Taboo subject
joolieb1
Posts: 140 Member
i am a little saddened that one subject we are not allowed to discuss on a healthy lifestyle forum is something that is so vital. MFP recommends a safe weekly weight loss of 1-2 lbs per week and 1200 daily calories as the minimum safe level to consume. However, recently a discussion about people losing large amounts of weight, eating very low amounts of calories has been closed. I felt it was something that would be useful for us to talk about. Recently, I asked a question on the MFP Facebook page about the safe weekly weight loss as I was concerned that the Slimmer of the Week title had been given to people losing 11, 6 and 8 lbs in a week. I suggested that perhaps other criteria would be a better way to award this - for example, someone consistently losing 1-2 lbs a week over a long period. I was bombarded with negative comments - I was being negative, spoiling someone's week etc and chose to close the page. However, this remains a valid point, I am sure we may have people here who might choose unhealthy ways to lose weight and the 1-2 lb a week is the benchmark for us all to remain healthy. It is not being hateful or jealous to ask a question about large losses or about someone living on 800 calories, it is concerning and we have a responsibility to encourage healthy choices
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I think your conception of what constitutes a healthy weight loss is overly narrow.0
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You're not supposed to bring up closed threads in another thread. Just FYI, not criticism.0
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tincanonastring wrote: »
Again, it wasn't a criticism. She's new and may not have known. I don't have any desire to criticize or report her for doing something she probably didn't know she wasn't supposed to do. It was intended as a friendly heads-up, not to point out guideline violations for the sake of doing it.0 -
I see what you did there.0
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tincanonastring wrote: »
Again, it wasn't a criticism. She's new and may not have known. I don't have any desire to criticize or report her for doing something she probably didn't know she wasn't supposed to do. It was intended as a friendly heads-up, not to point out guideline violations for the sake of doing it.
Be that as it may, the guidelines and moderator messaging has been clear: pointing out violations of the guidelines is, itself, a violation. Perhaps a PM next time if you'd rather not report the post?0 -
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OP - sorry that someone tried to derail this right out of the gate, but I agree that there's value in allowing healthy conversation around appropriate rates of loss. That said, an obese person's rate of loss, especially at the beginning, could easily outpace the "recommended" loss rate. When I first started out, I was easily losing 5 pounds a week even though I was eating at a 1.5-2 pound/week deficit.0
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However, recently a discussion about people losing large amounts of weight, eating very low amounts of calories has been closed.
If the moderator who closed the thread posted the guidelines, what more is there to discuss?
3. No Promotion of Unsafe Weight-Loss Techniques or Eating Disorders
a) Posts intended to promote potentially unsafe or controversial weight loss products or procedures, including non-medically prescribed supplements or MLM products will be removed without warning.
b) Profiles, groups, messages, posts, or wall comments that encourage anorexia, bulimia, or very low calorie diets of any kind will be removed, and may be grounds for account deletion. This includes positive references to ana/mia, purging, or self-starving. Our goal is to provide users with the tools to achieve their weight management goals at a steady, sustainable rate. Use of the site to promote, glamorize, or achieve dangerously low levels of eating is not permitted.
c) Photos intended to glamorize extreme thinness will be deleted.
d) Those seeking support in their recovery from eating disorders are welcome at MyFitnessPal. A growing list of support resources can be found in our Eating Disorder Resources page.
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kshama2001 wrote: »However, recently a discussion about people losing large amounts of weight, eating very low amounts of calories has been closed.
If the moderator who closed the thread posted the guidelines, what more is there to discuss?
3. No Promotion of Unsafe Weight-Loss Techniques or Eating Disorders
a) Posts intended to promote potentially unsafe or controversial weight loss products or procedures, including non-medically prescribed supplements or MLM products will be removed without warning.
b) Profiles, groups, messages, posts, or wall comments that encourage anorexia, bulimia, or very low calorie diets of any kind will be removed, and may be grounds for account deletion. This includes positive references to ana/mia, purging, or self-starving. Our goal is to provide users with the tools to achieve their weight management goals at a steady, sustainable rate. Use of the site to promote, glamorize, or achieve dangerously low levels of eating is not permitted.
c) Photos intended to glamorize extreme thinness will be deleted.
d) Those seeking support in their recovery from eating disorders are welcome at MyFitnessPal. A growing list of support resources can be found in our Eating Disorder Resources page.
I think there's a difference between a thread that is discussing VLCDs and a thread that is promoting VLCDs. Not sure under which category the thread in question would have fallen, but I think OP is right that a kneejerk reaction to close all threads related to the subject is inadvisable. It's not been my experience that discussions have been closed just due to that topic, but I didn't see the one OP is referencing.0 -
That wasn't the reason the thread was closed, as far as I can tell.
And OP, I think you're right. It is important to be talking about unhealthy weight loss that is somewhat sustained. Do keep in mind what @tincanonastring mentioned about early weight loss.
But maybe the right answer is to report those threads? I just don't know.0 -
This is a very fair question, OP. Validating very large amounts of weight loss on a site intended to promote healthy, safe weight loss and fitness does seem like a contradiction. Considering it's one of the very things we should avoid doing ourselves, and many of us strive to help new people or people who seem to be leaning toward an ED.... it's quite controversial to see. Especially when a thread like that pops up and several of us are doing what we can to help the OP avoid what looks like a potential ED and when an argument pops up and the first thing that happens is the shut down of the thread. That's wrong. Everything this site stands for is being twisted.0
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The thread was closed, how could I add to the discussion. I don't know how to communicate with moderators on the Forum but find it strange that this is a subject that is out of bounds. We can talk about putting on weight, staying the same but do not mention safe weight losses in case we offend others, I am concerned about someone losing lots of weight in one week and trying to follow safety for my own weight loss. I will try to contact the moderator if I can figure it out. Thanks0
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The thread was closed, how could I add to the discussion. I don't know how to communicate with moderators on the Forum but find it strange that this is a subject that is out of bounds. We can talk about putting on weight, staying the same but do not mention safe weight losses in case we offend others, I am concerned about someone losing lots of weight in one week and trying to follow safety for my own weight loss. I will try to contact the moderator if I can figure it out. Thanks
Every moderator has a personal profile page (like your own) and you can send them personal messages with your concerns. Even if you are not questioning their moderating actions, it is highly inadvisable to address them on the actual forums where other people could benefit from the exchange because that is a violation of the community guidelines.0 -
This isn't taboo. It gets discussed all the time. ALL the time. If the thread was closed, then it was probably closed because a number of people flagged it as supporting very low calorie diets or extreme weight loss. You can talk about moderate dieting all you want. But if the people on the Facebook page want to disagree with things you say or the way you say them, then that's something you may have to just deal with, just like in real life. There is no flagging feature in Facebook and I have no idea how or whether discussions are moderated there.0
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sheermomentum wrote: »This isn't taboo. It gets discussed all the time. ALL the time. If the thread was closed, then it was probably closed because a number of people flagged it as supporting very low calorie diets or extreme weight loss. You can talk about moderate dieting all you want. But if the people on the Facebook page want to disagree with things you say or the way you say them, then that's something you may have to just deal with, just like in real life. There is no flagging feature in Facebook and I have no idea how or whether discussions are moderated there.
nope, the discussion got closed because one poster got out of hand and started insulting a bunch of other posters. It's a little ridiculous. She should have been warned had her posts removed, and the thread put back up so that we could have continued. There's a lot of value in a thread like that. Value is lost when one person can't control him or herself and derails a thread with personal attacks.0 -
Thanks everyone for being so supportive, I have contacted MFP so they can discuss it with me. I have dealt with the Facebook page issue already but appreciate your kind words of encouragement. Perhaps if a thread is closed it would be helpful if I could understand the reason for its closure but not sure how to know so I can learn0
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The mods normally say why its closed. Perhaps it was because it wasnt felt to be a discussion about safe rates of loss, but one promoting overly agressive rates in unsustainable ways. Context is everything. Start your own thread about rates of loss , but frame it in accordance with guidelines and then you will be able to discuss it.0
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tincanonastring wrote: »Be that as it may, the guidelines and moderator messaging has been clear: pointing out violations of the guidelines is, itself, a violation. Perhaps a PM next time if you'd rather not report the post?
That is ludicrous, especially since the guidelines are not easy to find (they are buried in a "Getting Started" thread and do not come up when searched). Not criticizing you or your post, tincanonastring, critical of MFP. I suggested to the mods once that they make the guidelines easier to find, but they haven't done it.0 -
Whatever happened with the other thread, I think it's a valuable thing to talk about.
I agree that early on, if one is quite obese, one may lose safely at higher numbers than 1-2 lb/week without eating at unsafe levels, and of course in the first week or two huge losses are normal (and are largely water), but that's not the only context in which this comes up.0 -
I just lost 3.5 pounds in one day which you may say is unhealthy but the other side of that is that in four days prior to that I gained ten pounds by eating and drinking large amounts of beer. So, I guess I am all around unhealthy. Just having some fun with this and it was a really fun time. I do think long term excessive calorie deficit is bad for over all health and could even be dangerous. No one needs to be in a hurry here, we didn't gain it all overnight and surely don't want to lose it that fast either.0
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I just lost 3.5 pounds in one day which you may say is unhealthy but the other side of that is that in four days prior to that I gained ten pounds by eating and drinking large amounts of beer. So, I guess I am all around unhealthy. Just having some fun with this and it was a really fun time. I do think long term excessive calorie deficit is bad for over all health and could even be dangerous. No one needs to be in a hurry here, we didn't gain it all overnight and surely don't want to lose it that fast either.
I think what you're describing is water weight changes related to dietary choices the previous day. You'd have to eat ~35,000 calories over your maintance in one day to pack on 10 pounds overnight.0 -
sheermomentum wrote: »This isn't taboo. It gets discussed all the time. ALL the time. If the thread was closed, then it was probably closed because a number of people flagged it as supporting very low calorie diets or extreme weight loss. You can talk about moderate dieting all you want. But if the people on the Facebook page want to disagree with things you say or the way you say them, then that's something you may have to just deal with, just like in real life. There is no flagging feature in Facebook and I have no idea how or whether discussions are moderated there.
nope, the discussion got closed because one poster got out of hand and started insulting a bunch of other posters. It's a little ridiculous. She should have been warned had her posts removed, and the thread put back up so that we could have continued. There's a lot of value in a thread like that. Value is lost when one person can't control him or herself and derails a thread with personal attacks.
I didn't see the thread in question (link me?) but agree that punishing the many for the actions of the few is unjust.
That's twice in a few days I've agreed with you so we're on to something
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I don't think it's a taboo subject at all. I think the thread probably got closed because people couldn't have a civilized discussion about it. It's a shame, IMO. I know that once upon a time I wanted to lose as much weight as soon as possible and didn't really care what people said about healthy or unhealthy. I was pretty desperate. I did lose the weight. I was pretty smug about it too, actually. However, then I spent some time really reflecting and learning a lot about what healthy, sustainable weight loss is and why it is important. I do think that people sharing their experiences is important because it might just be the thing that someone needs to hear. Now when I listen and take advice....I do it from those whose experience and success I want to mirror. I discount the advice from those whom I do not.
I also think there could be a way to highlight what the ToS rules are in a way that is more user friendly to the average poster. I see people flagging post under Abuse all the time that definitely don't meet the criteria for Abuse, but the flags are just left there and there doesn't seem to be a lot of education around it. But alas....not my circus, not my monkeys.
MFP will be releasing their new member driven anti-wrongflag initiative with the next version. Members will have the exciting ability to hunt flags which do not meet the "Abuse Criteria" and flag them for moderator review. 17 WrongFlag flags and the offending flag will be hidden from sight pending moderator review.0 -
It was closed because it descended into name calling / insults from what I could see.
The actual subject matter was fine for discussion it appears (rightly so in my opinion.)0 -
I don't think it's a taboo subject at all. I think the thread probably got closed because people couldn't have a civilized discussion about it. It's a shame, IMO. I know that once upon a time I wanted to lose as much weight as soon as possible and didn't really care what people said about healthy or unhealthy. I was pretty desperate. I did lose the weight. I was pretty smug about it too, actually. However, then I spent some time really reflecting and learning a lot about what healthy, sustainable weight loss is and why it is important. I do think that people sharing their experiences is important because it might just be the thing that someone needs to hear. Now when I listen and take advice....I do it from those whose experience and success I want to mirror. I discount the advice from those whom I do not.
I also think there could be a way to highlight what the ToS rules are in a way that is more user friendly to the average poster. I see people flagging post under Abuse all the time that definitely don't meet the criteria for Abuse, but the flags are just left there and there doesn't seem to be a lot of education around it. But alas....not my circus, not my monkeys.
I agree that there should be much more education about the proper way to use the flag system.0 -
Thank you everyone, I am sure none of us would want to discourage others or call names, we are all on a healthy journey together. I will look at the thread again and see if I can see a post from the moderators explaining the closure, of course I understand name calling is not allowed0
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I will look at the thread again and see if I can see a post from the moderators explaining the closure, of course I understand name calling is not allowed
I've checked the thread through My Notifications and the last post shows the reasons for it being closed - insults and thread hi-jacking.
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Would you please post a link to the thread here?0
This discussion has been closed.
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