate daily but the trend should still be downwards). I started my diet on 1/5/15 (exercising 3 days per week) and have lost 20 lbs since then, all of that was lost in the first 2.5 weeks. Now it's just at a stand still. I guess I just got used to seeing it dramatically drop. With my weight being so high I just assumed that being on a 1250-1400 calorie per day diet it would take it a little while to start stalling.
Everything matters!!!! Every single bite you sneak that is not part of your plan. If you eat less than you burn you will lose weight at a rate of about 3500 cal = 1lb. Lets say you need 2000 calories to maintain your current weight and you cut that to 1400 all week so you pick up 3600 calories but then on Sat you eat whatever you want so that means a 4000 calorie day (its easier than you think) well that is 2000 calories over maintenance so those come from you 3600 you earned leaving you 1600 calories lost for the week which is not even one pound. Cheat days really only cheat you out of your goal. Log everything and if you think you will feel guilty logging it then that probably means you shouldn't eat it.
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aziapatrick wrote: »Log everything and if you think you will feel guilty logging it then that probably means you shouldn't eat it.
There is nothing you should feel guilty about or not eat.
Because it bears repeating:
As MrM said:
"- The OP has been at this for 1 month which isn't to long.
- She lost 20 lbs in that month which is normal for someone with that much weight to lose.
- She hasn't lost weight in 2 weeks which is nothing. Weight loss isn't linear.
- The OP has sloppy tracking and is still losing weight because she has a large margin of error available to her. She might be able to ride that out for a little bit or a long time, it all depends on how far off her tracking actually is. As she loses more weight and she begins to require less calories then her margin of error gets smaller and maybe catches up to her.
Class dismissed."0 -
^ Apparently you cannot quote two different people in the same post. Or I tried to that in the wrong way, apologies.0
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Ohhhh, I missed the part about the OP losing 20 pounds in a month.0
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I'm beginning to think the boards aren't a place for me. There have been several posts full of great information, but that is getting overshadowed by the snarky and rude comments. Being a morbidly obese woman dieting is hard but I am determined and when I ask for advice I'm looking for positivity and constructive criticism not "you're sloppy and aren't doing it right". So I want to really thank the posters who gave me advice and constructive criticism in a positive way.
I originally posted because I was curious about starvation mode. I wanted to know opinions on it. So I've gotten what I needed and I'm done.0 -
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Yes, Virginia, there is a starvation mode.
Here's a VERY well-done explanation, both of what it isn't (the common misconceptions) and what it is (with pictures and references and sciency stuff).
http://www.aworkoutroutine.com/starvation-mode/
If you are really eating less than your body needs to run, you will lose weight.
There's no way around it.
No, your body does not hold onto calories because you're not eating enough. That's a myth.
It has to have calories (energy). It prefers to burn carbohydrates (glucose, then glycogen), then it burns fat, as a distant third it burns protein (muscle). It's an inefficient conversion, and it's a gamble, hoping that you'll find food before too much of your heart & diaphragm are cannabilized & you die. THAT is starvation mode. It takes a long time to get there.
Here's a newbie help post I did, which compiles links to helpful info such as sexypants, responsible goal setting (weight, calories, macros), logging & measuring food accurately, motivation...
It seems you need to get realistic about several things:
a healthy calorie level, to allow you to lose 2 lb per week
your food intake (weigh &/or measure everything until you've got a handle on portion sizes, and log everything)
work up to at least 1 hour of cardio at least 5 days per week (and don't eat the exercise calories, or at least not regularly; if you're really hungry at the end of the day, once in a while have 1/3 - 1/2 of that days')
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First of all yes your right it can be pretty snarky here lol.
But dont give up hun. You can do this. You already lost 21 pounds.
So stick to your plan and be determent, despite what others say.
Its the internet people are like this.
Just try to step over it....
You can do it!! 0
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