Running - Trying to Improve but Frustrated
parfia
Posts: 184 Member
Hi Guys,
I run regularly on the treadmill at the moment - I know that outside is best, but I have a bit of a dodgy knee that plays up when running outside and live in England, so lets face it the weather isn't the best - anyhow -
I'm currently running 5k in around 40 minutes (which I know is abysmal) but whenever I take the pace up, I feel like I can't run for long enough to reach the distance that I want to reach - if I just keep running 5k will my time gradually improve I should I just suck it up and try and run quicker!!
I workout 5-6 times a week and have a relatively good fitness level when it comes to things like HIIT, circuits and spin etc but just cannot seem to get this running thing down!!
Just for info, I'm 5' 11' and 239lbs so there is quite a bit of me to hog along on a run!! haha!
I run regularly on the treadmill at the moment - I know that outside is best, but I have a bit of a dodgy knee that plays up when running outside and live in England, so lets face it the weather isn't the best - anyhow -
I'm currently running 5k in around 40 minutes (which I know is abysmal) but whenever I take the pace up, I feel like I can't run for long enough to reach the distance that I want to reach - if I just keep running 5k will my time gradually improve I should I just suck it up and try and run quicker!!
I workout 5-6 times a week and have a relatively good fitness level when it comes to things like HIIT, circuits and spin etc but just cannot seem to get this running thing down!!
Just for info, I'm 5' 11' and 239lbs so there is quite a bit of me to hog along on a run!! haha!
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Replies
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If you are determined to use the treadmill then you'll either need to change your speed, distance or incline to improve.
It sounds as though you are keen to keep your distance the same, and you're having trouble increasing your speed. So go with the incline. Put the machine up a percent and do your usual run.
Incidentally, I've been running for years and STILL find the first 15 minutes of any run the most tiring. Once I get past that time I can sail on for miles. Maybe give yourself a bigger push and see what happens?0 -
If you keep running 5k on the treadmill will you eventually get faster? You will have to change a variable to change the result. If you are losing weight you probably will be able to run at a faster pace but maybe you should switch up you workouts. If you are already on the treadmill for 40 minutes I would try a 5 minute warm up followed by 30 minutes of intervals and a five minute cool down once a week. You will probably be able to break through 5k For the same workout duration. If you want to improve open your mind to different aspects of running time vs. distance, treadmill vs. not (you may be able to find an indoor track) or longer runs vs. short speed workouts.
While a 40 minute 5k is not your goal it is not abysmal, don't be so hard on yourself.0 -
Try changing up your approach too. For example, running at the same pace every run not only gets monotonous, it is also not the most efficient way to get faster. Try incorporating some interval training on the treadmill. Sprint-jog-walk-sprint-walk-sprint-jog-sprint.... This will help you up your pace
In addition, running on a 1% incline (if your knee is ok with that) helps to more closely mirror an outside run, just FYI.
Also, I didn't see how long you have been following this running regimen for-can you elaborate?
Lastly, please never refer to your 5K time as 'abysmal' or anything similar. You are getting out there on that damn treadmill and pounding away almost every day which is light years ahead of the majority of the population. Don't be so hard on yourself, the pace will come.0 -
The easiest and least risky way of improving at running when you are a relative beginner is just to run further, but slowly. If you get used to doing longer runs, and gradually increase the frequency, you'll find you automatically get faster at 5k without even trying.0
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I don't keep a steady pace all the way through - I tend to flit between 7.0kmph up to 10.0kmph over the 40 minutes until I reach 5k, but there isn't a structured routine to it, I just sort of think 'oooh, I can go faster for the next X minutes' or 'I need to slow it down for the next X minutes' if that makes any sense??0
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Dodgy knee shouldn't be too much of a factor as long as you have good running shoes and if you can already run on a treadmill. The longer you stay on the treadmill, the longer you will remain frustrated....0
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There's a few things you can do. You can try to run shorter distance a couple times a week, at a faster pace to get your body used to running faster. You can continue doing what you are doing, and eventually you will run that distance more efficiently and will gradually (over a long period of time perhaps) be able to run a bit faster. You can also try doing some speed work. Do some sprints if you may. Or, try increasing the speed of your run for just the last half mile or so. For me, when I was a distance runner, I found that just the more I ran, the faster I would become at a distance. Treadmill running is tough though. I run much faster outside than on the treadmill.0
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I'm not entirely sure what you mean by a "dodgy knee" when running outside. Have you actually had some sort of medical diagnosis or is this, perhaps, a glute and/or hip weakness issue that can be addressed through exercise?
This may help (I hope).....
runnersworld.com/newswire/to-relieve-runners-knee-strengthen-your-hips
You don't say how long you've been running for but I'll echo the comment that running longer slower distances may help (you need to build your aerobic base first). I once had a wise triathlon coach tell me not to worry about running a fast 5K until I could run a slow 10K.
Once you've built your aerobic base then you can add in speed work (intervals, hills) which can be done on a treadmill by varying speed & incline (some treadmills will have built in programs).
It's discouraging to some athletes that bike fitness, swimming fitness etc don't translate into running fitness, it comes down to specificity....to be a better runner you need to run more.
When I ran my first 5K my only goal was to come in under 40 min (and I barely squeaked under that) since then I've come within seconds of busting 25:00 and have gone on to run half-marathon and Olympic distance duathlons.....it takes time, consistency and patience. Keep at it!
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Woah. At 240lbs with a bad knee the idea of doing intervals, speed work, sprints is a recipe for injury.
Work on a plan to increase your distance by about 10% each week at your regular pace. As distance increases so will speed. Also make sure you get your rest days. 6 days of running a week isn't providing you time to recover and improve.
As you lose weight, your speed will significantly improve also.
So don't worry so much about your speed. Work on distance, give yourself time to lose weight. Stay without injury.0 -
I wish I could run a 5k in 40minutes!!!!
from what I've read, the important thing is to increase stamina - so increasing distance and/or duration, no more than 10% a week.0 -
I didn't read all the responses, but yes, you ABSOLUTELY will improve by continuing to do just what you're doing. There is room for a lot of improvement for all new runners. I would say my race pace continued to improve for more than a year when I started running, JUST by running more at the same slow pace. Don't increase distance more than 10% per week, but sticking with your comfortable pace is just fine. Two years in, you would need to start looking at speed work, etc. to get faster, but not yet.0
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BrianSharpe wrote: »I'm not entirely sure what you mean by a "dodgy knee" when running outside. Have you actually had some sort of medical diagnosis or is this, perhaps, a glute and/or hip weakness issue that can be addressed through exercise?
This may help (I hope).....
runnersworld.com/newswire/to-relieve-runners-knee-strengthen-your-hips
You don't say how long you've been running for but I'll echo the comment that running longer slower distances may help (you need to build your aerobic base first). I once had a wise triathlon coach tell me not to worry about running a fast 5K until I could run a slow 10K.
Once you've built your aerobic base then you can add in speed work (intervals, hills) which can be done on a treadmill by varying speed & incline (some treadmills will have built in programs).
It's discouraging to some athletes that bike fitness, swimming fitness etc don't translate into running fitness, it comes down to specificity....to be a better runner you need to run more.
When I ran my first 5K my only goal was to come in under 40 min (and I barely squeaked under that) since then I've come within seconds of busting 25:00 and have gone on to run half-marathon and Olympic distance duathlons.....it takes time, consistency and patience. Keep at it!
@BrianSharpe - I will have a look at this. I have always had a slightly in-turned left foot which really affects my gait when I run outside on an uneven surface and I found that after a few weeks of running outside every other day, my knee was really giving me a lot of pain. Nothing diagnosed medically, just stopped running for a while and it improved but I find that if I try to run outside, the pain reappears after a few runs. I know that the quick fix would be to get a super duper expensive pair of running shoes to improve gait etc, but I'm poor!! haha!!0 -
There are a number of ways to improve. One of the biggest and easiest ways to get faster is to simply lose weight. The general rule is for every 10 lbs of weight lost you save 20 seconds per mile. So just losing weight will help you get faster. Another thing to remember is that while the general idea is to get faster, you need to train at where you are now. So, only once a month or so do a time trial or a 5K to see how you have improved. 80% of your runs should be easy, meaning that the pace will be much slower than when you are trying to do your best. Like other have said, the other 20% should be quality workouts, instead of quantity. So tempos, hill work, speed intervals, etc...0
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My 5k is about the same time as yours and I also run on a treadmill. Where I live is super hilly and paved. When I run outside, my times are faster but I get stress fractures. Doctor says I've got lower bone density or some BS like that. I think it is just because I'm fat. This is going to sound weird but the best improvements to my time came from running a steady pace instead of intervals and only running twice a week.
You do need adequate time to rest after a run to let things heal up/recover. Now, that isn't true for your elite runners. They might run everyday, but I'm 5'3" and 200lbs and my body hates too much running even though I love running.
During my last set of stress fractures I switched to swimming and lifting and I was able to pick up running again when I healed 12 weeks later and was actually slightly faster. Maybe throw in some other exercises that can build lung capacity on your off days?0 -
The best way IMO is running outside. I followed a program couch to 5km to get you started0
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@AsrarHussain - I have done couch to 5K and can run 5k outside in a slightly quicker time (probably about 35-36 mins(, but I tend to get a lot of pain in my knee when I run outside
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@AsrarHussain - I have done couch to 5K and can run 5k outside in a slightly quicker time (probably about 35-36 mins(, but I tend to get a lot of pain in my knee when I run outside
It could be your technique do you land with your heels or mid feet if you land heel first that puts stress on your knees. It's best to land mid foot0 -
@enterdanger - Thank you
I also do weight training and other cardio such as spin, circuit training and bootcamp classes as well as Body Pump classes.
I don't run 5k every day - tends to be twice weekly I'll try a 5k and the other two days I'll do about 20-30 minutes of steady running on the treadmill followed by one of the above classes at the gym.
I used to run before I had my little girl and I think that around 5-6 stone later, I have just been expecting to jump back into being able to run 10k and it just ain't going to happen!! *woe is me* Having said that, I have been losing and exercising for about 8 months now and I still would like to see more improvement in my running that I have been !!0 -
@AsrarHussain I have no idea how I land and I think this is largely where I am going wrong!!
As I say, I know that I have an (ever so) slightly in-turned left foot and this causes me problems sometimes but above and beyond that, I'm not very good at recognizing gaits and foot strikes etc - still a bit of a newbie idiot when it comes to things like that !! 0 -
Pay attention to how your feet land this is important. Try to relax and try to land mid foot then see how it feels IMO I think it's because you land heel first0
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@AsrarHussain I have no idea how I land and I think this is largely where I am going wrong!! As I say, I know that I have an (ever so) slightly in-turned left foot and this causes me problems sometimes but above and beyond that, I'm not very good at recognizing gaits and foot strikes etc - still a bit of a newbie idiot when it comes to things like that !!
Don't worry too much about it. Foot strike isn't something new runners generally have to worry about, and honestly, don't take advice on how to adjust your gait from someone on the internet who hasn't seen you run. Some people heel strike, some forefoot strike. Its one part of the gait, and has to be looked at in the context of your overall mechanics. For some runners, a heel strike is the lowest impact.
Anyway, try the usual suspects first. Get good shoes that are right for you. Build up slowly and consistently. Do not try speed work until you have been running regularly for a number of months (you won't get many gains from it anyway - you need to build up your musculature and cardio system to handle the load first).0 -
It's just advice do not say my advice is worthless. I simply gave my input and feet striking is a crucial thing if you are getting pain that means something is not right so fixing something would be important0
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AsrarHussain wrote: »It's just advice do not say my advice is worthless. I simply gave my input and feet striking is a crucial thing if you are getting pain that means something is not right so fixing something would be important
You have no way of knowing whether or not the OPs strike is causing pain, and it is irresponsible to tell them to overhaul their gait with out seeing them run. Gait changes will cause far more problems if not done correctly. Just because a forefoot strike is "in" right now among pop running culture does not mean it should be blindly parroted to everyone on the interwebs.
Long term injury rates are the same between forefoot, midfoot, and heel strikers. Impact patterns vary as function of all the components of gait. If you don't actually know what you are talking about, you should refrain from speaking.
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I run on the treadmill (I live in Alberta and it's winter, looking forward to spring and running outside). I've slowly decreased my 5k time by increasing the treadmill speed. I have it set on a hill type program that changes the incline from 1%-4% (keeping an average of 2%). Every week or so I increase my speed by 0.1 or 0.2 kph. Doesn't seem like much, but I've managed to get my 5k time down from about 40 minutes to just over 35 minutes (right now my goal is under 35 minutes).0
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AsrarHussain wrote: »Pay attention to how your feet land this is important. Try to relax and try to land mid foot then see how it feels IMO I think it's because you land heel first
Have you watched elite runners? You'd be surprised by how many of them are heel strikers.....
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My mile time got much shorter after I started lifting. I went from running a 10 minute mile to an 8 minute mile, much to my surprise, as I wasn't training for it. Lift and get those legs strong!0
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ThickMcRunFast wrote: »AsrarHussain wrote: »It's just advice do not say my advice is worthless. I simply gave my input and feet striking is a crucial thing if you are getting pain that means something is not right so fixing something would be important
You have no way of knowing whether or not the OPs strike is causing pain, and it is irresponsible to tell them to overhaul their gait with out seeing them run. Gait changes will cause far more problems if not done correctly. Just because a forefoot strike is "in" right now among pop running culture does not mean it should be blindly parroted to everyone on the interwebs.
Long term injury rates are the same between forefoot, midfoot, and heel strikers. Impact patterns vary as function of all the components of gait. If you don't actually know what you are talking about, you should refrain from speaking.
Don't listen to this chick she sucks at running.-2 -
The reason I said mid feet striking because its q common problem I had problems with. If he tries mid feet striking and feels better what's the harm then0
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ThickMcRunFast wrote: »AsrarHussain wrote: »It's just advice do not say my advice is worthless. I simply gave my input and feet striking is a crucial thing if you are getting pain that means something is not right so fixing something would be important
You have no way of knowing whether or not the OPs strike is causing pain, and it is irresponsible to tell them to overhaul their gait with out seeing them run. Gait changes will cause far more problems if not done correctly. Just because a forefoot strike is "in" right now among pop running culture does not mean it should be blindly parroted to everyone on the interwebs.
Long term injury rates are the same between forefoot, midfoot, and heel strikers. Impact patterns vary as function of all the components of gait. If you don't actually know what you are talking about, you should refrain from speaking.
Don't listen to this chick she sucks at running.
Bro, DYEBeerMile?0 -
ThickMcRunFast wrote: »ThickMcRunFast wrote: »AsrarHussain wrote: »It's just advice do not say my advice is worthless. I simply gave my input and feet striking is a crucial thing if you are getting pain that means something is not right so fixing something would be important
You have no way of knowing whether or not the OPs strike is causing pain, and it is irresponsible to tell them to overhaul their gait with out seeing them run. Gait changes will cause far more problems if not done correctly. Just because a forefoot strike is "in" right now among pop running culture does not mean it should be blindly parroted to everyone on the interwebs.
Long term injury rates are the same between forefoot, midfoot, and heel strikers. Impact patterns vary as function of all the components of gait. If you don't actually know what you are talking about, you should refrain from speaking.
Don't listen to this chick she sucks at running.
Bro, DYEBeerMile?
I can beermile better than you in my sleep, peasant.-1
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