Steam room dilemma
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Maybe he had a suit on under the towel?
What is the deal with his hands? First, they're "too close" to his genitals - is that in his lap? Now he's fiddling.
Honestly, if he creeps you out, just say, "I don't want to talk to men I don't know," and see how that goes. If he's special needs, be straight and to the point. There just isn't any reason to be nasty, IMO.
I'd you can't handle it on your own, talk to the staff and see if they can't help you out.0 -
Tortitudekitty wrote: »Now......you may be thinking, so what but the problem is that he definitely has "issues", maybe some sort of autism.
So does this tell us more about you than him. As you're in your 50s I'm somewhat surprised that you seek to excuse your own reaction nby wheeling out ill informed prejudice.
You've expressed your position to him. If he contues, then escalate it to the duty manager.
Even if he does have some form of spectrum disorder it's not relevant to the gym, unless it's part of a treatment plan.0 -
This doesn't seem like a discussion that belongs in "Fitness and Exercise".0
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My last word on this.
Yes I am in my 50's but I do not look it. I guess it's genetics. Lucky me, eh.
He doesn't use the gym.
Maybe it doesn't belong in this section, granted but neither did I want to put it in chit-chat as it is full of frivolous stuff.
Good day.0 -
There is a guy like that at our tennis courts (high functioning level autistic -- formerly Aspberger's). He likes to interfere with everyone's game. We have to be blunt with him. He habitually plays late afternoon so most of us try to get a court in the morning. (By the way, not a hard syndrome to recognize)
I would report that sauna guy for breaking rules. Then I would reschedule my sauna time.
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Every gym I've ever been in the steam room and sauna are where creepy guys go to stare. I hate those things and wish gyms wouldn't put them in the shower room. They don't even work out just sit there0
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By the way, not a hard syndrome to recognize
It does depend where on the spectrum someone is. Social anxiety, lower ability to pick up social cues, unsophisticated use of language could be indicators, or could just be indicators of lower educational level, or lower achievement.
Given the numbers of people who demonstrate ASD characteristics it can be difficult. What ASD doesn't offer is an opportunity for someone to project their own social anxieties onto others. The whole description reads like a Transactional Analysis case study.
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Any one who has worked in a health club has had to deal with this situation numerous times. The worst behavior issues are always in the water areas--pools, saunas, spas, steam rooms, and showers. There is something about the combination of moisture and reduced clothing that enhances tendencies for inappropriate behavior. I'm 95% certain that you are not the first person this guy has approached in this way. If you go to management, it is likely he has a history of this type of behavior and they can help with the situation. They may even have some insight into his background that might help reduce any perceived threat (even if it doesn't decrease the annoyance).0
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I'd simply tell him that he was being inappropriate and I don't want to be followed around as it felt like harassment and ask him to please not speak to me and to preferably use the sauna at another time.
Doesn't matter what's wrong with him, if anything. If he's going to be in public as an adult, he needs to be appropriate, at least within the widest bounds of reasonable behavior.0 -
MeanderingMammal wrote: »By the way, not a hard syndrome to recognize
It does depend where on the spectrum someone is. Social anxiety, lower ability to pick up social cues, unsophisticated use of language could be indicators, or could just be indicators of lower educational level, or lower achievement.
Given the numbers of people who demonstrate ASD characteristics it can be difficult. What ASD doesn't offer is an opportunity for someone to project their own social anxieties onto others. The whole description reads like a Transactional Analysis case study.
She was TRYING to give the guy the benefit of the doubt and not just label him a "creeper." But disabilities are not excuses for behaving in extremely inappropriate ways in public. There are certain lines beyond which people who are out unattended must not cross.
And YES, there are people in my family with serious disabilities.
Also, if you're not so far along the spectrum that you ARE extremely obvious to a person with experience, you have no excuse for being a creeper.0 -
MamaBirdBoss wrote: »She was TRYING to give the guy the benefit of the doubt and not just label him a "creeper.".
She did both, and characterised a fairly common condition as not normal and potential threat. Bluntly, that's a pretty offensive assumption.
The man was inappropriate. A 57year old who doesn't have the nous to go and speak to the duty manager, but instead comes onto a forum to ask for advice might well be demonstrating ASD related behaviours herself.
The described behaviour appears inappropriate. Deal with that rather than projecting ones own prejudices onto the other individual.
That said, I'm making my own assumptions about the originator, based on the narrative, which in itself influences my own response. One might consider that in light of TA as well, I know I do.
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MamaBirdBoss wrote: »MeanderingMammal wrote: »By the way, not a hard syndrome to recognize
It does depend where on the spectrum someone is. Social anxiety, lower ability to pick up social cues, unsophisticated use of language could be indicators, or could just be indicators of lower educational level, or lower achievement.
Given the numbers of people who demonstrate ASD characteristics it can be difficult. What ASD doesn't offer is an opportunity for someone to project their own social anxieties onto others. The whole description reads like a Transactional Analysis case study.
She was TRYING to give the guy the benefit of the doubt and not just label him a "creeper."
Not buying it - not when the story suddenly changed to the guy fiddling with his junk.
From what's been shared, IMO there's a whole lot of OP projecting going on here...
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MeanderingMammal wrote: »By the way, not a hard syndrome to recognize
It does depend where on the spectrum someone is. Social anxiety, lower ability to pick up social cues, unsophisticated use of language could be indicators, or could just be indicators of lower educational level, or lower achievement.
Given the numbers of people who demonstrate ASD characteristics it can be difficult. What ASD doesn't offer is an opportunity for someone to project their own social anxieties onto others. The whole description reads like a Transactional Analysis case study.
Or a high-functioning college educated (city planner and city planning commissioner) with high intelligence/language and low social skills/abilities.0 -
MeanderingMammal wrote: »The man was inappropriate. A 57year old who doesn't have the nous to go and speak to the duty manager, but instead comes onto a forum to ask for advice might well be demonstrating ASD related behaviours herself.
Putting the whole question of ASD to one side, women (of all ages!) often struggle with asserting themselves in the face of unwanted behaviour from men, because of the strong pressure to be polite/nice and to smooth things over, to work towards social harmony at a cost to one's own comfort. There's a lifetime of training that goes into that - it becomes instinctive for most women. We tolerate petty sexism and harrassment all the time, also because calling out every instance would be tiring and isn't always worth the costs (e.g. in job settings), and it often leads to a backlash.
More often, we just leave a situation that is uncomfortable or that feels threatening, because that's the lowest-cost option in terms of the other person's possible responses, judgements from others, etc. Except the cost is often that we lose out on that experience. (Is that fair?)
Someone above suggested saying, "your questions make me uncomfortable and I need you to stop". I think it's the right sort of thing to say (regardless of what's going on with the intrusive person asking unwanted questions). But that kind of thing is extremely hard to say!
So here the OP believes the person bothering her has ASD. That belief amps up the pressure OP feels to be polite and makes it harder to address her discomfort directly. Because she's supposed to be nice anyway, right, and if the person bothering her does have ASD, being uncomfortable and wanting to do something about it might make her look like an especially not- nice person, right? I'll say that it's especially hard to be understanding about behaviour that is directed at one's body or sexuality, I think some people are not getting this. (That's if he's on the spectrum and graciousness is called for. Although even then, I don't see how establishing boundaries is a bad or mean thing. If he's not on the spectrum, she'd be within her rights to just call him a jerk. And if he is a garden-variety jerk - well you wouldn't bother "talking things out" with a jerk, would you? You'd just report him straight away. Or leave. So anyway there are lots of reasons OP might feel conflicted.)
Also, @MeanderingMammal - what were you meaning to do by suggesting the OP has ASD herself? Were you meaning to use that as a kind of insult?0 -
MeanderingMammal wrote: »The man was inappropriate. A 57year old who doesn't have the nous to go and speak to the duty manager, but instead comes onto a forum to ask for advice might well be demonstrating ASD related behaviours herself.
Putting the whole question of ASD to one side, women (of all ages!) often struggle with asserting themselves in the face of unwanted behaviour from men, because of the strong pressure to be polite/nice and to smooth things over, to work towards social harmony at a cost to one's own comfort. There's a lifetime of training that goes into that - it becomes instinctive for most women. We tolerate petty sexism and harrassment all the time, also because calling out every instance would be tiring and isn't always worth the costs (e.g. in job settings), and it often leads to a backlash.
More often, we just leave a situation that is uncomfortable or that feels threatening, because that's the lowest-cost option in terms of the other person's possible responses, judgements from others, etc. Except the cost is often that we lose out on that experience. (Is that fair?)
Someone above suggested saying, "your questions make me uncomfortable and I need you to stop". I think it's the right sort of thing to say (regardless of what's going on with the intrusive person asking unwanted questions). But that kind of thing is extremely hard to say!
So here the OP believes the person bothering her has ASD. That belief amps up the pressure OP feels to be polite and makes it harder to address her discomfort directly. Because she's supposed to be nice anyway, right, and if the person bothering her does have ASD, being uncomfortable and wanting to do something about it might make her look like an especially not- nice person, right? I'll say that it's especially hard to be understanding about behaviour that is directed at one's body or sexuality, I think some people are not getting this. (That's if he's on the spectrum and graciousness is called for. Although even then, I don't see how establishing boundaries is a bad or mean thing. If he's not on the spectrum, she'd be within her rights to just call him a jerk. And if he is a garden-variety jerk - well you wouldn't bother "talking things out" with a jerk, would you? You'd just report him straight away. Or leave. So anyway there are lots of reasons OP might feel conflicted.)
Also, @MeanderingMammal - what were you meaning to do by suggesting the OP has ASD herself? Were you meaning to use that as a kind of insult?
Well said0 -
what were you meaning to do by suggesting the OP has ASD herself? Were you meaning to use that as a kind of insult?
Read what I said.
There are a wide range of behaviours that might be indicative of some form of ASD. These can include limited language skills, limited ability to communicate concepts and ideas, lack of empathy, inability to read reactions in others, unwillingness to challenge behaviours in others, limited ability to express challenge in a meaningful way. These behaviours are neither unique to ASD, nor particularly unusual in some areas of the UK.
The originator is expressing her assumptions about someone else based on his behaviours. Nothing that she's said points exclusively to ASD, and indeed there are more likely explanations subject to where in the country she's referring to.
What I was drawing attention to was that her description of her own behaviour ticks just as many boxes for an assessment of ASD as anything she's said in her prior posts. As you indicate, there may be mitigation for that, particularly in the originators demographic.
Given that I've already indicated that her suggestion of ASD based on her assumptions is offensive, do you really think that I'd use a reciprocal suggestion as an insult? If I was intending to be insulting it would be fairly explicit, and I wouldn't recite the same prejudiced nonsense that I've just called out the originator on.
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