Half Marathon training - Getting slower
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Side note: but is anyone else concerned about stride and stride length at slower paces? I find that my stride is AWFUL at slower paces. Anything slower than a 9 min mile really starts to suffer.0
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Lots of good advice already...just wanted to throw a little caution to the wind. Decreased performance can also be a sign of over training. Google Overtraining Syndrome and see if you have any other symptoms. If you've been following a good running program, it is probably not the case...but a little education on the subject doesn't hurt if you intend to keep running
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Lots of good advice already...just wanted to throw a little caution to the wind. Decreased performance can also be a sign of over training. Google Overtraining Syndrome and see if you have any other symptoms. If you've been following a good running program, it is probably not the case...but a little education on the subject doesn't hurt if you intend to keep running
Throwing caution to the wind means that you are essentially dispensing with caution... it's basically tantamount to saying "I don't care what the consequences are - I am going to do this!"
Not maybe the phrase you'd want to use when you're trying to warn someone against over training.
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I train for 15k distances (and longer) at a pace about 2 min/mi slower than my 5k pace. As a result, if I run a 5k while training for a distance race, I'll run that 5k slower than I would if my training runs were short distance. I don't think it's overtraining as much as adapting to longer and slower distances. Try taking some time off and see if that helps the times. It also may be beneficial to add some yoga or cross training to your routine and reduce the miles. At a half marathon distance, you shouldn't need to run a ton of miles - even if you're starting from scratch. Use a respected training program as a base, and fine tune the details to make them work for you.0
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I disagree with reducing your miles since you said you are running less than 20 a week now.
You will always be faster at all distances over 800 meters by running more miles if you run those training moles right.
My fastrsti 5k ever was only 2 weeks after my one and only 100 mi training week.
Once you get your miles up there for a while, if you don't run all of them too hard, your sramina for holding speed will go through the roof.0 -
Any training program should consist of 80% or more of the runs being easy runs for best results (particularly if you are building mileage). If you run too hard all the time progress will usually stagnate or begin regressing after a few months.
Easy is really easy, below the ventilatory threshold. In other words, you aren't even breathing hard. It sounds like magic that you get better running so easy but it works.
I started following this advice and my distance has increased well beyond what I was able to do when I was running in the past.
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The purpose of easy training runs is not to beat your previous paces. You're not winning anything, except more recovery time.0
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SonicDeathMonkey80 wrote: »The purpose of easy training runs is not to beat your previous paces. You're not winning anything, except more recovery time.
This. I know too many people who always try to "win" their workouts. Or PR every training run. This is not the right way to train.
It has gotten to the point where one friend will start telling me about his "PR 10k" effort on his training run the day before and I have stopped him dead. If you can PR your 10k in a training run, you are sandbagging your races.
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SonicDeathMonkey80 wrote: »The purpose of easy training runs is not to beat your previous paces. You're not winning anything, except more recovery time.
This. I know too many people who always try to "win" their workouts. Or PR every training run. This is not the right way to train.
It has gotten to the point where one friend will start telling me about his "PR 10k" effort on his training run the day before and I have stopped him dead. If you can PR your 10k in a training run, you are sandbagging your races.
Yep. I was there once myself, and I plateaued at 8:00 mile pace for everything. And to a point this goes for races as well. I'm in a couple clubs (Half Fanatics/Marathon Maniacs) and lots of the members will pile on the races and get all out of whack when they don't PR at each one of them. Even during a race, a PR shouldn't happen as a surprise - it should be trained for and completely expected (unless it's your first attempt at that distance). I've never PR'd during a training run, and even if I did, it would only mean that I haven't raced that particular distance in years, or like you said, I'm sandbagging the races.
Racing is not training, and training is not racing.
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I had a series of half-marathon PRs in training last season while training for a marathon. But that was because I almost never run half marathons (except as part of a half-ironman).
I was amused by that since I know full well I shouldn't be PRing in training, but at least I had a legitimate reason for this one.
The only time I was surprised by a PR was at a half marathon I ran this past January. I was at a triathlon training camp and the race was supposed to just be a kind of training event. We had ridden a few hundred miles in the days before, a few really long and hard swim efforts and some track runs. My legs were decidedly destroyed. Yet I get to the start line and rip out a 30-second PR. No clue where that even came from considering how tired I was and the lack of anything resembling a taper. Makes me wonder what I can do when specifically training for a half marathon with a sufficient taper ahead of it.0 -
I had a series of half-marathon PRs in training last season while training for a marathon. But that was because I almost never run half marathons (except as part of a half-ironman).
I was amused by that since I know full well I shouldn't be PRing in training, but at least I had a legitimate reason for this one.
The only time I was surprised by a PR was at a half marathon I ran this past January. I was at a triathlon training camp and the race was supposed to just be a kind of training event. We had ridden a few hundred miles in the days before, a few really long and hard swim efforts and some track runs. My legs were decidedly destroyed. Yet I get to the start line and rip out a 30-second PR. No clue where that even came from considering how tired I was and the lack of anything resembling a taper. Makes me wonder what I can do when specifically training for a half marathon with a sufficient taper ahead of it.
You Ironman people always shock me when you do standalone races
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Through my training, I have experienced this a number of times. With running, you will experience low points and high points. Not every run is going to great. A lot of things can factor your running. How long ago you ate, or how hard you went the day before. Another could be you have missed your long run two weeks in a row. That is the most important run of the week. You will bounce back, just don't over think things and just run.0
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SonicDeathMonkey80 wrote: »I had a series of half-marathon PRs in training last season while training for a marathon. But that was because I almost never run half marathons (except as part of a half-ironman).
I was amused by that since I know full well I shouldn't be PRing in training, but at least I had a legitimate reason for this one.
The only time I was surprised by a PR was at a half marathon I ran this past January. I was at a triathlon training camp and the race was supposed to just be a kind of training event. We had ridden a few hundred miles in the days before, a few really long and hard swim efforts and some track runs. My legs were decidedly destroyed. Yet I get to the start line and rip out a 30-second PR. No clue where that even came from considering how tired I was and the lack of anything resembling a taper. Makes me wonder what I can do when specifically training for a half marathon with a sufficient taper ahead of it.
You Ironman people always shock me when you do standalone races
It is the weirdest thing but I personally think a standalone marathon is a harder race than a full ironman. It is a faster run, so it hurts more. At an ironman you get off the 112 mile bike feeling drained already so your run starts off slow and just gets slower.
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HardcoreP0rk wrote: »Side note: but is anyone else concerned about stride and stride length at slower paces? I find that my stride is AWFUL at slower paces. Anything slower than a 9 min mile really starts to suffer.
Stride rate or stride distance? I don't understand. What's the issue with this @HardcoreP0rk0 -
SonicDeathMonkey80 wrote: »I had a series of half-marathon PRs in training last season while training for a marathon. But that was because I almost never run half marathons (except as part of a half-ironman).
I was amused by that since I know full well I shouldn't be PRing in training, but at least I had a legitimate reason for this one.
The only time I was surprised by a PR was at a half marathon I ran this past January. I was at a triathlon training camp and the race was supposed to just be a kind of training event. We had ridden a few hundred miles in the days before, a few really long and hard swim efforts and some track runs. My legs were decidedly destroyed. Yet I get to the start line and rip out a 30-second PR. No clue where that even came from considering how tired I was and the lack of anything resembling a taper. Makes me wonder what I can do when specifically training for a half marathon with a sufficient taper ahead of it.
You Ironman people always shock me when you do standalone races
It is the weirdest thing but I personally think a standalone marathon is a harder race than a full ironman. It is a faster run, so it hurts more. At an ironman you get off the 112 mile bike feeling drained already so your run starts off slow and just gets slower.
As an accomplished triathlete of three sprints of varying embarrassing times, I would celebrate getting off the bike with a leisurely 5k walk.0 -
Check out Fartlek training to increase your speed, I used to add a bit into my runs and it definitely helped. I do the same kind of thing on the bike too.0
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HardcoreP0rk wrote: »Side note: but is anyone else concerned about stride and stride length at slower paces? I find that my stride is AWFUL at slower paces. Anything slower than a 9 min mile really starts to suffer.
Nope. Whether I run a 7:30 or 12:30 mile, my stride/cadence is all the same - 176-184. Only when I go from 5:30-7:00 does it really change to 190-200+. Speed is not an excuse for poor form, unless you're going faster than you are able to for a specific duration.0 -
SonicDeathMonkey80 wrote: »HardcoreP0rk wrote: »Side note: but is anyone else concerned about stride and stride length at slower paces? I find that my stride is AWFUL at slower paces. Anything slower than a 9 min mile really starts to suffer.
Nope. Whether I run a 7:30 or 12:30 mile, my stride/cadence is all the same - 176-184. Only when I go from 5:30-7:00 does it really change to 190-200+. Speed is not an excuse for poor form, unless you're going faster than you are able to for a specific duration.
I did 8 this morning. First mile was a 9:53 pace and avg run cadence was 174. This progressed up till mile 8 @ 8:38 pace and 178 run cadence. Average for the entire run was 176. They're all nearly exactly the same. Mine can reach 190 for some faster interval work but the cadence is just about the same for any long distance work that's in the aerobic zone.0 -
Same here. My cadence rarely strays off the 175-179 range. Hills, up or down, or some sprint intervals will change it, but for the most part all of my running no matter the pace is at that cadence0
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Usually that means I need sleeeeeeeeeeeeep or an extra day off.
Most people will typically be faster later in the day.
I also recommend an "active" rest or recovery day to run with no tracking whatsoever-- no phone, watch, whichever.0
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