Family Problem - Need Advice - Mom wants $
Kolohe71
Posts: 613 Member
My mother has been extremely bad at managing her finances her whole life. She has filed for bankruptcy twice that I know of, she owed my grandparents over $10K when they died and she now owes me close to that the same amount. She has never taken ownership of her financial problems and always blames someone or some circumstance which has put her in her current predicament.
About once a year she will call me and ask for a loan because "My paycheck didn't get direct deposited this month" or "So-and-so owes me money, but they haven't paid me yet" etc. This is always followed by a sob story about how they are getting ready to shut off her utilities, the house is going into foreclosure, and can I give her a loan (usually for ~$3K) until her direct deposit gets cleared up etc.
On at least 4 occasions now, I have agreed to loan her money provided she makes small payments ($100 a month) until it is paid off. She always agrees, accepts the money, pays her bills and makes her payments to me for 2-3 months. Then, all of a sudden, she will begin to forget to mail me a check, and when I asked about it, she will usually respond with "Oh don't worry, you'll get paid back when I die and you sell my house."
So this past Saturday night, she e-mailed me (didn't call this time) with the usual story and requested yet another loan. (I haven’t responded to her yet because my wife and I are still trying to decide how to best handle the situation). Then this morning, on FB, she is posting about how she is in such financial straights that her cell phone was turned off today, her utilities will be shut off on Wednesday and that foreclosure on her house will be starting on the 15th because “My selfish son won’t help out his mother even though he can easily afford it”. Making ME out to look like the bad guy.
So to break it down simply:
1) Her house is upside-down by $60K, so any money I loan her will end up as a “Gift” because we will never recoup the money through its sale.
2) I know there is more to her problems than the reason she gives, because banks don’t typically foreclose on a home because the loan is behind one month (unless it’s habitual) and the same goes for utilities.
3) To loan her more money, requires me to pull it from my own retirement savings; putting my own future security at risk and creating stress between my wife and I for the same reason.
4) Without taking over her entire finances I don’t see a way to break this cycle, and she is not willing to let me do this.
Sorry this was so long, but thank you for reading. Any advice would be greatly appreciated as I am not really sure how to handle the situation any longer.
About once a year she will call me and ask for a loan because "My paycheck didn't get direct deposited this month" or "So-and-so owes me money, but they haven't paid me yet" etc. This is always followed by a sob story about how they are getting ready to shut off her utilities, the house is going into foreclosure, and can I give her a loan (usually for ~$3K) until her direct deposit gets cleared up etc.
On at least 4 occasions now, I have agreed to loan her money provided she makes small payments ($100 a month) until it is paid off. She always agrees, accepts the money, pays her bills and makes her payments to me for 2-3 months. Then, all of a sudden, she will begin to forget to mail me a check, and when I asked about it, she will usually respond with "Oh don't worry, you'll get paid back when I die and you sell my house."
So this past Saturday night, she e-mailed me (didn't call this time) with the usual story and requested yet another loan. (I haven’t responded to her yet because my wife and I are still trying to decide how to best handle the situation). Then this morning, on FB, she is posting about how she is in such financial straights that her cell phone was turned off today, her utilities will be shut off on Wednesday and that foreclosure on her house will be starting on the 15th because “My selfish son won’t help out his mother even though he can easily afford it”. Making ME out to look like the bad guy.
So to break it down simply:
1) Her house is upside-down by $60K, so any money I loan her will end up as a “Gift” because we will never recoup the money through its sale.
2) I know there is more to her problems than the reason she gives, because banks don’t typically foreclose on a home because the loan is behind one month (unless it’s habitual) and the same goes for utilities.
3) To loan her more money, requires me to pull it from my own retirement savings; putting my own future security at risk and creating stress between my wife and I for the same reason.
4) Without taking over her entire finances I don’t see a way to break this cycle, and she is not willing to let me do this.
Sorry this was so long, but thank you for reading. Any advice would be greatly appreciated as I am not really sure how to handle the situation any longer.
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Replies
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My advice would be to refuse the loan, you are not financially responsible for her, she is not your child. Sit down with her (if geographically possible) and explain the effect her selfishness in mis-handling her money is having on you, especially including her emotional blackmail. If necessary, I'd limit communication with her. She's making your life stressful, and endangering your future.0
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It sounds like setting boundaries would be a good start. It's unfortunate that she is having these financial issues, but she is responsible for her well being and her choices. It is admirable that you have helped her as much as you have, but I would be careful about enabling her. Perhaps suggest financial counseling of some sort.0
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Mother or not, the post on FB would be the straw that broke the camel's back for me. I say keep your money. You've done enough. Some people really need to learn to take responsibility for themselves.
Just sayin'....0 -
wow i left like i was re-living my life....you could have been writting about my mom and me......my advise is simple cut her off dont give another cents.....0
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No one can take advantage of you without your permission. I vote that you should try some tough love, and let her dig herself out. However, that is easy for me to say, since I have never been in your position. Good luck!0
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Tell her that the only way she is going to get anything from you ANY MORE is if she lets you take over her finances. End of story, no longer up for discussion. Since this has been going on for years, this could not possibly be a shock to her - even with being in heavy denial like she is. Then tell her you want to go with her to meet with the bank regarding the forclosure.
DO NOT let her make you feel guilty! You have been a wonderful child - any parent would be proud to have you!0 -
She needs to take responsibility for her own actions. It's not YOUR fault she can't handle money properly. You've done as much as you can....it's time to draw the line and create bounderies. "I love you mom, BUT......"0
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This may not sound kind, but your mother's financial problems are her own. She is not your financial responsibility. She is choosing to make bad choices and looking to you to save her time and time again. Quite frankly, she's not really motivated to do better when you keep enabling her by saving her over and again.
As far as FB goes, you don't have to be her friend on FB or you can change your settings so you don't see her posts.0 -
i understand its your mom but as you have already learn t you will not recoop the money therefore i wouldnt lend her the money - I would just say its all tied up in non touchable bank accounts etc and you are not allowed to take it out x0
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Wow, I am so sorry to hear you are going through this. I have dealt with a some what similar situation.
Best advice I can offer you is leave her alone. Do not give her anymore money. You have tried to help her in the past and she does not learn from her mistakes. She is your mother, you shouldnt have to bail her out because she should be a responsible adult setting an example for you.
You mentioned you are married, and even if you weren't I'd say the same thing, but you have to look out for your family. You and your wife and your own lives to support.
You're right, banks dont foreclose when you're only behind 1 month. Same with utilities. She's likely several months behind, if not more than that.
I think the part that I keep focusing on is that you have helped her before and she doesnt change. She doesnt change because she knows she can take advantage of you.
Stop enabling her. As painful as it is for you, you've got to let her stand on her own or she will never change. Heck, she may never change anyway. So stop letting her be this way at your expense.
Good luck.0 -
That's rough. Honestly sounds like she needs the tough love. I know we all hate to do things like this to our parents, but come on now. You can only do so much. It's clear that she doesn't have any intentions of ever paying back the full amount. Guilting you into it is even worse! So sorry you have to go through this. That said... What happens if she does lose her house, will she try to live with you? If you decide to do it stand firm that she will need to turn all of her financial matters over to you, and maybe make her sign and have papers notarized that she will pay you back or give you the financial control? Yikes!0
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Mother or not, the post on FB would be the straw that broke the camel's back for me. I say keep your money. You've done enough. Some people really need to learn to take responsibility for themselves.
Just sayin'....
Agreed!0 -
Wow. Rock and a hard place. I think you probably know what you need to do. If you are having to pull out of your own retirement - that puts you and your family in danger of not being taken care of later on. Where would you draw the line? At half of your retirement savings that you have been working hard at? More? You need to do what you can live with - it sounds like you have always helped her out so maybe it has been enabling her?0
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It's harsh.. I love my family , but in a situation like that I'd have to stop sending the money. Once or twice.. fine, if it's getting paid back, no problem. But you're just gifting and gifting and you don't even know where the money's going to! It's obviously not going to house and utility payments, so what's happening to your money? I'd not give anything else until you know exactly what's happening with your money. Then, once the cause of the problem is known, you can try and fix it together with her.
Oh yes.. the facebook post, please do not let that bother you. It's nothing but emotional blackmail. If that's the way she thinks about you? Then why give her more money? Selfish, she should check how much you've given her already..0 -
I agree with the others. She is your mother but you have done more then enough. And you are right, she's not going to change her cycle if she hasn't already. Sounds like she is going to have to learn the hard way. So sorry you are having to go through this. I would just tell her that you aren't able to help her out anymore. That you helping her isn't helping her in the long run. I'm sure anybody who sees that post on facebook probably knows the truth behind it. Good luck! :flowerforyou:0
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Yup, tell her what you just told us. And you're right - banks don't foreclose the first month, nor are occupants removed from the home immediately; especially with how foreclosure regs are being tightened up right now.
SHE got HERSELF into this - you've been way more than patient and helpful.
ETA: un-friend her on FB... or remove her from your news feed.
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Wow. I'm mostly shocked that she put that business on FB like that. I would deny the loan. It sounds like you've helped her out one too many times. Good luck with everything.0
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A similar situation happened to me when I was a teenager. My mother would not pay her bills correctly (she would pay less than she owed, then spend the rest on booze) and constantly asked me for money, telling me I owed it to her because she raised me.
My solution? I left her home, I stopped all contact, I let her to her own ways. After a few months she finally contacted me, asking for money, whining and crying 'why doesn't my daughter care about me?' and so on. I told her of course I care, and I know she can find a way to take care of herself. As for me helping, I have my own finances to worry about, and they are taking the front seat.
She found a way out of her hole by her own means, I think she found a guy and smuggled money from him or something, I don't really know. I do know that I was able to pay my own way, save up my own money, and feel no guilt about leaving my mother to do her own thing.
She is an adult, can make decisions to benefit or detriment herself, and should be left to make those decisions on her own sometimes. This sounds like one of those times.
I'm sorry you have to put up with the insult of her spreading *kitten* around facebook, that wasn't around when I had troubles or else I'm sure my mother would have done the same. Just ignore her comments and try not to get into details with folks who ask, it's not their business in the first place.
Focus on your life with your wife and keeping yourself on your feet. The government offers plenty of programs to help folks in debt, she can move out of her house and into a small government approved apt. for very low rent, file for another bankruptcy and try to start over. Her bad decisions should not effect you, as you are both adults and she is living her own life.
It is HARD because it is your family, but understand that in dire situations, sometimes hard decisions must be made. I hope you can find a solution of any type soon, because the stress of a situation like this is immense, I know. Perhaps paying for her financial counseling instead of loaning her money will be a cheaper and smarter/safer route? I get the feeling she will claim she doesn't need counseling, though.0 -
I feel for you, I agree with thelandofwin "It sounds like setting boundaries would be a good start". Question is, if she did loose her house where would she live? With you? That would not only be a financial strain for you but also a strain on your marriage. Sorry i don't have any advice, I hope it works out for you though.0
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It is extremely immature of your mother to post on FACEBOOK! Especially regarding sensitive family issues. I definitely agree there is more to this issue than being behind ONE month's mortgage. As someone suggested, counseling might be a good idea, and her reaction to even the suggestion might tell you a lot. My mom and dad have always been extremely hard workers and are both the oldest siblings in large families....and both my parents (now in their late 50s) are still loaning their siblings money! And let's just say my parents don't really have the money to be supporting adult family members with families of their own.
Sorry, I didn't mean to turn this into an all-about-me post, I just think if you don't stop with the lending now, the asking will NEVER end.0 -
Don't. Use tought love and show her what she is doing to herself. It's hard but for the best0
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My husband and I supported his mother financially for 20 years. When we could no longer do so in the manner to which she was accustomed, she accused us of stealing from her. As of January 1st of this year, we have not sent her any money at all. She complains constantly that she doesn't have money for food, medications, etc, yet she is still financially supporting one of my sisters in law (she's 35) AND buying clothing, shoes etc for her grandchildren. Now I'm not saying that she shouldn't do those things, but to do them and expect money from us is ridiculous.
Don't put yourself in danger to help your mom. She is a grown woman and really needs to figure it out for herself. The longer you continue to help her, the longer she can be irresponsible. I'd cut her off, and I'd tell her it's for her own good. She, like I mother in law, needs to learn to live within her means like the rest of us.0 -
Tough love. You are not responsible for your mother's financial problems. This isn't a one-time situation, this is a life-long pattern, and if you continue to help her out, there is no reason for this pattern to ever change. By helping her, you are enabling her to continue to be financially irresponsible. The most loving thing you can do in this situation is to allow her to fail, to suffer the consequences of her own bad decisions, and to hopefully learn from that experience that taking control of her finances is something she needs to do. If you really want to help her and have the money to do something, rather than lend her any money, I'd offer to pay for a financial counselor to meet with her and work through some of her issues with money. But I would not lend or give her a single cent. Foreclosure isn't the end of the world. Loosing her cell phone isn't the end of the world. Nothing that is going to happen to her is going to be fatal. It's going to be a struggle for her, and it's going to be a struggle for you to watch it happen, but she is never going to change if she never has any incentive to do so. Good luck! Also, I'd ignore her on FB for a while, for your own sanity's sake...0
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this is just my opinion, but I think you have done way more than most would have. You might almost be enabling her to continue doing whatever it is that is putting her in this situation. She thinks she can bully you into bailing her out each time. If anyone wants to believe the stuff she posts, then they are not worth your time, because those who know and love, I am sure will know you are not like that. If they ask you, tell the truth, maybe you can offer your mom to stay with you, if she cannot get a loan modification on her home. Just be firm and say no. If you have kids, the best thing you can do for them, is secure your own retirement so that they will not have to carry the burden of taking care of you and your medical bills.0
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Wow, that sounds like a heck of a mess. You're right, banks don't foreclose on homes until they are seriously delinquent and utilities won't be shut off until she is at least a few months behind. They are usually pretty understanding about letting you make payments to get back on track, too, so it sounds like she hasn't been paying anything for quite awhile.
I think you need to take the tough love approach here. You've tried loaning her money, and it obviously hasn't helped the situation. You might make her an ultimatum: "I'll loan you the money to bail you out again, but you're going to let me take over your finances from this point forward". That would mean putting yourself on all of her accounts, which isn't necessarily a good thing for you. It would also mean handling all of her bills and giving her an allowance for personal expenses, again not fun.
Most people don't just mismanage money, it has to be going somewhere if it's not being used to pay the bills. This might be something you already suspect or know but it sounds like your mom has some sort of a problem, whether it be that she's a shopping addict (a closet full of clothes that still have the tags on them), or a drug or gambling addiction. If this were happening to me, those would be the first things I would suspect and would try to figure out. In either case, helping her to solve the problem either by taking over for her, or getting her some sort of counseling (financial or otherwise) is the only way to make this problem end.
I truly wish you the very best in handling this situation.0 -
My wife and I were in a position where we could have loaned my mother money for a very similar situation. I decided no because it would be the equivalent of putting a band-aid on cannon ball hole. Tell her that she would be much better off selling the house and moving to a new one that is smaller and more manageable for her. I almost think you should tell her no just because of the facebook post.0
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I understand how horrible this must be on you and your wife. Have you considered getting her to quick claim the house to you? Then you could work on a loan modification and rent it to her. I would also talk with her about the utilities etc.
Have you ever sat down and worked a budget with her? Maybe she'd be willing to let you have power of attorney over it for awhile so that you can iron these things out and get her to pay along the way to make ends meet.
Is it a question of over spending? or is she just not making enough to cover the said bills? A combo of both?
I'm sorry that you're in this predicament but don't just gift her money anymore. Come up with a plan (if you and your wife decide to help) that helps take care of the situation not just band aids it up if you know what I mean.0 -
As much as it sucks as with any addictive or negative personality or habit you at some point need to stop enabling her. I realize how much it sucks because she's your Mother but she should also be held accountable for her own choices and actions. When someone is always the victim they never learn or see their own short comings and you can't make her change only she can. It's harsh but you need to cut her off and explain why. Putting anyone on blast is never easy especially if they are your family but as someone that used to be careless like your Mom with my finances, my parents refusal to help me financially, made me hit rock bottom, figure some stuff out and then accept my responsiblility in the situation and now I'm a firm believer and practicing bills or responsibilty first, and play second. Good luck because I know it's easier said than done and she will lash out and try to hurt you but maybe you need to step away. I'm praying for you.0
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You have answered your own problem. You do not have one good reason for helping her listed. She continues this pattern because you keep bailing her out. She does not appreciate your previous help. You can not risk your own family's security for her irresponsibility. Let her know that you can not afford it, she needs to come up with another plan. There are resources for utility help and foreclosure help as well. If you pull from your retirement, that is selfish of her to expect that. You will be not only losing that money you took from it but also the interest you would be accruing from now until you retire. DON'T DO IT!!! It sounds like she stops paying you back when she decides she no longer feels responsible to you and wants to continue her spending issues. You need to have a back bone and tell her no! You're wife is your number one woman now and she is being pretty darn nice about it. I wouldn't have allowed it the second time, let alone several times. Good luck with this one.0
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i totally agree with the othe posters... i understand the desire to help your mother but there comes a time when help is turning into enabling... i would find a credit union or something that has financial councelors that could sit down with her and find out where things are going wrong.. maybe teach her how to get back on track.. she will be mad but its time she starts living on her money and not yours.. you have to protect the future of your family too..
give a man a fish and he will eat for a day, teach a man to fish and he will never go hungry.
be the teacher and you just may save her from herself.0
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