judged by your weight
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joejward95 wrote: »You could say a form of social evolution yes, not biological evolution.
Thanks Sheldon
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>You could say a form of social evolution yes, not biological evolution.
Ohh look at me yeah ahahaha how funny, he knows basic biology. Yeah what a nerd lets laugh at him because laughing at nerds is great!
Im sorry I have chosen to pursue a career in physics and hence have a respect for science.0 -
MindySaysWhaaat wrote: »Everyone has preferences. If someone asked me out and I didn't find them attractive for whatever reason (weight, appearance etc) I'd probably just be polite and say "I'm sorry, I'm just not interested in you that way." I wouldn't tell them a specific reason because even if I don't like how someone looks, I wouldn't want to make them feel self conscious.
That being said, if a person is rude about telling someone they're not attracted to them, then that's just plain wrong. It sounds like the person you're talking about was probably in this category. Sorry you had to deal with that. Shrug it off, and move on.
Well I do agree with you but sometimes some women want to know why they are undateable by the guy they are talking to. If it is the truth well you got the answer right.
Yes I might sound a little odd but when you had women say your unattractive because of looks well it is what it is to them.
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You know, I met two of my boyfriends online. First time around I would have been considered a little overweight and the second time somewhere between overweight and slightly obese. I didn't put a picture online until I'd chatted to the men I was interested in and then sent honest pictures. All were ok with my look. I met a few men and they all were interested in meeting again. Some were bigger, some were thinner. But they were all decent guys. I also asked some of them about their preferences and some of them had had bigger and thinner girlfriends. I am now dating a lovely man now who has dated smaller and bigger women. He is overweight himself. I think he's very handsome. My ex was fairly skinny. I thought he was very handsome.
Some people mind weight more than others. I have been attracted to bigger and thinner men. In my last round of dating there was only guy who I just couldn't feel attracted to. Yes, he was quite overweight. But so is my current partner. The point with him was that he couldn't keep up with me during a walk through town. And that his table manners were horrible. I could have told him that but I didn't. I knew he was working on his fitness levels and was feeling really self-conscious about it. So why hurt him? I only told him there was no spark. Which is still true.
It's fine not being interested but there's no need to be hurtful.0 -
joejward95 wrote: »You could say a form of social evolution yes, not biological evolution.
Dude, why so serious??
Otherwise, the guy was rude. No, he is not required to be attracted to you. Yes, people have their types and you shouldn't try to change what they are attracted to. But, you don't have to be a jerk when rejecting someone. It says a lot more about him than it does about you.
Just be happy you dodged that bullet.0 -
TIL that it's "wrong" to be honest about your preferences and you'll be called names for it.
No seriously, we've got threads complaining about guys being dishonest and threads angry when that they are.
It's just a lose-lose situation.0 -
joejward95 wrote: »>You could say a form of social evolution yes, not biological evolution.
Ohh look at me yeah ahahaha how funny, he knows basic biology. Yeah what a nerd lets laugh at him because laughing at nerds is great!
Im sorry I have chosen to pursue a career in physics and hence have a respect for science.
So my assumption was correct in some way. Here is the thing. Not everything is science. Can love be explain with science? Can love be explain?
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I hate how everyone downplays the importance of physical attraction in a potential mate. Physical attractiveness may be explicitly relative (eye of the beholder), but it doesn't matter how much of every other factor a person has if they're not physically attractive to you. That said, there are plenty of other factors which carry the same weight, all of which are weighted relatively as well.
For me, what I deem as physical attractiveness is on the same level as a potential significant other's intelligence, empathy, kindness, and curiosity. I wouldn't be with someone I didn't find physically attractive even if other qualities were met. On the other hand, I wouldn't be with someone who I found extremely physically attractive, but also a boorish idiot with no imagination. I've done both of these before quite a number of times, and it was pretty awful for all parties involved.
One caveat here is that, for me, the factors apart from physiology can boost one's physical attractiveness, but it doesn't work that way in reverse.
If someone is not physically attracted to you, and won't consider to date you because of it, they are not automatically shallow. They are just looking for something different than you, and that's completely okay. Not everyone is going to find a person physically attractive, so what?
By the sound of it, you wouldn't want to be with someone who won't date you regardless of your weight, so you're ahead in the situation by them coming directly out to say it instead of feigning attraction, and leading you on for no reason other than to not hurt your feelings. However, there are plenty of people who place differing levels of importance on different aspects, so just seek them out instead.
Just remember, this is something EVERYONE has done at some point in their life when regarding strict physical attractiveness. We all live, or have at some point lived, in glass houses when it comes to this subject, so even if someone rejects us on the basis of physicality, we've all done the same exact thing before also. We are no better than the next person who has done the same.0 -
yopeeps025 wrote: »In the olden days wasn't it a big thing to have a fat husband? Sounds crazy, I know, but back then if you were fat it meant you were rich. Women went nuts for it. I suppose this is a type of social Darwinism. Rich guy = good provider in some cases the same way strong guy = good provider in other cases. This both disproves and proves joeward95's theory. So go figure.
Funny how things change now. Was it evolution that changed it?
Evolution is real, to deny that w/o evidence is to deny any experiment based on fact found in a reasonable scientific study. If you do not find value in evidence, then i cant provide anything to dissuade you.
I think it is all just survival. With society becoming more prevalent, money matters for survival, so you can overlook physical attributes. You don't need to be sexually attracted to someone to get married or benefit from them. Relationships happen for a plethora of reasons.
As far as the original intent of the post; Dating is hard, you do have to make yourself vulnerable and put yourself out there. It simply is not easy. It was *kitten* for him to give you his opinion like that, especially w/o your asking for it. I hope you have a better experience in the future with dating and that this does not discourage you from trying to find happiness.
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Well everything can be explained by science yes.The brain is a biological entity, which follows the rules of chemistry and hence the laws of physics. There are many evolutionary reason for love, its beneficial to look after each other, especially your mate, hence you love them. But I am not a biologist, I cant answer all your questions, you will have to turn to google to answer some stuff.
It doesn't sound as nice when put like that, but you did ask. Doesn't mean you consciously think through this process, but its why it exists.0 -
pineapple_peach10 wrote: »I've been there. Had guys tell me things about my weight. One said id be hotter if I lost weight.
There is a good man out there who will love you at any size.
I guess I know I would never be so shallow..dont get me wrong, we all have our types and there is nothing wrong with that. But to come right out and say that ??? I guess people dont know where Ive been and how hard I have fought to get here.
There is a difference between having a "type" and being an ***hole.
That's the thing that gets me. Are people not concerned that those types of comments are going to come back to haunt them somehow? I think it is a-okay not to be attracted to somebody but there's no reason to be rude about it.0 -
joejward95 wrote: »What I am saying is that it is subconscious. I personally am not attracted to someone who is overweight, this is the case with most men.The reason for this is because of the factors I listed. You can't choose what you're attracted to, you can't guilt someone into being attracted to you, the same way they're not an *kitten* for disliking you because you're overweight.
Why do you think many men like women with great hips? The biological reason is because a women with wide hips is better for giving birth. Me personally? I love good hips, yet I don't want children, but that doesn't matter because it is subconscious
But what you're implying you look for is a biological rarity. You want someone who has the perfect (or close to perfect) waist to hip ratio while still being fit/thin and appears to within a normal weight range.
Plus women with "great hips" for "child bearing" tend to be women who are prone to being heavier set. I'm not saying fat or over weight or whatever. I'm saying women with these child bearing hips are not usually petite, small framed women. I'm sure sometimes they can be, so I'm not saying always or never, but I'm saying generally women who have this hip to waist ratio are not tiny. They are usually curvy.
Also, being and looking overweight are two drastically different things. What you want is someone who doesn't look like they are over weight for their height because depending on what method you're using to determine healthy it could give you someone who doesn't have any hips. For example, I'm 5'10, female, 25 years old. If I used the BMI as a measure, I should weigh approx 165 - 170 lbs. At that weight I appear to be very unhealthy. I look healthier at around 200 lbs. At 170 lbs, I don't have hips, I don't have boobs, I have hip bones and a rib cage showing. To me, that's not attractive but that's where I'm not "over weight". So I'm pretty sure you just want someone who looks "hot" rather than actually being a healthy weight.0 -
acorsaut89 wrote: »joejward95 wrote: »What I am saying is that it is subconscious. I personally am not attracted to someone who is overweight, this is the case with most men.The reason for this is because of the factors I listed. You can't choose what you're attracted to, you can't guilt someone into being attracted to you, the same way they're not an *kitten* for disliking you because you're overweight.
Why do you think many men like women with great hips? The biological reason is because a women with wide hips is better for giving birth. Me personally? I love good hips, yet I don't want children, but that doesn't matter because it is subconscious
But what you're implying you look for is a biological rarity. You want someone who has the perfect (or close to perfect) waist to hip ratio while still being fit/thin and appears to within a normal weight range.
Plus women with "great hips" for "child bearing" tend to be women who are prone to being heavier set. I'm not saying fat or over weight or whatever. I'm saying women with these child bearing hips are not usually petite, small framed women. I'm sure sometimes they can be, so I'm not saying always or never, but I'm saying generally women who have this hip to waist ratio are not tiny. They are usually curvy.
Also, being and looking overweight are two drastically different things. What you want is someone who doesn't look like they are over weight for their height.
I don't think perfection is what is being sought so much as it is a trend to like certain attributes. Like how you can get a craving for steak when you're pregnant/close to mensuration because you are low on iron. You may not know you are low on iron... but your body does.0 -
acorsaut89 wrote: »joejward95 wrote: »What I am saying is that it is subconscious. I personally am not attracted to someone who is overweight, this is the case with most men.The reason for this is because of the factors I listed. You can't choose what you're attracted to, you can't guilt someone into being attracted to you, the same way they're not an *kitten* for disliking you because you're overweight.
Why do you think many men like women with great hips? The biological reason is because a women with wide hips is better for giving birth. Me personally? I love good hips, yet I don't want children, but that doesn't matter because it is subconscious
But what you're implying you look for is a biological rarity. You want someone who has the perfect (or close to perfect) waist to hip ratio while still being fit/thin and appears to within a normal weight range.
Plus women with "great hips" for "child bearing" tend to be women who are prone to being heavier set. I'm not saying fat or over weight or whatever. I'm saying women with these child bearing hips are not usually petite, small framed women. I'm sure sometimes they can be, so I'm not saying always or never, but I'm saying generally women who have this hip to waist ratio are not tiny. They are usually curvy.
Also, being and looking overweight are two drastically different things. What you want is someone who doesn't look like they are over weight for their height.
I don't think perfection is what is being sought so much as it is a trend to like certain attributes. Like how you can get a craving for steak when you're pregnant/close to mensuration because you are low on iron. You may not know you are low on iron... but your body does.
Right - and those certain attributes rarely come together. There are very few women I know who are within a normal weight range and have those child bearing hips he's talking about.
Usually those with hips/butt to give the appearance of child bearing hips have higher BF % because those areas are where fat tends to be stored on women.
It might be a ton of evolution that has taught men to subconsciously seek those attributes, but that's going to lead to some disappointment simply because it's rare to have a woman built like that. There are some, so I'm not saying never, but the general trend is that they aren't.0 -
peachyfuzzle wrote: »I hate how everyone downplays the importance of physical attraction in a potential mate. Physical attractiveness may be explicitly relative (eye of the beholder), but it doesn't matter how much of every other factor a person has if they're not physically attractive to you. That said, there are plenty of other factors which carry the same weight, all of which are weighted relatively as well.
For me, what I deem as physical attractiveness is on the same level as a potential significant other's intelligence, empathy, kindness, and curiosity. I wouldn't be with someone I didn't find physically attractive even if other qualities were met. On the other hand, I wouldn't be with someone who I found extremely physically attractive, but also a boorish idiot with no imagination. I've done both of these before quite a number of times, and it was pretty awful for all parties involved.
One caveat here is that, for me, the factors apart from physiology can boost one's physical attractiveness, but it doesn't work that way in reverse.
If someone is not physically attracted to you, and won't consider to date you because of it, they are not automatically shallow. They are just looking for something different than you, and that's completely okay. Not everyone is going to find a person physically attractive, so what?
By the sound of it, you wouldn't want to be with someone who won't date you regardless of your weight, so you're ahead in the situation by them coming directly out to say it instead of feigning attraction, and leading you on for no reason other than to not hurt your feelings. However, there are plenty of people who place differing levels of importance on different aspects, so just seek them out instead.
Just remember, this is something EVERYONE has done at some point in their life when regarding strict physical attractiveness. We all live, or have at some point lived, in glass houses when it comes to this subject, so even if someone rejects us on the basis of physicality, we've all done the same exact thing before also. We are no better than the next person who has done the same.
I think that these are all good points. I have no problem whatsoever with people admitting that they prefer X, Y, or Z as far as physical characteristics in a mate. It just seems really mean to say "you would be hotter if you lost weight" unless the person asked what it was about them that made the person not attracted to them. (If it was the latter, I'm of the opinion that you shouldn't ask questions that you don't want answers to. I mean, if I asked a person why they didn't find me attractive and said person said "your glasses make you look like a nerd" or "your hair is ridiculous" I really could only blame myself for asking at that point.)0 -
I've lost over a hundred pounds and was ostracized and insulted daily. I had a brain injury which effected my thyroid and hormones and was no fault of mine I had become obese. It taught me compassion for which I'm thankful.
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I hate how we are judged by our size...it isnt easy being overweight and trying to date and put yourself out there. I actually had a man tell me once he would rather date an unattractive , uneducated, unemployed girl as long as she had a good body. sad but true
Sounds like a jerk and thankfully you aren’t attached to him.
I remember the first time I spoke with my wife on the phone before we even met. I HATE talking on the phone (max = 5 to 10 minutes usually) and our conversation lasted about an hour! It was soooo good, I went to the office the next day and told a co-worker I didn’t care what she looked like. She wasn’t jaded in her conversation. She “volunteered” at church etc. (that told me she wasn’t self-centered). She had no self-pity. Turned out we knew some of the same people. At the time I was NOT obese.
We were married 6 months later.
Fast-forward a dozen years or so. I wasn’t obese – I was super obese. She NEVER criticized me. She NEVER called me fat. When I would call myself fat, obese etc., she only replied…”I don’t care if you weigh 500 pounds – I only care that you are around and that we can grow old together.” She would say, “I didn’t wait this long to find you – just to lose you.”
In the end, I wanted to lose the weight for health reasons (I do have multiple medical issues) and so I would be around as long as possible. Of course – humor and similar values plays a big part in our relationship. Physical appearance will always play a part with initial impressions – after that – things can change.
Best wishes.
Success Photos on pages 1 and 4 – (see link)
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10080664/lost-191-lbs-photos-success-after-999-failures/p1
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PikaKnight wrote: »TIL that it's "wrong" to be honest about your preferences and you'll be called names for it.
No seriously, we've got threads complaining about guys being dishonest and threads angry when that they are.
It's just a lose-lose situation.
I know I would prefer honesty...yes it hurts, yes it's hard to deal with but until you know where you stand with anyone... wouldn't you want to know before you start to like a person? The same can be said for women, towards men as well. No one is perfect, unfortunately there are "dating" standards out there that have been in place for young, old, thin and not thin... all physical makeups...it happens to be human nature to notice based on physical attractiveness. I would think the OP would be glad she found out how someone is before hand. I would be, count your blessings...
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acorsaut89 wrote: »acorsaut89 wrote: »joejward95 wrote: »What I am saying is that it is subconscious. I personally am not attracted to someone who is overweight, this is the case with most men.The reason for this is because of the factors I listed. You can't choose what you're attracted to, you can't guilt someone into being attracted to you, the same way they're not an *kitten* for disliking you because you're overweight.
Why do you think many men like women with great hips? The biological reason is because a women with wide hips is better for giving birth. Me personally? I love good hips, yet I don't want children, but that doesn't matter because it is subconscious
But what you're implying you look for is a biological rarity. You want someone who has the perfect (or close to perfect) waist to hip ratio while still being fit/thin and appears to within a normal weight range.
Plus women with "great hips" for "child bearing" tend to be women who are prone to being heavier set. I'm not saying fat or over weight or whatever. I'm saying women with these child bearing hips are not usually petite, small framed women. I'm sure sometimes they can be, so I'm not saying always or never, but I'm saying generally women who have this hip to waist ratio are not tiny. They are usually curvy.
Also, being and looking overweight are two drastically different things. What you want is someone who doesn't look like they are over weight for their height.
I don't think perfection is what is being sought so much as it is a trend to like certain attributes. Like how you can get a craving for steak when you're pregnant/close to mensuration because you are low on iron. You may not know you are low on iron... but your body does.
Right - and those certain attributes rarely come together. There are very few women I know who are within a normal weight range and have those child bearing hips he's talking about.
Usually those with hips/butt to give the appearance of child bearing hips have higher BF % because those areas are where fat tends to be stored on women.
It might be a ton of evolution that has taught men to subconsciously seek those attributes, but that's going to lead to some disappointment simply because it's rare to have a woman built like that. There are some, so I'm not saying never, but the general trend is that they aren't.
Look at my photos...child bearing hips! Given birth to 3 kids on gas and air, not needed stitches. At my thinnest (pre-preg) I'm a UK 10/12 (us 6/8).0 -
peachyfuzzle wrote: »I hate how everyone downplays the importance of physical attraction in a potential mate. Physical attractiveness may be explicitly relative (eye of the beholder), but it doesn't matter how much of every other factor a person has if they're not physically attractive to you. That said, there are plenty of other factors which carry the same weight, all of which are weighted relatively as well.
For me, what I deem as physical attractiveness is on the same level as a potential significant other's intelligence, empathy, kindness, and curiosity. I wouldn't be with someone I didn't find physically attractive even if other qualities were met. On the other hand, I wouldn't be with someone who I found extremely physically attractive, but also a boorish idiot with no imagination. I've done both of these before quite a number of times, and it was pretty awful for all parties involved.
One caveat here is that, for me, the factors apart from physiology can boost one's physical attractiveness, but it doesn't work that way in reverse.
If someone is not physically attracted to you, and won't consider to date you because of it, they are not automatically shallow. They are just looking for something different than you, and that's completely okay. Not everyone is going to find a person physically attractive, so what?
By the sound of it, you wouldn't want to be with someone who won't date you regardless of your weight, so you're ahead in the situation by them coming directly out to say it instead of feigning attraction, and leading you on for no reason other than to not hurt your feelings. However, there are plenty of people who place differing levels of importance on different aspects, so just seek them out instead.
Just remember, this is something EVERYONE has done at some point in their life when regarding strict physical attractiveness. We all live, or have at some point lived, in glass houses when it comes to this subject, so even if someone rejects us on the basis of physicality, we've all done the same exact thing before also. We are no better than the next person who has done the same.
I think that these are all good points. I have no problem whatsoever with people admitting that they prefer X, Y, or Z as far as physical characteristics in a mate. It just seems really mean to say "you would be hotter if you lost weight" unless the person asked what it was about them that made the person not attracted to them. (If it was the latter, I'm of the opinion that you shouldn't ask questions that you don't want answers to. I mean, if I asked a person why they didn't find me attractive and said person said "your glasses make you look like a nerd" or "your hair is ridiculous" I really could only blame myself for asking at that point.)
^^^ This! If you did not ask for his opinion on it all it was rude and inappropriate for him to give it.
However that does not take away from natural preferences. There have been legitimate social experiments and studies done on sexual attraction. It is not simply people being mean, although you are going to find that too, especially with online dating where you are perceived as "less as a person" I say it that way because people tend to be more mean online than in person.
This should not discourage you from meeting people and searching, everyone has their own preferences, but it is important to recognize that natural reactions and instincts are a real thing.
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maybe i wasnt clear.........i dont anyone to settle for me or talk themselves into me. I am upfront and honest about where I am with my weight. I told him from the get go and sent full body pics. He was honest, and I was not upset..hurt me with the truth rather than deceive me with a lie is what I always want. My point is, that it was an eye opener that weight truly is a barrier in dating and I guess it is a harsh pill to swallow. Especially when someone tells you you are very pretty, eloquent in how you speak, educated, have a good moral compass..etc...but they just cant get past your physicality. I dont hate myself, nor do I let others determine my self worth. It just shocked me that he couldnt just leave it at YOU ARE TOO OVERWEIGHT..but instead said he would rather date an unattractive, unemployed, uneducated woman if she was thin because that is all that matters to him. I never even met him....and yes I was glad he was honest..but a little too brutally honest .
Physical attractiveness plays a part in dating? Never would have guessed
clearly you didnt read my initial post where I state there is nothing wrong with someone wanting a certain type.....0 -
It just shocked me that he couldnt just leave it at YOU ARE TOO OVERWEIGHT..but instead said he would rather date an unattractive, unemployed, uneducated woman if she was thin because that is all that matters to him. I never even met him....and yes I was glad he was honest..but a little too brutally honest .
Yeah, agreed, that's over the top and unnecessary. It would make me a lot less sad about him not being interested, though, so look on the bright side.0 -
_dracarys_ wrote: »You're making a blanket statement based on ONE guy's opinion?
i did not make a blanket statement..I was citing an example just to see if anyone else had experienced this kind of thing... maybe you have never been on the receiving end of someone saying something like that to you....no different than someone saying..gee I find you great in every way, except the color of your skin as mentioned in one of the other comments...
I was raised with manners...I had a man show up once to meet me and he was about 100 lbs heavier than a pic he had posted...did I feel the need to insult him? NO...I left him his dignity. Thats not lying, that being compassionate to someone.0 -
At that point, a person being uncouth affecting your mood is more on you than it is them, in my mind. You cannot control what a person says/does, but you can most certainly control your own personal reactions to what they say/do.0
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joejward95 wrote: »No, its not ingrained to go after a partner with the same skin tone (im not a biologist, maybe there is some preference. Ill have to look into it later). I personally am more attracted to someone who is Caucasian, maybe its a coincidence that I am Caucasian as well? I don't know enough to tell you for sure. But this is not what I was discussing. Dont bring up race to try and then imply I am a bigot of some form. The fact is that being overweight = greater risk at childbirth , greater risk of illness, implies they have a lack of discipline and care for themselves. Would you want to date someone like that? Because the for the huge huge majority of overweight people this is the case.
My sister is a size 2...skinny isnt always healthier..her cholesterol, triglycerides and sugar are all elevated and I run circles around her at the gym..of course, being overweight increases your risk factors which is why we are all trying to get healthier.. but dont assume that skinny= healthy..not always the case
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no..it didnt get that far...he started the conversation with...GEE YOU ARE REALLY PRETTY BLAH BLAH BLAH..but here is a hint..MEN WOULD RATHER DATE AN UGLY, STUPID, UNEMPLOYED GIRL IF HER BODY IS GOOD.... than someone overweight.... it was quite a perspective to hear, and while some may think it, he was the first one to say it so directly. I have no problem dating men who liked me 74 lbs ago and today as well...I have learned a lot on this journey of weight loss..and most of all is that anyone who is trying to better themselves is already a winner . its all about the loveyopeeps025 wrote: »
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Well.. With that man at least he was honest with you.. And now you honestly know how shallow he is 0
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peachyfuzzle wrote: »At that point, a person being uncouth affecting your mood is more on you than it is them, in my mind. You cannot control what a person says/does, but you can most certainly control your own personal reactions to what they say/do.
i didnt react..there were no tears shed, I actually laughed out loud because yes, we can all be a little more brazen behind the computer. Its all about the delivery is my point... I prefer bald, some facial hair , tattoos..so I wouldnt message a man if I was still online that I did not find attractive based on his pics!! let alone, message him knowing how he looks ( as this jerk did because I had a full body pic posted) only to hurl an insult. again..manners are a lost art in some. I can like someone so very much and sometimes they can fit the pic on all levels of what I want, and for reasons unknown, it doesnt click. it is either there or it isnt. we all want what we want, and I am 100% guilty of that myself. loving everyones perspectives0 -
GymnasticsMommy wrote: »Well.. With that man at least he was honest with you.. And now you honestly know how shallow he is
see..YOU get it...lol... .... he just needed to pass me by without the need to tell me how I need to better myself so men would like me. I have no probs in that area. I just wanted to start a thread..and oh boy have I
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