Cutting carbs and refined sugar
Replies
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I don't know about everyone, but as someone who's been an addict with pretty much every narcotic there is at some point (I know, I know...lame...that's well behind me and it's going to stay there), I feel the same way about refined sugar. Once I start eating *kitten* sugars like cake or candy, it escalates quickly. I get ravenous for it. When I finally make the choice to stop, it sucks. I feel different in a bad way, and I crave it for a good while. But once it's been out of my system I'm okay. I think a lot of people experience this! Or at least some of the people I've talked to about how much I have to stay away from it... Everyone's different, obviously. But I can totally relate to your "dramatic" feelings about it hahaha internet forums are so ridiculous sometimes.
Do you eat sugar right out of the bowl or bag??0 -
People who are interested in low carb will find the info - there is lots out there. For someone whose only interest seems to be in proving it is a wrong/bad way to eat, why bother?
Actually I am quite well versed in the literature, who said it was wrong or a bad way to eat? All l did was ask someone to substantiate a claim, since the burden of proof falls on the claim maker. Perhaps low carbers should stop making things up if they don't want to be called on their nonsense?0 -
Yep, see it all the time.
Stick around. You'll see it. It happens all the time.
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So is anyone going to substantiate the ridiculous claims form low carb advocates in the last few pages? So far the only thing put forth can be called nothing short of a joke, since I'm unsure how anyone with a smidgen of intelligence could consider the links as any proof of their claims
That is some impressive unsubstantiated dissing - aka 'trumping' your opponent - and you might get a better result with factual knowledge or personal experiences.
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That is some impressive unsubstantiated dissing - aka 'trumping' your opponent - and you might get a better result with factual knowledge or personal experiences.
Unsubstantiated?
"some claiming the brain needs dietary carbs to function optimally (which is simply not true)" which was backed up by this
"You have!!!
I know for a fact I have posted a study (probably about a year ago) showing no difference in 'long-term' brain function on a low carb diet compared to a high carb diet."
That in no way supports the original claim, not even a little
"The brain does very well without dietary carbs. Yes, it needs glucose but you don't need to get it from food.
Unsubstantiated nor could the poster even define what very well means in that context
"High carb is hard on the brain:"
which was supported by this
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22810099
That also does not support that claim
"Low carb helps dementia:"
http://www.webmd.com/alzheimers/news/20051018/high-fat-low-carb-diet-may-help-alzheimers
Link doesn't support the claim
Those are facts, the support offered for the claims does not actually support their claims. So what was unsubstantiated dissing?0 -
So is anyone going to substantiate the ridiculous claims form low carb advocates in the last few pages? So far the only thing put forth can be called nothing short of a joke, since I'm unsure how anyone with a smidgen of intelligence could consider the links as any proof of their claims
perhaps nobody wants to play your semantic nitpicking games. I have no idea if brain function is "optimal" on any given level of dietary carbohydrate. But I do know the brain continues to work in the absence of deitary carbohydrate as has been published and witnessed in real life.0 -
perhaps nobody wants to play your semantic nitpicking games. I have no idea if brain function is "optimal" on any given level of dietary carbohydrate. But I do know the brain continues to work in the absence of deitary carbohydrate as has been published and witnessed in real life.
How is it semantics, even using a loose definition of optimal, how could one make the claim that the brain needs dietary carbs to function optimally is a falsehood and support it with a claim that there was a study in which subjects ate carbs?
Whether or not the brain continues to function without dietary carbs has no bearing on the claim, that was not up for debate. Unsure why you would even bring that up.
Perhaps this is typical behavior of certain advocates making their usual fantastic claims but unable to substantiate them. Not really a surprise there0 -
Sadly, you can't fight faith with facts...Everyone seems to ignore I said specifically jumping out the window because you no longer believe in gravity.
It is actually an important distinction because I also said people who have celiac shouldn't eat gluten - there's actual scientific evidence for avoidance. People thinking gluten is what made them fat avoiding gluten are doing for wrong reasons. The whole point is about the reasoning behind the action, not the action.0 -
The idea that the body first uses glucose is an oversimplification. Just as there are metabolic pathways that can only glucose can perform such the brain's need for glucose, there are certain things only fats can use.
The body uses/clears glucose first (if it is able) then looks to fats for energy. If your body is not able to use glucose, it is generally a good idea to reduce how much glucose making carbs you shovel in.
I'm not sure what use your diabetes 'definition' has (or even find it at all accurate) - I find it more useful to focus on solutions. The problem is not that difficult to define as many pre & diabetics have made a transition (both on their own or with medical assistance) to low carb and ketogenic diets and have improved their health in ways drugs and standard diabetic diet recommendations were unable to achieve.
Reducing weight helps when it eventually occurs, dropping carbs helps immediately - that same day as a matter of fact!
From the things you say, it seems that you are not a low carb or keto pre diabetic or even hanging around low carb or keto diet pre diabetics or diabetics. Why don't you apply whatever you are experienced in to those who would value it?
Can you substantiate a better claim for what diabetes is? Seriously, glucose becoming too high is a symptom of diabetes, but it isn't diabetes itself. The problem is the change in insulin sensitivity, and it is a distinction worth making as insulin controls more than just your glucose metabolism. The flip side of this is, if a person is now eating high fat without calorie reduction, and doesn't have glucose causing insulin to signal fat cells to store fat, the body is going to leave fat circulating in the blood stream. This would also be known as having high triglycerides. You've traded one problem for another.
Any change in diet that the subject believes will improve the condition will cause same day changes. That's the placebo effect - it hits far faster than any dietary change can. Immediacy is also a bogus drive. The most important thing for improving diabetes is long term, sustainable changes. It doesn't matter if low carb diets low a person's glucose for a few days if long term compliance doesn't lead to sustained and maintained weight loss.0 -
That is some impressive unsubstantiated dissing - aka 'trumping' your opponent - and you might get a better result with factual knowledge or personal experiences.
Huh???0 -
Unsubstantiated?
"some claiming the brain needs dietary carbs to function optimally (which is simply not true)" which was backed up by this
"You have!!!
I know for a fact I have posted a study (probably about a year ago) showing no difference in 'long-term' brain function on a low carb diet compared to a high carb diet."
That in no way supports the original claim, not even a little
"The brain does very well without dietary carbs. Yes, it needs glucose but you don't need to get it from food.
Unsubstantiated nor could the poster even define what very well means in that context
"High carb is hard on the brain:"
which was supported by this
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22810099
That also does not support that claim
"Low carb helps dementia:"
http://www.webmd.com/alzheimers/news/20051018/high-fat-low-carb-diet-may-help-alzheimers
Link doesn't support the claim
Those are facts, the support offered for the claims does not actually support their claims. So what was unsubstantiated dissing?
Cosign. When evidence provided doesn't support the claim being made, the claimant is either desperately seeking validation, does not understand the information, or chooses not to learn. All 3 bad for acquiring knowledge.0 -
Sadly, you can't fight faith with facts...
Sales of certain books support your statement0 -
Apparently feeling low carb helps, makes you feel healthier, and doesn't feel like it reduces intelligence is all the substantiation needed.mantium999 wrote: »
Huh???
Good thing I have enough carbs to remember reading about this study:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0195666308005515-1 -
Unsubstantiated?
"some claiming the brain needs dietary carbs to function optimally (which is simply not true)" which was backed up by this
"You have!!!
I know for a fact I have posted a study (probably about a year ago) showing no difference in 'long-term' brain function on a low carb diet compared to a high carb diet."
That in no way supports the original claim, not even a little
"The brain does very well without dietary carbs. Yes, it needs glucose but you don't need to get it from food.
Unsubstantiated nor could the poster even define what very well means in that context
"High carb is hard on the brain:"
which was supported by this
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22810099
That also does not support that claim
"Low carb helps dementia:"
http://www.webmd.com/alzheimers/news/20051018/high-fat-low-carb-diet-may-help-alzheimers
Link doesn't support the claim
Those are facts, the support offered for the claims does not actually support their claims. So what was unsubstantiated dissing?
Acg67 wrote: »
So is anyone going to substantiate the ridiculous claims form low carb advocates in the last few pages? So far the only thing put forth can be called nothing short of a joke, since I'm unsure how anyone with a smidgen of intelligence could consider the links as any proof of their claims
I was strictly referring the the assorted insults contained in the above post. Who talks like that to others?
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The idea that the body first uses glucose is an oversimplification. Just as there are metabolic pathways that can only glucose can perform such the brain's need for glucose, there are certain things only fats can use.
Can you substantiate a better claim for what diabetes is? Seriously, glucose becoming too high is a symptom of diabetes, but it isn't diabetes itself. The problem is the change in insulin sensitivity, and it is a distinction worth making as insulin controls more than just your glucose metabolism. The flip side of this is, if a person is now eating high fat without calorie reduction, and doesn't have glucose causing insulin to signal fat cells to store fat, the body is going to leave fat circulating in the blood stream. This would also be known as having high triglycerides. You've traded one problem for another.
Any change in diet that the subject believes will improve the condition will cause same day changes. That's the placebo effect - it hits far faster than any dietary change can. Immediacy is also a bogus drive. The most important thing for improving diabetes is long term, sustainable changes. It doesn't matter if low carb diets low a person's glucose for a few days if long term compliance doesn't lead to sustained and maintained weight loss.
OK, I don't see how this is accomplishing anything for either of us, so I'm out.
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How is it semantics, even using a loose definition of optimal, how could one make the claim that the brain needs dietary carbs to function optimally is a falsehood and support it with a claim that there was a study in which subjects ate carbs?
Whether or not the brain continues to function without dietary carbs has no bearing on the claim, that was not up for debate. Unsure why you would even bring that up.
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Acg67 wrote: »
So is anyone going to substantiate the ridiculous claims form low carb advocates in the last few pages? So far the only thing put forth can be called nothing short of a joke, since I'm unsure how anyone with a smidgen of intelligence could consider the links as any proof of their claims
I was strictly referring the the assorted insults contained in the above post. Who talks like that to others?
Where was the insult? Calling the claims ridiculous? (what would you call them? Wishful thinking? Delusional?) that the support offered for their claims was a joke? Again how would that insulting? It's factual. That even people with little intelligence would understand none of the links supported their claim? Again factual, unless many people don't understand difference between 0 and anything higher than zero or that if something is correlated to something it doesn't actually mean it's the cause of it? Not rocket science
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The brain does very well without dietary carbs. Yes, it needs glucose but you don't need to get it from food.
High carb is hard on the brain:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22810099
Low carb helps dementia:
http://www.webmd.com/alzheimers/news/20051018/high-fat-low-carb-diet-may-help-alzheimers
That first study might be the ultimate in bad study design.
They're studying people who might have dementia, and having them fill out a survey of what they remember eating. Does anyone else see the potential pitfall of asking people who might have dementia what they remember eating? Anyone?Participants also completed a 128-item food-frequency questionnaire at baseline; total daily caloric and macronutrient intakes were calculated using an established database.0 -
I hear the debate, and sometimes I just need to try something for myself.GaleHawkins wrote: »
That is a very good post and mirrors my results on low carb. My arthritis pain dropped off the radar for the most part in 30 days. In six months my 40 years of dealing with IBS was OVER and has not returned.
Others can eat what they wish when they wish. I plan to continue to eat in a way my body prefers going forward.
Cutting out processed junk carbs made a huge difference in my health.
That's not science, but getting results are good enough for me. And bully to all of you who can eat whatever you want with zero consequence.
That is so not me!
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I jumped out the window because the fire was burning my backside and the pain was very real. Thankfully I landed in a soft Low Carb bush. I did not even know the LCHF term. I had just read coconut oil helped someone's arthritic pain and another person loss pain when they cut out sugar and grain.
30 days before I was to start on a pain management solution that most likely would lead to cancer in my case I really just closed my eyes and JUMPED out of the Carb window after living there for 40 years.
I was dumb as a brick about food and diet in general, was 63 and going down for the last time and realized it.
30 days after I closed my eyes and jumped out the window burning with pain that I rated as a 7-8 level it was down to 2-3 on a 1-10 scale. In 90 days my 40 years of serious IBS started to clear and was fully gone by 180 days. It has been 300 days since I jumped out of the high carb window.
There is a lot of noise on this subject. This old man can only state what worked for him when there was little to no hope left. I beg those talking down what saved my life with little time left to stop doing. While I do my own research and act on that there are some that may assume disinformation on dieting is factual.
There is no ONE dieting thought that works for everyone. If you have personal experience be it good or bad share it on any dieting idea share it with others but please do not post that something will not work that you have never tried. Thank you.0 -
That first study might be the ultimate in bad study design. They're studying people who might have dementia, and having them fill out a survey of what they remember eating. Does anyone else see the potential pitfall of asking people who might have dementia what they remember eating? Anyone?
Me, sir.
Also, the second study is in mice. Mice. Really?0 -
That first study might be the ultimate in bad study design. They're studying people who might have dementia, and having them fill out a survey of what they remember eating. Does anyone else see the potential pitfall of asking people who might have dementia what they remember eating? Anyone?
Me! Me! My mother had dementia. The woman always loved food and our phone conversations when she was in the nursing home in her last few years used to always include this question from her, "so tell me what yummy foods you've been cooking?" And then I would ask her what she had been eating at the home. She would pause, searching for the answer, and say, "meat.... I think, yes meat. That's right isn't it? You always have meat with dinner don't you? Yes I'm sure I ate meat today".
So apparently my mom was a low carber. Didn't seem to do her a lot of good.0 -
If u are eating mostly clean & getting carbs from sweet potatoes, oats etc them u shouldn't restrict your carbs. U will be miserable & u don't need to restrict them to lose weight. Once u stop eating junk food so much u will be less likely to crave it. Don't keep bad foods in your house & try to find low calorie & fat snacks that u like, such as animal crackers, wheat thins, granola, dates etc. but moderation of course & just think of all the hard work u put into the gym & how it will all be pointless if u over eat on junk food0
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sunkissmarie wrote: »If u are eating mostly clean & getting carbs from sweet potatoes, oats etc them u shouldn't restrict your carbs. U will be miserable & u don't need to restrict them to lose weight. Once u stop eating junk food so much u will be less likely to crave it. Don't keep bad foods in your house & try to find low calorie & fat snacks that u like, such as animal crackers, wheat thins, granola, dates etc. but moderation of course & just think of all the hard work u put into the gym & how it will all be pointless if u over eat on junk food
Not even sure where to begin with this one. Clean, bad foods, junk, low fat. Just need one more for the MFP bingo card!0 -
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sunkissmarie wrote: »If u are eating mostly clean & getting carbs from sweet potatoes, oats etc them u shouldn't restrict your carbs. U will be miserable & u don't need to restrict them to lose weight. Once u stop eating junk food so much u will be less likely to crave it. Don't keep bad foods in your house & try to find low calorie & fat snacks that u like, such as animal crackers, wheat thins, granola, dates etc. but moderation of course & just think of all the hard work u put into the gym & how it will all be pointless if u over eat on junk food
Been low carbing for two years. Helped budge 20 lbs that weren't moving the way I used to eat and I have yet to put them back on. My foods are awesome and diverse and I love experimenting with new ways to make things. Last night I made chinese food. Miserable, I am not. At least not over what I'm eating.
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mantium999 wrote: »
Not even sure where to begin with this one. Clean, bad foods, junk, low fat. Just need one more for the MFP bingo card!
I was thinking the same thing...oy vey!
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GaleHawkins wrote: »I jumped out the window because the fire was burning my backside and the pain was very real. Thankfully I landed in a soft Low Carb bush. I did not even know the LCHF term. I had just read coconut oil helped someone's arthritic pain and another person loss pain when they cut out sugar and grain.
30 days before I was to start on a pain management solution that most likely would lead to cancer in my case I really just closed my eyes and JUMPED out of the Carb window after living there for 40 years.
I was dumb as a brick about food and diet in general, was 63 and going down for the last time and realized it.
30 days after I closed my eyes and jumped out the window burning with pain that I rated as a 7-8 level it was down to 2-3 on a 1-10 scale. In 90 days my 40 years of serious IBS started to clear and was fully gone by 180 days. It has been 300 days since I jumped out of the high carb window.
There is a lot of noise on this subject. This old man can only state what worked for him when there was little to no hope left. I beg those talking down what saved my life with little time left to stop doing. While I do my own research and act on that there are some that may assume disinformation on dieting is factual.
There is no ONE dieting thought that works for everyone. If you have personal experience be it good or bad share it on any dieting idea share it with others but please do not post that something will not work that you have never tried. Thank you.
I love this and agree.
I'm so happy this worked for you, it's working for me as well. Xo0
This discussion has been closed.
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