Kinesiologist recommends 175g protein for 136lbs woman?
Replies
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The larger bolus study(s) have been around for a while so there is nothing new with that. I don't think (or at least I am not aware) of studies that look at the efficacy of BCAAs for the older population - although as I type this, something is niggling my brain about it so I may be doing some google-fu'ing today.
Interested in this concept as well since I a) am > 50 and b) tend not to hit my protein target very often.
I recently started doing 5g BCAAs pre-workout just for fun... well, CYA really since I work out fasted, probably 12ish hours after my last significant protein meal... and so far it seems to slightly benefit stamina anyway. (Could be placebo effect, could be the fact that I'm finally recovering from a nasty sinus infection.)
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The larger bolus study(s) have been around for a while so there is nothing new with that. I don't think (or at least I am not aware) of studies that look at the efficacy of BCAAs for the older population - although as I type this, something is niggling my brain about it so I may be doing some google-fu'ing today.
Interested in this concept as well since I a) am > 50 and b) tend not to hit my protein target very often.
I recently started doing 5g BCAAs pre-workout just for fun... well, CYA really since I work out fasted, probably 12ish hours after my last significant protein meal... and so far it seems to slightly benefit stamina anyway. (Could be placebo effect, could be the fact that I'm finally recovering from a nasty sinus infection.)
BCAAs are generally considered to be more likely to be beneficial when training fasted. Personally, I just have whey protein in my coffee if I train in the morning as I usually am not hungry in the morning.0 -
Springfield1970 wrote: »FWIW, my highest protein goal is 170g - thats when I am cutting. Its higher than usual as there is some argument to higher protein when older so it was a bit of a 'try it and see;. Usually my goal when cutting is 150 - 160g and when maintaining its 135 - 145g (these are set by my coach). I weigh quite a bit more than you - around the 161 - 163lb mark.
Hi! I'm older :-( can you tell me more about why us geriatrics need more protein? I would have thought it would get 'ignored' even more by the body due to lack of hormones etc ( I'm hypothesising out loud!)
At the risk of name dropping, my coach is Alberto Nunez and I actually discussed this very briefly with Eric Helms (sorry - sounds douchy with the name dropping, but just mentioning them so you know the reliability of the source). It's nothing actually 'proven' as such - just something they are looking at and extrapolating from what is known I beleive. There is evidence that older people need bigger bolus' (sounds rude lol) to activate MPS (I think Layne discusses it on one of his vlogs). I did not get into too many details with them but I think it has to do with not being as efficient at utilizing/partitioning protein and possibly that we use more for non MPS purposes.
Typing this out makes me realize that I should have asked more questions lol.
ETA: to clarify, the higher protein comment was about possibly 'optimizing' MPS. Sort of eeking out that little bit extra - which at the end of the day is not useful if it causes adherence problems.
But you look 21 years old0 -
LolBroScience wrote: »Springfield1970 wrote: »FWIW, my highest protein goal is 170g - thats when I am cutting. Its higher than usual as there is some argument to higher protein when older so it was a bit of a 'try it and see;. Usually my goal when cutting is 150 - 160g and when maintaining its 135 - 145g (these are set by my coach). I weigh quite a bit more than you - around the 161 - 163lb mark.
Hi! I'm older :-( can you tell me more about why us geriatrics need more protein? I would have thought it would get 'ignored' even more by the body due to lack of hormones etc ( I'm hypothesising out loud!)
At the risk of name dropping, my coach is Alberto Nunez and I actually discussed this very briefly with Eric Helms (sorry - sounds douchy with the name dropping, but just mentioning them so you know the reliability of the source). It's nothing actually 'proven' as such - just something they are looking at and extrapolating from what is known I beleive. There is evidence that older people need bigger bolus' (sounds rude lol) to activate MPS (I think Layne discusses it on one of his vlogs). I did not get into too many details with them but I think it has to do with not being as efficient at utilizing/partitioning protein and possibly that we use more for non MPS purposes.
Typing this out makes me realize that I should have asked more questions lol.
ETA: to clarify, the higher protein comment was about possibly 'optimizing' MPS. Sort of eeking out that little bit extra - which at the end of the day is not useful if it causes adherence problems.
But you look 21 years old
You sweet-talker you.
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The larger bolus study(s) have been around for a while so there is nothing new with that. I don't think (or at least I am not aware) of studies that look at the efficacy of BCAAs for the older population - although as I type this, something is niggling my brain about it so I may be doing some google-fu'ing today.
Interested in this concept as well since I a) am > 50 and b) tend not to hit my protein target very often.
I recently started doing 5g BCAAs pre-workout just for fun... well, CYA really since I work out fasted, probably 12ish hours after my last significant protein meal... and so far it seems to slightly benefit stamina anyway. (Could be placebo effect, could be the fact that I'm finally recovering from a nasty sinus infection.)
BCAAs are generally considered to be more likely to be beneficial when training fasted. Personally, I just have whey protein in my coffee if I train in the morning as I usually am not hungry in the morning.
Which concurs with what I've read, and why I started taking them. Glad it might not be a total waste.
I'm really nauseous first thing in the morning, have been for decades. Never eat breakfast. I have whey protein (with water, even mixing with almond milk doesn't sit well) post-workout, but that's about an hour after I get up.
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The larger bolus study(s) have been around for a while so there is nothing new with that. I don't think (or at least I am not aware) of studies that look at the efficacy of BCAAs for the older population - although as I type this, something is niggling my brain about it so I may be doing some google-fu'ing today.
Interested in this concept as well since I a) am > 50 and b) tend not to hit my protein target very often.
I recently started doing 5g BCAAs pre-workout just for fun... well, CYA really since I work out fasted, probably 12ish hours after my last significant protein meal... and so far it seems to slightly benefit stamina anyway. (Could be placebo effect, could be the fact that I'm finally recovering from a nasty sinus infection.)
BCAAs are generally considered to be more likely to be beneficial when training fasted. Personally, I just have whey protein in my coffee if I train in the morning as I usually am not hungry in the morning.
Which concurs with what I've read, and why I started taking them. Glad it might not be a total waste.
I'm really nauseous first thing in the morning, have been for decades. Never eat breakfast. I have whey protein (with water, even mixing with almond milk doesn't sit well) post-workout, but that's about an hour after I get up.
Do you eat late the night before? Heartburn, reflux. I wouldn't be too happy about being nauseous in the morning, you're missing a great opportunity to fuel up like a mofo and have the workouts of dreams...
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Springfield1970 wrote: »The larger bolus study(s) have been around for a while so there is nothing new with that. I don't think (or at least I am not aware) of studies that look at the efficacy of BCAAs for the older population - although as I type this, something is niggling my brain about it so I may be doing some google-fu'ing today.
Interested in this concept as well since I a) am > 50 and b) tend not to hit my protein target very often.
I recently started doing 5g BCAAs pre-workout just for fun... well, CYA really since I work out fasted, probably 12ish hours after my last significant protein meal... and so far it seems to slightly benefit stamina anyway. (Could be placebo effect, could be the fact that I'm finally recovering from a nasty sinus infection.)
BCAAs are generally considered to be more likely to be beneficial when training fasted. Personally, I just have whey protein in my coffee if I train in the morning as I usually am not hungry in the morning.
Which concurs with what I've read, and why I started taking them. Glad it might not be a total waste.
I'm really nauseous first thing in the morning, have been for decades. Never eat breakfast. I have whey protein (with water, even mixing with almond milk doesn't sit well) post-workout, but that's about an hour after I get up.
Do you eat late the night before? Heartburn, reflux. I wouldn't be too happy about being nauseous in the morning, you're missing a great opportunity to fuel up like a mofo and have the workouts of dreams...
I did in the past but now I'm on a med taken at bedtime that needs an empty stomach so no food two hours prior. Supper is easily my largest meal, however.
I'm used to the nausea thing, I guess. I just tell people I've had morning sickness for the last 40 years, lol.
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Springfield1970 wrote: »FWIW, my highest protein goal is 170g - thats when I am cutting. Its higher than usual as there is some argument to higher protein when older so it was a bit of a 'try it and see;. Usually my goal when cutting is 150 - 160g and when maintaining its 135 - 145g (these are set by my coach). I weigh quite a bit more than you - around the 161 - 163lb mark.
Hi! I'm older :-( can you tell me more about why us geriatrics need more protein? I would have thought it would get 'ignored' even more by the body due to lack of hormones etc ( I'm hypothesising out loud!)
At the risk of name dropping, my coach is Alberto Nunez and I actually discussed this very briefly with Eric Helms (sorry - sounds douchy with the name dropping, but just mentioning them so you know the reliability of the source). It's nothing actually 'proven' as such - just something they are looking at and extrapolating from what is known I beleive. There is evidence that older people need bigger bolus' (sounds rude lol) to activate MPS (I think Layne discusses it on one of his vlogs). I did not get into too many details with them but I think it has to do with not being as efficient at utilizing/partitioning protein and possibly that we use more for non MPS purposes.
Typing this out makes me realize that I should have asked more questions lol.
ETA: to clarify, the higher protein comment was about possibly 'optimizing' MPS. Sort of eeking out that little bit extra - which at the end of the day is not useful if it causes adherence problems.
Since you name dropped and referenced Layne as well, has the usage of BCAAs ever come up by Alberto or Eric to utilize in hypo-caloric states to help with MPS?
Have you seen youtube video this by Eric? The series is great, but this one is on supps.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tp3ZIFKkLg
They have BCAA's as a 'possibly useful as a CYA but not necessary', and unlikely to provide additional benefits in a surplus category basically.
Yep, have watched it many times. I just know Layne is a proponent of them (taking their potential efficacy in context of being minimal in the overall scope of things), but didn't know if Eric's thoughts on the matter had shifted since he did the series and as you mention, the older populace having to take in larger boluses of protein (thus more luecine) to activate MPS events. Also, my statement was in a hypo-caloric situation and not hyper...I know your statement was about "in a surplus category..." My thoughts were just utilizing BCAAs to stimulate those events at points where larger protein intake is not possible due to logistics or wanting to have a greater focus on say... carbs, yet being able to ingest BCAAs to induce MPS events without too many added calories.
BCAAs have calories comparable to that of protein, so you couldn't substitute BCAAs to save calories.
http://www.ajcn.org/content/52/5/770.full.pdf0 -
Did anyone ask why the kinesiologist is giving dietary recommendations?
or did I just skim that?0 -
Did anyone ask why the kinesiologist is giving dietary recommendations?
or did I just skim that?
Yes, I thought that too or more, why listen to the advice (unless he has the qualifications to do so)? We get a lot of that over here - PTs giving diet advice, it's usually on the bro side, although some downright dangerous. My daughters boxing club had a new coach who suggested the cabbage soup diet to her at 15!! (he, thankfully, didn't last long).
I don't think the 175 would do any harm (especially while cutting) but it's overkill IMO. Although, I am swayed by what @Sarauk2sf is saying - I'm not getting any younger and I don't think it'd be too much of a stretch for me to squeeze another 20/30g in.
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Springfield1970 wrote: »FWIW, my highest protein goal is 170g - thats when I am cutting. Its higher than usual as there is some argument to higher protein when older so it was a bit of a 'try it and see;. Usually my goal when cutting is 150 - 160g and when maintaining its 135 - 145g (these are set by my coach). I weigh quite a bit more than you - around the 161 - 163lb mark.
Hi! I'm older :-( can you tell me more about why us geriatrics need more protein? I would have thought it would get 'ignored' even more by the body due to lack of hormones etc ( I'm hypothesising out loud!)
At the risk of name dropping, my coach is Alberto Nunez and I actually discussed this very briefly with Eric Helms (sorry - sounds douchy with the name dropping, but just mentioning them so you know the reliability of the source). It's nothing actually 'proven' as such - just something they are looking at and extrapolating from what is known I beleive. There is evidence that older people need bigger bolus' (sounds rude lol) to activate MPS (I think Layne discusses it on one of his vlogs). I did not get into too many details with them but I think it has to do with not being as efficient at utilizing/partitioning protein and possibly that we use more for non MPS purposes.
Typing this out makes me realize that I should have asked more questions lol.
ETA: to clarify, the higher protein comment was about possibly 'optimizing' MPS. Sort of eeking out that little bit extra - which at the end of the day is not useful if it causes adherence problems.
Since you name dropped and referenced Layne as well, has the usage of BCAAs ever come up by Alberto or Eric to utilize in hypo-caloric states to help with MPS?
Have you seen youtube video this by Eric? The series is great, but this one is on supps.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tp3ZIFKkLg
They have BCAA's as a 'possibly useful as a CYA but not necessary', and unlikely to provide additional benefits in a surplus category basically.
Yep, have watched it many times. I just know Layne is a proponent of them (taking their potential efficacy in context of being minimal in the overall scope of things), but didn't know if Eric's thoughts on the matter had shifted since he did the series and as you mention, the older populace having to take in larger boluses of protein (thus more luecine) to activate MPS events. Also, my statement was in a hypo-caloric situation and not hyper...I know your statement was about "in a surplus category..." My thoughts were just utilizing BCAAs to stimulate those events at points where larger protein intake is not possible due to logistics or wanting to have a greater focus on say... carbs, yet being able to ingest BCAAs to induce MPS events without too many added calories.
BCAAs have calories comparable to that of protein, so you couldn't substitute BCAAs to save calories.
http://www.ajcn.org/content/52/5/770.full.pdf
True, but 5g of BCAA with enough luecine to drive MPS has 20 calories. Whey at say 21g-24g of protein to get enough luecine to drive MPS, will have typically about 120-140 calories. So looking at it for example, 2x a day ingestion, would be a savings of 200+ calories that could be utilized toward carb consumption.
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Springfield1970 wrote: »FWIW, my highest protein goal is 170g - thats when I am cutting. Its higher than usual as there is some argument to higher protein when older so it was a bit of a 'try it and see;. Usually my goal when cutting is 150 - 160g and when maintaining its 135 - 145g (these are set by my coach). I weigh quite a bit more than you - around the 161 - 163lb mark.
Hi! I'm older :-( can you tell me more about why us geriatrics need more protein? I would have thought it would get 'ignored' even more by the body due to lack of hormones etc ( I'm hypothesising out loud!)
At the risk of name dropping, my coach is Alberto Nunez and I actually discussed this very briefly with Eric Helms (sorry - sounds douchy with the name dropping, but just mentioning them so you know the reliability of the source). It's nothing actually 'proven' as such - just something they are looking at and extrapolating from what is known I beleive. There is evidence that older people need bigger bolus' (sounds rude lol) to activate MPS (I think Layne discusses it on one of his vlogs). I did not get into too many details with them but I think it has to do with not being as efficient at utilizing/partitioning protein and possibly that we use more for non MPS purposes.
Typing this out makes me realize that I should have asked more questions lol.
ETA: to clarify, the higher protein comment was about possibly 'optimizing' MPS. Sort of eeking out that little bit extra - which at the end of the day is not useful if it causes adherence problems.
Since you name dropped and referenced Layne as well, has the usage of BCAAs ever come up by Alberto or Eric to utilize in hypo-caloric states to help with MPS?
Have you seen youtube video this by Eric? The series is great, but this one is on supps.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tp3ZIFKkLg
They have BCAA's as a 'possibly useful as a CYA but not necessary', and unlikely to provide additional benefits in a surplus category basically.
Yep, have watched it many times. I just know Layne is a proponent of them (taking their potential efficacy in context of being minimal in the overall scope of things), but didn't know if Eric's thoughts on the matter had shifted since he did the series and as you mention, the older populace having to take in larger boluses of protein (thus more luecine) to activate MPS events. Also, my statement was in a hypo-caloric situation and not hyper...I know your statement was about "in a surplus category..." My thoughts were just utilizing BCAAs to stimulate those events at points where larger protein intake is not possible due to logistics or wanting to have a greater focus on say... carbs, yet being able to ingest BCAAs to induce MPS events without too many added calories.
BCAAs have calories comparable to that of protein, so you couldn't substitute BCAAs to save calories.
http://www.ajcn.org/content/52/5/770.full.pdf
True, but 5g of BCAA with enough luecine to drive MPS has 20 calories. Whey at say 21g-24g of protein to get enough luecine to drive MPS, will have typically about 120-140 calories. So looking at it for example, 2x a day ingestion, would be a savings of 200+ calories that could be utilized toward carb consumption.
Good catch, thanks.
Joseph Agu (brilliant dude IMO) makes some comments about that here:
http://josephagu.com/2013/03/26/bccas-for-bodybuilders-just-the-science-part-3/
I had asked Eric Helms a similar question because IIRC some BCAA labels do not list calories and I think it has to do with FDA requirements since BCAAs aren't a complete macronutrient. But I didn't specifically mention the difference in quantity required to elicit MPS.
At any rate, see below for thoughts on this:
Specifically:
What about their caloric efficiency?
Given that BCAAs are the only amino acids that stimulate protein synthesis, another rationale for the use of BCAAs whilst dieting is due to their greater caloric economy in comparison to whole protein sources. In other words, if your aim were to get 3g of leucine in a given meal, ingesting whole protein food such as whey would require about 25g (100kcal), whereas 6g (24kcal) of BCAAs would provide the same amount of leucine.
By the same logic, if things were only as simple as getting enough leucine to max out MPS at each meal (~4-6g of most brands of BCAAs), we would theoretically only need 24-36g of BCAAs per day to cover protein requirements. However, it’s no use having leucine to initiate protein synthesis if there is no protein (i.e. other amino acids) to actually carry on this process. What will basically happen is that things will short circuit, meaning that MPS may begin but then stop soon after. A quote from a review by Balage & Dardevet (2010) on the topic sums this up nicely:
“There is some evidence that long-term leucine availability is sufficient to improve muscle mass or performance during exercise training. However, it needs to be associated with other amino acids to be efficient (for example, through leucine-rich proteins).”
This wouldn’t seem to be a problem for the between-meal dosing of BCAAs since there are already other amino acids in circulation. The aim of this strategy isn’t to stimulate MPS using BCAAs by themselves; rather, it is to extend MPS.
However, like a complete protein, it also appears that an EAA mixture may optimise MPS. As such, consuming sufficient whole protein the majority of the time and then replacing around-workout whey protein with BCAAs may also have the intended benefit (i.e. optimal MPS stimulation) but with greater caloric efficiency. For example, whey contains roughly 25% BCAA, so assuming someone consumes 30g of whey protein pre and post training, this would amount to 60g of whey (240kcal), whereas isolated BCAAs will account for 15g total (60 kcal), a saving of 180kcal per workout day. If this person trained four times per week, this would be a saving of 720kcal per week, just over 100 kcal per day.
However, I honestly can’t see why someone would want to save calories by reducing protein intake in the first place, never mind go to all that effort just to save themselves 100kcal per day. The same reduction could be achieved by sticking with whey and reducing fat by 11g or carbohydrate by 25g per day, or a combination of the two. Not only will this save you money, you’ll get as much BCAA as well as all the other essential and non-essential amino acids (which may impart added benefit). You’ll also get the
I don't know about you but I'd prefer more to a meal than this whilst dieting.
—I don’t know about you but I’d prefer more to a meal than this whilst dieting.
potentially therapeutic compounds contained in whey such as immunoglobins and lactoferrin, as well potentially anabolic properties of whey independent of its constituent amino acids. Finally, you’ll likely experience greater satiety with whey compared to isolated BCAAs (something that would benefit dieters). In clinical research, BCAAs have been used to stimulate appetite in populations at risk for muscle wasting. The mechanism to explain why this is the case involves BCAAs competing with tryptophan for entry into the brain, thereby reducing the production of a satiating neurotransmitter, serotonin. As such, it is ironic that the same supplement many take for dieting purposes may actually make dieting a more difficult experience than it needs to be. Conversely, the satiating effects of whey protein are well documented
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TLDR whole thread.
IMO, I'm surprised that someone other than a dedicated bodybuilder would recommend over the 1g/lb for protein. Good for them.
Personally, if you are otherwise healthy, I don't see anything wrong with it and as long as you are not completely starving yourself of valuable carbs and fats too. Hardcore bodybuilders can do as much as 2g and your run of the mill nutritionist could go as low as 0.5g/lb. It's debateable whether to choose LBM or current bodyweight.
But if your goals are more lean mass and less fat, then listen to the pros who have been there and done it. I would say at a minimum, do 1g/lb of total bodyweight or 1.5g/lb of LBM.
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Any reason why you chose not to read the thread but commented instead? This page alone has had some interesting information.
At quick glance, it diverged into a bcaa thread and everyone questioning the source of the advice whether they were a Kinesiologist, nutritionist, or bodybuilder, when we are all internet strangers in a semi-public forum.
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Springfield1970 wrote: »FWIW, my highest protein goal is 170g - thats when I am cutting. Its higher than usual as there is some argument to higher protein when older so it was a bit of a 'try it and see;. Usually my goal when cutting is 150 - 160g and when maintaining its 135 - 145g (these are set by my coach). I weigh quite a bit more than you - around the 161 - 163lb mark.
Hi! I'm older :-( can you tell me more about why us geriatrics need more protein? I would have thought it would get 'ignored' even more by the body due to lack of hormones etc ( I'm hypothesising out loud!)
At the risk of name dropping, my coach is Alberto Nunez and I actually discussed this very briefly with Eric Helms (sorry - sounds douchy with the name dropping, but just mentioning them so you know the reliability of the source). It's nothing actually 'proven' as such - just something they are looking at and extrapolating from what is known I beleive. There is evidence that older people need bigger bolus' (sounds rude lol) to activate MPS (I think Layne discusses it on one of his vlogs). I did not get into too many details with them but I think it has to do with not being as efficient at utilizing/partitioning protein and possibly that we use more for non MPS purposes.
Typing this out makes me realize that I should have asked more questions lol.
ETA: to clarify, the higher protein comment was about possibly 'optimizing' MPS. Sort of eeking out that little bit extra - which at the end of the day is not useful if it causes adherence problems.
Since you name dropped and referenced Layne as well, has the usage of BCAAs ever come up by Alberto or Eric to utilize in hypo-caloric states to help with MPS?
Have you seen youtube video this by Eric? The series is great, but this one is on supps.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tp3ZIFKkLg
They have BCAA's as a 'possibly useful as a CYA but not necessary', and unlikely to provide additional benefits in a surplus category basically.
Yep, have watched it many times. I just know Layne is a proponent of them (taking their potential efficacy in context of being minimal in the overall scope of things), but didn't know if Eric's thoughts on the matter had shifted since he did the series and as you mention, the older populace having to take in larger boluses of protein (thus more luecine) to activate MPS events. Also, my statement was in a hypo-caloric situation and not hyper...I know your statement was about "in a surplus category..." My thoughts were just utilizing BCAAs to stimulate those events at points where larger protein intake is not possible due to logistics or wanting to have a greater focus on say... carbs, yet being able to ingest BCAAs to induce MPS events without too many added calories.
BCAAs have calories comparable to that of protein, so you couldn't substitute BCAAs to save calories.
http://www.ajcn.org/content/52/5/770.full.pdf
True, but 5g of BCAA with enough luecine to drive MPS has 20 calories. Whey at say 21g-24g of protein to get enough luecine to drive MPS, will have typically about 120-140 calories. So looking at it for example, 2x a day ingestion, would be a savings of 200+ calories that could be utilized toward carb consumption.
Good catch, thanks.
Joseph Agu (brilliant dude IMO) makes some comments about that here:
http://josephagu.com/2013/03/26/bccas-for-bodybuilders-just-the-science-part-3/
I had asked Eric Helms a similar question because IIRC some BCAA labels do not list calories and I think it has to do with FDA requirements since BCAAs aren't a complete macronutrient. But I didn't specifically mention the difference in quantity required to elicit MPS.
At any rate, see below for thoughts on this:
Specifically:
What about their caloric efficiency?
Given that BCAAs are the only amino acids that stimulate protein synthesis, another rationale for the use of BCAAs whilst dieting is due to their greater caloric economy in comparison to whole protein sources. In other words, if your aim were to get 3g of leucine in a given meal, ingesting whole protein food such as whey would require about 25g (100kcal), whereas 6g (24kcal) of BCAAs would provide the same amount of leucine.
By the same logic, if things were only as simple as getting enough leucine to max out MPS at each meal (~4-6g of most brands of BCAAs), we would theoretically only need 24-36g of BCAAs per day to cover protein requirements. However, it’s no use having leucine to initiate protein synthesis if there is no protein (i.e. other amino acids) to actually carry on this process. What will basically happen is that things will short circuit, meaning that MPS may begin but then stop soon after. A quote from a review by Balage & Dardevet (2010) on the topic sums this up nicely:
“There is some evidence that long-term leucine availability is sufficient to improve muscle mass or performance during exercise training. However, it needs to be associated with other amino acids to be efficient (for example, through leucine-rich proteins).”
This wouldn’t seem to be a problem for the between-meal dosing of BCAAs since there are already other amino acids in circulation. The aim of this strategy isn’t to stimulate MPS using BCAAs by themselves; rather, it is to extend MPS.
However, like a complete protein, it also appears that an EAA mixture may optimise MPS. As such, consuming sufficient whole protein the majority of the time and then replacing around-workout whey protein with BCAAs may also have the intended benefit (i.e. optimal MPS stimulation) but with greater caloric efficiency. For example, whey contains roughly 25% BCAA, so assuming someone consumes 30g of whey protein pre and post training, this would amount to 60g of whey (240kcal), whereas isolated BCAAs will account for 15g total (60 kcal), a saving of 180kcal per workout day. If this person trained four times per week, this would be a saving of 720kcal per week, just over 100 kcal per day.
However, I honestly can’t see why someone would want to save calories by reducing protein intake in the first place, never mind go to all that effort just to save themselves 100kcal per day. The same reduction could be achieved by sticking with whey and reducing fat by 11g or carbohydrate by 25g per day, or a combination of the two. Not only will this save you money, you’ll get as much BCAA as well as all the other essential and non-essential amino acids (which may impart added benefit). You’ll also get the
I don't know about you but I'd prefer more to a meal than this whilst dieting.
—I don’t know about you but I’d prefer more to a meal than this whilst dieting.
potentially therapeutic compounds contained in whey such as immunoglobins and lactoferrin, as well potentially anabolic properties of whey independent of its constituent amino acids. Finally, you’ll likely experience greater satiety with whey compared to isolated BCAAs (something that would benefit dieters). In clinical research, BCAAs have been used to stimulate appetite in populations at risk for muscle wasting. The mechanism to explain why this is the case involves BCAAs competing with tryptophan for entry into the brain, thereby reducing the production of a satiating neurotransmitter, serotonin. As such, it is ironic that the same supplement many take for dieting purposes may actually make dieting a more difficult experience than it needs to be. Conversely, the satiating effects of whey protein are well documented
Good resource. Have been reading his articles. Thanks, it made me seriously rethink my stance on BCAAs.
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Any reason why you chose not to read the thread but commented instead? This page alone has had some interesting information.
At quick glance, it diverged into a bcaa thread and everyone questioning the source of the advice whether they were a Kinesiologist, nutritionist, or bodybuilder, when we are all internet strangers in a semi-public forum.
Incorrect, I suggested that the OP be the one to question it and get the answers.0 -
Any reason why you chose not to read the thread but commented instead? This page alone has had some interesting information.
At quick glance, it diverged into a bcaa thread and everyone questioning the source of the advice whether they were a Kinesiologist, nutritionist, or bodybuilder, when we are all internet strangers in a semi-public forum.
You maybe are internet strangers.
But these are my peoples.
We aren't strangers at all.
No strange here to be had.0 -
You maybe are internet strangers.
But these are my peoples.
We aren't strangers at all.
No strange here to be had.
To the OP, there is no dead set, magic bullet, grams of protein to build lean mass, some say 0.5g, some say 1g, some say 2+, so the recommendation given to you was on the high side (~1.5), but still inline. Try out 1g and see if you can handle that in your diet and how well your body responds, you could always vary it from there to tailor your needs.
Well it doesn't take more than simple math. No need to question the source or the credentials.0
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