Overcoming Sugar Addiction
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@SamandaIndia , working on the mindfulness!
Thank you!
@Tennisskater I HEAR YOU!! I'm happy to hear of your success! Make BROWNIES? I ate an entire tray of rice krispie treats not too long ago...in a single day. Strong work, keep it up! I really like your mantra, "I know..." That is part of the mindfulness too, I think. To be always of aware of what you KNOW, right?0 -
The 2015 Dietary Guidelines indicate that 10% or less than one's total calorie intake should be from sugar, so there's not a specific number of grams-per-day, but a general guideline to follow (page 9).
http://health.gov/dietaryguidelines/2015-scientific-report/PDFs/Scientific-Report-of-the-2015-Dietary-Guidelines-Advisory-Committee.pdf0 -
gambling/shopping/sex "addiction" is not classed like drug addictions..
and based on this study
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-29126872
It is a "mental disorder" or "behavioural disorder" similar to that of gambling...so perhaps instead of touting studies that about rats and blogs that mean nothing...
Look at contradictory evidence and supportive studies that used humans...not rodents.
conditioning...Pavlov dog
"Prof Suzanne Dickson, of Gothenburg University and co-ordinator of the NeuroFAST project, said: "There has been a major debate over whether sugar is addictive.
"There is currently very little evidence to support the idea that any ingredient, food item, additive or combination of ingredients has addictive properties."0 -
I LOVE sweets, but I've made myself alot more picky. If someone brings grocery store donuts to work (which is usually what they bring because it's cheaper), I don't partake because they just aren't as fresh as Krispy Kreme. The rare occasions when someone DOES bring Krispy Kreme, I can't resist because it tastes SOOO much better than the grocery store crap. Also, store bought cakes & cookies don't cut it anymore - it's gotta be homemade so that it doesn't have that chemical taste. I had cut myself down to 1 coke a month, but I actually haven't had one in about 3 months & I don't miss it. I'm nowhere near ready to cut out red wine - that's just crazy talk! But I only have a couple of glasses a week now. For those of you who have cut out all added sugars - y'all are my heroes!!!0
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@Francl27, great idea to really focus on the craving and subbing a healthier version! That's the kind of focus on mindful eating that would really help me, rather than just trying to avoid it altogether!
I think I can call myself addicted to sugar as well. I can only handle this, by cutting all carbhydrates to below 20g/day, and making sure insulin is low and stable by eating predominantly fats and moderate protein (ketogenic). I've tried a number of strategies, mindful eating amongst others, and high protein low carb, but this is the only approach that works.
The analogy isn't altogether accurate, but in my case, people who tell me I can eat "a little bit of sugar" are like people who suggest "just a small drink" to an alcoholic. I learned that the hard way and my health suffered for it.1 -
I believe that I've said from the very beginning that it is a psychologically driven problem that is physically rewarding.
Basic understanding of conditioning behaviors, as in Pavlov's dog, hardly broach the complexity of the issue, and to reduce complex issues as such is insulting. And if/once you have kids, you'll realize that Pavlov had really, really obedient dogs. Life just doesn't work in such a superficial way.
Your suggestion to meta-out the issue with human studies suggests that you have never had the joyful and exhilarating experience of approaching an IRB with a research proposal. Human studies are very hard to do, especially in the US. And studies on neuro-anything--especially drugs (as in medicine)--are done in rats first. This is not inappropriate science at all. However, it appears I must clarify that the studies were provided as food-for-thought into the strength of the physical reward, not to relay evidence for the psychological base of the issue (although they are more interconnected than you think).
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I LOVE sweets, but I've made myself alot more picky. If someone brings grocery store donuts to work (which is usually what they bring because it's cheaper), I don't partake because they just aren't as fresh as Krispy Kreme. The rare occasions when someone DOES bring Krispy Kreme, I can't resist because it tastes SOOO much better than the grocery store crap. Also, store bought cakes & cookies don't cut it anymore - it's gotta be homemade so that it doesn't have that chemical taste. I had cut myself down to 1 coke a month, but I actually haven't had one in about 3 months & I don't miss it. I'm nowhere near ready to cut out red wine - that's just crazy talk! But I only have a couple of glasses a week now. For those of you who have cut out all added sugars - y'all are my heroes!!!
I think I need some wine!! LOL
I once successfully used your method too, @goldshotc, of being ultra picky about the sweets, thanks for the reminder!0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »There's 5 grams of sugars in 100 grams of broccoli plus 100 grams of zucchini, which aren't even high sugar veg. Given that recommendations are 5-7 servings of veg and fruit (I think serving sizes for veg are small, so tend to get more), I think promoting less than 5 grams of sugar is unhealthy.
I also would like to see evidence that anyone has "addiction" issues with broccoli or zucchini. Like a scientific study or something.
@lemurcat12 I think this person is addicted to broccoli lmao: http://paleomg.com/paleo-broccoli-fritters/
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@Francl27, great idea to really focus on the craving and subbing a healthier version! That's the kind of focus on mindful eating that would really help me, rather than just trying to avoid it altogether!
The analogy isn't altogether accurate, but in my case, people who tell me I can eat "a little bit of sugar" are like people who suggest "just a small drink" to an alcoholic. I learned that the hard way and my health suffered for it.
@lodro, I agree. It's too hard to say just one little x. I do find too, that really fatty nuts can hold me out pretty far.0 -
@Francl27, great idea to really focus on the craving and subbing a healthier version! That's the kind of focus on mindful eating that would really help me, rather than just trying to avoid it altogether!
The analogy isn't altogether accurate, but in my case, people who tell me I can eat "a little bit of sugar" are like people who suggest "just a small drink" to an alcoholic. I learned that the hard way and my health suffered for it.
@lodro, I agree. It's too hard to say just one little x. I do find too, that really fatty nuts can hold me out pretty far.
But oh, how I wanted to believe them!0 -
I think this thread would be a useful (albeit long) read for many posting in this thread.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10226257/food-addiction-a-different-perspective/p10 -
[/quote]
But oh, how I wanted to believe them![/quote]
Yep. Like Santa. 0 -
The 2015 Dietary Guidelines indicate that 10% or less than one's total calorie intake should be from sugar, so there's not a specific number of grams-per-day, but a general guideline to follow (page 9).
http://health.gov/dietaryguidelines/2015-scientific-report/PDFs/Scientific-Report-of-the-2015-Dietary-Guidelines-Advisory-Committee.pdf
It's added sugar, though (see p. 9). I personally try to follow the WHO's 5% most days (there are days I don't, and days I eat much less), but I don't worry about sugar from fruit, vegetables, or lactose at all. My own diet isn't super fruit heavy, though, so I don't have to worry about crowding out other foods or the calories in them. I tend to like local, seasonal fruit best, so eat more in the summer, lots of apples at this time of year, and berries all year 'round (because they seem to be more consistently available). Bananas throughout the year too, although more occasionally. (Yes, probably more than you need to know.) ;-)0 -
Kimberly_Harper wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »There's 5 grams of sugars in 100 grams of broccoli plus 100 grams of zucchini, which aren't even high sugar veg. Given that recommendations are 5-7 servings of veg and fruit (I think serving sizes for veg are small, so tend to get more), I think promoting less than 5 grams of sugar is unhealthy.
I also would like to see evidence that anyone has "addiction" issues with broccoli or zucchini. Like a scientific study or something.
@lemurcat12 I think this person is addicted to broccoli lmao: http://paleomg.com/paleo-broccoli-fritters/
Heh, I might have to try that recipe. (The author has been a guest on a podcast I listen to, maybe more than one, but I always forget to check that site for new recipes.)0 -
WinoGelato wrote: »I think this thread would be a useful (albeit long) read for many posting in this thread.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10226257/food-addiction-a-different-perspective/p1
I second this.
Another good (and IMO relevant) read is The Power of Habit, by Charles Duhrigg.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »The 2015 Dietary Guidelines indicate that 10% or less than one's total calorie intake should be from sugar, so there's not a specific number of grams-per-day, but a general guideline to follow (page 9).
http://health.gov/dietaryguidelines/2015-scientific-report/PDFs/Scientific-Report-of-the-2015-Dietary-Guidelines-Advisory-Committee.pdf
It's added sugar, though (see p. 9). I personally try to follow the WHO's 5% most days (there are days I don't, and days I eat much less), but I don't worry about sugar from fruit, vegetables, or lactose at all. My own diet isn't super fruit heavy, though, so I don't have to worry about crowding out other foods or the calories in them. I tend to like local, seasonal fruit best, so eat more in the summer, lots of apples at this time of year, and berries all year 'round (because they seem to be more consistently available). Bananas throughout the year too, although more occasionally. (Yes, probably more than you need to know.) ;-)
Thank you for pointing that out. Yes, they were explicit in the "added sugars" label. I try not to get too hung up on natural sugar from fruit and veggies with natural fiber anyway.
Bananas are a weakness, so I actually only buy two at a time! (Now THAT is sad!!) I live in Michigan so we are finishing up apple season, and it's been a pretty delicious fall!
I agree with you on not overloading worry on the fruits/veggies, we need everything they got!0 -
WinoGelato wrote: »I think this thread would be a useful (albeit long) read for many posting in this thread.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10226257/food-addiction-a-different-perspective/p1
Yes, please do read this - anyone who is claiming to be addicted to sugar, candy, or food of any kind. You will learn a lot, and it's worth the time to read.0 -
Do you have white sugar or brown sugar in the house? If so, do you eat spoonsful of sugar to get your fix? That's addictive behavior.
<Sheepishly raises hand> A heaping tablespoon of brown sugar is delicious, the rush is to die for, and the desire to scoop another heaping tablespoon is almost overpowering. It's my personal Kryptonite. I have to treat stuff that is extremely high in sugar as if it were a drug. No issues with fruits or even most desserts (unless they're frosted). But straight-up sugar, candy, honey or jelly -- ai-yi-yi.
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Do you have white sugar or brown sugar in the house? If so, do you eat spoonsful of sugar to get your fix? That's addictive behavior.
<Sheepishly raises hand> A heaping tablespoon of brown sugar is delicious, the rush is to die for, and the desire to scoop another heaping tablespoon is almost overpowering. It's my personal Kryptonite. I have to treat stuff that is extremely high in processed sugar as if it were a drug. No issues with fruits or even most desserts (unless they're frosted). But straight-up sugar and candy -- ai-yi-yi.
I hear you. When I was a kid (pre-literate), I remember seeing my dad use this giant tub of crystal-white icing over and over. Seeing it sit in the cupboard was like torture every time I opened it. One day, I snuck into the kitchen, climbed onto the counter, dug a HUGE spoonful out, shoved it into my mouth and ran into my bedroom.
It was lard. I quickly learned to read.
I do the same thing today, though. If, in a moment of garish self-inflating will power, I decide to buy icing, or powdered sugar (I make a killer buttercream) thinking I can handle it, I eventually regret it spoonful by spoonful.
We try. Keep trying. Straight up.0 -
It's not been proven in humans that you can be addicted to food as a substance. For a fairly thorough discussion of this topic, please see this thread which includes links: http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10226257/food-addiction-a-different-perspective/p1
The current thinking in the scientific community is that "addiction" to eating as a behavioral construct can exist. That thread explores the issue.
The difference between seeing your issue in light of a behavioral problem, whether you believe you pass or fall short of an addiction threshold, is in how you address it.
If you feel you're truly an eating addict, professional cognitive behavioral therapy is in order. If you are simply colloquially using the term, some self-help methods of behavior modification can work for you.
The most important thing in addressing any behavioral problem is to own that behavior, though. Blaming the substance when your real problem lies with eating will only lead you down a frustrating path. In other words, it's not really the food you're consistently reaching for, it's that you're consistently reaching for food.
Different people respond to different behavioral modification techniques. I personally found it helpful to analyze why and when I was reaching for my "trigger" foods, because knowing that enabled me to brainstorm ideas to avoid avoid/counteract those situations.0 -
I appreciate the weigh-ins, but the goal and purpose of this IS for those who relate to the feeling to find support, discuss triggers and discuss strategies: Pragmatic, cognitive, behavioral, etc.
The utility of debating it's credence is testament to not really understanding the concept here.
I do think that using sugar as a coping strategy is a nasty, beastly addiction similar, but possibly more virulent, than other food addictions. Now, I don't have other things I reach for to really make a comparison, but I know what I feel when I "crave" sugar. And that is desperation. And it's a slippery slope to a lot of poor health choices.
So, it'd be really nice to have an engaging conversation with people similar to myself that feel this way, or those willing to lend an ear with an eye for constructive suggestion, than have to defend why eating 692 grams of sugar a day everyday is a sign of trouble and an emotional addiction. It's a problem.0 -
I appreciate the weigh-ins, but the goal and purpose of this IS for those who relate to the feeling to find support, discuss triggers and discuss strategies: Pragmatic, cognitive, behavioral, etc.
The utility of debating it's credence is testament to not really understanding the concept here.
I do think that using sugar as a coping strategy is a nasty, beastly addiction similar, but possibly more virulent, than other food addictions. Now, I don't have other things I reach for to really make a comparison, but I know what I feel when I "crave" sugar. And that is desperation. And it's a slippery slope to a lot of poor health choices.
So, it'd be really nice to have an engaging conversation with people similar to myself that feel this way, or those willing to lend an ear with an eye for constructive suggestion, than have to defend why eating 692 grams of sugar a day everyday is a sign of trouble and an emotional addiction. It's a problem.
Rather than sit in a circle and just talk about how you all continue to eat sugary candy, snacks and other foods, why wouldn't you want to discuss ways and means to work through the problem and find a solution? No one asking you to defend yourself if you do eat the sugary things every day. Admitting that you do it is a great step - now, rather than just holding hands with others and talking about how you all still do it, let's talk about how to defeat the behavior.0 -
I appreciate the weigh-ins, but the goal and purpose of this IS for those who relate to the feeling to find support, discuss triggers and discuss strategies: Pragmatic, cognitive, behavioral, etc.
The utility of debating it's credence is testament to not really understanding the concept here.
I do think that using sugar as a coping strategy is a nasty, beastly addiction similar, but possibly more virulent, than other food addictions. Now, I don't have other things I reach for to really make a comparison, but I know what I feel when I "crave" sugar. And that is desperation. And it's a slippery slope to a lot of poor health choices.
So, it'd be really nice to have an engaging conversation with people similar to myself that feel this way, or those willing to lend an ear with an eye for constructive suggestion, than have to defend why eating 692 grams of sugar a day everyday is a sign of trouble and an emotional addiction. It's a problem.
Rather than sit in a circle and just talk about how you all continue to eat sugary candy, snacks and other foods, why wouldn't you want to discuss ways and means to work through the problem and find a solution? No one asking you to defend yourself if you do eat the sugary things every day. Admitting that you do it is a great step - now, rather than just holding hands with others and talking about how you all still do it, let's talk about how to defeat the behavior.
Exactly. As the post above said, it's intended for discussion of triggers and strategies...and...engaging conversation with constructive suggestions. I mean to ask those focused on the semantics of addiction and will power to either refocus or regroup where the discussion is more relevant to the purpose.
I'm not particularly fond of hand-holding.0 -
I appreciate the weigh-ins, but the goal and purpose of this IS for those who relate to the feeling to find support, discuss triggers and discuss strategies: Pragmatic, cognitive, behavioral, etc.
The utility of debating it's credence is testament to not really understanding the concept here.
I do think that using sugar as a coping strategy is a nasty, beastly addiction similar, but possibly more virulent, than other food addictions. Now, I don't have other things I reach for to really make a comparison, but I know what I feel when I "crave" sugar. And that is desperation. And it's a slippery slope to a lot of poor health choices.
So, it'd be really nice to have an engaging conversation with people similar to myself that feel this way, or those willing to lend an ear with an eye for constructive suggestion, than have to defend why eating 692 grams of sugar a day everyday is a sign of trouble and an emotional addiction. It's a problem.
Did you read this thread?
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10226257/food-addiction-a-different-perspective/p10 -
I appreciate the weigh-ins, but the goal and purpose of this IS for those who relate to the feeling to find support, discuss triggers and discuss strategies: Pragmatic, cognitive, behavioral, etc.
That we don't call it "addiction" doesn't mean we don't relate to the feeling. I definitely have struggled with stress eating and emotional eating, and found the kinds of strategies discussed in the book I mentioned helpful.
I think talking about strategies is more important than the name it's called. There are reasons I find the addiction terminology unhelpful and misleading, but I don't mind if others use it. I just don't think that their eating issues are things I can't relate to because they have a different idea of what addiction is, probably.0 -
Yes, it's helpful and informative but there's a distinction that should be made here: the intention is to be able to come here and vent, talk about it, create camaraderie among those that are currently struggling; and in direct contrast to the OP on that thread, and other posters as well, the intervening discussion of will power, reduction of our feelings toward it and assertion that it doesn't exist has totally undermined the purpose here. These conversations have been tracked off to the agenda of the posters on that thread. Literally, it states not to tell someone who believes that they are addicted to something, "no you're not," and that was the very suggestion made by the OP from that thread here.
As I've repeated ad nauseam, using sugar as the go-to is a psychologically driven problem--rewarded with a physical response. Therefore, I feel comfortable making the statement that I'm addicted to sugars. Anecdotally, I've talked to my physician. He agreed. I've talked to a dietician. She agreed. While some substances create physiological addiction (crack, alcohol) to a very high degree, sugar does it to a manageable degree. No big deal for most people. But what if your behavior becomes married to that feel good moment? What if seeking that feeling becomes habitual, what if it is psychologically addicting, and the repeated behavior begins to physically alter the lower curve of your threshold?
That's why I started this and made that statement. It's seems that I can't be clear enough that this was intended for discussions about getting on with it, not about the academic validity of our feelings.
But I'll tell you what, the experience is repeatable--with the same outcome every time. Replicable results. And it's a pretty elegant design. That's validation enough for me in my life.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »I appreciate the weigh-ins, but the goal and purpose of this IS for those who relate to the feeling to find support, discuss triggers and discuss strategies: Pragmatic, cognitive, behavioral, etc.
That we don't call it "addiction" doesn't mean we don't relate to the feeling. I definitely have struggled with stress eating and emotional eating, and found the kinds of strategies discussed in the book I mentioned helpful.
I think talking about strategies is more important than the name it's called. There are reasons I find the addiction terminology unhelpful and misleading, but I don't mind if others use it. I just don't think that their eating issues are things I can't relate to because they have a different idea of what addiction is, probably.
Thank you. I did look the book up as well. Thanks.0 -
Why isn't "understanding that sugar isn't addictive, doesn't have power over you, and is just like any other tempting food or behavior that must be managed" a strategy?
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Yes, it's helpful and informative but there's a distinction that should be made here: the intention is to be able to come here and vent, talk about it, create camaraderie among those that are currently struggling;
What on earth does that accomplish? It doesn't move you forward to gaining control over behavior around food. People who over eat on sugar have a behavior problem. Food isn't the culprit.
I got all fired up about added sugars after watching Fed Up a couple years ago. I started down that path of trying to eradicate sugar from my diet and it was its own brand of madness. Very unnatural. Totally depressing.
I am grateful that the forums on MFP set me straight. The most liberating thing I learned from this site is that I don't have to demonize any food groups. Just knowing that gave me a starting point of power.
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gambling/shopping/sex "addiction" is not classed like drug addictions..
and based on this study
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-29126872
It is a "mental disorder" or "behavioural disorder" similar to that of gambling...so perhaps instead of touting studies that about rats and blogs that mean nothing...
Look at contradictory evidence and supportive studies that used humans...not rodents.
conditioning...Pavlov dog
"Prof Suzanne Dickson, of Gothenburg University and co-ordinator of the NeuroFAST project, said: "There has been a major debate over whether sugar is addictive.
"There is currently very little evidence to support the idea that any ingredient, food item, additive or combination of ingredients has addictive properties."
So you are saying it is actually an eating addiction - interesting.
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This discussion has been closed.
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