Are "diet" sodas really bad
Replies
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Time magazine reported from From the Journal of the American Geriatrics Society (http://time.com/3746047/diet-soda-bad-belly-fat/)
This is another correlation thing. It comes down to this question: are there likely to be other things that separate out populations that drink diet soda vs. those that do not, on average.
It's the same problem with any correlation study. Are vegetarians (who may get reported as being healthier in certain ways) eating a healthier diet because meat is unhealthy? Or is it because they are more likely to be thoughtful about their diets (on average) or eat more vegetables? Unless you are willing to follow all the advice from the correlation studies (like the Nurses Study), which probably would lead to a healthier diet, but most pay attention to only selectively, focusing on this seems bizarre.
See also http://www.forbes.com/sites/fayeflam/2015/03/18/questioning-this-weeks-health-scare-linking-diet-soda-to-belly-fat/#2715e4857a0b317e9fe275e50 -
Faulty correlation example:
Fact: Everybody who ate a pickle in 1740 is now dead.
Conclusion: Eating pickles is deadly.0 -
Did you read the "conclusions" of both articles?You all are kidding - right? It is not the lack of calories that make diet soda bad for you, it is the chemicals which increase the risk of metabolic syndrome.
Google "scientific research on diet soda" and several journal articles pop up. Here is a quote from the American Diabetes Association "At least daily consumption of diet soda was associated with a 36% greater relative risk of incident metabolic syndrome and a 67% greater relative risk of incident type 2 diabetes compared with nonconsumption (HR 1.36 [95% CI 1.11–1.66] for metabolic syndrome and 1.67 [1.27–2.20] for type 2 diabetes)" (source: http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/32/4/688.full)
and here is another "This is one of the largest studies on this topic, and our findings are consistent with some previous data, especially those linking diet drinks to the metabolic syndrome.” – Dr. Ankur Vyas, a Fellow in cardiovascular disease at UI Hospitals and Clinics, and the lead investigator of the study". (source: http://now.uiowa.edu/2014/03/ui-study-finds-diet-drinks-associated-heart-trouble-older-women)
If you don't know what metabolic syndrome is, I strongly encourage you to find out. It is a very scary syndrome without which there would be no MFP.
Take care of you total body health, quit diet soda today.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
This. Not to mention the ADA RECOMMENDS diet soda as an alternative drink.You all are kidding - right? It is not the lack of calories that make diet soda bad for you, it is the chemicals which increase the risk of metabolic syndrome.
Google "scientific research on diet soda" and several journal articles pop up. Here is a quote from the American Diabetes Association "At least daily consumption of diet soda was associated with a 36% greater relative risk of incident metabolic syndrome and a 67% greater relative risk of incident type 2 diabetes compared with nonconsumption (HR 1.36 [95% CI 1.11–1.66] for metabolic syndrome and 1.67 [1.27–2.20] for type 2 diabetes)" (source: http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/32/4/688.full)
and here is another "This is one of the largest studies on this topic, and our findings are consistent with some previous data, especially those linking diet drinks to the metabolic syndrome.” – Dr. Ankur Vyas, a Fellow in cardiovascular disease at UI Hospitals and Clinics, and the lead investigator of the study". (source: http://now.uiowa.edu/2014/03/ui-study-finds-diet-drinks-associated-heart-trouble-older-women)
If you don't know what metabolic syndrome is, I strongly encourage you to find out. It is a very scary syndrome without which there would be no MFP.
Take care of you total body health, quit diet soda today.
:huh:
Correlation <> Causation
From first study
CONCLUSIONS Although these observational data cannot establish causality, consumption of diet soda at least daily was associated with significantly greater risks of select incident metabolic syndrome components and type 2 diabetes.
So no establishment of causality but causality inferred by the lay reader
What Can I Drink?
Food often takes center stage when it comes to diabetes. But don't forget that the beverages you drink can also have an effect on your weight and blood glucose!
We recommend choosing zero-calorie or very low-calorie drinks. This includes:
Water
Unsweetened teas
Coffee
Diet soda
Other low-calorie drinks and drink mixes
You can also try flavoring your water with a squeeze of lemon or lime juice for a light, refreshing drink with some flavor. All of these drinks provide minimal calories and carbohydrate.
- See more at: http://www.diabetes.org/food-and-fitness/food/what-can-i-eat/making-healthy-food-choices/what-can-i-drink.html?loc=ff-slabnav#sthash.4WUnyOvu.dpuf
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Lol, you do realize that drinking water is inundated with "chemicals" to make it drinkable?Very interesting discussion. Of course proving causality is extremely difficult because you have to rule out almost everything else that could be a cause. However, I am not willing to risk metabolic syndrome or diabetes just so I can drink a can of chemicals.
The water in third world countries also has zero calories, but I wouldn't suggest drinking it.
Isn't MFP about more than zero calories?
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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I've been drinking a few coke zero and rum a day for years and I'm still alive. Pepsi max is better with whisky and diet dr pepper with bourbon.0
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I drink diet ice tea. It has artificial sugar. My doctor says it is okay. I drink water, too.0
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Diet soda won't hurt as far as calories, but for some people they can make them crave other sweets as well.
As far as health, the biggest issue to watch may be your teeth, rather than your waistline.
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finneyjason218 wrote: »The problem with diet sodas isn't the calories or the "chemicals". It's the artificial sweetener, but not for the reasons you have probably been told... (They do not cause cancer)
When you consume zero calorie sweetened foods or beverages you are tricking your body. Your body wants sugar because it has a lot of quickly available energy that your ancestors might need to go hunt a deer and kill it with their bare hands. But your body also has an 'off switch' for your sweet tooth that tells you when you've had all the short release energy your body can use at a time. When you consume artificial sweeteners, your body thinks it has achieved it's goal to obtain quickly available calories, when it hasn't. Upon realizing that it didn't get the energy that it thinks it should have, it quickly puts in a order for more sugar. If you again satisfy this impulse with another diet soda, the pattern will repeat itself. After prolonged diet soda consumption, your body's sweetness regulation is all out of wack. It now believes you need to consume an ungodly amount of sweets in order to get just a tiny amount of energy from them. Now when you reach for that candy bar, the real sugar (with the calories) will be registered as a tiny fraction of what you need, and you will more than likely go in for a second or third. This is where the weight gain from diet sodas comes from.
I have experienced this first hand. About 3 years ago, I was drinking 12 diet sodas a day roughly. No big deal, that's still 0 calories right? Wrong. I remember that I couldn't trust myself around sweets, I had to keep them out of the house or I would eat all of them. I could easily eat a whole package of Oreo's in one sitting. I just thought I had a crazy intense sweet tooth. Then, about 2 years ago, I learned what diet sodas where actually doing to my body's built in regulation center, and cut them out entirely. Now, I maaaybe have 1 regular soda every month or two, and can easily have a one piece of cake, or a cookie when grandma goes through a lot of effort to make them for us, without needing to eat them all.
If you do drink diet sodas, just know that you haven't done any permanent damage to your body, but if your goal is to lose weight, you really should cut them out of your life. They will turn satisfying treats into unsatisfying binges very quickly.
Bravo! I'm glad someone finally explained the insulin release that happens with fake and or real sugar. When I stopped drinking sweetened drinks I lost weight easier and quicker.0 -
Yes, diet sodas are not good. They reinforce that need for sugar on your palette. I was never a fan of diet soda, but I am a recovering soda addict. It not a joke, as they are very addictive. I've had luck finally getting off of them, but it was hard. I have relapse every now, and then, but I think about what it is doing to my body, and stop again.0
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Yes, diet sodas are not good. They reinforce that need for sugar on your palette. I was never a fan of diet soda, but I am a recovering soda addict. It not a joke, as they are very addictive. I've had luck finally getting off of them, but it was hard. I have relapse every now, and then, but I think about what it is doing to my body, and stop again.
Why couldn't this (reinforcing the "need" for sugar) be said about sweet items like fruit? I had dates in my breakfast oats this morning. They were incredibly sweet. Wouldn't that also reinforce my palate's (quite natural) taste for sugar?
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elaineously wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »The problem with diet sodas isn't the calories or the "chemicals". It's the artificial sweetener, but not for the reasons you have probably been told... (They do not cause cancer)
When you consume zero calorie sweetened foods or beverages you are tricking your body. Your body wants sugar because it has a lot of quickly available energy that your ancestors might need to go hunt a deer and kill it with their bare hands. But your body also has an 'off switch' for your sweet tooth that tells you when you've had all the short release energy your body can use at a time. When you consume artificial sweeteners, your body thinks it has achieved it's goal to obtain quickly available calories, when it hasn't. Upon realizing that it didn't get the energy that it thinks it should have, it quickly puts in a order for more sugar. If you again satisfy this impulse with another diet soda, the pattern will repeat itself. After prolonged diet soda consumption, your body's sweetness regulation is all out of wack. It now believes you need to consume an ungodly amount of sweets in order to get just a tiny amount of energy from them. Now when you reach for that candy bar, the real sugar (with the calories) will be registered as a tiny fraction of what you need, and you will more than likely go in for a second or third. This is where the weight gain from diet sodas comes from.
I have experienced this first hand. About 3 years ago, I was drinking 12 diet sodas a day roughly. No big deal, that's still 0 calories right? Wrong. I remember that I couldn't trust myself around sweets, I had to keep them out of the house or I would eat all of them. I could easily eat a whole package of Oreo's in one sitting. I just thought I had a crazy intense sweet tooth. Then, about 2 years ago, I learned what diet sodas where actually doing to my body's built in regulation center, and cut them out entirely. Now, I maaaybe have 1 regular soda every month or two, and can easily have a one piece of cake, or a cookie when grandma goes through a lot of effort to make them for us, without needing to eat them all.
If you do drink diet sodas, just know that you haven't done any permanent damage to your body, but if your goal is to lose weight, you really should cut them out of your life. They will turn satisfying treats into unsatisfying binges very quickly.
Bravo! I'm glad someone finally explained the insulin release that happens with fake and or real sugar. When I stopped drinking sweetened drinks I lost weight easier and quicker.
https://examine.com/faq/do-artificial-sweeteners-spike-insulin/0 -
elaineously wrote: »finneyjason218 wrote: »The problem with diet sodas isn't the calories or the "chemicals". It's the artificial sweetener, but not for the reasons you have probably been told... (They do not cause cancer)
When you consume zero calorie sweetened foods or beverages you are tricking your body. Your body wants sugar because it has a lot of quickly available energy that your ancestors might need to go hunt a deer and kill it with their bare hands. But your body also has an 'off switch' for your sweet tooth that tells you when you've had all the short release energy your body can use at a time. When you consume artificial sweeteners, your body thinks it has achieved it's goal to obtain quickly available calories, when it hasn't. Upon realizing that it didn't get the energy that it thinks it should have, it quickly puts in a order for more sugar. If you again satisfy this impulse with another diet soda, the pattern will repeat itself. After prolonged diet soda consumption, your body's sweetness regulation is all out of wack. It now believes you need to consume an ungodly amount of sweets in order to get just a tiny amount of energy from them. Now when you reach for that candy bar, the real sugar (with the calories) will be registered as a tiny fraction of what you need, and you will more than likely go in for a second or third. This is where the weight gain from diet sodas comes from.
I have experienced this first hand. About 3 years ago, I was drinking 12 diet sodas a day roughly. No big deal, that's still 0 calories right? Wrong. I remember that I couldn't trust myself around sweets, I had to keep them out of the house or I would eat all of them. I could easily eat a whole package of Oreo's in one sitting. I just thought I had a crazy intense sweet tooth. Then, about 2 years ago, I learned what diet sodas where actually doing to my body's built in regulation center, and cut them out entirely. Now, I maaaybe have 1 regular soda every month or two, and can easily have a one piece of cake, or a cookie when grandma goes through a lot of effort to make them for us, without needing to eat them all.
If you do drink diet sodas, just know that you haven't done any permanent damage to your body, but if your goal is to lose weight, you really should cut them out of your life. They will turn satisfying treats into unsatisfying binges very quickly.
Bravo! I'm glad someone finally explained the insulin release that happens with fake and or real sugar. When I stopped drinking sweetened drinks I lost weight easier and quicker.
No it doesn't ..that's woo..unsubstantiated derp...although I seem to remember a rat study somewhere never replicated in humans
I'm afraid you've been taken in by lazy journalism and the replication of articles as fact...everybody looking for clickbait ...and nobody focusing on the science0 -
Yes, diet sodas are not good. They reinforce that need for sugar on your palette. I was never a fan of diet soda, but I am a recovering soda addict. It not a joke, as they are very addictive. I've had luck finally getting off of them, but it was hard. I have relapse every now, and then, but I think about what it is doing to my body, and stop again.
You should be careful using a clinical term like addiction when it comes to foods and drinks because simply no...physically they contain no addictive qualities..now a behavioural or emotional drive to consume is different and can be addressed by conscious moderation or elimination. But that is not equal to addiction0 -
As I posted earlier, I drink diet soda every day. I also use a bit of Splenda in my coffee. And yet I have zero cravings for sweets. I was thinking over the holidays (as I watched others scarfing down all the sweet treats) that they have about as much appeal to me as broccoli or carrots. If I was really hungry and there was a veggie tray available I'd sure eat them. But they're not something that ever just pops in my head and I think "boy, I wish I had a good head of broccoli or a bunch of carrot sticks." Sweets are exactly the same for me. In fact, I can easily decline sweets even when I'm hungry because I don't like the way my body reacts to them.
So anecdotally . . .no, I don't believe that artificial sweeteners increase cravings for sweets.0 -
As I posted earlier, I drink diet soda every day. I also use a bit of Splenda in my coffee. And yet I have zero cravings for sweets. I was thinking over the holidays (as I watched others scarfing down all the sweet treats) that they have about as much appeal to me as broccoli or carrots. If I was really hungry and there was a veggie tray available I'd sure eat them. But they're not something that ever just pops in my head and I think "boy, I wish I had a good head of broccoli or a bunch of carrot sticks." Sweets are exactly the same for me. In fact, I can easily decline sweets even when I'm hungry because I don't like the way my body reacts to them.
So anecdotally . . .no, I don't believe that artificial sweeteners increase cravings for sweets.
Agreed!0 -
If you were given a 60% chance that if you try to cross the interstate you be ok - would you take it? There is no causation that crossing the road will wipe you out, but there is a correlation. It is a risk/benefit analysis. There is evidence to show that diet sodas are harmful to your health. It is not true that there is no scientific proof. But it is true that there isn't absolute proof. Saying there is no scientific proof is just as bad as saying diet soda causes obesity and I am not saying that. I am just trying to point out that there is evidence that diet soda can be harmful to your health and could lead things link metabolic syndrome, cardiac problems, increased belly fat and diabetes.
I would be interesting to know, how many people on this forum who drink diet soda, are not overweight?0 -
If you were given a 60% chance that if you try to cross the interstate you be ok - would you take it? There is no causation that crossing the road will wipe you out, but there is a correlation. It is a risk/benefit analysis. There is evidence to show that diet sodas are harmful to your health. It is not true that there is no scientific proof. But it is true that there isn't absolute proof. Saying there is no scientific proof is just as bad as saying diet soda causes obesity and I am not saying that. I am just trying to point out that there is evidence that diet soda can be harmful to your health and could lead things link metabolic syndrome, cardiac problems, increased belly fat and diabetes.
I would be interesting to know, how many people on this forum who drink diet soda, are not overweight?
That's not how correlation works.
Here's a piece of correlation:
In summer, more people are drowning than in winter.
Summer isn't the cause and neither is it a risk for drowning though. It's just that in summer people are more likely to go swim, which is the actual cause for more drownings.0 -
Well I was overweight, then I wasn't. Diet soda consumption unaltered throughout.0
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Another piece of correlation. Most births happen in summer. August and July specifically. You aren't any more likely to get pregnant in winter though, people just bang more often during the cold months which leads to more pregnancies.0
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stevencloser wrote: »Another piece of correlation. Most births happen in summer. August and July specifically. You aren't any more likely to get pregnant in winter though, people just bang more often during the cold months which leads to more pregnancies.
But using the principals of "risk/benefit analysis" as they were explained above, I guess I should just avoid sex all winter long. I mean, how we can be SURE there isn't a greater risk of getting knocked up in winter? I'm going to wait for absolute proof.0 -
If you were given a 60% chance that if you try to cross the interstate you be ok - would you take it? There is no causation that crossing the road will wipe you out, but there is a correlation. It is a risk/benefit analysis. There is evidence to show that diet sodas are harmful to your health. It is not true that there is no scientific proof. But it is true that there isn't absolute proof. Saying there is no scientific proof is just as bad as saying diet soda causes obesity and I am not saying that. I am just trying to point out that there is evidence that diet soda can be harmful to your health and could lead things link metabolic syndrome, cardiac problems, increased belly fat and diabetes.
I would be interesting to know, how many people on this forum who drink diet soda, are not overweight?
Probably about the same percentage of people on this forum who are not overweight.
I am not overweight currently, and I drink it. (Biggest factor for me in times of my life when I easily seem to maintain a non-overweight weight and not is how active I am.)
I've also never had metabolic syndrome, etc.
I also (as said above) don't crave sweets. To the extent I crave foods, they are savory foods.
Also, you are misunderstanding the correlation vs. causation thing with the road crossing analogy -- it's not analogous. One thing that is important to do before drawing conclusions about one item from these kinds of studies is to look at all the different results from them and think about what other differences the groups might have.0 -
If you were given a 60% chance that if you try to cross the interstate you be ok - would you take it? There is no causation that crossing the road will wipe you out, but there is a correlation. It is a risk/benefit analysis. There is evidence to show that diet sodas are harmful to your health. It is not true that there is no scientific proof. But it is true that there isn't absolute proof. Saying there is no scientific proof is just as bad as saying diet soda causes obesity and I am not saying that. I am just trying to point out that there is evidence that diet soda can be harmful to your health and could lead things link metabolic syndrome, cardiac problems, increased belly fat and diabetes.
I would be interesting to know, how many people on this forum who drink diet soda, are not overweight?
I would be that some of the most fit people on this board drink diet drinks. We have a member who lost over 300 lbs while drinking a lot of diet pepsi. Many members losing over 100 lbs lost while drinking diet. I am about 50 lbs lost with diet soda.
The risk or observed risk in a rare but few studies is much less than the risk factors caused by obesity.
But if you are really interested, I could always start a thread and do some statistical modeling.0 -
stevencloser wrote: »Another piece of correlation. Most births happen in summer. August and July specifically. You aren't any more likely to get pregnant in winter though, people just bang more often during the cold months which leads to more pregnancies.
I actually thought October was the highest birth month because of new years.... because alcohol.0 -
stevencloser wrote: »Another piece of correlation. Most births happen in summer. August and July specifically. You aren't any more likely to get pregnant in winter though, people just bang more often during the cold months which leads to more pregnancies.
I actually thought October was the highest birth month because of new years.... because alcohol.
https://www.yahoo.com/parenting/why-the-most-babies-are-born-in-the-summer-128339451207.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2145471/How-common-birthday-Chart-reveals-date-rates.html
September and October are fairly close.
I also noticed that the 13th is consistently less likely than the day before and after. Maybe because of superstition against Friday the 13th?0 -
I would be interesting to know, how many people on this forum who drink diet soda, are not overweight?
I'm not.
I was when I was younger, but then I lost 60+ pounds about 27 years ago and maintained that until this past year my thyroid function took a nosedive and one of the (many) effects of that was that I gained some weight. I got diagnosed with hypothyroidism and medicated and lost it all. All while drinking diet Pepsi daily.
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wight loss is about calorie deficit and has nothing to with diet soda. So yes you can drink diet soda and lose weight, and as long as you are getting adequate nutrition then there is nothing bad about it.0
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I'll say something with my experience. I use to work for Coca-Cola. When I pulled pallets of diets or zeros it was always heavier than the regular sodas because of all the sugar that's in them.0
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beatyfamily1 wrote: »I'll say something with my experience. I use to work for Coca-Cola. When I pulled pallets of diets or zeros it was always heavier than the regular sodas because of all the sugar that's in them.
I'm sure that was it...0 -
beatyfamily1 wrote: »I'll say something with my experience. I use to work for Coca-Cola. When I pulled pallets of diets or zeros it was always heavier than the regular sodas because of all the sugar that's in them.
Wait, what?0 -
Night time......no traffic and it's a clear view.........sure.If you were given a 60% chance that if you try to cross the interstate you be ok - would you take it?
Driving a vehicle increases your risk of getting in an auto accident 100% versus not driving one at all. We can find scientific proof for just about anything for risk. Typing on a computer consistently increases risk for carpal tunnel syndrome. Should you stop or avoid it completely? How about getting your hair done in a salon and being exposed to the chemicals in the air? Or cooking in your kitchen and risking a burn versus having someone else prepare your food for you?There is no causation that crossing the road will wipe you out, but there is a correlation. It is a risk/benefit analysis. There is evidence to show that diet sodas are harmful to your health. It is not true that there is no scientific proof. But it is true that there isn't absolute proof. Saying there is no scientific proof is just as bad as saying diet soda causes obesity and I am not saying that. I am just trying to point out that there is evidence that diet soda can be harmful to your health and could lead things link metabolic syndrome, cardiac problems, increased belly fat and diabetes.
Get if you don't like diet soda, but using bad analogies that can be easily be countered with other bad analogies is disingenous.
How about people who don't drink diet soda are overweight on the forum?I would be interesting to know, how many people on this forum who drink diet soda, are not overweight?
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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