Your Thoughts on the Easy/Lazy way to fat loss (Surgery)?
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MarziPanda95 wrote: »Back to OPs point... WLS like gastric band is not a lazy way out, because it takes a lot of work. But tummy tucks and liposuction... I can see your point. If they were willing to work hard to keep the weight off (from the surgery) they would have been willing to work hard to get it off in the first place, surely? But I guess it's her money, she can do what she wants with it. If she ends up gaining it all back, then that's her own money wasted.
Another thing to consider is that she didn't want to lose weight. Maybe that one spot was just bothering her for some reason - like it affected her balance or posture, but not so much as it became a "medical" issue. Just like having the tag of a shirt bother you until you finally take the scissors to it - it was just a thing she wanted done.
Would that make the opinion of the OP any better though?0 -
Ah pish posh, who cares? People will do what they want. And from your description if she only lost like 30 lbs from the procedure she's still extremely overweight at 5'1 so doesn't sound like much was accomplished in the weight loss department anyway.0
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I might mention that recovery from this sort of surgery is longer and more painful than mine. Sometimes a binding corset must be worn for weeks to encourage the skin to reattach to the underlying tissue. It is very unpleasant.
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I think cosmetic surgery is (usually) ridiculous in general. Most beautification surgeries just leave people looking weird, but they can do as they wish with their money. As well, some great things have come from cosmetic surgery (repairing cleft lips, rebuilding breasts after a mastectomy, etc.). I would probably just have scoffed at the ridiculousness of the situation, and went about my day. It's not something worth getting upset over, that much is certain.
@AJ_G Is it really ok to ridicule a person? I just mean in general, when does it become OK to publicly deride someone? Unless their behavior is harmful to the community, then I don't think it's ever necessary. Call out the people that drive drunk, call out the homewreckers, call out the abusive parents, call out the vandals and thieves. Who do you think you are helping by calling out fat people? Do you think they don't realize that they are fat? Being fat isn't something to be proud of or happy about, but equally you shouldn't feel ashamed for existing.0 -
What she had wasn't weight loss surgery, which, by the way, isn't the short cut it's perceived to be, but anyway, that's a different topic.
It was cosmetic surgery. People do it every day and they all have their own reasons for it. Maybe it was a lead-in to improvements that she and her medical team want to make in her life. Maybe she really does think the fat and skin will be gone forever. Who knows? Who cares? If the procedure wasn't medically warranted, then insurance probably didn't cover it, so it's nobody's business.0 -
OP, I'm glad we live in different countries so I will never EVER have to deal with you for any hospital stay I may have in the future. I hope to all the gods you decide, at some point in your life, to have cosmetic surgery and you get to meet a person taking care of you who has your attitude.
Let me take my 5'2", 150# fattness out of here.
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OP, I'm glad we live in different countries so I will never EVER have to deal with you for any hospital stay I may have in the future. I hope to all the gods you decide, at some point in your life, to have cosmetic surgery and you get to meet a person taking care of you who has your attitude.
Let me take my 5'2", 150# fattness out of here.
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Out of curiosity I asked him was there a problem with them, cancerous, or some sickness or disease or something, that she's in here getting it or was it like just cosmetic reasons. (Again, since its first time I saw that procedure since working there). Nope, cosmetic reasons only. "For her mind / mental health", as apparently it was like that after pregnancy.
I'm not going to comment on the rest of your post, but I just wanted to say that you may be working hard to manage your weight but you, nor anyone else, will ever know when you might get a mental health issue. I hope you don't meet someone who poopoos it as "cosmetic" if you do.
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@Spyer116 - while it doesn't sound like the patient had cosmetic surgery after WLS, perhaps you should watch a few episodes of My 600 Pound Life. Doing this gave me some perspective and empathy for people who chose to have WLS, and these people generally needed to have cosmetic surgery later on.
All the enabling by family members was very interesting as well.0 -
The story was pretty long as it was, so I just left out alot more side things, that i'll try mention quickly.
1. While its a long story and takes a while to read, the conversation with the nurse, and the time I spent thinking about it and all that, was pretty short. 5 mins conversation. 5-10 mins thinking to myself. I didn't go brooding on for half a day about it till I wrote the post, it just came back to me when I came on mfp.
2. I meant the post and opinions / discussion (and my own opinions about what she did), in regards to just weight loss surgery in general though. Not about her personally. her life only. Or what she is doing. Just used her as an example to highlight some of the points (the cost, not changing lifestyle / habits, cosmetic reasons only versus medical necessity, etc).
3. She may be the nicest person I'd ever meet, she might be the best mother in the world, and have amazing hobbies/interests and everything else. I'm not saying she's a bad human/person or doesn't deserve any respect what-so-ever because she got the surgery done. Again, I just used her as an example to highlight some of the points for opinions.
4. Everyone judges everyone about everything. That's what an opinion is, a judgement of sorts. I didn't treat her any different to any other patient or even staff. I didn't go saying any of that stuff to the nurse or other staff or friends. Nor did I go making jokes about her or anything of sort.
5. I know i'm very critical / blunt or even harsh in my opinions / thoughts / judgements, but what I say or how I act or treat people, isn't based on any opinions I come up with to myself like that. And I accept that people may and do / will judge me just as bad as well.
6. It doesn't really need to be my business to have an opinion about something. I'm not trying to force it on her or anyone else there or on here. Just sharing it, and i'm glad to read all the different stuff people here are saying, even those that disagree with it or say some of the bad things about me.
7. What one person said, about taking a risk that could end in death (even if its such a tiny risk) for minor improvements. I agree with that. With general anaesthetic - no matter what they use, what the surgery is, how long your under it for, or anything else, that there is supposedly always a chance (not sure of 1 in however many people, or what percentage it is), that you don't wake up from it. so to take that risk to lose a bit of fat for cosmetic reasons, imo again as controversial as it is, does seem to not be the smartest idea.
I don't care about her, personally anyway. Again, she was an example to highlight some of the points.Angelfire365 wrote: »
And you'll find plenty like me. The theatre staff (in the different complexes i've worked in), are a team. from the housekeeping/cleaners, up to the surgeons and nurses and doctors, they all treat and talk to each other about that stuff.
I couldn't go up and ask for any personal details about a patient like their address or life history or anything like that.
But I can ask for details about their current procedure, risks, and medical issues related to it. The vast majority of staff would talk freely about almost all of it even to those of us who aren't directly doing the surgery.
But that doesn't mean the patients aren't treated well or given any less respect.
Staff make little comments and observations to each other of their own opinions about a patient or the procedure or similar things. they're(we're) not robots or anything like that.
Many times, we've dealt with massive patients, and while that patient is lying under anaesthetic and naked on the bed in sight of all staff in the theatre, they'd straight up say as if he wasn't even there"this is a really fat man, we're gonna have to get another 3 or 4 people to come in and help us move him" or whatever. Its not a very nice thing to say. But it still doesn't make it any less true or particularly bad. Yet if that was said while the patient was awake, they would almost certainly get upset and probably put a complaint or something, even though its a cold hard fact, and the doctor or whoever wasn't saying it to insult him. but as a general statement for the purpose of the procedure. As in, "this guy needs to be moved. He's too big for 4 of us. Call in some other staff, we need help with it".
Just out of curiousity, are your legs big from fat though? Or could some/most of that be muscle? I've seen a lot of complaints from women on here about big legs/thighs, but for alot of them it just seems they have muscular legs, not like fat legs or anything like that.
I more or less pretty much agree with you there!
Thanks for that. And yeah jealousy is definitely some of it, I admit. maybe more than I even know..
But I didn't go out of my way to find all that out.
The doctors/surgeons were debating about how to proceed, and talked about what she ate that day and when. And usually when they do that for patients, I don't give a second thought. But in this case, I did think about what they said previously when they talked about what she ate, since it seemed to be linked in about the surgery anyway.
And the nurse I was talking too, mentioned the general price range of that kind of surgery anyway too.
As I said above in my reply, all theatre staff (here anyway) are a team, and don't strictly hide everything about a patient from each other. I freely walk in and out of theatres during operations and can ask about what they're doing, or why they might be doing that for certain patients or whatever, just out of curiosity and learning some random tidbits about the different procedures.
I set up the theatres (attachments, surgical sets, equipment, etc) for the operations.
I transfer patients from beds to the tables.
I assist (since there can be anywhere from 3-8 people) in turning and moving patietns and positioning them on the bed. I assist with taking off casts, holding limbs for new casts or stitching.
Put on the various monitors and stuff (ecg leads, blood pressure cuffs, etc).
I bring the different x ray machines into the theatres when needed.
During certain brain surgeries (wouldn't know which kinds exactly), the patients are kept awake / conscious. And in my short time there so far, i've had to stay in there and keep talking with the patients and ask certain questions throughout those surgeries (So the surgeons know that they didn't cut or do something wrong or whatever with the brain).
I did it twice so far.
And then after the operations, I transfer the patients again, bring them to recover, and go back and clean up the theatre.
I also have more responsibilities outside the theatres / not involving patients too, but no point listing them out.
I didn't go taking stock. I remembered what the doctors/surgeons said she ate. I know the details of the breakfasts in the hospital because I work there. and its very much routine. The meals are given at the same times every day, with the same few options, and always made the same way too. (of course, different options or some are made specially, for patients that need it).ManiacalLaugh wrote: »
Country? Province/state/area? Hospital? Patient name or nationality or age or anything?
My name or details? My job/position?
Not a single person I work with knows my online name, nor am I friends with on here or on any online site. I have no doubt that some (or maybe even many) people in the hospital use MFP or some other calorie counting site.
But "a woman - possibly has a baby or young child - had a tummy tuck - in a hospital" I don't think that narrows it down too much for you or most people...
"Perhaps orderlies like yourself would be less judjy if you could see what I ate before and after my surgery (which wasn't much)."
I love it. You talk of me judging people. Yet then use a judgmental line like that, classing all orderlies into one group, and assuming they all are judgmental. That sounds a bit hypocritical both for being judgmental and making them sound to be beneath you.
I don't know what an orderly is. But that is not what I am. Nor do I bring food to patients.0 -
When I first started my diet at 235lb, I cheated. I took tablets prescribed by my doctor and I didn't change my diet at all. I wanted a free ride. But after a couple months I realized the tablets work a whole lot better if I ate less fat (less lasagne actually). I only made one tiny change to my diet but it was the beginning of something much bigger. I wanted more. I started trying to find other ways to make pills work better....eventually I realized I could do better than the pills completely on my own. I lost 20lb with the help of the pills but another 45lb after that with diet alone (not even exercise! I just wasn't ready for it!). And my life was changed forever. The weight has stayed off for 5 years now and my diet is unrecognizable from where it began when I was 235lb. I also have been hitting the gym 5 days a week for 3 years now.
It all started when I realized I needed to lose weight and tried to do it the easiest (most cheating) way I had available to me. If I had more money I might have done what the woman in OPs story did.
That woman's surgery could have merely been the beginning. A first step into realizing it was time to take action. We don't know her reasons and probably never will....which is why I cringe when we judge her. She could have been me.0 -
How do you know that this woman hasn't tried hard to lose the weight before?
That she doesn't sit reading these forums like other people?
Working in the legal profession, if I wrote something along those lines about one of my clients I'd be disbarred. I could even be jailed.
Working in the legal profession, if I was that woman and saw this, I'd have your job.
It astounds me how people in positions of care can be so uncaring. Really, take a better look at yourself OP. If you intended to spark debate there was a better way to go about it than this. Your tone of your post quite frankly comes across badly. And you seem to be aware of this but posted it in that way anyway.0 -
"Perhaps orderlies like yourself would be less judjy if you could see what I ate before and after my surgery (which wasn't much)."
I love it. You talk of me judging people. Yet then use a judgmental line like that, classing all orderlies into one group, and assuming they all are judgmental. That sounds a bit hypocritical both for being judgmental and making them sound to be beneath you.
I don't know what an orderly is. But that is not what I am. Nor do I bring food to patients.
From your description of your job, you're an orderly. It may not be called an orderly in your country, but in the US and Canada, you're an orderly.0 -
IsaackGMOON wrote: »Cliffs????
So much this. TLDR (well not much of it any ways).0 -
Surgery doesn't teach one how to control the habitual behavior that got them overweight in the first place. There are lots and lots of people who have had tummy tucks, etc., get that tummy back due to not addressing over consumption of calories.
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If you are in the US, you and your gossiping co-workers are committing HIIPA violations left and right. Anywhere else and this is a breach of most reputable facilities code of conduct. Is knowing if or if not this woman had a child, when and what she ate, why she is having surgery, what kind of surgery she is having, is she a private pay or third party payer patient, or is it elective or non-elective, necessary for you to perform your duties? It sounds to me as if you just do set up and clean up and none of that information is necessary knowledge for you to have, let alone share, even if you don't reveal her name or your location in this post. Have some integrity man.0
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daniwilford wrote: »If you are in the US, you and your gossiping co-workers are committing HIIPA violations left and right. Anywhere else and this is a breach of most reputable facilities code of conduct. Is knowing if or if not this woman had a child, when and what she ate, why she is having surgery, what kind of surgery she is having, is she a private pay or third party payer patient, or is it elective or non-elective, necessary for you to perform your duties? It sounds to me as if you just do set up and clean up and none of that information is necessary knowledge for you to have, let alone share, even if you don't reveal her name or your location in this post. Have some integrity man.
Truth. Yearly HIPAA certification for employee benefits tells me that the only time you can discuss a patient's medical information is when it's required for your role in their care, whether that role be direct care, indirect care, or claim payment. The people you work for might look the other way, but it's still a violation.
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UltimateRBF wrote: »Sounds like just another form of fat shaming. It's saying, "it isn't enough to lose weight, you have to do it in the right way too. You have to purge and sacrifice and be in discomfort to purify your past failures."
I'll preface this by stating that what I am about to say has nothing to do with the original post, as I didn't read the whole thing because it was long and boring.
People talk about fat shaming like it's a bad thing. You have the right to eat what you want, and you have the right to get as large and unhealthy as you'd like, but you don't necessarily have the right to have people treat you as if you take care of your body and are a healthy person. If you are obese and are working to get healthy again, I have the utmost respect for you, but if you are obese and are continuing to over consume calories, I have no respect for you because you have no respect for yourself. If you are obese and doing nothing to correct that, or even worse, working on becoming more obese, you should be ashamed, and society should shame you. That's my opinion anyway.
How do you feel about other undesirables who don't conform to your ideals?
Being healthy is not an "ideal" and it's not my ideal. It's a concrete thing. If you are obese, you are unhealthy, that's not an opinion, that's a fact. Everyone makes judgments about everyone else all the time. Just because people don't voice their judgments, doesn't mean they're not made. To answer your question, how do I feel about other undesirables that don't conform to my ideals. Well, I'm personally against drug use but believe everyone has the ability and the right to decide what they want for themselves as long as it doesn't directly cause harm to someone else, but I can believe that and also believe they have bad judgement. If you shoot heroine, I think you're an idiot. If you smoke crack, I think you're an idiot. If you smoke weed, I also think you're weak and have a need to escape the reality of your life. If you're obese, I think you're weak and you don't have respect for your body. Like I said, everyone has the right to do what they want with their own body, but I'm going to judge you, and so is everybody else. Why is eating excess calories day after day to the point of you shortening your lifespan drastically any better than doing hard drugs or smoking cigarettes?0 -
Surgery doesn't teach one how to control the habitual behavior that got them overweight in the first place. There are lots and lots of people who have had tummy tucks, etc., get that tummy back due to not addressing over consumption of calories.
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Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
or having children0 -
PaulaWallaDingDong wrote: »
Truth. Yearly HIPAA certification for employee benefits tells me that the only time you can discuss a patient's medical information is when it's required for your role in their care, whether that role be direct care, indirect care, or claim payment. The people you work for might look the other way, but it's still a violation.
This guy's story was possibly a bit TOO detailed. He seemed to conveniently know information about this woman (what she had for lunch, dinner, medical history) even though his employment role did not really put him in a position to see or find out any of this first hand (or at least a significant bit of it anyway). Sure, you can put some of this down to gossip but for a story so detailed.......I smell embellishment. Lots of it. I guess the ploy backfired....
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