Overcoming Sugar Addiction
Replies
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Yes, it's helpful and informative but there's a distinction that should be made here: the intention is to be able to come here and vent, talk about it, create camaraderie among those that are currently struggling; and in direct contrast to the OP on that thread, and other posters as well, the intervening discussion of will power, reduction of our feelings toward it and assertion that it doesn't exist has totally undermined the purpose here. These conversations have been tracked off to the agenda of the posters on that thread. Literally, it states not to tell someone who believes that they are addicted to something, "no you're not," and that was the very suggestion made by the OP from that thread here.
As I've repeated ad nauseam, using sugar as the go-to is a psychologically driven problem--rewarded with a physical response. Therefore, I feel comfortable making the statement that I'm addicted to sugars. Anecdotally, I've talked to my physician. He agreed. I've talked to a dietician. She agreed. While some substances create physiological addiction (crack, alcohol) to a very high degree, sugar does it to a manageable degree. No big deal for most people. But what if your behavior becomes married to that feel good moment? What if seeking that feeling becomes habitual, what if it is psychologically addicting, and the repeated behavior begins to physically alter the lower curve of your threshold?
That's why I started this and made that statement. It's seems that I can't be clear enough that this was intended for discussions about getting on with it, not about the academic validity of our feelings.
But I'll tell you what, the experience is repeatable--with the same outcome every time. Replicable results. And it's a pretty elegant design. That's validation enough for me in my life.
this is where you've actually nailed down your own problem - that it's not the food, and not an addiction, but a behavioral issue. The reason that this is so important is that the treatment for behavioral issues is completely different from the treatment for substance addiction.
While you can certainly find people who have the same behavioral issues as yourself, and you can perhaps figure out how to agree on your own behavioral pattern, the struggle begins in working to face and defeat that pattern. Targeting the food isn't the answer - targeting the behavior is.
This is why so many of us are working to help you understand the difference.0 -
I am right there with you! It is especially hard that halloween just passed. I have a bowl of over million grams of sugar looking at me every day now.
Try these suggestions.
http://www.sportsnutritionminute.com/how-to-quit-sugar-like-a-bad-habit/0 -
Hey lshapard, I completely sympathise with multiple attempts to cut down on sugary stuff and I, too, have a behavioural problem. It can be so hard to undo years of habit-building! I'm trying to construct a sort of avoidance strategy at the moment, based on recommendations from David Gillespie's Sweet Poison Quit Plan, where I note down all my sugar-related habits and then create a corresponding list of strategies to combat these habits. I'll let you know how it goes! I'm in the thick of exam-season so it's probably not the best time, but as soon as I finish my exams I'll be able to adhere to it better.
I also want to sat that I think the most important thing is that you've never given up. Personally, I am trying to look at the long term trajectory of my health, and multiple lapses and attempts to give up are just blips on a greater scheme of better health. With that in mind I'm hoping to look beyond the short-term feelings of shame and frustration, and viewing the trial-and-error as shaping my future health.0 -
Yes, it's helpful and informative but there's a distinction that should be made here: the intention is to be able to come here and vent, talk about it, create camaraderie among those that are currently struggling; and in direct contrast to the OP on that thread, and other posters as well, the intervening discussion of will power, reduction of our feelings toward it and assertion that it doesn't exist has totally undermined the purpose here. These conversations have been tracked off to the agenda of the posters on that thread. Literally, it states not to tell someone who believes that they are addicted to something, "no you're not," and that was the very suggestion made by the OP from that thread here.
As I've repeated ad nauseam, using sugar as the go-to is a psychologically driven problem--rewarded with a physical response. Therefore, I feel comfortable making the statement that I'm addicted to sugars. Anecdotally, I've talked to my physician. He agreed. I've talked to a dietician. She agreed. While some substances create physiological addiction (crack, alcohol) to a very high degree, sugar does it to a manageable degree. No big deal for most people. But what if your behavior becomes married to that feel good moment? What if seeking that feeling becomes habitual, what if it is psychologically addicting, and the repeated behavior begins to physically alter the lower curve of your threshold?
That's why I started this and made that statement. It's seems that I can't be clear enough that this was intended for discussions about getting on with it, not about the academic validity of our feelings.
But I'll tell you what, the experience is repeatable--with the same outcome every time. Replicable results. And it's a pretty elegant design. That's validation enough for me in my life.
this is where you've actually nailed down your own problem - that it's not the food, and not an addiction, but a behavioral issue. The reason that this is so important is that the treatment for behavioral issues is completely different from the treatment for substance addiction.
While you can certainly find people who have the same behavioral issues as yourself, and you can perhaps figure out how to agree on your own behavioral pattern, the struggle begins in working to face and defeat that pattern. Targeting the food isn't the answer - targeting the behavior is.
This is why so many of us are working to help you understand the difference.
Thank you for trying to parse something out for me, but again, it's not relevant to the need for social interaction with like-minded individuals.
I appreciate the desire to help. I would just like to point out that I consistently have said from the outset that this is a coping-mechanism (i.e. behavior) that needs to change (I wonder if you have read my posts at all?). Understanding triggers and creating strategies are the first goals listed. I also stated that the goal to get sugar intake to healthy levels is for HEALTH. Not to vilify sugar, and as I have also said repeatedly, we need sugar in appropriate amounts from healthy sources.
I would like to utilize this space for talking about personal experiences and how we've all been moving on--and not getting bundled up in the semantic scales of behavioral versus physiological versus psychological addiction versus rote conditioning (which this is certainly NOT). It might not be real for you because you haven't sweat your way through a nauseating, head-pounding, anger-producing sugar withdrawal, or lashed out to those around you because you couldn't--or wouldn't--give into a craving, but it is real for some people. It is a real behavior pattern with a real psychological drive with real physical responses. Splitting hairs doesn't really help.
I certainly don't deny that substance abuse therapy and behavioral therapy are likely methodically different, but counselors don't give advice in online forums, nor should they. Suggesting that one sees a counselor to address the core issue is a redundancy to the core premise of the first post: to address triggers and develop better coping mechanisms. And sure, it's a good suggestion. But don't deny that social support is also invaluable. You can't get counseling here. Social support you can. This venue is for social gathering.0 -
glutenfreida wrote: »Hey lshapard, I completely sympathise with multiple attempts to cut down on sugary stuff and I, too, have a behavioural problem. It can be so hard to undo years of habit-building! I'm trying to construct a sort of avoidance strategy at the moment, based on recommendations from David Gillespie's Sweet Poison Quit Plan, where I note down all my sugar-related habits and then create a corresponding list of strategies to combat these habits. I'll let you know how it goes! I'm in the thick of exam-season so it's probably not the best time, but as soon as I finish my exams I'll be able to adhere to it better.
I also want to sat that I think the most important thing is that you've never given up. Personally, I am trying to look at the long term trajectory of my health, and multiple lapses and attempts to give up are just blips on a greater scheme of better health. With that in mind I'm hoping to look beyond the short-term feelings of shame and frustration, and viewing the trial-and-error as shaping my future health.
Thanks glutenfreida! I'll look forward to it!! Never giving up is important!
Thanks for the nice comments!
I've tried for a long time to really be in control, and stay steady and the reality is: Life Happens. When I thought it was just a sugar thing, I did very well for a long time...until Life happened. And when I fell off of the bandwagon, I was really depressed that I "failed." It took a lot of self-reflection and mindful eating to understand when I was going downhill and why. It took even more reflection to understand the personal effect sugary foods had on me IN THAT MOMENT versus when I was in control. When I'm doing well and I'm on a roll, I do have fewer cravings--but not gone--and I can enjoy something that I wasn't even craving without going overboard. But if I go for a snack when I'm having one of those mind-consuming cravings--game over.
So, the deeper-level reflections are what I try to really pull forward in the times I'm really struggling: what is pulling me, what do I WANT to feel and what else can I do RIGHT now to remedy this? It's hard. I'm anticipating hearing how the journal and strategy development goes based on the book.
Personally the worst part for me is that cravings based in mommy-stress (whining and fighting) specifically make me intensely irritable when I don't satisfy them. I used to give in the most to those because I hated being irritable or not having a lot of patience with the kids. But now, instead, I've been working on recognizing behaviors in my kids that lead up to their own meltdowns and head THOSE off as a preventative measure! Talk about a network!
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@lshapard Thank you for the valiant effort.
They are just not going to let us have the thread. Other MFP members will not post now because it's too uncomfortable talking about this especially when you know people are going to say it's a lack of willpower or we want to be victims like the posts in the linked thread about another viewpoint.
Maybe after the first of the year we can sneak a thread in about this while they are making fun of all the new members.0 -
LOL
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Yes, it's helpful and informative but there's a distinction that should be made here: the intention is to be able to come here and vent, talk about it, create camaraderie among those that are currently struggling; and in direct contrast to the OP on that thread, and other posters as well, the intervening discussion of will power, reduction of our feelings toward it and assertion that it doesn't exist has totally undermined the purpose here. These conversations have been tracked off to the agenda of the posters on that thread. Literally, it states not to tell someone who believes that they are addicted to something, "no you're not," and that was the very suggestion made by the OP from that thread here.
As I've repeated ad nauseam, using sugar as the go-to is a psychologically driven problem--rewarded with a physical response. Therefore, I feel comfortable making the statement that I'm addicted to sugars. Anecdotally, I've talked to my physician. He agreed. I've talked to a dietician. She agreed. While some substances create physiological addiction (crack, alcohol) to a very high degree, sugar does it to a manageable degree. No big deal for most people. But what if your behavior becomes married to that feel good moment? What if seeking that feeling becomes habitual, what if it is psychologically addicting, and the repeated behavior begins to physically alter the lower curve of your threshold?
That's why I started this and made that statement. It's seems that I can't be clear enough that this was intended for discussions about getting on with it, not about the academic validity of our feelings.
But I'll tell you what, the experience is repeatable--with the same outcome every time. Replicable results. And it's a pretty elegant design. That's validation enough for me in my life.
this is where you've actually nailed down your own problem - that it's not the food, and not an addiction, but a behavioral issue. The reason that this is so important is that the treatment for behavioral issues is completely different from the treatment for substance addiction.
While you can certainly find people who have the same behavioral issues as yourself, and you can perhaps figure out how to agree on your own behavioral pattern, the struggle begins in working to face and defeat that pattern. Targeting the food isn't the answer - targeting the behavior is.
This is why so many of us are working to help you understand the difference.
Thank you for trying to parse something out for me, but again, it's not relevant to the need for social interaction with like-minded individuals.
I appreciate the desire to help. I would just like to point out that I consistently have said from the outset that this is a coping-mechanism (i.e. behavior) that needs to change (I wonder if you have read my posts at all?). Understanding triggers and creating strategies are the first goals listed. I also stated that the goal to get sugar intake to healthy levels is for HEALTH. Not to vilify sugar, and as I have also said repeatedly, we need sugar in appropriate amounts from healthy sources.
I would like to utilize this space for talking about personal experiences and how we've all been moving on--and not getting bundled up in the semantic scales of behavioral versus physiological versus psychological addiction versus rote conditioning (which this is certainly NOT). It might not be real for you because you haven't sweat your way through a nauseating, head-pounding, anger-producing sugar withdrawal, or lashed out to those around you because you couldn't--or wouldn't--give into a craving, but it is real for some people. It is a real behavior pattern with a real psychological drive with real physical responses. Splitting hairs doesn't really help.
I certainly don't deny that substance abuse therapy and behavioral therapy are likely methodically different, but counselors don't give advice in online forums, nor should they. Suggesting that one sees a counselor to address the core issue is a redundancy to the core premise of the first post: to address triggers and develop better coping mechanisms. And sure, it's a good suggestion. But don't deny that social support is also invaluable. You can't get counseling here. Social support you can. This venue is for social gathering.
That's fine, I'll leave you to your thread. I will point out one thing in closing - we don't need sugar at any level to live. We always get some, in our diet, since most of what we eat (fruits, vegetables, and carbs) all contain some. but we don't need any.0 -
susan100df wrote: »@lshapard Thank you for the valiant effort.
They are just not going to let us have the thread. Other MFP members will not post now because it's too uncomfortable talking about this especially when you know people are going to say it's a lack of willpower or we want to be victims like the posts in the linked thread about another viewpoint.
Maybe after the first of the year we can sneak a thread in about this while they are making fun of all the new members.
No one who is trying to help anyone in this thread ever makes fun of any new members. And if you followed the link to Carol's very finely written post and actually read what she wrote, you'd see there's nothing in there calling anyone a victim. Please don't try to play those cards.0 -
glutenfreida wrote: »Hey lshapard, I completely sympathise with multiple attempts to cut down on sugary stuff and I, too, have a behavioural problem. It can be so hard to undo years of habit-building! I'm trying to construct a sort of avoidance strategy at the moment, based on recommendations from David Gillespie's Sweet Poison Quit Plan, where I note down all my sugar-related habits and then create a corresponding list of strategies to combat these habits. I'll let you know how it goes! I'm in the thick of exam-season so it's probably not the best time, but as soon as I finish my exams I'll be able to adhere to it better.
I also want to sat that I think the most important thing is that you've never given up. Personally, I am trying to look at the long term trajectory of my health, and multiple lapses and attempts to give up are just blips on a greater scheme of better health. With that in mind I'm hoping to look beyond the short-term feelings of shame and frustration, and viewing the trial-and-error as shaping my future health.
Thanks glutenfreida! I'll look forward to it!! Never giving up is important!
Thanks for the nice comments!
I've tried for a long time to really be in control, and stay steady and the reality is: Life Happens. When I thought it was just a sugar thing, I did very well for a long time...until Life happened. And when I fell off of the bandwagon, I was really depressed that I "failed." It took a lot of self-reflection and mindful eating to understand when I was going downhill and why. It took even more reflection to understand the personal effect sugary foods had on me IN THAT MOMENT versus when I was in control. When I'm doing well and I'm on a roll, I do have fewer cravings--but not gone--and I can enjoy something that I wasn't even craving without going overboard. But if I go for a snack when I'm having one of those mind-consuming cravings--game over.
So, the deeper-level reflections are what I try to really pull forward in the times I'm really struggling: what is pulling me, what do I WANT to feel and what else can I do RIGHT now to remedy this? It's hard. I'm anticipating hearing how the journal and strategy development goes based on the book.
Personally the worst part for me is that cravings based in mommy-stress (whining and fighting) specifically make me intensely irritable when I don't satisfy them. I used to give in the most to those because I hated being irritable or not having a lot of patience with the kids. But now, instead, I've been working on recognizing behaviors in my kids that lead up to their own meltdowns and head THOSE off as a preventative measure! Talk about a network!
You are doing so well @lshapard! Fighting cravings in times of stress is so bloody hard, and I love that you have used those moments to reflect on what happened and why. It shows that you're mindful about not only your cravings but the cycles you go through in times of stress. Being mindful is so important when it comes to overcoming cravings. Something I've found to be helpful, not only in terms of cravings but general health, is taking chromium supplements when I've been overindulging. I don't think this is a long term solution, but it helps to make up for deficiencies from eating lots of sugary things and to regulate blood sugar and insulin spikes. L-glutamine dissolved in water is also very helpful for cravings, although the taste is a bit strange.
It must be incredibly stressful being a single working Mum, I know that my Mum went through a lot to raise me on her own! I think it's important to be aware that your own feelings are completely valid and reasonable. Stress is totally natural, but changing how we handle it can make all the difference and I think it's important to support and comfort yourself. What I like to do is calculate how much money I'll save if I don't buy chocolate (my one sugary vice) over a certain period of time, and then put that money towards something comforting that isn't food related. I'm saving up for a tattoo currently! You are doing so well and I'm looking forward to following your progress 0 -
Yes, it's helpful and informative but there's a distinction that should be made here: the intention is to be able to come here and vent, talk about it, create camaraderie among those that are currently struggling; and in direct contrast to the OP on that thread, and other posters as well, the intervening discussion of will power, reduction of our feelings toward it and assertion that it doesn't exist has totally undermined the purpose here. These conversations have been tracked off to the agenda of the posters on that thread. Literally, it states not to tell someone who believes that they are addicted to something, "no you're not," and that was the very suggestion made by the OP from that thread here.
As I've repeated ad nauseam, using sugar as the go-to is a psychologically driven problem--rewarded with a physical response. Therefore, I feel comfortable making the statement that I'm addicted to sugars. Anecdotally, I've talked to my physician. He agreed. I've talked to a dietician. She agreed. While some substances create physiological addiction (crack, alcohol) to a very high degree, sugar does it to a manageable degree. No big deal for most people. But what if your behavior becomes married to that feel good moment? What if seeking that feeling becomes habitual, what if it is psychologically addicting, and the repeated behavior begins to physically alter the lower curve of your threshold?
That's why I started this and made that statement. It's seems that I can't be clear enough that this was intended for discussions about getting on with it, not about the academic validity of our feelings.
But I'll tell you what, the experience is repeatable--with the same outcome every time. Replicable results. And it's a pretty elegant design. That's validation enough for me in my life.
this is where you've actually nailed down your own problem - that it's not the food, and not an addiction, but a behavioral issue. The reason that this is so important is that the treatment for behavioral issues is completely different from the treatment for substance addiction.
While you can certainly find people who have the same behavioral issues as yourself, and you can perhaps figure out how to agree on your own behavioral pattern, the struggle begins in working to face and defeat that pattern. Targeting the food isn't the answer - targeting the behavior is.
This is why so many of us are working to help you understand the difference.
Thank you for trying to parse something out for me, but again, it's not relevant to the need for social interaction with like-minded individuals.
I appreciate the desire to help. I would just like to point out that I consistently have said from the outset that this is a coping-mechanism (i.e. behavior) that needs to change (I wonder if you have read my posts at all?). Understanding triggers and creating strategies are the first goals listed. I also stated that the goal to get sugar intake to healthy levels is for HEALTH. Not to vilify sugar, and as I have also said repeatedly, we need sugar in appropriate amounts from healthy sources.
I would like to utilize this space for talking about personal experiences and how we've all been moving on--and not getting bundled up in the semantic scales of behavioral versus physiological versus psychological addiction versus rote conditioning (which this is certainly NOT). It might not be real for you because you haven't sweat your way through a nauseating, head-pounding, anger-producing sugar withdrawal, or lashed out to those around you because you couldn't--or wouldn't--give into a craving, but it is real for some people. It is a real behavior pattern with a real psychological drive with real physical responses. Splitting hairs doesn't really help.
I certainly don't deny that substance abuse therapy and behavioral therapy are likely methodically different, but counselors don't give advice in online forums, nor should they. Suggesting that one sees a counselor to address the core issue is a redundancy to the core premise of the first post: to address triggers and develop better coping mechanisms. And sure, it's a good suggestion. But don't deny that social support is also invaluable. You can't get counseling here. Social support you can. This venue is for social gathering.
That's fine, I'll leave you to your thread. I will point out one thing in closing - we don't need sugar at any level to live. We always get some, in our diet, since most of what we eat (fruits, vegetables, and carbs) all contain some. but we don't need any.
Very true. Sugar consumption is completely unneccesary to live a health life. The body can make all the glucose it needs form protein.
It's not had to cut sugars to almost zero if you want to though. I think today was about 5g of sugar for me.0 -
Here's a handy infographic video from TED to get to know your brain on sugar!
http://ed.ted.com/lessons/how-sugar-affects-the-brain-nicole-avena#review
LOLs.
"Starches are a kind of sugar." "Sugar spikes dopamine". "Broccoli does not spike dopamine."
Therefore it can be concluded by logic that either broccoli does not contain starch or that video contains false premises.
Guess what I know about broccoli! Guess what I know about that video!0 -
Here's a handy infographic video from TED to get to know your brain on sugar!
http://ed.ted.com/lessons/how-sugar-affects-the-brain-nicole-avena#review
LOLs.
"Starches are a kind of sugar." "Sugar spikes dopamine". "Broccoli does not spike dopamine."
Therefore it can be concluded by logic that either broccoli does not contain starch or that video contains false premises.
Guess what I know about broccoli! Guess what I know about that video!
I didn't verify the data on the TED video, but TED generally uses reputable data sources and experts. Off the cuff, I imagine that the data is presented in a relational frame, maybe? As in: maybe broccoli doesn't have the same effect as x? Thank you for bringing that to light, though!0 -
This is for venting about the frustration of sugar cravings, sharing life hacks to deal with them, and lending support to one another getting through it--and maintaining a food lifestyle that is satisfied without excessive sugar. At face value, lowering sugar will probably help with weight loss, but I've already lost my weight (215 to 145 in 2 years) and that's a great motivator to curb the cravings. But I'm more concerned now with the long term affects excessive sugar will have on my life, and the lives of my kids. Sugar has a purpose, but in small amounts. I want to be OVERALL healthy, not just LOOK healthy on the outside.
Last year, I knocked my sugar intake down to a whopping 25-40g/day, which was awesome! And once the ball was rolling, it was pretty easy to maintain...but it was hard as Hell to get there, and once life started getting stressful, super easy to fall back into old habits. I'm looking to create some accountability here, for me, for you, for anyone looking to challenge their own cravings and take control of their diet and overall health. The sneakiest thing about sugar cravings for me was that it took serious effort to realize that it was a problem.
I had no idea how much sugar I was taking in, or how badly I craved it, until I asked a friend for dietary help to get lean for my wedding many years ago. I worked out, I was active, ate well, but still couldn't lose weight or achieve the "look" I wanted. My friend, a professional bodybuilder, pointed out the ridiculous amounts of sugar in my average daily intake--hundreds of grams...a lot of hundreds. My protein shake, my vegetable juice and my morning coffee each individually had more sugar than I needed in one day--add to that a single Coke once a day, my adoration for fresh fruit and carbohydrate-heavy dinners, and I was in ever-constant sugar overload while doing "everything in moderation." Even after talking to him, following his diet, and seeing changes, I still didn't believe that I ate too much sugar. I didn't eat donuts everyday, or candy or fast food! But I did eat a lot of sneaky sugar. First, it's everywhere, and second, I just didn't even realize I was eating sometimes...I would see M&Ms and grab a few, or mindlessly have a bagel in the middle of the day, or put 6 packets of sugar in my coffee...thinking that was somehow better than drinking a 20 oz Coke. I begrudgingly dropped my daily Starbucks Venti White Mocha and immediately realized that I wasn't actually addicted to caffeine--but to the crazy amount sugar in it (75 grams of sugar in ONE DRINK).
I've tried four times to curb my sugar intake, to reign it in, and I've been both very successful and a dismal failure. It might sound silly and cheesy and crazy to say it: but kicking the sugar habit is really, really hard. Trying to do it at any point is going to be hard. I tried with a baby while nursing: Nope. I tried once the diapers were done and potty training over: Nope. I tried while in grad school before kids: Nope. I tried when I worked and then when I stayed at home: Nope and NO WAY IN HELL. There will never be an easy time. There will only be now.
So, here's what I'm going to do for this fifth round. I'm going to share the trending suggestions and ask if they've worked for you, and share if they've worked for me. And I'm going to ask you to share your tips and thoughts and experiences and I'll keep sharing mine. And when the dog rips the garbage apart and the bills are due and the laundry is piling up and my boss wants to chat about that last project timeline: I'm going to post here, instead of perch against the kitchen counter gorging on Lime Sherbet and Chocolate Cake--and you should too. Because most sugar cravings seem to be, at least for me, a response to stress--ANY kind of stress. Which is why I think that breaking the habit is so hard, but I've also realized that it's only the first step, it might be the hardest step, but keeping the lifestyle is going to be work too.
Thank you for taking the time to give such articulate, thoughtful, and helpful posts. I had a very similar experience with sugar. Currently on a break from logging because I did it for years, but will start again soon. Your post is a nice reminder of just how mindful I need to be of sugar.
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I struggle with cravings, almost daily, to some extent. I can eat real food to satiety. Dried fruit is difficult to portion, but something goes very wrong in the refinery. I have eaten sugar by itself when I was young, the boring white stuff, and those sticks that are made to put into tea or coffee. Once I stole some boxes of expired and discarded candy from some shop's disposal container. I have eaten chocolate milk powder, and fruit tea granules. Chocolate spread too, obviously, but everybody does that. I recently bought a tub of palm sugar, but I had to throw it out because I started to eat it with a spoon. I wanted to make cookies, but I knew I had to buy the brown sugar last, or else I'd eat it before I could use it. The cookies taste just "too good", I should have been just happy/proud, but it's so hard to not eat them all at once.
A balanced diet consisting of a variety of fresh tasty food, getting enough sleep and rest and exercise, and not keeping large amounts of trigger foods in the house, are my best weapons against cravings, "binges"/overeating. Lots of "tips and tricks" I read about are useless, or even insulting.0 -
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kgeyser
MFP Moderator0 -
Here's a handy infographic video from TED to get to know your brain on sugar!
http://ed.ted.com/lessons/how-sugar-affects-the-brain-nicole-avena#review
LOLs.
"Starches are a kind of sugar." "Sugar spikes dopamine". "Broccoli does not spike dopamine."
Therefore it can be concluded by logic that either broccoli does not contain starch or that video contains false premises.
Guess what I know about broccoli! Guess what I know about that video!
I didn't verify the data on the TED video, but TED generally uses reputable data sources and experts. Off the cuff, I imagine that the data is presented in a relational frame, maybe? As in: maybe broccoli doesn't have the same effect as x? Thank you for bringing that to light, though!
Depends on which part of TED. Actual TED talks are fairly vetted. I've seen TEDx talks that are utter rubbish and destroying TED's value. I don't know the vetting for TEDed.
Dopamine isn't the reward neurotransmitter, that's an old understanding that is too simple and falls apart. Dopamine is better viewed as reward anticipation transmitter, and possibly even better as the transmitter that arouses anticipation of all kinds - dopamine rises with painful things too, but we don't say the victim on America's Funniest home video is addicted to baseball bats to the crotch like drugs, yet people are ok with that comparison for sex, gambling, and eating ham sandwiches. Suddenly comparing events over just the presence of neurotransmitter seems to miss something.0 -
One of the best things I ever did for myself was do a yeast and parasite cleanse for 95 days...I know, I know it sounds so extreme however it made such an amazing difference in any kind of cravings. I no longer have ANY cravings for sugar, the weight slipped off of me with no problems and I am now maintaining just fine. I now believe that because of eating processed and raw foods as well as living with pets for a huge part of my life it created a terrible imbalance in my system. I can't say enough about what a HUGE difference I feel. I saw a Naturopathic Dr. who helped me. All the best to you!-1
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RadiantChange wrote: »One of the best things I ever did for myself was do a yeast and parasite cleanse for 95 days...I know, I know it sounds so extreme however it made such an amazing difference in any kind of cravings. I no longer have ANY cravings for sugar, the weight slipped off of me with no problems and I am now maintaining just fine. I now believe that because of eating processed and raw foods as well as living with pets for a huge part of my life it created a terrible imbalance in my system. I can't say enough about what a HUGE difference I feel. I saw a Naturopathic Dr. who helped me. All the best to you!
I'm sorry, did you just say yeast and PARASITE cleanse?? For 3 months?? On purpose??0 -
RadiantChange wrote: »One of the best things I ever did for myself was do a yeast and parasite cleanse for 95 days...I know, I know it sounds so extreme however it made such an amazing difference in any kind of cravings. I no longer have ANY cravings for sugar, the weight slipped off of me with no problems and I am now maintaining just fine. I now believe that because of eating processed and raw foods as well as living with pets for a huge part of my life it created a terrible imbalance in my system. I can't say enough about what a HUGE difference I feel. I saw a Naturopathic Dr. who helped me. All the best to you!
Wow! You really should post more about this one day. I'm totally fascinated. Never heard of this until today. Thanks for sharing 0 -
RadiantChange wrote: »One of the best things I ever did for myself was do a yeast and parasite cleanse for 95 days...I know, I know it sounds so extreme however it made such an amazing difference in any kind of cravings. I no longer have ANY cravings for sugar, the weight slipped off of me with no problems and I am now maintaining just fine. I now believe that because of eating processed and raw foods as well as living with pets for a huge part of my life it created a terrible imbalance in my system. I can't say enough about what a HUGE difference I feel. I saw a Naturopathic Dr. who helped me. All the best to you!
Please don't post things like this. Cleanses don't work and aren't necessary. The liver and kidneys perform the function of cleansing the blood and keeping the body healthy.
The cleanse you are promoting is a colon cleanse. The intestines are a major part of the body's immune system, and 'cleanses' that affect the gut flora can seriously damage this immune system. There are many benign bacteria in the gut and using this cleanse removes them from the body, leaving you vulnerable to many dangerous infections and viruses.0 -
RadiantChange wrote: »One of the best things I ever did for myself was do a yeast and parasite cleanse for 95 days...I know, I know it sounds so extreme however it made such an amazing difference in any kind of cravings. I no longer have ANY cravings for sugar, the weight slipped off of me with no problems and I am now maintaining just fine. I now believe that because of eating processed and raw foods as well as living with pets for a huge part of my life it created a terrible imbalance in my system. I can't say enough about what a HUGE difference I feel. I saw a Naturopathic Dr. who helped me. All the best to you!
Wow! You really should post more about this one day. I'm totally fascinated. Never heard of this until today. Thanks for sharing
It's especially helpful for people are full of...well, who are really backed up.0 -
Dude did not cleanse. Look what happened.RadiantChange wrote: »One of the best things I ever did for myself was do a yeast and parasite cleanse for 95 days...I know, I know it sounds so extreme however it made such an amazing difference in any kind of cravings. I no longer have ANY cravings for sugar, the weight slipped off of me with no problems and I am now maintaining just fine. I now believe that because of eating processed and raw foods as well as living with pets for a huge part of my life it created a terrible imbalance in my system. I can't say enough about what a HUGE difference I feel. I saw a Naturopathic Dr. who helped me. All the best to you!
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Lmao!!!!DisneyDude85 wrote: »Looks like somebody is...
"Fed up"
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Tinyhabits.com. com by BJ Fogg is worth exploring as a choice to eat can be driven by a need for something else. His university scientists explore ways that individuals can first recognise a habit ( ie morning cappucino or chocolate bar) then make a tiny replacement that is easy to move towards more positive habits. This can be used with addictive behaviour like smoking as well as non addictive behaviour.0
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Some websites folk may find useful:
http://growinghumankindness.com/10-steps-to-control-sugar-cravings/
Web site has a Lovely self worth start to their 10 steps to ditching sugar
** http://foodaddiction.com/step-0/
Has a genuine 12 step process for kicking any food addiction.
One last site for good measure.
** http://www.12step.com/sugar-addiction#sthash.RDWvCWzt.dpuf
If the addict label helps you and others find what they need to move into recovery then awesome. I am less in favour of a label if it is worn as a badge of honour that excludes others from helping and given the honour and being special it is even harder for an individual to change choices towards healthier ones that bring them into a former badge carrier category. Good luck.
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kommodevaran wrote: »I struggle with cravings, almost daily, to some extent. I can eat real food to satiety. Dried fruit is difficult to portion, but something goes very wrong in the refinery. I have eaten sugar by itself when I was young, the boring white stuff, and those sticks that are made to put into tea or coffee.
This is a difference, either in people or more likely developed taste, as I find this disgusting and hate sweetened coffee/tea. I know it's to some extent learned, as in the US an affinity for "sweet tea" or no is a north/south thing. I was recently in Mississippi and people were joking about it.
I ONLY like sweet foods with fat. Pretty much everything just sugar I hate (too bad, they have fewer calories). Foods that are supposed to be savory (like mustard) that are sweet, I hate.A balanced diet consisting of a variety of fresh tasty food, getting enough sleep and rest and exercise, and not keeping large amounts of trigger foods in the house, are my best weapons against cravings, "binges"/overeating. Lots of "tips and tricks" I read about are useless, or even insulting.
Yes, much as I can't relate to the rest of it, this is sensible.
One of my problems with the addiction model is I think it discourages people from focusing on their own patterns and triggers, and that's key.0 -
tincanonastring wrote: »RadiantChange wrote: »One of the best things I ever did for myself was do a yeast and parasite cleanse for 95 days...I know, I know it sounds so extreme however it made such an amazing difference in any kind of cravings. I no longer have ANY cravings for sugar, the weight slipped off of me with no problems and I am now maintaining just fine. I now believe that because of eating processed and raw foods as well as living with pets for a huge part of my life it created a terrible imbalance in my system. I can't say enough about what a HUGE difference I feel. I saw a Naturopathic Dr. who helped me. All the best to you!
Wow! You really should post more about this one day. I'm totally fascinated. Never heard of this until today. Thanks for sharing
It's especially helpful for people are full of...well, who are really backed up.
Heh.0 -
Here's a handy infographic video from TED to get to know your brain on sugar!
http://ed.ted.com/lessons/how-sugar-affects-the-brain-nicole-avena#review
LOLs.
"Starches are a kind of sugar." "Sugar spikes dopamine". "Broccoli does not spike dopamine."
Therefore it can be concluded by logic that either broccoli does not contain starch or that video contains false premises.
Guess what I know about broccoli! Guess what I know about that video!
I didn't verify the data on the TED video, but TED generally uses reputable data sources and experts. Off the cuff, I imagine that the data is presented in a relational frame, maybe? As in: maybe broccoli doesn't have the same effect as x? Thank you for bringing that to light, though!
Depends on which part of TED. Actual TED talks are fairly vetted. I've seen TEDx talks that are utter rubbish and destroying TED's value. I don't know the vetting for TEDed.
Dopamine isn't the reward neurotransmitter, that's an old understanding that is too simple and falls apart. Dopamine is better viewed as reward anticipation transmitter, and possibly even better as the transmitter that arouses anticipation of all kinds - dopamine rises with painful things too, but we don't say the victim on America's Funniest home video is addicted to baseball bats to the crotch like drugs, yet people are ok with that comparison for sex, gambling, and eating ham sandwiches. Suddenly comparing events over just the presence of neurotransmitter seems to miss something.
Ah, yes, the readiness neurotransmitter, right?
LOL. Baseball bats. Yikes. But I love the point.
I really appreciate this point and I ask, could it shed some light into why cravings escalate in-process?
Meaning...
I get a spoonful of sugar, eat it, LOVE it and then in 10 minutes NEED another one....then 5 minutes later, another one...and another one...and as the time between spoonfuls diminishes, so too does the craving itself diminish.
Is it worth thinking that my eating behavior is causing a dopamine release which tells me that something is going to happen (I assume it will be GOOD!) but it doesn't really happen (because I've altered my thresholds over time), so I go back again and again in attempt to satisfy an outcome that the original spoonful suggested would happen?
I'm not an over-eater of anything else--at all. But I do know that the first bite of anything sugary is the most dangerous.
Maybe, isolated to this topic for our purposes, it's more appropriate to suggest escalating cravings are the result of trying to get that damn reward that we've convinced ourselves exists because we sense that dopamine "tells*" us that something might happen, then? That is the kind of conditioning I might buy.
*I know that's reaching a bit.0 -
SamandaIndia wrote: »Some websites folk may find useful:
http://growinghumankindness.com/10-steps-to-control-sugar-cravings/
Web site has a Lovely self worth start to their 10 steps to ditching sugar
** http://foodaddiction.com/step-0/
Has a genuine 12 step process for kicking any food addiction.
One last site for good measure.
** http://www.12step.com/sugar-addiction#sthash.RDWvCWzt.dpuf
If the addict label helps you and others find what they need to move into recovery then awesome. I am less in favour of a label if it is worn as a badge of honour that excludes others from helping and given the honour and being special it is even harder for an individual to change choices towards healthier ones that bring them into a former badge carrier category. Good luck.
Thanks @SamandaIndia for the posts. I've found that focused incremental changes don't necessarily help the big problem (coping mechanism) but they DO really develop resources for alternatives when I WANT something. For instance, I'm craving that morning capp like crazy! But, if I've changed it in the past successfully, and I'm trying to avoid the craving, I'm better able to make the healthy, alternative choice because I've had success with it in the past. That totally works in-the-moment. It's a handy tool.
Your links were helpful, and I Liked this link-from-the-link: http://growinghumankindness.com/healing-sugar-habit/
I'll admit it is a bit saccharin for my taste
; but a good resource. 0
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