Women with PCOS and BMR
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To the people who think pcos becomes an excuse you should keep in mind everyone has a different level of the syndrome and thus everyone has to try different things to see results. To answer your question I am in the same boat with eating low calories to see any change. I try to stay around 1200-1500cal and count half my exercise cals. Some things to try... Carb cycling. It keeps your body guessing and I had most success on it. Another thing is get rid of dairy. I didn't look at your diary but I'm just starting it and so far it's great! Also lifting weights as mentioned is a great approach for pcos.
YES - exactly
thank you 0 -
PikaKnight wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »My suggestion is to dump the HIIT and instead do 40-45 minutes of LISS (low impact steady state) cardio like walking four times a week, in addition to lifting weights 2-3x/wk. Keep the pilates if you would like, for stretching once a week but don't count on it as a great calorie burner.
I'd probably start at 1650 calories per day, stick with it for four weeks of good solid logging, and then analyze the results.
Been there, done that. LISS doesn't change my weight loss either:( And my Pilates is advance so it's really not to be considered just "stretch" - I burn about 300kcal in a session. And I track EVERYTHING (kcal, carbs, protein, fat, kcal burn through exercise) - I'm no newbie to this.
And ARE you suffering from PCOS, TOO?
But THANKS anyway.
I always jump in when people say yoga doesn't burn many calories, but can't speak to Pilates. How are you getting the 300 cal/session burn? If from the database, those burns are considered inflated and many people suggest you just eat 50% of the calories you've earned from them back.
Someone else (I wish I remember who) said burns for her are more accurate when she says she is an inch shorter than she really is and I am trying that at the moment cuz it's easier than always adjusting the burn.
Ofc yoga burns calories just depends what kind of yoga you're doing
I use heart monitor btw:*
But HRMs are for steady state cardio. Using it for other activities like yoga, aerobics, strength training, etc will end up giving you exaggerated burn.
That is not true. HRMs are to use for any physical exercise - including strenght training and HIIT...and even Pilates - it just depends how you have it adjusted;) mine counts calories after I get above 60% of my HR for example;)
HRMs are categorically NOT to be used for any physical exercise ...not strength training, not HIIT, not Pilates
Calorie burn is NOT directly related to heart rate. A HRM is only for steady state cardio based exercise like running, rowing, cycling at specific intensities ...the formula works on a table of HR in these conditions conversion to oxygen uptake
Getting your hr to 60% of some formulaic max (again heart rate zones is old school) does not equate to a specific calorific burn
It wouldn't matter if you were losing, but you aren't
Because your logging is wrong
Other people's calorie intake is irrelevant
I personally lost most of my weight eating around 1800 calories, currently eat around 2300-2400 in maintenance and my carbs never normally drop below 50%.. This is irrelevant to you
Stick to your excuses and incorrect assumptions, they won't help you
HRMs keep my arrythmia in check and that's all that matters to me in fact:) I wonder if you'd ever consider the possibility that I AM logging right - after 8 years of exercise and diet and 5 years of steadily losing - I think I am and the problem is really mainly in hormonal disbalance. But I guess you'd say the same thing to obese ppl, right? They don't have a health issue...they're probably just lazy *kitten*, making excuses, right?0 -
I'm confused by that post and your response
@pineygirl 5'1 and 122 your BMR is around 1350 and you say you're eating 1500 to 2000 calories a day, averaging 1650 .. if you're set to lose 1lb a week that would put your TDEE at 2150 which is probably appropriate for an active / very active person at your height and weight
Where exactly is the lower BMR?
What do you mean by eating 250 under due to logging inaccuracies - are you actually not eating 1650 but eating 1400? and losing a pound?0 -
PikaKnight wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »My suggestion is to dump the HIIT and instead do 40-45 minutes of LISS (low impact steady state) cardio like walking four times a week, in addition to lifting weights 2-3x/wk. Keep the pilates if you would like, for stretching once a week but don't count on it as a great calorie burner.
I'd probably start at 1650 calories per day, stick with it for four weeks of good solid logging, and then analyze the results.
Been there, done that. LISS doesn't change my weight loss either:( And my Pilates is advance so it's really not to be considered just "stretch" - I burn about 300kcal in a session. And I track EVERYTHING (kcal, carbs, protein, fat, kcal burn through exercise) - I'm no newbie to this.
And ARE you suffering from PCOS, TOO?
But THANKS anyway.
I always jump in when people say yoga doesn't burn many calories, but can't speak to Pilates. How are you getting the 300 cal/session burn? If from the database, those burns are considered inflated and many people suggest you just eat 50% of the calories you've earned from them back.
Someone else (I wish I remember who) said burns for her are more accurate when she says she is an inch shorter than she really is and I am trying that at the moment cuz it's easier than always adjusting the burn.
Ofc yoga burns calories just depends what kind of yoga you're doing I use heart monitor btw:*
But HRMs are for steady state cardio. Using it for other activities like yoga, aerobics, strength training, etc will end up giving you exaggerated burn.
That is not true. HRMs are to use for any physical exercise - including strenght training and HIIT...and even Pilates - it just depends how you have it adjusted;) mine counts calories after I get above 60% of my HR for example;)
HRMs are categorically NOT to be used for any physical exercise ...not strength training, not HIIT, not Pilates
Calorie burn is NOT directly related to heart rate. A HRM is only for steady state cardio based exercise like running, rowing, cycling at specific intensities ...the formula works on a table of HR in these conditions conversion to oxygen uptake
Getting your hr to 60% of some formulaic max (again heart rate zones is old school) does not equate to a specific calorific burn
It wouldn't matter if you were losing, but you aren't
Because your logging is wrong
Other people's calorie intake is irrelevant
I personally lost most of my weight eating around 1800 calories, currently eat around 2300-2400 in maintenance and my carbs never normally drop below 50%.. This is irrelevant to you
Stick to your excuses and incorrect assumptions, they won't help you
HRMs keep my arrythmia in check and that's all that matters to me in fact:) I wonder if you'd ever consider the possibility that I AM logging right - after 8 years of exercise and diet and 5 years of steadily losing - I think I am and the problem is really mainly in hormonal disbalance. But I guess you'd say the same thing to obese ppl, right? They don't have a healt issue...they're probably just lazy *kitten*, making excuses, right?
Good I'm glad you are using the HRM for what it is designed for - that makes perfect sense
You're not losing weight
Your posts speak to logging inaccuracies to be considered in the first instance
Are you weighing your food? you have yet to answer
How are you estimating your calorie burns (300 for pilates is overestimating) you have yet to answer
after a long time dieting it is far more likely that bad habits have snuck in and if it looks like a horse it's probably a horse
If you steadily lost for 5 years how come you still need to lose weight - even at 0.5lb a week that would be a weight loss of what? 130lbs?
do you yo-yo by any chance?
If you think you have hormonal imbalances / thyroid issues go to the doctor
You know what I'd say to obese people? I'd say log your food accurately by weight and don't overestimate your calorie burns. I wouldn't advise weight resistance exercise until they are down from morbidly obese though because of joint issues - but for someone like you I would say you should be following a progressive resistance programme for it's many benefits
or you can just cut your calories further to make up for your inaccuracies - that will work too
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PikaKnight wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »My suggestion is to dump the HIIT and instead do 40-45 minutes of LISS (low impact steady state) cardio like walking four times a week, in addition to lifting weights 2-3x/wk. Keep the pilates if you would like, for stretching once a week but don't count on it as a great calorie burner.
I'd probably start at 1650 calories per day, stick with it for four weeks of good solid logging, and then analyze the results.
Been there, done that. LISS doesn't change my weight loss either:( And my Pilates is advance so it's really not to be considered just "stretch" - I burn about 300kcal in a session. And I track EVERYTHING (kcal, carbs, protein, fat, kcal burn through exercise) - I'm no newbie to this.
And ARE you suffering from PCOS, TOO?
But THANKS anyway.
I always jump in when people say yoga doesn't burn many calories, but can't speak to Pilates. How are you getting the 300 cal/session burn? If from the database, those burns are considered inflated and many people suggest you just eat 50% of the calories you've earned from them back.
Someone else (I wish I remember who) said burns for her are more accurate when she says she is an inch shorter than she really is and I am trying that at the moment cuz it's easier than always adjusting the burn.
Ofc yoga burns calories just depends what kind of yoga you're doing I use heart monitor btw:*
But HRMs are for steady state cardio. Using it for other activities like yoga, aerobics, strength training, etc will end up giving you exaggerated burn.
That is not true. HRMs are to use for any physical exercise - including strenght training and HIIT...and even Pilates - it just depends how you have it adjusted;) mine counts calories after I get above 60% of my HR for example;)
HRMs are categorically NOT to be used for any physical exercise ...not strength training, not HIIT, not Pilates
Calorie burn is NOT directly related to heart rate. A HRM is only for steady state cardio based exercise like running, rowing, cycling at specific intensities ...the formula works on a table of HR in these conditions conversion to oxygen uptake
Getting your hr to 60% of some formulaic max (again heart rate zones is old school) does not equate to a specific calorific burn
It wouldn't matter if you were losing, but you aren't
Because your logging is wrong
Other people's calorie intake is irrelevant
I personally lost most of my weight eating around 1800 calories, currently eat around 2300-2400 in maintenance and my carbs never normally drop below 50%.. This is irrelevant to you
Stick to your excuses and incorrect assumptions, they won't help you
HRMs keep my arrythmia in check and that's all that matters to me in fact:) I wonder if you'd ever consider the possibility that I AM logging right - after 8 years of exercise and diet and 5 years of steadily losing - I think I am and the problem is really mainly in hormonal disbalance. But I guess you'd say the same thing to obese ppl, right? They don't have a healt issue...they're probably just lazy *kitten*, making excuses, right?
Good I'm glad you are using the HRM for what it is designed for - that makes perfect sense
You're not losing weight
Your posts speak to logging inaccuracies to be considered in the first instance
Are you weighing your food? you have yet to answer
How are you estimating your calorie burns (300 for pilates is overestimating) you have yet to answer
after a long time dieting it is far more likely that bad habits have snuck in and if it looks like a horse it's probably a horse
If you steadily lost for 5 years how come you still need to lose weight - even at 0.5lb a week that would be a weight loss of what? 130lbs?
do you yo-yo by any chance?
If you think you have hormonal imbalances / thyroid issues go to the doctor
You know what I'd say to obese people? I'd say log your food accurately by weight and don't overestimate your calorie burns. I wouldn't advise weight resistance exercise until they are down from morbidly obese though because of joint issues - but for someone like you I would say you should be following a progressive resistance programme for it's many benefits
or you can just cut your calories further to make up for your inaccuracies - that will work too
I count calories strictly for my cardio burns - I've done LISS and HIIT over the years, I used to run, I swam,... so I really was just curious about caloric INTAKE of other girls with PCOS:)
I DID lose for 5 years and THEN I gained about 16-17lbs in just two months (but I alredy wrote that in a previous post:)) about a month after I was diagnosed with arrythmia and was put on betablockers:)
I eat as healthy as I did before I gained - lc/keto - healthy fats, lots of green veggie, lean meat, not much dairy - I've worked as a model since I was 16 so strict healthy diet IS part of my contract too - but the weight gain makes it almost impossible to model now:/
I do have hormonal imbalances (PCOS is not a just a flu as you know yourself:)), don't suffer from thyroid issues - fortunatelly and I take betablockers for my arrythmia. I go to BOTH gynecologist and endocrynologist and AM trying to solve this problem with them. But as I said: since I'm not exactly overweight or obese yet and they see my eating is ok - they don't do anything about it:)
But you're right - I should maybe put more preasure on them:) Thank you:-)
PS: when it comes to obese ppl, it's a hormonal issue too, and you should take that into account:)0 -
PS it is always a Calories in vs calories out issue and blaming hormones is generally an excuse
PPS many models have some of the worst diets in the world, I'm glad to see you didn't fall into that trap
PPPS maybe add a dietician to your mix of specialists0 -
PS it is always a Calories in vs calories out issue and blaming hormones is generally an excuse
PPS many models have some of the worst diets in the world, I'm glad to see you didn't fall into that trap
PPPS maybe add a dietician to your mix of specialists
It's not an excuse but that's your opinion:)
Depends on model agency - the good ones want healthy models:)
My fitness trainer is a nutritionist but not helping either:/
But thank you:)0 -
It's less of an opinion than an actuality - unless you have seen studies that refute that in which case please do link them here
I have worked with a lot of agencies .. lots of them profess to policies they don't carry out
A nutritionist is not a dietician - be careful on taking diet advice from a fitness trainer
and you're welcome0 -
@rabbitjb
Honestly, I don't care about studies very much cause most of the time they're just paid and not occurate.
I've lived around ppl with hormonal disbalance most of my life (some of them obese) and I could see how hard it was for them to lose weight even if they did everything right... or they lost some weight (still far away from "slim figure") and then all of sudden their metabolism striked back and they gained most of the weight back.
I come from medical family so I know this stuff. And any doctor will tell you that if "hormones go crazy" (and you probably know this since you're almost 50 based on your profile) there's not much you can do about it. YES, you can keep it in check sort of. But you'll probably never have a model body exactly.
But thanks for your advice anyway 0 -
You're welcome
Your anecdotal evidence and belief system is against scientific fact, but that's fine - you aren't trying to convince anyone that you know what you're talking about.. you're just looking for other people's opinions
And I know you know that you don't get the level of knowledge a specialist like a registered dietician or endocrinologist has through osmosis
Any doctor telling you 'hormones go crazy' should be struck off .. or at least sent back to school .. because science
You're right I'm almost 50 .. there's plenty I can do about my body and weight .. a healthy nutritious diet and resistance programme and I actually think my body is pretty good to be honest. It's got me through many years of different health issues, made 2 beautiful children. Though if you've been stalking my profile you can make your own judgement of course regarding a 'model body' LOL, but having worked with a number of models I have my own opinions there ... I certainly don't feel I need to lose weight :huh: :bigsmile:
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Not being able to do much about 'when hormones go crazy'. Well, if a doctor ever said this to me I'd find a different doctor. Luckily the doctors I know and speak to understand turning 50 and 'not being able to do anything about hormones going crazy' probably do not go well together. I turn 50 next year so I'll start checking about the inability to impact my hormones due to age. OP--best of luck, at age 23, with all the specialists you go to and your family's knowledge in the medical field you ought to be able to figure out how to go after your goals and know the difference between science and woo.0
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I have to say, being 53 and post the "hormones going crazy" phase of things, there is anything I feel but helpless in the face of it. My doctor's advice to me regarding my weight was the same it would have been to any other patient.
It's something to hold onto going forward in life. Hormones are a very small part of the equation. Calories and activity matter far more.0 -
I understand. I gave up asking or telling people about PCOS and IR years ago.People who don't suffer with these conditions don't understand.Sometimes we hear the calories in vs. Calories out Soooooo much,that we forget that there are people with VALID HEALTH ISSUES that cause us to lose weight MUCH slower. MFP may not be the place to ask.. Maybe a forum for people with PCOS/IR would get you more answers.
Anyways... I'm 5'9 and My weight stays the same(or I gain) at 1500 calories if I eat the standard American diet.. I have to eat 1100 on the SAD to lose weight every week(YES I weigh and measure). This was at 300lbs btw. If I take Metformin I can eat 100 grams of carbs per day and 1500 cal and lose weight. Without medication I have to eat 1100 calories of the SAD,or do a LCHF diet. When I did an Atkins or similar plan I could eat 1500 or more calories and lose weight.... It took me YEARS to figure it out... As of now I try to eat 50 or less carbs a day,walk 10,000 steps daily,and occasionaly go to the gym and I lose 2.5 per week for the last 15 weeks...
What helps is to try things for a few weeks and constantly tweak your plan until it works.Also,you might need medication if your IR/PCOS is bad.. I stopped taking the Meds,but I know that IR makes it waaay easier to get type 2 Diabetes so I'm trying to fix it now. The BEST things for IR is exercise and low carbs.Good luck on your journey.0 -
There are plenty of people on MFP, on this very thread, who have PCOS with and without IR, who understand how it works and what effects it has. Women with PCOS, both with and without IR, have lower BMRs, yes. But that doesn't mean that their fat is built with less energy (fewer calories) than anybody else. People who are obese (with or without PCOS) have an excess of fat because they have ingested more food than necessary to fuel their bodies at lower weights.
We are not made of air and pixie dust. Nobody gains fat without eating more than their bodies need to maintain. Can we gain weight, including that which can be attributed to water retention, more food in the stomach and bowels, etc., without eating in excess? Yes, absolutely. You can do that due to hormonal fluctuations, salty meals, more carbs than usual, etc. But fat? No.
Coming from a medical family means diddly squat as far as having a proper science and medical education. My dad was a computer programmer and I can't program a computer. My grandpa owned a transmission shop and I would have to google "car transmission" to be able to point one out. My husband's family owns a salon but I wouldn't let him near my head with a pair of scissors. You don't inherit knowledge or education.0 -
We have all met a person who eats A LOT of EVERYTHING and never gains weight,so why is it so hard to believe the opposite? One of my best friends is 5'8 and 120lbs.. People made fun of her for being too skinny so she used to eat 2 whole pizzas a day and drink a gallon of chocolate milk,snickers and everything to try to gain weight.She never gained weight..why? She was obviously eating way more than she should(for Years!). We all know people like this... If there are people who overeat and don't gain weight why is it so hard to believe that not every overweight person overeats? "Science is just science until it's not." K.W. I have been saying that for years.. There are many things in science that were not fully known or understood until some other scientist discovered something. I believe that weight/metabolism/hormones have a looooooong way to go in the scientific world.
All I know is that before I had PCOS I was like most of you... Judgemental. I used to hear people saying " I'm doing everything I can..ect,ect." I secretly would think that they were lying,binge eating,or not being accurate. But,now I know better.
Your journey is YOUR OWN- the way that you are affected by PCOS will not be the same for another person.0 -
rainbowblu wrote: »We have all met a person who eats A LOT of EVERYTHING and never gains weight,so why is it so hard to believe the opposite? One of my best friends is 5'8 and 120lbs.. People made fun of her for being too skinny so she used to eat 2 whole pizzas a day and drink a gallon of chocolate milk,snickers and everything to try to gain weight.She never gained weight..why? She was obviously eating way more than she should(for Years!). We all know people like this... If there are people who overeat and don't gain weight why is it so hard to believe that not every overweight person overeats? "Science is just science until it's not." K.W. I have been saying that for years.. There are many things in science that were not fully known or understood until some other scientist discovered something. I believe that weight/metabolism/hormones have a looooooong way to go in the scientific world.
All I know is that before I had PCOS I was like most of you... Judgemental. I used to hear people saying " I'm doing everything I can..ect,ect." I secretly would think that they were lying,binge eating,or not being accurate. But,now I know better.
Your journey is YOUR OWN- the way that you are affected by PCOS will not be the same for another person.
I call BS on eating 2 whole pizzas, a gallon of chocolate milk, and a Snickers every day. Maybe once or twice? Maybe. On an ongoing basis? No. Very light people who think they eat "a ton" and never gain eat less than they think. A good number of them are also more active than other people, whether through exercise or through NEAT activity (fidgeting, etc.)0 -
rainbowblu wrote: »We have all met a person who eats A LOT of EVERYTHING and never gains weight,so why is it so hard to believe the opposite? One of my best friends is 5'8 and 120lbs.. People made fun of her for being too skinny so she used to eat 2 whole pizzas a day and drink a gallon of chocolate milk,snickers and everything to try to gain weight.She never gained weight..why? She was obviously eating way more than she should(for Years!). We all know people like this... If there are people who overeat and don't gain weight why is it so hard to believe that not every overweight person overeats? "Science is just science until it's not." K.W. I have been saying that for years.. There are many things in science that were not fully known or understood until some other scientist discovered something. I believe that weight/metabolism/hormones have a looooooong way to go in the scientific world.
All I know is that before I had PCOS I was like most of you... Judgemental. I used to hear people saying " I'm doing everything I can..ect,ect." I secretly would think that they were lying,binge eating,or not being accurate. But,now I know better.
Your journey is YOUR OWN- the way that you are affected by PCOS will not be the same for another person.
I call BS on eating 2 whole pizzas, a gallon of chocolate milk, and a Snickers every day. Maybe once or twice? Maybe. On an ongoing basis? No. Very light people who think they eat "a ton" and never gain eat less than they think. A good number of them are also more active than other people, whether through exercise or through NEAT activity (fidgeting, etc.)
Yeah - it's amazing how when you put these 'magical-metabolism' people under the microscope it turns out that there is no magic or different metabolic rates - it's calorie intake and calorie burn only
there's a good example of that on video I've posted a few times but I'm not on my home pc so can't link now - if anyone else can to the metabolism testing and the doubly water trials that would be good (for the lurkers)0 -
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PeachyCarol wrote: »
I've never seen that. Excellent.
I was a "she eats so much and doesn't gain weight" person in high school. I graduated weighing 115 at 5'6" but ranged between 105 and 115 through h.s. I ate a Snickers at lunch 4 days a week, which made my friends see me as eating junk food all the time. But that's all I ate for lunch those days. Snickers and water. 250 calories total. That's because I got $10 per week for lunch money and if I spent $.75 for lunch four days a week I had enough to go out one day and get a 6" Subway sub and a drink and pocket the change so I could buy a package of Spree at the basketball game on Saturday night. Or I could go out a couple of days and get a single McDonald's hamburger and small fry and have enough to buy a package of Reese's cups on the weekend. For breakfast I had a couple of pieces of toast and jam or a bowl of cereal, and hot tea. For supper whatever meat my mom made and salad. I usually skipped the mashed potatoes because I didn't like them. That's it, no snacks. That's not a lot of calories but a lot came from "junk food" so my friends thought I ate a ton. Same goes for college. I ate a bit more then but I was way more active due to walking around campus between classes and for my job (I gave 40 minute walking tours to prospective students four times a week) so I burned more calories.0 -
I'm confused by that post and your response
@pineygirl 5'1 and 122 your BMR is around 1350 and you say you're eating 1500 to 2000 calories a day, averaging 1650 .. if you're set to lose 1lb a week that would put your TDEE at 2150 which is probably appropriate for an active / very active person at your height and weight
Where exactly is the lower BMR?
What do you mean by eating 250 under due to logging inaccuracies - are you actually not eating 1650 but eating 1400? and losing a pound?
It really depends on the day. I use a Fitbit Charge HR to estimate my TDEE. I take 16,000 to 21,000 steps per day and it says I burn between 2100 and 2800 calories per day. I usually eat anywhere from 1400 to 2000 per day. I take an extra 250 in addition to my 500 calorie deficit to account for my lower metabolism from the PCOS and hypothyroidism and also because the fitbit is inaccurate too. I'm probably more accurate in my food logging than my fitbit is at estimating my calorie burn. So hence the 250 calorie "buffer". So far it's working. I'm steadily losing get 1lb per week. So I think my TDEE is more like 2150...not 2400 like my fitbit says. So 1650 is a decent target. But some days I'm not as active so I eat less those days...like 1450 or so.
My calculated BMR is 1209...but I think it's more like 1100. But I suppose I'm pretty active...so my low BMR doesn't matter that much.0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTr1JUvEiUU
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