Strength Standards for the general population
ForecasterJason
Posts: 2,577 Member
I think every strength standard chart I've seen is relative to the population that lifts weights or at least does some training on the exercises. While I am no expert on this subject, I decided to create a percentile chart to approximate how much weight the general population under age 40 can bench press. I took into account several variables.
As a guide, I used the strength standards for adults under age 40 here as a guide, knowing that (from what I've read) most men can't bench press their own bodyweight. I also know there are major differences in strength between a completely untrained individual and one that has trained for several years, and most people on this forum are much stronger than the average person. And from what I've read, most people don't even lift weights on a consistent basis. I also factored in anecdotal accounts I've read as well as examples from myself and people I know in real life. I suspect the higher percentiles are more subject to larger error, as much of the examples I used from what most people I know most likely bench were based on those who are untrained.
Thoughts on whether this may have any real accuracy, or am I way off?
As a guide, I used the strength standards for adults under age 40 here as a guide, knowing that (from what I've read) most men can't bench press their own bodyweight. I also know there are major differences in strength between a completely untrained individual and one that has trained for several years, and most people on this forum are much stronger than the average person. And from what I've read, most people don't even lift weights on a consistent basis. I also factored in anecdotal accounts I've read as well as examples from myself and people I know in real life. I suspect the higher percentiles are more subject to larger error, as much of the examples I used from what most people I know most likely bench were based on those who are untrained.
Thoughts on whether this may have any real accuracy, or am I way off?
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women's standards suck- and the 15 weight class jump is annoying (IMHO)0
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(Yes, I'm about to "go there"--apologies in advance to the purists). I think at least for women, the CrossFit guidelines are a bit more realistic for the masses. Especially when it comes to bench press. A lot of women can't even do a full push-up, remember. I *can*--in fact, I can crank them out pretty nicely--and it still took me a couple months of dumbbell press to build up to benching the bar alone.
Additionally, I don't think you can track categories like untrained, novice, advanced etc into percentiles. That assumes that all people lift, and progress evenly. The vast, vast majority of (e.g.) women, even women who work out, are not Stronglifting or Wendlering or whatever.0 -
cheshirecatastrophe wrote: »(Yes, I'm about to "go there"--apologies in advance to the purists). I think at least for women, the CrossFit guidelines are a bit more realistic for the masses. Especially when it comes to bench press. A lot of women can't even do a full push-up, remember. I *can*--in fact, I can crank them out pretty nicely--and it still took me a couple months of dumbbell press to build up to benching the bar alone.
Additionally, I don't think you can track categories like untrained, novice, advanced etc into percentiles. That assumes that all people lift, and progress evenly. The vast, vast majority of (e.g.) women, even women who work out, are not Stronglifting or Wendlering or whatever.
no- it's true- and something to keep in mind.
I personally tend to lose track of what a woman who doesn't do ANY working out - is NOT currently capable of- I grew up throwing heavy things around- i have always been able to pick up and push things- so I know for me- my perception of what someone who isn't trained can do- is... off. I remember I got my *kitten* HANDED to me for saying bench at 135 was warm up weight- I was genuinely confused why people were so annoyed with me but- because for me- it has been for many years. And apparently- I also live in a bubble. It's definitely a valid point- and I think to some extent- we here are a little bit in a bubble- and in any fitness forum. Our standards for ourselves are ALWAYS higher than we they really are- and are substantially higher than what an untrained counterpart would be.0 -
Where are squats and deadlifts?0
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I haven't done much research on these exercises from an anecdotal perspective (in terms of how much untrained individuals can lift), so this would be a little harder for me. But granted, I would imagine similar principles would hold for these lifts as well. Meaning, the 50th percentiles would probably correlate with the mid end of the untrained category.Where are squats and deadlifts?
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The numbers seem like ballpark at a glance, but what's the point if I may ask? If 90% of the population doesn't work out at all then why does it matter what they can bench press? That's why I'm generally curious where I stand among the population of lifters, not random people who've never seen the inside of a gym.0
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You do have a point. But since the bench press is often regarded as being one test of upper body strength in general, I think it does have some relevancy for people who are just starting out. That being said, I'm debating whether it'd be worth it to develop charts for adults over 40 or even for squats and deadlifts.The numbers seem like ballpark at a glance, but what's the point if I may ask? If 90% of the population doesn't work out at all then why does it matter what they can bench press? That's why I'm generally curious where I stand among the population of lifters, not random people who've never seen the inside of a gym.
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cheshirecatastrophe wrote: »(Yes, I'm about to "go there"--apologies in advance to the purists). I think at least for women, the CrossFit guidelines are a bit more realistic for the masses. Especially when it comes to bench press. A lot of women can't even do a full push-up, remember. I *can*--in fact, I can crank them out pretty nicely--and it still took me a couple months of dumbbell press to build up to benching the bar alone.
Additionally, I don't think you can track categories like untrained, novice, advanced etc into percentiles. That assumes that all people lift, and progress evenly. The vast, vast majority of (e.g.) women, even women who work out, are not Stronglifting or Wendlering or whatever.
Were those front or back squats, do you know?
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Your percentiles do not translate. Somewhere around 80% of Americans fall into the 5th percentile, which means they are untrained and would perform at the untrained number. Only 1% of Americans are at the Advanced level (or your 75th percentile).0
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is this on a bowflex or barbell0
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cheshirecatastrophe wrote: »I think at least for women, the CrossFit guidelines are a bit more realistic for the masses. Especially when it comes to bench press.
Yes, this seems more realistic.0 -
LolBroScience wrote: »is this on a bowflex or barbell
Neither......... Smith Machine...........0 -
Bret Contreras has a chart based on women who he has trained. His article, which includes a reminder about how many people don't lift at all, explains it a bit:
http://bretcontreras.com/female-strength-levels/0 -
Cheshirecatastrophe wrote:Additionally, I don't think you can track categories like untrained, novice, advanced etc into percentiles. That assumes that all people lift, and progress evenly.Your percentiles do not translate. Somewhere around 80% of Americans fall into the 5th percentile, which means they are untrained and would perform at the untrained number. Only 1% of Americans are at the Advanced level (or your 75th percentile).
I think there may be some confusion here. I wasn't trying to have the percentiles match the untrained, novice, intermediate, advanced, and elite standards. This is why the 50th percentile numbers are actually still in the untrained category, and the 5th percentile numbers are lower than any numbers you would see on any other chart. Likewise, what I have as the 95th percentile is around the intermediate level on other strength standards charts. I'm sure there may still be some overestimation though.0 -
ForecasterJason wrote: »
You do have a point. But since the bench press is often regarded as being one test of upper body strength in general, I think it does have some relevancy for people who are just starting out. That being said, I'm debating whether it'd be worth it to develop charts for adults over 40 or even for squats and deadlifts.The numbers seem like ballpark at a glance, but what's the point if I may ask? If 90% of the population doesn't work out at all then why does it matter what they can bench press? That's why I'm generally curious where I stand among the population of lifters, not random people who've never seen the inside of a gym.
Newbies shouldn't be doing 1-rep max tests, due to the high risk involved.
Besides, newbies shouldn't worry about how they compare with other newbies - they should just follow a good strength program.
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This is true. I actually thought about safety earlier as a possible reason why there aren't too many of these charts around (though I do think the one for women from Bret Contreras that jemhh linked to may be more realistic). It's not very easy and safe to get untrained people to test this out.Cherimoose wrote: »ForecasterJason wrote: »
You do have a point. But since the bench press is often regarded as being one test of upper body strength in general, I think it does have some relevancy for people who are just starting out. That being said, I'm debating whether it'd be worth it to develop charts for adults over 40 or even for squats and deadlifts.The numbers seem like ballpark at a glance, but what's the point if I may ask? If 90% of the population doesn't work out at all then why does it matter what they can bench press? That's why I'm generally curious where I stand among the population of lifters, not random people who've never seen the inside of a gym.
Newbies shouldn't be doing 1-rep max tests, due to the high risk involved.
Besides, newbies shouldn't worry about how they compare with other newbies - they should just follow a good strength program.
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Cherimoose wrote: »ForecasterJason wrote: »
You do have a point. But since the bench press is often regarded as being one test of upper body strength in general, I think it does have some relevancy for people who are just starting out. That being said, I'm debating whether it'd be worth it to develop charts for adults over 40 or even for squats and deadlifts.The numbers seem like ballpark at a glance, but what's the point if I may ask? If 90% of the population doesn't work out at all then why does it matter what they can bench press? That's why I'm generally curious where I stand among the population of lifters, not random people who've never seen the inside of a gym.
Newbies shouldn't be doing 1-rep max tests, due to the high risk involved.
Besides, newbies shouldn't worry about how they compare with other newbies - they should just follow a good strength program.
Most people unless competing probably should not be doing 1 rep max due to the injury thing.0 -
Bret Contreras has a chart based on women who he has trained. His article, which includes a reminder about how many people don't lift at all, explains it a bit:
http://bretcontreras.com/female-strength-levels/
This^^ was an interesting read actually!
I need to find out if i can do a chin up!
Lol
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No clue about men, but for the general population, the women chart is completely nonsense OP, sorry. Just a collection of random numbers. From my personal experience.0
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LolBroScience wrote: »is this on a bowflex or barbell
wait- I thought we were using resistance bands?0 -
I like how Bret Contreras has a range in his chart. If you read his explanation with the chart, he does say that your environment can skew your perspective of strength. I also agree with him that it is likely that an untrained woman, which I'm equating with your 5%, could even bench an empty bar. This is just based on what I have seen at my gym.0
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I like how Bret Contreras has a range in his chart. If you read his explanation with the chart, he does say that your environment can skew your perspective of strength. I also agree with him that it is likely that an untrained woman, which I'm equating with your 5%, could even bench an empty bar. This is just based on what I have seen at my gym.
The average completely untrained woman most definitely cannot bench press an olympic bar.0 -
ExRelaySprinter wrote: »Bret Contreras has a chart based on women who he has trained. His article, which includes a reminder about how many people don't lift at all, explains it a bit:
http://bretcontreras.com/female-strength-levels/
This^^ was an interesting read actually!
I need to find out if i can do a chin up! Lol
Man, this chart makes me really happy! But, I as well need to work up to a chin up... Trying to get there with TRX assistance!0 -
I'm not sure why it should really matters unless you get into some kind of competition maybe. But then it only matters where you're at for that competition.Cherimoose wrote: »ForecasterJason wrote: »
You do have a point. But since the bench press is often regarded as being one test of upper body strength in general, I think it does have some relevancy for people who are just starting out. That being said, I'm debating whether it'd be worth it to develop charts for adults over 40 or even for squats and deadlifts.The numbers seem like ballpark at a glance, but what's the point if I may ask? If 90% of the population doesn't work out at all then why does it matter what they can bench press? That's why I'm generally curious where I stand among the population of lifters, not random people who've never seen the inside of a gym.
Newbies shouldn't be doing 1-rep max tests, due to the high risk involved.
Besides, newbies shouldn't worry about how they compare with other newbies - they should just follow a good strength program.
Yeah, there's little reason to shoot for a 1-rep max as a new lifter. Injury potential aside, the person is untrained and not going to be very strong which should be understood. The only real relevance of knowing an untrained individuals absolute strength would be in a study comparing an intervention to untrained individuals for before and after results; they'd likely take a 6RM anyway.0 -
Since it puts me in the top 1 or 2 percent of my weight bracket, I will say it's accurate.
Can't dog on something that makes me look good...lol. 0 -
The numbers seem like ballpark at a glance, but what's the point if I may ask? If 90% of the population doesn't work out at all then why does it matter what they can bench press? That's why I'm generally curious where I stand among the population of lifters, not random people who've never seen the inside of a gym.
You're not familiar with OP, are you?0 -
The numbers seem like ballpark at a glance, but what's the point if I may ask? If 90% of the population doesn't work out at all then why does it matter what they can bench press? That's why I'm generally curious where I stand among the population of lifters, not random people who've never seen the inside of a gym.
You're not familiar with OP, are you?
Justifying his mediocrity.0
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